What was Sexton thinking?

by GloriousEmpire Wed 10 Jul 2013, 7:24 pm

The Lions won by such an overwhelming margin that largely, thoughts of the judgement failure riddled performance has been forgotten.

My first question on this topic is in the title.

19-3 up, with the lions dominant in all aspects Sexton elected to try a drop goal.

Now the Lions had front foot ball approaching the Wallaby 22. The biggest threat was loss of ball control, a knock on, a scrum and a 95% chance that halfpenny wood get an easy shot at goal.

Why the dodgy half witted pot at goal? It just have the ball back to Australia who proceeded to score shortly after and call the result back into question.

When you have found the weakness : keep plugging it.

by tigerleghorn Wed 10 Jul 2013, 7:43 pm

He made a bad call, that's it. I'm sure there are others from different players if you dissect the whole game.

Are you dangling a worm in the Irish pool now?

by GloriousEmpire Wed 10 Jul 2013, 7:46 pm

Not at all, just interested in what corrupt thinking could have led to this remarkable brain blip. The lions certainly came alive when Farrell came on though, didnt they?

by gleesonisgod Wed 10 Jul 2013, 7:46 pm

If I remember correctly the Lions were going nowhere and Sexton usually slots his droppies.... so not the worst call.

by bedfordwelsh Wed 10 Jul 2013, 7:49 pm

The attack was going nowhere after umpteen phases it was bad call that's it really.

by GloriousEmpire Wed 10 Jul 2013, 7:51 pm

Potentially game changing bad call - an admission the attack was toothless. Patience was required. Patience and creativity.

by tigerleghorn Wed 10 Jul 2013, 7:57 pm

GloriousEmpire wrote:Potentially game changing bad call - an admission the attack was toothless. Patience was required. Patience and creativity.

So he went for the drop when he shouldn't have and the AB's failed to take the drop when that was all that was required in that favourite game of yours?

Oops, that loss and major brain fa*t was Wayne Barnes' fault wasn't it?

by GloriousEmpire Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:10 pm

Incomparable situations.

by tigerleghorn Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:13 pm

GloriousEmpire wrote:Incomparable situations.

I kinda thought you'd think that.

by Thomond Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:14 pm

They went 28 phases and had gone all of ten metres, try and get something rather then nothing was the philosophy. The Gatland way had it s struggles during the game no doubt about that.

by LeinsterFan4life Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:15 pm

If he had got the drop goal would you have thought it was a bad decision?

by asoreleftshoulder Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:16 pm

It's just a pity people keep commenting on these articles (yes I'm aware of the irony).

by Rory_Gallagher Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:21 pm

GloriousEmpire wrote:The Lions won by such an overwhelming margin that largely, thoughts of the judgement failure riddled performance has been forgotten.

My first question on this topic is in the title.

19-3 up, with the lions dominant in all aspects Sexton elected to try a drop goal.

Now the Lions had front foot ball approaching the Wallaby 22. The biggest threat was loss of ball control, a knock on, a scrum and a 95% chance that halfpenny wood get an easy shot at goal.

Why the dodgy half witted pot at goal? It just have the ball back to Australia who proceeded to score shortly after and call the result back into question.

When you have found the weakness : keep plugging it.

What is your obsession with Jonathan Sexton? Why are you making so many painfully boring threads?

by tigerleghorn Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:27 pm

Rory_Gallagher wrote:
GloriousEmpire wrote:The Lions won by such an overwhelming margin that largely, thoughts of the judgement failure riddled performance has been forgotten.

My first question on this topic is in the title.

19-3 up, with the lions dominant in all aspects Sexton elected to try a drop goal.

Now the Lions had front foot ball approaching the Wallaby 22. The biggest threat was loss of ball control, a knock on, a scrum and a 95% chance that halfpenny wood get an easy shot at goal.

Why the dodgy half witted pot at goal? It just have the ball back to Australia who proceeded to score shortly after and call the result back into question.

When you have found the weakness : keep plugging it.

What is your obsession with Jonathan Sexton? Why are you making so many painfully boring threads?

I'm sure it's nothing personal, he just likes to throw a few hand grenades in the hope that English posters in the main will pick them up. I guess if that fails he throws them a little further.

It's spooky really, he's just like the erstwhile Greyghost isn't he?

by GloriousEmpire Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:47 pm

No hand grenades here! I merely thought the dust had settled enough to let some serious analysis kick in without too many emotional feathers getting rustled. If it's too early let me know and I will hold fire, because I have some other points to make on a similar topic.

by majesticimperialman Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:51 pm

He was trying to keep the scoreboard ticking over..Thats all,Keep putting the points on the board and take the game out of reach of Australia.

by Seagultaf Wed 10 Jul 2013, 9:37 pm

GloriousEmpire wrote:Not at all, just interested in what corrupt thinking could have led to this remarkable brain blip. The lions certainly came alive when Farrell came on though, didnt they?

