Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00

by yappysnap Sun 02 Feb 2014, 9:32 am

First topic message reminder :

Thought I'd start a thread to discuss next weeks game.

ENGLAND

England head coach Stuart Lancaster has kept faith with the side which lost to France and named an unchanged line-up for Saturday's match against Scotland.
Gloucester's Jonny May starts on the wing despite breaking his nose nine minutes into the 26-24 loss in Paris.
Courtney Lawes will be in the second row after his cheekbone bruising eased, while Danny Care and Owen Farrell form the half-back partnership.
"They're determined to put last week's result behind them," said Lancaster.
England will be hoping to avoid a third successive Test defeat, having lost to New Zealand in the autumn and France in the opening weekend of the Six Nations.
Scotland, however, were well beaten by Ireland on Sunday have not prevailed in the Calcutta Cup since their 15-9 win at Murrayfield in 2008.
"Scotland will be hugely motivated by their defeat in Dublin and, as we found two years ago, Murrayfield is a tough place to play," added Lancaster, who began his England reign with a 13-6 win against Scotland in 2012.
May is not expected to wear a protective face mask when he wins his third cap in Edinburgh.
Luther Burrell, who scored on his debut at the Stade de France, will make his second Test appearance at centre, while Jack Nowell takes up the right-wing spot for what will also be his second cap.
Wasps prop Matt Mullan will travel as the 24th man.

England XI v Scotland: Mike Brown (Harlequins, 22 caps), Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs, 1 cap), Luther Burrell (Northampton Saints, 1 cap), Billy Twelvetrees (Gloucester Rugby, 9 caps), Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby, 2 caps), Owen Farrell (Saracens, 20 caps), Danny Care (Harlequins, 43 caps), Joe Marler (Harlequins, 16 caps), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints, 51 caps), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers, 44 caps), Joe Launchbury (London Wasps, 15 caps), Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints, 26 caps), Tom Wood (Northampton Saints, 24 caps), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins, capt, 21 caps), Billy Vunipola (Saracens, 6 caps)
Replacements: Tom Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 13 caps), Mako Vunipola (Saracens, 11 caps), Henry Thomas (Sale Sharks, 2 caps), Dave Attwood (Bath Rugby, 6 caps), Ben Morgan (Gloucester Rugby, 16 caps), Lee Dickson (Northampton Saints, 13 caps), Brad Barritt (Saracens, 17 caps), Alex Goode (Saracens, 14 caps)

Scotland

Scots team:

1.grant
2.ford
3.low
4.swinson
5.hamilton
6.wilson
7.fusaro
8.denton
9.laidlaw
10.weir
11.lamont
12.scott
13.dunbar
14.seymor
15 hogg

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 12:53 pm

Exiledinborders wrote:
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:You also cant pretend it was a flawless victory. They dominated against weak opposition but to pretend that this makes England suddenly invincible is delusional. As does pretending Ireland are suddenly invincible after one big game over a distracted Wales side.
What we do know is that theres 3 teams in the title race now.

I think there are still four teams in the race. I would only write off Scotland and Italy as potential champions.

Wales? Theyve had their easiest fixture already and still sit in 4th place (assuming france beat italy otherwise it will be 5th) with a terrible points difference.
Even if the manage to finish 4-1 its unlikely theyd top the table.
Whilst statistically possible its highly unlikely, especially given how far off their potential they are. Youd get long odds them winning it from here.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 12:54 pm

TJ wrote:The scottish pitch has a parasite infection that has killed the root system

Thats a bit harsh on Scott Johnson

by TJ Sun 09 Feb 2014, 12:54 pm

mystiroakey wrote:Psw has however been very critical of England in recent weeks, and now is changing his tune to what everyone already knew.

The backs did ok yesterday.. Much better than before. So rather than saying they are still rubbish because they left a bit out there . Why not just understand that it was an improvement and understand you don't go from being a good team to a great team over night..

There is an upward curve in our performance..

