England vs India - Second Test - Lords

First topic message reminder :

Seeming as we have such a short turnaround thought I'd stick up a thread

England have added Simon Kerrigan to the squad interestingly. I'd imagine he must be in serious contention, or else what's the point of adding another body?

319 to chase then. I make India favourites, but I wouldn't rule out a gallant, heroic English victory. I remember the first test against Sri Lanka two years ago..twas a nail-biter!

One batsman will have to make a big score, he'll need able support from at least two of his fellow batsmen. No more than two down at the close and it's on!

Come on England!

To be honest if I was Cook, I'd just go out and try and smash the cover off it

What in the blue hell is Warne's point here

And the collapse begins

Think England need to get after Jadeja, can't let him bowl from one end keeping pressure on, and he's not that good that he can't be got after

Bizarre from Dhoni bowling Vijay this much when Cook has been a duck for Kumar

Dhoni standing back to a spinner #headsgone

Dhoni doing a fantastic job of making Prior look like James Foster

New ball not doing much damage. That gives England abig chance. Alastair Cook, England's most important playher against spin, has survived the new ball.
Faf and AB, McCullum and Watling and then Neesham. Are we in for another of those?

Becoming more and more convinced this series is just an incredible crap off between two incompetent sides. And its beautiful

England are scoring at close to 3 an over. If they reach 130 for 1 or 2 down, they will be hot favorites going into the final day.
Ball is doing a bit for the spinners, but Bhuvi hasn't bowled enough with the new ball. Strange tactics from Dhoni.

Long as you've got runs on the board, you're still in it. Who would have thought Sri Lanka would fold like a cheap deck of cards in two sessions on a raging turner, with a spinner taking only one wicket?

England hasn't been scoring too many of late, but they are making ksmall progress. The key here is to close out the day not more than 2 down. Even if they get to a hundred by stumps only for 1 or 2, that will be England's day. Cook and Balance putting up a 50 + partnership, the England skipper, who is key in countering the Indian spin threat, has survived for almost 28 overs out there. Not looking good for India.......

msp83 wrote:England hasn't been scoring too many of late, but they are making ksmall progress. The key here is to close out the day not more than 2 down. Even if they get to a hundred by stumps only for 1 or 2, that will be England's day. Cook and Balance putting up a 50 + partnership, the England skipper, who is key in countering the Indian spin threat, has survived for almost 28 overs out there. Not looking good for India.......

Easy there msp, you still got a big lead and the ball is spinning and creating chances

Shami gives India a break. They would need at least one more before stumps to feel comfortable. Cook, despite his recent struggles can be a major problem for India here. Bell and Root can all play spin alright.

Olly wrote:

msp83 wrote:England hasn't been scoring too many of late, but they are making ksmall progress. The key here is to close out the day not more than 2 down. Even if they get to a hundred by stumps only for 1 or 2, that will be England's day. Cook and Balance putting up a 50 + partnership, the England skipper, who is key in countering the Indian spin threat, has survived for almost 28 overs out there. Not looking good for India.......

Easy there msp, you still got a big lead and the ball is spinning and creating chances

Olly, as you'd have read above, its been well over a thousand days since India won overseas. Our aging side had lost touch, and the new young side hasn't learned to close out the deal in big moments. So I am expecting a calamity any time. Cook surviving thus far is a terrible sign for India.

Bell's place surely under threat

msp83 wrote:

Olly wrote:

msp83 wrote:England hasn't been scoring too many of late, but they are making ksmall progress. The key here is to close out the day not more than 2 down. Even if they get to a hundred by stumps only for 1 or 2, that will be England's day. Cook and Balance putting up a 50 + partnership, the England skipper, who is key in countering the Indian spin threat, has survived for almost 28 overs out there. Not looking good for India.......

Easy there msp, you still got a big lead and the ball is spinning and creating chances

Olly, as you'd have read above, its been well over a thousand days since India won overseas. Our aging side had lost touch, and the new young side hasn't learned to close out the deal in big moments. So I am expecting a calamity any time. Cook surviving thus far is a terrible sign for India.

MSP not even your lot can throw this away against our current shambles

Another 18 overs remaining in the day's play. If England score another 45 50 runs, then they would be around 120. Scoring 200 on the last day is very much possible if they have wickets in hand.
Remember India do not have a Dale Steyn or a Morne Morkel or a Mitchell Johnson in their ranks. Not even Ravichandran Ashwin for that matter.......!