According to the stats Farrell came on at 64mins after North's try, the Lions scored one more at 68min when Murray put Roberts through a hole. So not sure how Farrell can take the credit for bringing the Lions to life?

by GloriousEmpire Wed 10 Jul 2013, 9:46 pm

They appeared more creative with Farrell guiding things. The up and unders stopped and there were certainly no more drop goal attempts!

by mckay1402 Wed 10 Jul 2013, 9:56 pm

I was going to say the same as thomond. They had battered away for what felt like ten minutes and got nowhere. The idea of coming away with points and restarting with the ball was correct. Don't see the problem

by formerly known as Sam Wed 10 Jul 2013, 9:57 pm

The Lions had slow ball and the hindrance of Phillips at 9. Your in the opponents half take the points and keep the pressure on. Winning a turnover in the opposition 22 boosts morale going another 3 doesn't. If you miss the opposition has to kick it back to you and your electric back three get to counter attack.

by logie28 Wed 10 Jul 2013, 9:58 pm

Seriously people, ignore this troll for the sake of the board

by Guest Wed 10 Jul 2013, 10:11 pm

logie28 wrote:Seriously people, ignore this troll for the sake of the board

by Hood83 Wed 10 Jul 2013, 10:17 pm

tigerleghorn wrote:
GloriousEmpire wrote:Incomparable situations.

I kinda thought you'd think that.

Brilliant

by Hood83 Wed 10 Jul 2013, 10:20 pm

GloriousEmpire wrote:They appeared more creative with Farrell guiding things. The up and unders stopped and there were certainly no more drop goal attempts!

I suppose the main thing is the result GE.

by aucklandlaurie Wed 10 Jul 2013, 10:43 pm

Personally I thouight Jonathan Sexton had a pretty good game, and I respect the way he was prepared to take the line on, so what was so different in this game to when I usually see him play?

by asoreleftshoulder Thu 11 Jul 2013, 12:41 am

aucklandlaurie wrote:
Personally I thouight Jonathan Sexton had a pretty good game, and I respect the way he was prepared to take the line on, so what was so different in this game to when I usually see him play?

You usually see him play for a conservative Ireland team,things are about to change.

by nganboy Thu 11 Jul 2013, 1:40 am

What you think Sexton's going to be dropped?

by Artful_Dodger Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:02 am

nganboy wrote:What you think Sexton's going to be dropped?

I think he means Schmidt is going to turn is into the attacking outfit he turned Leinster into Wink

by asoreleftshoulder Thu 11 Jul 2013, 4:52 am

Artful_Dodger wrote:
nganboy wrote:What you think Sexton's going to be dropped?

I think he means Schmidt is going to turn is into the attacking outfit he turned Leinster into

by GloriousEmpire Thu 11 Jul 2013, 7:05 am

formerly known as Sam wrote:The Lions had slow ball and the hindrance of Phillips at 9. Your in the opponents half take the points and keep the pressure on. Winning a turnover in the opposition 22 boosts morale going another 3 doesn't. If you miss the opposition has to kick it back to you and your electric back three get to counter attack.

Take the points is the opposite of keep the pressure on. The point is that if sexton couldn't manufacture something in the position he was in, then conceding the ball and starting again either from a drop return or in their own half were both diabolical ideas - and as it transpired it was as after he needlessly turned over the ball, Australia scored and built their own pressure: by keeping ball in hand.

by Glas a du Thu 11 Jul 2013, 7:19 am

Simple rule of thumb on drop goals:

Goes over - wonderful play!
Goes wide - poor decision making...

by GloriousEmpire Thu 11 Jul 2013, 7:24 am

Tell that to Matt Dunning!

I think it would've been the wrong decision even if it went over.

I believe young men of the north have grown up with the silly marketing of Wilkinsons 2003 dg in their heads and they see a romantic notion if their own image superimposed into that frame. Unfortunately the frame is utterly out of context. World Cup final extra time? Absolutely. 19-3 up with a dominant pack? Patience, not self promotion is the order of the day.

by **LondonTiger** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 7:26 am

GloriousEmpire wrote:Patience, not self promotion is the order of the day.

A motto we all wish you would live by.

by GloriousEmpire Thu 11 Jul 2013, 7:28 am

Mate lets discuss rugby and not get personal. Disagree with the post, don't attack the poster should be your motto.

by mystiroakey Thu 11 Jul 2013, 7:35 am

Who did you used to be Glorious?- you remind me of someone budski!

by tigerleghorn Thu 11 Jul 2013, 7:43 am

I sense another Dr Who like re-incarnation is not too far away for our Kiwi friend.

by jimmyinthewell68 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 8:08 am

only thing i didnt like what sexton did was shake his head and have a little sulk when being substituted . i always think that's a sign of well Im a better player then him attitude

by **rodders** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:24 am

Sexton was one of the best players in the series, and tour full stop. He defended strongly, created a number of the tries and directed play for the Lions. His chips over the defence caused problems for the wallabies in each of the tests. Given that the scrum halves struggled in the test series his performances were all the more impressive. Along with Jones and Halfpenny he was the key man in each test.

