Super Saturday, Game 2: Scotland v Ireland

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SCOTLAND v IRELAND
Saturday 21 March 2015
KO: 14:30
BT Murrayfield, Edinburgh

Referee: Jérôme Garcès (FFR)
AR1: Pascal Gauzere (FFR)
AR2: Federico Anselmi (UAR)
TMO: Graham Hughes (RFU)

***********************

A. Teams

SCOTLAND

15 Stuart Hogg (Glasgow Warriors)
14 Dougie Fife (Edinburgh Rugby)
13 Mark Bennett (Glasgow Warriors)
12 Matt Scott (Edinburgh Rugby)
11 Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors)
10 Finn Russell (Glasgow Warriors)
09 Greig Laidlaw (Gloucester)

01 Ryan Grant (Glasgow Warriors)
02 Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby)
03 Euan Murray (Glasgow Warriors)
04 Jim Hamilton (Saracens)
05 Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors)
06 Adam Ashe (Glasgow Warriors)
07 Blair Cowan (London Irish)
08 David Denton (Edinburgh Rugby)

16 Fraser Brown (Glasgow Warriors)
17 Alasdair Dickinson (Edinburgh Rugby)
18 Geoff Cross (London Irish)
19 Tim Swinson (Glasgow Warriors)
20 Rob Harley (Glasgow Warriors)
21 Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (Edinburgh Rugby)
22 Greig Tonks (Edinburgh Rugby)
23 Tim Visser (Edinburgh Rugby)

IRELAND

15 Rob Kearney (UCD/Leinster)
14 Tommy Bowe (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster)
13 Jared Payne (Ulster)
12 Robbie Henshaw (Buccaneers/Connacht)
11 Luke Fitzgerald (Blackrock/Leinster)
10 Johnny Sexton (Racing Metro)
09 Conor Murray (Garryowen/Munster)

01 Cian Healy (Clontarf/Leinster)
02 Rory Best (Banbridge/Ulster)
03 Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster)
04 Devin Toner (Lansdowne/Leinster)
05 Paul O'Connell (Young Munster/Munster) captain
06 Peter O'Mahony (Cork Constitution/Munster)
07 Sean O'Brien (UCD/Leinster)
08 Jamie Heaslip (Dublin University/Leinster)

16 Sean Cronin (St. Mary's College/Leinster)
17 Jack McGrath (St. Mary's College/Leinster)
18 Martin Moore (Lansdowne/Leinster)
19 Iain Henderson (Ballynahinch/Ulster)
20 Jordi Murphy (Lansdowne/Leinster)
21 Eoin Reddan (Lansdowne/Leinster)
22 Ian Madigan (Blackrock/Leinster)
23 Felix Jones (Shannon/Munster)

B. Head to Head

119 Played 119

58 Wins 56

56 Losses 58

5 Draws 5

187 Tries 200

96 Conversions 102

128 Penalties 104

32 Drop Goals 15

1,234 Points 1,301

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

Notch wrote:It means that whenever a Munster player gets dropped we get buried in an tidal wave of pure bullshitium, basically. It's both amusing and predictable. Last year you wanted Dave Kearneys head for a string of performances that were of pretty much exactly the same standard as Zebos so far. If Zebo was a Leinster player you wouldn't rate him on the basis of what he's produced in the last four games at all.

I rate Zebo higher than Fitzgerald but he hasn't exactly put down a marker for keeping the shirt. He'll be picked again soon, don't worry.

Funny that you accuse me of repeating myself when you constantly dredge up the provincial bias bile simply to goad Munster fans...  

Again, not about you. Not directed at you. Nothing to do with you.

Sin é wrote:

Notch wrote:It means that whenever a Munster player gets dropped we get buried in an tidal wave of pure bullshitium, basically. It's both amusing and predictable. Last year you wanted Dave Kearneys head for a string of performances that were of pretty much exactly the same standard as Zebos so far. If Zebo was a Leinster player you wouldn't rate him on the basis of what he's produced in the last four games at all.