England 3 down, yet Alastair cook is there.......
Not spin, but the seamers doing damage for India. Shami, and now Ishant.

Cook fails again, could put that dismissal on repeat

This cannot go on, we've gotta do something to change this

We've got to get Alastair cook the batsman bacm

And he fought so hard. I don't even know if he can take heart from that innings. Just keep working I suppose

So Cook won't be the man of calamity for India in this game. Root? Ali? Prior or bloody Anderson!? Who is it going to be?

Ali is a positive and dangerous player. That start was as emphatic as they come.

India will be desperate to get Joe Root's wicket.

The lower order of England is pretty hit and miss.

Alastair Cook has been worked out good and proper. Unless Cook can start scoring off the front foot, his goose is cooked.

Moeen Ali's only test hundred came in similar circumstances. He has got a cool mindset. He was denied ones, will he take it out on India?

Ian Bell, rumoured to be next captain, is barely worthy of being in the Test side.

His poor run of form was masked by the 3 x 100 in the 2013 Ashes.

He's now scored only 4 x 100 in last 61 innings.

Gerry SA wrote:Ian Bell, rumoured to be next captain, is barely worthy of being in the Test side.

His poor run of form was masked by the 3 x 100 in the 2013 Ashes.

He's now scored only 4 x 100 in last 61 innings.

Indeed. He's gone under the radar thanks to Cook and Prior's equally awful form, and the fact he looks pretty for his 20's.

This could be near enough done tonight if India grab one more wicket, the lower order could fold quickly.

Looks like Olly's 80/4 prediction will be near-enough correct. And my pre-series prediction that India would beat England moves a little closer.

Cook's problem is similar to one that Trescothick suffered from; hopefully he can get over it just the same.

luckily root is in.

The only player we have that can turn the tide and stick about till the end of the innings. He has been in these positions way to often in his short career where experience players stick all the pressure on him , but he can pull it of and has done plenty of times already.

Root and Ali putting together a bit of a partnership. At 105-4, England aren't out of it as yet. One time a bit ahead, but the other side closly behind. Set up for an exciting final day.

it was a great day to be at lords. Game is over.
even miracles won't save Eng here.
every over in the last 7 odd overs there was a near wicket.
Jadeja is making the ball explode and even vijay n dhawan were a handful.
seamers still have something in it...ishant bowled a great spell. If eng do very well, they might get to 200, unlikely though.
Jadeja's day and it might be tomm also.
Binny gone, rohit will return me thinks

India firmly in the driving seat, will take something special from an Englishman to win the game for them from here on in

Cook cannot continue on like this. I don't know what to do, strip him of the captaincy, drop him, I dunno but what I do know is that if we don't do something, we could very well be seeing the dying embers of his career.

Ian Bell also needs his place to be put under serious threat.

i had a chance to talk to Ramprakash and Stewart, at length , they were there to mingle in the hospitality boxes with guests and both were firm.....ECB inside news......Cook will not be dropped as a captain.
If he decides to quit, they will still pick him as a batsman.
and we know in the last game Cook said he does not quit, so we will see him through this series

Well if these two batsmen can take England past the halfway mark, then hope may start springing up again!

Paul Farbrace on whether the form of senior players is a concern: "No, not at all." 

I sincerely hope that he doesn't believe that and is just trying to publicly back the senior players in a weird way. If he does believe that, then my word...

"@legsidelizzy: Asked about the senior players' form he said "the main thing is they are contributing in and around the dressing room". #okthen"

THAT'S NOT THE MAIN THING

All about a happy dressing room right guys! What a joke. Batsmen are there to score runs, bowlers to take wickets no matter who you are.

Cook is shot but should drop the captaincy and focus on batting.

Bell has been poor for almost a year now but like others have said, other's form and the KP saga have been a welcome distraction.

Broad and Anderson have bowler poor for almost 3 series now. Constantly bowling short, not taking wickets. If it was Finn or Plunkett doing the same they'd be out the door. These two should be no different.

Bell/Prior/Cook/Anderson/Broad should seriously be considered for being dropped if they fail in the next test. Prior should be dropped now though. His body is failing him and if he fails in this innings he must certainly be out the door and Buttler the new man with the gloves.

That's a lot of dropped players.
Who would be your team then, Liam?