I would agree with that. Workmanlike is the phrase I would use. England are still in a rebuilding phase and maybe coming to the end of it. A lot of combinations with little experience together and some inexperienced players. Work in progress and could be awesome in time for the next WC. Untapped potential remains untapped potential however.

by kiakahaaotearoa Sun 09 Feb 2014, 12:59 pm

Mike Brown back at fullback is the smart move. SL should take note that is his position. Seems picky to say England should've won by more. They shut out Scotland and never gave them a sniff. They got the win and have plenty to work on in the break to prepare for the Ireland game. Going to be fascinating seeing those two packs colliding as both seem to be in good form. Will Ireland take on England in the rolling maul like they did with Wales or will England decide to do the same. Then you have the flyhalf duel with Farrell and Sexton trying to put their stamp on the game and this shapes up to be a fascinating tactical battle. Normally England have the edge in the forwards but I see this year both sides evenly balanced. England at home should fancy themselves but the break comes at the right time for Ireland to prepare thoroughly. Ireland Wales was a disappointment but England Ireland shapes for some real fireworks up front.

by HammerofThunor Sun 09 Feb 2014, 1:08 pm

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
TJ wrote:The scottish pitch has a parasite infection that has killed the root system

Thats a bit harsh on Scott Johnson

Not really Smile

by TJ Sun 09 Feb 2014, 1:11 pm

SJ is a parasitic worm. I hope he has 1/10th of Robinsons integrity and walks.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 1:15 pm

Brown was a bit of a happy accident for Lancaster, getting his shout because of injuries and a lack of viable children at that time to step in who had the all round skillset required ...but he has been Englands most consistent player since getting his chances.
The decision that he should be the fullback was a strong one form Lancaster but it hasnt exactly taken a genius to keep him there.
Its really important for englands long term development that we get more players like this who are nailed on first choice over a period of years rather than months. Even if he has a dip he should be secure enough to retain a place, then we can talk about having a team not just a squad of players meeting for the first time.
Even Lancaster is admitting hes surprised by how quickly his centre partnership is developing, the worries about having so many untried combinations in the backs were and still are quite legitimate and shared by the coaching staff.
As it is the (partly enforced) gamble is paying off. Lets just hope the next twelve months sees an end to the chopping and changing and the current side plus the injured chaps and a coupe of other guys get a chance to devleop a real team and squad that has some experience and doesnt play like the first 20 minutes against France.

by mystiroakey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 1:21 pm

'Viable children'

What are you talking about.

You really don't like SL do you?

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 1:49 pm

Re Brown gloating: @mikebrown_15: @matt9dawson @brianmoore666 haha good point matt! Btw wasn't goading him, just happy to score & laughing at the chat he was giving me!

@brianmoore666: @mikebrown_15 @matt9dawson If that's the case Mike - I was wrong and I apologise.

by lostinwales Sun 09 Feb 2014, 1:55 pm

TJ wrote:What do I base that on?

they have the best 10 around right now
They are playing the right tactics and vary them for each game / opposition
they have a settled experienced team
They absolutely destroyed last years champions
They have confidence and team ethic
They have no obvious weak points

Now England are not a bad side but are not the finished article yet and I don't think they have the tactical flexibility or understanding of each other to beat Ireland

Ireland just have that extra bit of something that separates the great from the good

Its just on the showing so far but to any neutral Ireland are clearly the best side FROM WHAT WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR

Maybe - but then the less experienced version of the current England team showed considerable tactical flexibility and understanding to stuff Ireland twice in a row.

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 1:56 pm

Ireland won't hump us- not at HQ and not with the team very hard to breakdown unless some stupid subs are made...- and we won't hump them. It will be close

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 2:07 pm

Cyril wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:I am just hoping one of Ireland or Wales can beat France.. SO the tourney is open
Is it too much to hope Italy can do it today?

Answer: Probably yes.