What nonsense. With a winger with a bit of pace, Ireland would have won a Grand Slam last year (Kearney being run down by a prop when any other wing in the world would have been in for a try). He has turned Zebo from a pacy, try scoring wing into a backrow forward to resource rucks. Zebo has done everything asked of him and gets dropped. To actually say a player is 'relieved to be dropped' is just bonkers cowpat coming from him.

The problem is there are a few players who didn't perform last week (like Best, Sexton, Toner and Murray for starters), but there isn't even a hint of criticism of them. Schmidt should know that Best always gets the wobblies when up against a Gatland coached team.

To be fair Sin é, the Schmidt robot approach had to affect certain posters on here who aren't able to form their own opinions. We were bound to see a few parrots...

Notch wrote:

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

Notch wrote:It means that whenever a Munster player gets dropped we get buried in an tidal wave of pure bullshitium, basically. It's both amusing and predictable. Last year you wanted Dave Kearneys head for a string of performances that were of pretty much exactly the same standard as Zebos so far. If Zebo was a Leinster player you wouldn't rate him on the basis of what he's produced in the last four games at all.

I rate Zebo higher than Fitzgerald but he hasn't exactly put down a marker for keeping the shirt. He'll be picked again soon, don't worry.

Funny that you accuse me of repeating myself when you constantly dredge up the provincial bias bile simply to goad Munster fans...  

Again, not about you. Not directed at you. Nothing to do with you.

Did I say it was directed at me? NO. It was a simple observation of you repeating yourself, much like you accused me of.


If you are able to dish it out then you should be able to take it...

rodders wrote:

SecretFly wrote:

rodders wrote:[

Also one of the criticisms against Wales was the lack of leaders out wide, and the pack hogging the ball close to the line, so Fitz being a confident chap was probably picked for this.

So Fitz can shot louder and wave his hands faster?
This new attack plan is taking real shape now.

Well yes, he can....

..there was a clearly a bit too much of "please sir, can I have the ball...oh sorry .. please beg my parden sir, I'm just a humble kiwi/corkman, I didn't mean to speak out of turn and am grateful to be in your presence this afternoon" - rather than "hey fatty/baldy/slow coach stop fooking around at that bloody ruck and give me the feckin ball as I'm about to score here".

Like I said earlier. Don't worry Rodders. Fitz can score without the ball - he's that good. And maybe that's the real reason he was brought in - to do a host of deceptive scoring weaves, twists, shimmies and jinks....as actually someone quite boring is scoring across the field when the entire Scottish team is trying to stop Fitz getting through.

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Notch wrote:It means that whenever a Munster player gets dropped we get buried in an tidal wave of pure bullshitium, basically. It's both amusing and predictable. Last year you wanted Dave Kearneys head for a string of performances that were of pretty much exactly the same standard as Zebos so far. If Zebo was a Leinster player you wouldn't rate him on the basis of what he's produced in the last four games at all.

What nonsense. With a winger with a bit of pace, Ireland would have won a Grand Slam last year (Kearney being run down by a prop when any other wing in the world would have been in for a try). He has turned Zebo from a pacy, try scoring wing into a backrow forward to resource rucks. Zebo has done everything asked of him and gets dropped. To actually say a player is 'relieved to be dropped' is just bonkers cowpat coming from him.

The problem is there are a few players who didn't perform last week (like Best, Sexton, Toner and Murray for starters), but there isn't even a hint of criticism of them. Schmidt should know that Best always gets the wobblies when up against a Gatland coached team.

To be fair Sin é, the Schmidt robot approach had to affect certain posters on here who aren't able to form their own opinions. We were bound to see a few parrots...

Where has there not been criticism? There's been loads of criticism.

But in some positions - specifically the back row and wing there are more scope for changes than others.

The front 5 is a settled unit, hence to suggest dropping Best and Toner after one game is just stupid. McGrath is different as Healy would always be first choice if fit. I'd have stuck with McGrath but this is the bolder choice, which is what people have been asking for.

TOD has not been treated harshly - he's clearly O'Briens understudy at openside this year and has stepped in twice and done well, but Murphy is more versatile so a better bench option.