The drop goal was the correct decision, after multiple phases of going nowhere, but the execution wasn't just there.

by mystiroakey Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:27 am

Sexton was fine. Did nothing wrong. Maybe it was a bit of a questionable kick- but so flipping what . It was just one moment in the game. Not a big deal tbh

by Exiledinborders Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:28 am

I thought Sexton played fine in third test. My only criticism of him in that game is that he reacted like a spoilt schoolboy when replaced by Farrell.

by aucklandlaurie Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:29 am

jimmyinthewell68 wrote:only thing i didnt like what sexton did was shake his head and have a little sulk when being substituted . i always think that's a sign of well Im a better player then him attitude

Sometimes you see players shake their head and have a little sulk, I always think its a sign that their drop kick didnt go over.

by **LondonTiger** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:30 am

rodders wrote:Sexton was one of the best players in the series, and tour full stop. He defended strongly, created a number of the tries and directed play for the Lions. His chips over the defence caused problems for the wallabies in each of the tests. Given that the scrum halves struggled in the test series his performances were all the more impressive. Along with Jones and Halfpenny he was the key man in each test.

The drop goal was the correct decision, after multiple phases of going nowhere, but the execution wasn't just there.

I agree with this last bit whole heartedly.

I struggle to agree with much of the first bit though. At times the Sexton I have seen for Leinster was there, but in general I felt that he was below par this tour.

by **rodders** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:35 am

If I was Sexton I'd have been frustrated at being subbed at that point as the Lions had been going through a sustained spell of Australian pressure and dominance and it was Sexton who, more than anyone else rallied those around him and the scored the crucial try to swing momentum back to the Lions.

If you watch that 10 minute period you can see heads dropping from a lot of the Lions players and Sexton is the one leading the charge, rallying his troops, encouraging the crowd and architecting the attack and defence.

That middle part of the second half won us the series and Sexton was at the heart of it.

by **rodders** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:40 am

LondonTiger wrote:
I struggle to agree with much of the first bit though. At times the Sexton I have seen for Leinster was there, but in general I felt that he was below par this tour.

I thought he played some of the best rugby of his career. He was playing a bit more controlled than at Leinster to fit the system but I thought his calling of the plays was excellent in every test.

He called the move for Cuthberts crucial try in the first half and again came up with the crucial score in the third.

The test series was very much about Genia v Sexton. Sexton was the key man in the Lions backline for sure. I thought he was superb.

by **LondonTiger** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:44 am

I guess we all see different things when we view a match as I certainly did not see it that way. Funny thing is we could both be right, and both be wrong.

by SecretFly Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:53 am

Exiledinborders wrote:I thought Sexton played fine in third test. My only criticism of him in that game is that he reacted like a spoilt schoolboy when replaced by Farrell.

That's why he was playing in three tests. That's why he's been so central to Leinster's success. That's him. He's not going to change. He's a passionate guy who shouts and moans and whines and demands as much of himself as he does of others around him... even Lord BOD has had bollockings from Mr Fumin'Sexton Wink

Long may it be part of his makeup. Plus none of us are dumb, we know what that was all about and it had nothing to do with Farrell coming on.

by aucklandlaurie Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:56 am

Im dumb, what was it about?

by **Ozzy3213** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:57 am

rodders wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:
I struggle to agree with much of the first bit though. At times the Sexton I have seen for Leinster was there, but in general I felt that he was below par this tour.

I thought he played some of the best rugby of his career. He was playing a bit more controlled than at Leinster to fit the system but I thought his calling of the plays was excellent in every test.

He called the move for Cuthberts crucial try in the first half and again came up with the crucial score in the third.

The test series was very much about Genia v Sexton. Sexton was the key man in the Lions backline for sure. I thought he was superb.

I thought Sexton was well below his best on tour and was actually very disappointed with what I saw from him. I expected more as he had been hyped up as the best 10 in the NH and according to some is second only to Dan Carter. I thought he was average at best through the series.

by jimmyinthewell68 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 10:19 am

he had a good tour but i will look out for him to see what he does in the AI

by SecretFly Thu 11 Jul 2013, 10:21 am

Ozzy3213 wrote:
rodders wrote:
LondonTiger wrote:
I struggle to agree with much of the first bit though. At times the Sexton I have seen for Leinster was there, but in general I felt that he was below par this tour.

I thought he played some of the best rugby of his career. He was playing a bit more controlled than at Leinster to fit the system but I thought his calling of the plays was excellent in every test.

He called the move for Cuthberts crucial try in the first half and again came up with the crucial score in the third.

The test series was very much about Genia v Sexton. Sexton was the key man in the Lions backline for sure. I thought he was superb.

I thought Sexton was well below his best on tour and was actually very disappointed with what I saw from him. I expected more as he had been hyped up as the best 10 in the NH and according to some is second only to Dan Carter. I thought he was average at best through the series.

He was playing with Phillips... for good chunks of two tests. He was the odd one out - not with any of his familiar 'units' - that were all the rage in the fashion stakes over the last few weeks Wink

Then Murray comes on and the prospects of a real 'unit' being formed again is cut short as Sexton is hauled in. He did grand for what was asked of him, considering the tactics applied in each game.