If they lose to us, Ireland will be fired up and beat France, that's the opponent who they have struggled to beat and I think they will beat France

by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sun 09 Feb 2014, 2:17 pm

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
TJ wrote:The scottish pitch has a parasite infection that has killed the root system

Thats a bit harsh on Scott Johnson

Nicest thing I've heard him called in the last 2 days

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 2:37 pm

mystiroakey wrote:'Viable children'

What are you talking about.

My point being had there been a fit on form 20 year old "wingback" available at that point would Lancaster have picked Brown over him?
He got his place in the squad as a replacement because Sharples was injured. He lost his place in the starting side when Sharples was fit and they wanted Goodes ability to act as a second fly half. He won he place back on the wing when sharples took another knock.
It took another year for him to finally be allowed to start games at fullback, after being probably the only 16 cap winger to never have scored a try. Noone has really disputed he should continue since.
Id heavily dispute that Lancaster always had him earmarked as his first choice fullback,but as I said it was a strong decidion to put him in ahead of Foden when he did and has proven to be a good decision. I still think though if he hadnt been desperately mucking about with his wings at that point and short of a strong contender from the youth team he would ever have done it.
Its not a complaint, just observation. Many teams develop through a mixture of gambles, shrewd judgement, dead ends, chance and injuries.

by mystiroakey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 2:39 pm

It sounded like you think sl is picking kids for the sake of picking kids..

by Geordie Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:32 pm

mystiroakey wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:How many points does Farrell miss for,England!

Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!

Ireland are going to hump us big time.
yeah thats right.

you having a bad day or something..

what is it that you expect ?

and do you think Ireland are a bunch of superheros?

Excuse me?!!

Im not criticising Farrells play, im saying for a guy whos supposed to be a metronomic kicker he doesn't half miss some for England.

What do I expect? The benchmark is NZ and SA....and they would have put 60 points on Scotland yesterday....FACT!!!

There was some decent performances .....no more!

No more hiding away from it...we're not good enough.

by mystiroakey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:35 pm

Grow up lad .You have no given right to expect to be the best. I take it you won't be happy until you wake up one morning and we have transformed miraculously in to the best team in the world..

Just be patient. Watch the growth.. It takes time..

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:36 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:How many points does Farrell miss for,England!

Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!

Ireland are going to hump us big time.
yeah thats right.

you having a bad day or something..

what is it that you expect ?

and do you think Ireland are a bunch of superheros?

Excuse me?!!

Im not criticising Farrells play, im saying for a guy whos supposed to be a metronomic kicker he doesn't half miss some for England.

What do I expect? The benchmark is NZ and SA....and they would have put 60 points on Scotland yesterday....FACT!!!

There was some decent performances .....no more!

No more hiding away from it...we're not good enough.

If we beat Ireland, would that be good enough?

by WELL-PAST-IT Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:39 pm

Sorry GF, can't agree. That pitch stopped any attempts at decent rugby. Every time lateral pressure was put on the turf i.e. a sidestep of swerve the turf gave way. Full and frontal was the only way. It would have been the same for any side, if you had said 30-40 it might have been realistic, especially with the rain and the mud.

Nothing is a FACT that cannot be proved, other than Worcester will get relegated and Saints will win the AP final, they are both obvious.

The Ireland game will be the one the shows how far we have come, hopefully in decent conditions.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:40 pm

Well France are laying down a marker against Italy. They are obviously defensively weak though having shipped 3 points Rolling Eyes

by mystiroakey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:43 pm

Yep I think that the France result puts things into perspective.

It show how bad Wales form is and how good Frances is..

Ireland have done ok. But to think they will smash England is nonsense

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:44 pm

To be fair, Italy have made such horrible basic errors, and one of France's tries was flukey. Ireland will beat France. We should beat Ireland

by mystiroakey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:45 pm

I really can't see Ireland beaten France.. I am hoping they do..

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:46 pm

mystiroakey wrote:I really can't see Ireland beaten France.. I am hoping they do..

Why not?