If people really try and be objective I think they'd see all the decisions make logical/tactical sense, which makes a change from previous Irish coaching regimes.

The poor Scots. I think they've been the most vocal sect this season. The Glasgow/Edinburgh banter threads were always stuffed with banter chat. They've outgunned most tribes this year.

And now they can't get a bloody word in because of a mad herd of Irish infighters tearing the place apart.

Would yis not for peace sake calm down a while and let a few Scottish people say a few things about their own team???!!!!

SecretFly wrote:
Like I said earlier.  Don't worry Rodders.  Fitz can score without the ball - he's that good.  And maybe that's the real reason he was brought in - to do a host of deceptive scoring weaves, twists, shimmies and jinks....as actually someone quite boring is scoring across the field when the entire Scottish team is trying to stop Fitz getting through.

Fitz also has a great scoring record against teams at the bottom of the 6N table

SecretFly wrote:The poor Scots.  I think they've been the most vocal sect this season.  The Glasgow/Edinburgh banter threads were always stuffed with banter chat.  They've outgunned most tribes this year.

And now they can't get a bloody word in because of a mad herd of Irish infighters tearing the place apart.

Would yis not for peace sake calm down a while and let a few Scottish people say a few things about their own team???!!!!  

Like I said! We need to ban a few of the Irish posters!

We need to get back discussing important matters like Glasgow's irn bru and buckfast culture!

rodders wrote:

TOD has not been treated harshly - he's clearly O'Briens understudy at openside this year and has stepped in twice and done well, but Murphy is more versatile so a better bench option.

If people really try and be objective I think they'd see all the decisions make logical/tactical sense, which makes a change from previous Irish coaching regimes.

But its not about TOD being SOB's understudy, its about picking form players. Right now TOD is in better form that SOB and is playing well. Why continue to select a player that is obviously still carrying a knock and is not fully fit when you have a more than capable replacement?

Nice idea!!! Banning a few Irish lads. Neat.

I'd start by banning everyone of them that never agree with me..........................

................................. em........................ scrap, that, I'd be left all on my own.

So we put in a winger with pace in Zebo and he's had the exact same lack of influence as Kearney did last year... Not happy to see him dropped, also certain it will not adversely affect our performance.

Regarding a host of players who would have been worried about their positions after last week, and I'd add Rob Kearney, Tommy Bowe, Sean O'Brien and Jamie Heaslip to the four you mention, I'd be the first to admit that those players did not play well, but for many of them there is a lack of like for like replacements in their positions. At least for Kearney, Best, Sexton and Murray anyway. Those last three just don't have players behind them who are close to their ability so they have to go through a more prolonged slump before it starts looking like the right decision. Cronin is as dodgy with his darts as Best can be, Madigan/Keatley is a big step down from Sexton, Reddan isn't at the same level as Murray anymore. I don't think Jones is anything more than a cut-price Kearney and while I think other guys could fill in for him, we'd have to move guys from the centre to replace Kearney, which is more disruptive than its worth. I would have had no problem if it was Kearney who was dropped with Zebo playing at fullback however. At test level I think Zebo would see more of the ball wearing 15 and I think the more touches of the ball he gets the more confident he becomes and the more he grows into the game. I would be keen to see him play more at 15 for Ireland, definitely more than Felix Jones. I would not have a problem if Toner was dropped, but I understand why he isn't. He offers something in the lineout other don't.

That leaves four under-performers we could conceivably drop- Tommy Bowe, Simon Zebo, Sean O'Brien and Jamie Heaslip. I would have dropped Zebo and O'Brien and brought in Tommy O'Donnell and Dave Kearney if I had to choose players to come in. Fitzgerald is much the same level as Kearney. Don't feel it would be wise to change the back three wholesale, two or three changes is getting towards tampering too much.

I would keep Heaslip because I believe he's got a much better game in him as he continues his comeback from injury, and also we just need experienced and calm heads to manage this game. O'Connell is one of the best Captains I've ever seen in my life, but we need plenty of other experienced guys on the field because we need to tread a fine balance between winning and putting up a score. Thats probably why O'Brien is still starting, but I think a bit like Healy was at the start of the tournament he's only half-fit and would be better as an impact substitute.