I wouldn't drop all of them at once obviously, but you can only rest on past glories so much.

my team:

cook
robson
ballance
bell
ali
root
stokes
buttler
Jordan
anderson
Plunkett/Finn

Anderson's not been at his best, but he's still our best bowler. And let's not forget how good Broad was in Aus, he had a genuinely good series, made even better by the context in which he performed. Calls for them to be dropped our madness.

Prior should be gone if he doesn't get any this knock. Cook shouldn't be skipper, deserves a chance to try and regain his form without the captaincy though. Bell gets until the end of the series too for me, despite the fact he may not deserve it.

Hopefully long term:

Cook
Robson - Remain unconvinced
Ballance - Good it upstairs, which is more important than technique a lot of the time
Taylor
Root
? Not sure about Ali, and Styokes can't bat 6 at the moment
Foster/Read for the series as (C), Buttler long term
Stokes - Maybe a spinner and he competes with Jordan/Finn for the third seamer
Jordan - think he's a better bet than Plunkett, keep eyes on Finn though
Broad
Anderson

Broad is injured, no?

My worry with Broad is that he clearly isn't fully fit. He's barely above 80mph some of the time, and he's hobbling about the field. Personally I think we should rest him for the fourth test and Anderson for the third test. Both need a game off otherwise they're going to be run into the ground. And that's good for nobody

Prior has to go, done nothing to deserve his recall and has done nothing to justify it. Buttler can do no worse that's for sure.

Bell/Cook is interesting. Both stay in for me, a lack of viable alternatives imo, but both on a short leash. They have to start scoring serious runs. 

As for captaincy, maybe a little out there, but I'd really look to the future and maybe give it to Root. 

All the newbies are doing well imo. Robson a little shaky, but scored a good hundred. Ballance is gonna be a star imo, Ali is bowling tidily now (very well this match) and his batting is good, Stokes is bowling very well, batting awful tho. Plunkett has been a revelation, let him bowl normally none of this stupid leg theory round the wicket nonsense

No Kerrigan?

It's a difficult situation. The change room atmosphere is important but how long it will last is another question. I think the side has a few glaring weaknesses and is very unbalanced.

I'd probably persevere with Broad (needs to get his tail up again with some wickets) and look at strengthening the top order. Doesn't Ali bat higher up usually? Then get a proper spinner in the mix somehow. Prior should probably make way for Buttler as everyone is saying. Just feel there a few players on the verge of turning things around but I realise this series has been agonisingly frustrating thus far for England fans. Oddly enough, I'd like to see Cook smile more. Decent catch which would help his confidence but the pressure on him is immense.

I think India should get through this Test with a well deserved win even though their bowling isn't too fearsome and their batting has been mostly under par overall. However, they have looked that little bit hungrier to me - and the sniff of blood should inspire them to get the job finished tomorrow.

We need all our remaining players to keep their heads and bat like they can to have any chance. That means Prior and Stokes sorting his life out, Root staying in, and Broad playing like he did last test not last innings

Yeah, I'd agree that Anderson and Broad need a rest. Been bowled into the ground.

Ali's bowled decent in this game, but he did get carted about at TB. Still not convinced. Always like to have a proper spinner in the team. I'm still doubtful of Plunkett, but he deserves a chance for the rest of this series at least. Ali's batting has been ropey too, one great knock but thrown it away a lot around that.

JDizzle wrote:Yeah, I'd agree that Anderson and Broad need a rest. Been bowled into the ground.

Ali's bowled decent in this game, but he did get carted about at TB. Still not convinced. Always like to have a proper spinner in the team. I'm still doubtful of Plunkett, but he deserves a chance for the rest of this series at least. Ali's batting has been ropey too, one great knock but thrown it away a lot around that.

I think with Ali and the way he bats sometimes he will get out playing loose shots, but ultimately he's got it in him to play special knocks, so you've gotta take the rough with the smooth.

His bowling is not too bad I don't think, he's got decent fundamentals, he just needs more experience and practice to cut out the bad balls. Not saying he'll ever be a front line guy, but he could be a very decent all rounder type.

Anyways I'm going to be very disappointed if we see no Chris Woakes soon. I need some Woakes/Stokes in my life

Hmm, I just find it ironic that Ali is meant to be this flashy stroke player who can play these special knocks, but comfortably the best International innings he has played is when he's had to dig in and bat time! He's probably going to get the rest of this series, bar some tinkering if Kerrigan plays, but I need to see some more from him.

The best captain candidate is Morgan but you'd then have to find a new opener and drop a middle order batter.