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:48 pm

France, a couple of sparks aside, still don't look that good, how did we lose again? Oh yeah. I tried to forget...

by mystiroakey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:48 pm

France just look really good..

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:50 pm

mystiroakey wrote:France just look really good..

You and are watching different matches, evidently. They look ok.

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:50 pm

Italy were pretty bloody poor

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:51 pm

As in, ok in lots of areas, but handle about as well as a team as 36 in the first half vs France- ie abysmal.

by mystiroakey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:51 pm

ChequeredJersey wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:France just look really good..

You and are watching different matches, evidently. They look ok.

They look ok, as do England and Ireland.

Maybe I should have said really ok thumbsup

by Geordie Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:53 pm

Grow up?? Whatever Mysti!

I don't expect us to miraculously be the best in the world but I do have expectations and we're not there sorry.

That was a poor Scotland side and regardless of the pitch we should be putting them away better than we did.

We'll beat Italy but I really cant see us beating any other sides this 6n.

by TJ Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:55 pm

France look mercurial and dangerous in a way no other team has - they have the ability to score out of the blue and at long range and the willingness to attack from deep. Played a very unstructured game today. Will Irelands defense be able to handle them? England couldn't

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:56 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Grow up?? Whatever Mysti!

I don't expect us to miraculously be the best in the world but I do have expectations and we're not there sorry.

That was a poor Scotland side and regardless of the pitch we should be putting them away better than we did.

We'll beat Italy but I really cant see us beating any other sides this 6n.

Fair enough. I think we will beat Wales and Ireland too, but fair enough. Pessimism followed by surprise joy is easier than optimistism followed by heartbreak, I suppose.

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:57 pm

TJ wrote:France look mercurial and dangerous in a way no other team has - they have the ability to score out of the blue and at long range and the willingness to attack from deep. Played a very unstructured game today. Will Irelands defense be able to handle them? England couldn't

Depends if Ireland play players in position. If they do, then yes. Easily.

by doctor_grey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:57 pm

You are my hero!!!!

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:....Nothing is a FACT that cannot be proved, other than Worcester will get relegated and Saints will win the AP final, they are both obvious....

Just don't be jinxing Saints now, mind. The Premiership final is two days after my birthday, and is on my birthday weekend. What a great present. I deserve it. We all do.

by Duty281 Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:58 pm

From the two rounds of games thus far in the Six Nations, I would say Ireland look the best team, closely followed by England. Then France, a bit of daylight, then Wales (who have woefully underperformed so far), followed by Italy and Scotland.

It's going to be a big ask for England to turn the points difference around and hope that other games go their way so they can win the title, so I wouldn't worry about that for now.

Just win the next 3 games and play well...keep the upward curve going ahead of 2015. As I've previously said, the Six Nations is the least important event of England's year...the summer tour and the Autumn Internationals will tell Lancaster so much more.

by Nachos Jones Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:58 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:

That was a poor Scotland side and regardless of the pitch we should be putting them away better than we did.

We'll beat Italy but I really cant see us beating any other sides this 6n.

I think that England did reasonable well considering the conditions. Really never looked out of control so there was no real need to risk the expansive game and try to rack up the points as it wasn't the conditions to do so.

I can see you beating us Irish at Twickers and I can certainly see you beating Wales and Italy. It will be between England, France and Ireland come the end I feel with nothing between them.

by SecretFly Sun 09 Feb 2014, 4:59 pm

Maybe I'll be foolish and proved completely wrong but after two weeks, and with two big away games for us against England and France, based on what I've seen, the England game is a much more dangerous prospect.... in theory.

Having said that, they both might slaughter us Wink

Schit happens. but for now, England are the big challenge.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 5:10 pm

Started watching thi sback with the commentary which I missed live, a few observations:

1) Moore does know what Glee is no matter what he says for comedy effect
2) Nematodes are described using the same terminology that Alan Partridge did for Thai Ladyboys
3) Danny Care varying his play is the key to the space englands backs are finding.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 5:42 pm

ChequeredJersey wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:How many points does Farrell miss for,England!

Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!

Ireland are going to hump us big time.
yeah thats right.

you having a bad day or something..

what is it that you expect ?

and do you think Ireland are a bunch of superheros?

Excuse me?!!

Im not criticising Farrells play, im saying for a guy whos supposed to be a metronomic kicker he doesn't half miss some for England.

What do I expect? The benchmark is NZ and SA....and they would have put 60 points on Scotland yesterday....FACT!!!

There was some decent performances .....no more!

No more hiding away from it...we're not good enough.

If we beat Ireland, would that be good enough?

http://www.espn.co.uk/six-nations-2014/rugby/story/214167.html

by nathan Sun 09 Feb 2014, 5:47 pm

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Brown was a bit of a happy accident for Lancaster, getting his shout because of injuries and a lack of viable children at that time to step in who had the all round skillset required ...but he has been Englands most consistent player since getting his chances.
The decision that he should be the fullback was a strong one form Lancaster but it hasnt exactly taken a genius to keep him there.
Its really important for englands long term development that we get more players like this who are nailed on first choice over a period of years rather than months. Even if he has a dip he should be secure enough to retain a place, then we can talk about having a team not just a squad of players meeting for the first time.
Even Lancaster is admitting hes surprised by how quickly his centre partnership is developing, the worries about having so many untried combinations in the backs were and still are quite legitimate and shared by the coaching staff.
As it is the (partly enforced) gamble is paying off. Lets just hope the next twelve months sees an end to the chopping and changing and the current side plus the injured chaps and a coupe of other guys get a chance to devleop a real team and squad that has some experience and doesnt play like the first 20 minutes against France.

jeez what do people have to do in order for you to give them credit? "it was a happy accident", Brown didn't select himself you know, that would of been Lancaster's selection to cover an injury. There were many others he could of chose.

Lancaster actually said he was happy with the work the coaches were doing with them (centres) and how it was paying off. Bit different from saying he as surprised.

Why do i get the feeling you've already made your mind up on the coaching setup and your just waiting for them to fail?

by nathan Sun 09 Feb 2014, 5:48 pm

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
ChequeredJersey wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:How many points does Farrell miss for,England!

Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!

Ireland are going to hump us big time.
yeah thats right.

you having a bad day or something..

what is it that you expect ?

and do you think Ireland are a bunch of superheros?

Excuse me?!!

Im not criticising Farrells play, im saying for a guy whos supposed to be a metronomic kicker he doesn't half miss some for England.

What do I expect? The benchmark is NZ and SA....and they would have put 60 points on Scotland yesterday....FACT!!!

There was some decent performances .....no more!

No more hiding away from it...we're not good enough.

If we beat Ireland, would that be good enough?

http://www.espn.co.uk/six-nations-2014/rugby/story/214167.html

They didn't play at Muddeyfield though

by flyhalffactory Sun 09 Feb 2014, 5:49 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:What do I expect? The benchmark is NZ and SA....and they would have put 60 points on Scotland yesterday....FACT!!!

If it hasn't happened how could it be a FACT

Kinda strange rationale that

by mystiroakey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 5:50 pm

odd thing to say by Falcon when NZ only just scraped past Ireland, France and England,

BUt yeah lol ok!

by ChequeredJersey Sun 09 Feb 2014, 5:51 pm

flyhalffactory wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:What do I expect? The benchmark is NZ and SA....and they would have put 60 points on Scotland yesterday....FACT!!!

If it hasn't happened how could it be a FACT

Kinda strange rationale that

I think he's making a call back to the old board. Where people used to end their arguments with "FACT. End of."

by DaveM Sun 09 Feb 2014, 5:53 pm

Well I thought that was anther step forward. Those were very difficult conditions, and England played some pretty decent rugby considering. Yes they left some chances out there, but they are creating them from open play, which is promising. Farrell appears to be improving his creative play at some pace.