The guy who's really hard done by, the only guy who is hard done by apart from Tommy O'Donnell, is Jack McGrath. Don't see anyone shedding any tears for McGrath!

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

rodders wrote:

TOD has not been treated harshly - he's clearly O'Briens understudy at openside this year and has stepped in twice and done well, but Murphy is more versatile so a better bench option.

If people really try and be objective I think they'd see all the decisions make logical/tactical sense, which makes a change from previous Irish coaching regimes.

But its not about TOD being SOB's understudy, its about picking form players. Right now TOD is in better form that SOB and is playing well. Why continue to select a player that is obviously still carrying a knock and is not fully fit when you have a more than capable replacement?

Is he really playing better than SOB? I know he scored that great try against Italy and did well against England but you'd have to look at the stats to get the full picture - my feeling is SOB is not carrying as effectively but is still doing great work at the contact and getting through a lot of work.

Even if you accept on form there isn't much in it, then the question for me is if SOB has his best day and TOD has his best day who offers more? With respect to TOD I think that is fairly easy to answer.

Personally I'm surprised O'Mahoney isn't getting more criticism. For me he's been the weak link, has not been effective at all with his carrying and his work rate is miles of the other backrowers.

interesting stats on backlines,

IRELAND points/game age SCOTLAND points/game age


Kearney 0.84 28 Hogg 1.60 22
Bowe 2.33 31 Fife 1.00 24
Payne 0.00 29 Bennett 1.67 22
Henshaw 0.56 21 Scott 0.65 24
Fitzgerald 0.37 27 Seymour 1.88 26
Sexton 9.26 29 Russell 0.25 22
Murray 0.44 25 Laidlaw 8.82 29

2.0 27.1 2.3 24.1

rodders wrote:

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

rodders wrote:

TOD has not been treated harshly - he's clearly O'Briens understudy at openside this year and has stepped in twice and done well, but Murphy is more versatile so a better bench option.

If people really try and be objective I think they'd see all the decisions make logical/tactical sense, which makes a change from previous Irish coaching regimes.

But its not about TOD being SOB's understudy, its about picking form players. Right now TOD is in better form that SOB and is playing well. Why continue to select a player that is obviously still carrying a knock and is not fully fit when you have a more than capable replacement?

Is he really playing better than SOB? I know he scored that great try against Italy and did well against England but you'd have to look at the stats to get the full picture - my feeling is SOB is not carrying as effectively but is still doing great work at the contact and getting through a lot of work.

Even if you accept on form there isn't much in it, then the question for me is if SOB has his best day and TOD has his best day who offers more? With respect to TOD I think that is fairly easy to answer.

Personally I'm surprised O'Mahoney isn't getting more criticism. For me he's been the weak link, has not been effective at all with his carrying and his work rate is miles of the other backrowers.

Well personally, I feel that TOD has played better than SOB this 6N. As I said earlier in this thread, a fit and inform SOB starts everyday.

As for POM, well he has been Irelands best and most consistent performer this 6N. Had a quiet game against Wales but I more put that down to him having to do a lot of cover work for SOB and Heaslip.

As I have said for some time now, Kearney is my biggest worry at 15. He looks way off the pace of what we all know he can do.

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:
As for POM, well he has been Irelands best and most consistent performer this 6N. Had a quiet game against Wales but I more put that down to him having to do a lot of cover work for SOB and Heaslip.

Really? Consistantly not very good I'd say. Other than the odd set play at the lineout I've seen him do very little. Looks way off his best.

Kearney is not in great form I agree.

I don't think anyone has been poor though....not 100% but not poor. The selection calls have all been marginal and someone has to miss out.

rodders wrote:

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:
As for POM, well he has been Irelands best and most consistent performer this 6N. Had a quiet game against Wales but I more put that down to him having to do a lot of cover work for SOB and Heaslip.

Really? Consistantly not very good I'd say. Other than the odd set play at the lineout I've seen him do very little. Looks way off his best.

Kearney is not in great form I agree.

I don't think anyone has been poor though....not 100% but not poor. The selection calls have all been marginal and someone has to miss out.

Against France and especially England, I would have had POM as the man of the match.

To be fair, up against an unbalanced Scotland back row, with two eights starting ( two thirds towards Scott Johnson's dream back row), it wont matter much if SOB isn't at his best.

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:

rodders wrote:

Nachos Jones_1 wrote:
As for POM, well he has been Irelands best and most consistent performer this 6N. Had a quiet game against Wales but I more put that down to him having to do a lot of cover work for SOB and Heaslip.

Really? Consistantly not very good I'd say. Other than the odd set play at the lineout I've seen him do very little. Looks way off his best.

Kearney is not in great form I agree.

I don't think anyone has been poor though....not 100% but not poor. The selection calls have all been marginal and someone has to miss out.

Against France and especially England, I would have had POM as the man of the match.

Based on what? Genuine question - on all the stats he really isn't doing much for a blindside. Always single figures in the tackle count and not much in the way of carrying.

SecretFly wrote:The poor Scots.  I think they've been the most vocal sect this season.  The Glasgow/Edinburgh banter threads were always stuffed with banter chat.  They've outgunned most tribes this year.

And now they can't get a bloody word in because of a mad herd of Irish infighters tearing the place apart.

Would yis not for peace sake calm down a while and let a few Scottish people say a few things about their own team???!!!!  

Bless you Mr Fly. The trouble is that there were no surprises or contentious inclusions in the Scotland 23. Laughing Boy Cotter has avoided the path signposted, "Try out some players before the World Cup" and motored resolutely down the, "Play your best 15 and get them working together and winning to build up confidence". It's working out quite well. Performances are much better than last year and results are similarly on the up.
We could have picked Saturday's 15 before the England game, so what is there to say about it?
My gut feeling is that Frodo will be at 9 until he collects his pension, or Laughing Boy gets another job offer: whichever comes first. Frodo is; steady, reliable, hard-working, predictable, slow, unimaginative and couldn't take your breath away without the use of a garrotte. He is in fact the living embodiment of Laughing Boy's selection techniques. ( See me, I've been spoiled by the wonders of Toonie's Magic Tombola so I have.)
We know Chinhook will start all the important World Cup games, so why not give Fraser Brown a start this weekend to see how he copes? Ditto with Frodo and The Spaniard.
The lack of Scottish voices is, I think, because we've said it all over the previous four games.
Scotland can win but we need to show the same grit and resolution that the Welsh Walians showed last week while also attacking like we did in the second twenty against England for maybe slightly (about 60 minutes) longer.

Notch wrote:So we put in a winger with pace in Zebo and he's had the exact same lack of influence as Kearney did last year... Not happy to see him dropped, also certain it will not adversely affect our performance.

Kearney had an opportunity. At least he had passing centres inside him. Schmidt has selected non-passing centres.

Regarding a host of players who would have been worried about their positions after last week, and I'd add Rob Kearney, Tommy Bowe, Sean O'Brien and Jamie Heaslip to the four you mention, I'd be the first to admit that those players did not play well, but for many of them there is a lack of like for like replacements in their positions.

This is where I have a problem. Shouldn't Schmidt be able to come up with a gameplan that suits the players he has got at his disposal. He has one plan, thats it. He is Ireland's answer to Gatland.

At least for Kearney, Best, Sexton and Murray anyway. Those last three just don't have players behind them who are close to their ability so they have to go through a more prolonged slump before it starts looking like the right decision. Cronin is as dodgy with his darts as Best can be, Madigan/Keatley is a big step down from Sexton, Reddan isn't at the same level as Murray anymore. I don't think Jones is anything more than a cut-price Kearney and while I think other guys could fill in for him, we'd have to move guys from the centre to replace Kearney, which is more disruptive than its worth. I would have had no problem if it was Kearney who was dropped with Zebo playing at fullback however. At test level I think Zebo would see more of the ball wearing 15 and I think the more touches of the ball he gets the more confident he becomes and the more he grows into the game. I would be keen to see him play more at 15 for Ireland, definitely more than Felix Jones. I would not have a problem if Toner was dropped, but I understand why he isn't. He offers something in the lineout other don't.