I thought the centres did a good job and the wingers involved themselves in a very pleasing way. After the JWC I thought Nowell had a real shot of being the starting winger in the opening game of the 2015 WC, and I'm not seeing anything to change my mind. May's strength in contact is a pleasant surprise. I can see the back division really starting to settle down from here. Replace Barritt with Tuilagi on the bench (able to cover wing or centre) and we are getting somewhere. And if anyone loses form there are players like Yarde, Wade, Miller and Daly to apply pressure. Strength in depth looks like it is there, as long as Ford can step up and Ben Youngs finds some form.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 6:22 pm

nathan wrote:
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
ChequeredJersey wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
mystiroakey wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:How many points does Farrell miss for,England!

Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!

Ireland are going to hump us big time.
yeah thats right.

you having a bad day or something..

what is it that you expect ?

and do you think Ireland are a bunch of superheros?

Excuse me?!!

Im not criticising Farrells play, im saying for a guy whos supposed to be a metronomic kicker he doesn't half miss some for England.

What do I expect? The benchmark is NZ and SA....and they would have put 60 points on Scotland yesterday....FACT!!!

There was some decent performances .....no more!

No more hiding away from it...we're not good enough.

If we beat Ireland, would that be good enough?

http://www.espn.co.uk/six-nations-2014/rugby/story/214167.html

They didn't play at Muddeyfield though

Yeah but the opposition was a lot better Whistle

by stub Sun 09 Feb 2014, 6:26 pm

DaveM wrote:Well I thought that was anther step forward. Those were very difficult conditions, and England played some pretty decent rugby considering. Yes they left some chances out there, but they are creating them from open play, which is promising. Farrell appears to be improving his creative play at some pace.

I thought the centres did a good job and the wingers involved themselves in a very pleasing way. After the JWC I thought Nowell had a real shot of being the starting winger in the opening game of the 2015 WC, and I'm not seeing anything to change my mind. May's strength in contact is a pleasant surprise. I can see the back division really starting to settle down from here. Replace Barritt with Tuilagi on the bench (able to cover wing or centre) and we are getting somewhere. And if anyone loses form there are players like Yarde, Wade, Miller and Daly to apply pressure. Strength in depth looks like it is there, as long as Ford can step up and Ben Youngs finds some form.

Couldn't agree more. Need to give Tom Youngs some time off to recapture his throwing confidence too though... I think 0-20 is a fantastic result whatever problems the Scottish team are having. The Ireland match is going to be very telling - a strong performance by England in that one will really fill me with confidence. It's going to be a long 2 weeks!

by SecretFly Sun 09 Feb 2014, 6:31 pm

Why do the English always feel compelled to talk about who should and shouldn't be part of a party that belongs to all?

Paul Hayward in the Telegraph doesn't feel inclined to look at what Scotland needs to get their team firing competitively again (Vern Cotter, etc for example) but instead just decides to insult an entire nation by saying it doesn't even deserve to be in the great competition.

Nice winning mentality, Paul - graceful Smile

He's careful to cover himself and say it isn't "English Arrogance" talking. But yes, Paul - it very much is.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/sixnations/10627088/Six-Nations-2014-Scotland-are-not-fit-to-be-a-part-of-this-great-tournament.html

by stub Sun 09 Feb 2014, 6:35 pm

SecretFly wrote:Why do the English always feel compelled to talk about who should and shouldn't be part of a party that belongs to all?

Paul Hayward in the Telegraph doesn't feel inclined to look at what Scotland needs to get their team firing competitively again (Vern Cotter, etc for example) but instead just decides to insult an entire nation by saying it doesn't even deserve to be in the great competition.

Nice winning mentality, Paul - graceful He's careful to cover himself and say it isn't "English Arrogance" talking. But yes, Paul - it very much is.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/sixnations/10627088/Six-Nations-2014-Scotland-are-not-fit-to-be-a-part-of-this-great-tournament.html

Some English may feel that way Fly (Paul for instance) but not all of us. Erm

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