All the problems stem from a lack of ball carriers. Best gets selected because he is good at the breakdown (to cover up for O'Brien and Heaslip). Sean Cronin is selected even though he can't throw straight and can't hook because he is a good ball carrier. Devin Toner is selected to provide an easy target for Best & Cronin.

Meanwhile, the only hooker (Duncan Casey) who can throw very well and can hook and scrummage can't even make the squad! Should he not be the option on the bench when the lineout is going to pieces, not another hooker who can't throw or hook?

That leaves four under-performers we could conceivably drop- Tommy Bowe, Simon Zebo, Sean O'Brien and Jamie Heaslip. I would have dropped Zebo and O'Brien and brought in Tommy O'Donnell and Dave Kearney if I had to choose players to come in. Fitzgerald is much the same level as Kearney. Don't feel it would be wise to change the back three wholesale, two or three changes is getting towards tampering too much.

The only effective game that Schmidt has played is kick and chase - and Zebo is better than Luke for that one. For the record, I'm delighted to see Luke back, but I don't think he is a winger. Kearney has been very poor all tournament. Why not start Jones at fullback. He has been training for the last 2 months with the squad.

I would keep Heaslip because I believe he's got a much better game in him as he continues his comeback from injury, and also we just need experienced and calm heads to manage this game. O'Connell is one of the best Captains I've ever seen in my life, but we need plenty of other experienced guys on the field because we need to tread a fine balance between winning and putting up a score. Thats probably why O'Brien is still starting, but I think a bit like Healy was at the start of the tournament he's only half-fit and would be better as an impact substitute.

Murphy played way better than Heaslip so far and the backrow was way more effective with POM, TOD & Murphy (v England). O'Brien is another player who the Welsh can chop tackle all day and who he makes no ground against.

The guy who's really hard done by, the only guy who is hard done by apart from Tommy O'Donnell, is Jack McGrath. Don't see anyone shedding any tears for McGrath!

I actually made the point that McGrath is very hard done by, but at least he hasn't been dumped out of the squad completely. He will get about 20 or 30 minutes. The only players that get dumped are Tommy O'Donnell & Zebo. As well as that, Felix Jones has been poorly treated as well.

Its not a question of marginal or even taking provincial bias out of the equation. Its the weirdness of the change. Why Zebo (why McGrath as well)?

What has happened now as in the discussion here is that the focus has been taken off the team failure last weekend and now its like "oh yeah Zebo was ineffective and lets focus on his deficiencies" etc. Whereas Zebo was about 1/15th at fault last weekend. Also lets look at McGrath v Healy. Doesnt make sense either, Healy was relatively ineffectual when he came on except for looking slightly manic, most commentators noted this on Sunday and that the major impacts came from Henderson/Cronin. By Tues/Weds when it looked like Healy was coming in it suddenly became "clear" that he had an effect...certainly the knock on was an effect but hey who's noting these.

Anyhow Zebo gets parachuted out of the match day squad and we are left with Felix (honest and trustworthy) to make an impact..

What should have happened is nothing. Give the team another chance should have been the approach given how well and effective players like Zebo and McGrath have been.

If there is a loss this weekend the six nations looks a whole lot different from before the weekend. As I said earlier we will have the bstard child of EOS and DK in charge with the possibility we are going to the world cup with bish/bosh methods that opposing teams will work out very easily.

From a purely munster perspective (and yes this is closed shop thinking) I wouldnt mind seeing players like Earls/Zebo and POM being jettisoned. Joe has already wrecked TODs confidence, has probably done a job on Zebo and POM is being changed from the player he is for Munster. If Joe gets near Earls god knows what will happen.

You know, as I sit here and read the firebrand stuff, I'm happy.  
We're back at least to fully analysing the true makeup of this Irish team.  That's good.  It all got way too smarmy when we were winning. And even though some of us were looking at performance from some players that left us unmoved, we still didn't have much arguing space to suggest changes.  After all, the only show in town everywhere - amongst the media and fans - was of how measured and pragmatic we were and how impressive everything was.  You try biting into that cake of fluff when things are going well and it a recipe for getting your head handed to you in Ireland.

So thank you Wales.  You've exposed a weak underbelly where complacency disguised a few home truths.  A lot still to work on before we can remotely say we're ready to do something much more effective at the next World Cup.  It's still bits and pieces, Joe still seems to be toying with things - there is no true fluidity between a containing and defensive minded kick/chase game and that more risky and rapid fight-back game.  I said we'd need to get the rust off such a game - and such a change of style and intent.   It failed against Wales... because it was allowed rust too much.  We need more variety - in action - through all future games before the World Cup.... not just on the training field behind the scenes.

"Six Nations: Scotland need to frustrate Ireland at Murrayfield
By Mike Blair
Former Scotland scrum-half

Scotland's next opponents Ireland are a team that seem to mix their tactics considerably, depending on who they are playing.

Against Wales in last week's 23-16 defeat, they looked to have identified a weakness between the ruck and the player defending the first receiver, the link zone. It's called the link zone as often it is the pivot between the last forward defending around the ruck and the first back.
They challenged this area in phase play with simple inside balls but had some clever set plays - the hallmark of head coach Joe Schmidt - up their sleeves too.

They also didn't kick competitively as often, or as effectively, as against England the week before - probably due to the strength of the Welsh back three's aerial game - preferring to look for grass and potential lineout opportunities. They are unlikely to tactically play Scotland in the same way.

Ireland will have done their homework on Scotland and will look to play with width during phase play to try and tire the Scottish forwards.

This will come secondarily to the two things that have been at the core of the Irish successes and where Ireland will attempt to pressurise Scotland - the driving maul and their competitive kicking game.

If Scotland can deal with these two aspects of the Irish game, like Wales generally did, then they go a long way to winning the game.

Sean O'Brien and Rory Best are the main jackal threats so they need to be effectively dealt with and they will look to choke tackle a bit more in this game. Ireland possibly feared the English scrum therefore didn't employ this tackle technique but it has previously been a real strength of the side.

Scotland's selection edges towards the realisation they need some more ball carriers. Win the gain line in the early phases and the game becomes a lot easier. If Dave Denton and Adam Ashe can give the backs front foot ball then it should be a great game.

It would be good to see Tommy Seymour get his hands on the ball a lot more, in counter attack and off Greig Laidlaw and Finn Russell's shoulder, as he is a terrific broken field runner. Scotland need to get their best attacking threats on the ball as much as possible. They need to put their hands up and help get the Scottish crowd on their feet.

Stuart Hogg needs to be used more within Scotland's exit strategy. He has an enormous boot and can relieve pressure with it. Scotland's competitive kicking and chase haven't been accurate enough. It's better giving Ireland the ball 30m further back if Scotland have a low percentage chance of winning back the ball from their competitive kicks.

A look through the Irish team reveals few weaknesses but the Welsh organised defence made Ireland look a little devoid of ideas. Scotland need to avoid the system errors of last week in the defeat by England and frustrate their opposition.

Ireland will be big favourites for this game but Scotland have got something to prove to the home crowd."

Just seen on the BBC website that the walking penalty magnet Jim Hagrid Hamilton feels that his next main contribution to Scottish rugby is to pass some of his skills onto young Jonny Gray.
Yep. My next task will surely be to teach young Jonny Depp how to impress the laydeez.

ME-109 wrote:I
From a purely munster perspective (and yes this is closed shop thinking) I wouldnt mind seeing players like Earls/Zebo and POM being jettisoned. Joe has already wrecked TODs confidence, has probably done a job on Zebo and POM is being changed from the player he is for Munster. If Joe gets near Earls god knows what will happen.

Zebo has been poor for Munster this season - trying to change his game to get into Schmidt's squad. I'd really worry about Earls though. Of course, Schmidt has history in not being able to coach talented players (Carlos Spencer).

As well as that, come contract renewal time, I can see a few of those players taking the plane to France. Zebo will be much in demand considering his French connections and fluency. Not sure if it was Jackman or ROG who said that lack of being able to speak French is a big problem which seemingly the Welsh are poor at picking up and that is why they are generally not doing well in France (except for Halfpenny maybe where there are no French speakers in the team!)

Carlos. Ah how we've missed you.

You've been later than usual showing up, just got in there with one more day left! Cutting it fine!!! But it's good to see you all the same

SecretFly wrote:Carlos.  Ah how we've missed you.

You've been later than usual showing up, just got in there with one more day left!  Cutting it fine!!!  But it's good to see you all the same

carlos spencer? Schmidt coached him a decade ago? Relevant...

Wolfball...Love the user name. You can't get enough references to Hilary Mantell on this forum in my opinion.

[quote="Notch"] I would have dropped Zebo and O'Brien and brought in Tommy O'Donnell and Dave Kearney if I had to choose players to come in. quote]



HAHAHAHA I come back in for an aul nose and I see Notch looking for Daverage to be brought back Good luck

Daverage had a better season than Simundane though

He played every game and scored as many tries.

wolfball wrote:

SecretFly wrote:Carlos.  Ah how we've missed you.

You've been later than usual showing up, just got in there with one more day left!  Cutting it fine!!!  But it's good to see you all the same

carlos spencer? Schmidt coached him a decade ago? Relevant...

The Blues won a Super Rugby title with Spencer at out half playing great rugby, the following season Schmidt came in as backs coach, dropped Spencer because he lost all confidence and the Blues have been Poopie since. Schmidt apparently couldn't 'get Spencer' at all.

Same has happened with Fionn Carr who also had a bit of dazzle (not a world break now), who by the time he left Leinster looked about the 1/4 the player he was when he arrived back at Connacht. I also think it might be the reason why Conway got out of Leinster.

Nacewa. Ask him was his balls handcuffed to his boss's talent killing gameplans?

But it's seasonal - like Christmas. Sin, Ireland, Joe and Carlos.

I think Zebo has had plenty of chances and done well. Let's see if Luke Fitz makes any difference. I think it's reasonable to assume that Joe was being honest and Zebo had picked up a few niggles. He'll be back. Honestly I would like to have seen Henderson for this game aswell for his ball carrying and aggressiveness at the breakdown. I get Toner offers a big benefit at lineouts and has been playing well Wales game aside, thought maybe this would be one for Henderson to prove his salt.

Tattie Scones RRN wrote:Hamilton spoke of the "huge role" he and his experience must play in the junior players' development.

Huge role?

If rugby be the bread of heaven, it is better to have a small role than a huge loaf.

Sin é wrote:

wolfball wrote:

SecretFly wrote:Carlos.  Ah how we've missed you.

You've been later than usual showing up, just got in there with one more day left!  Cutting it fine!!!  But it's good to see you all the same

carlos spencer? Schmidt coached him a decade ago? Relevant...

The Blues won a Super Rugby title with Spencer at out half playing great rugby, the following season Schmidt came in as backs coach, dropped Spencer because he lost all confidence and the Blues have been Poopie since. Schmidt apparently couldn't 'get Spencer' at all.

Same has happened with Fionn Carr who also had a bit of dazzle (not a world break now), who by the time he left Leinster looked about the 1/4 the player he was when he arrived back at Connacht. I also think it might be the reason why Conway got out of Leinster.

Lol great stuff,keep it going Sin lets see how many times you can repeat the same stupid thing,I'd say you've mentioned this at least ten times on the fourm by now.

rodders wrote:

Based on what? Genuine question - on all the stats he really isn't doing much for a blindside. Always single figures in the tackle count and not much in the way of carrying.

He has been very solid defensively, done some very good work in the breakdown and has been getting a lot of turnovers. Against England he won some very important turnovers when Ireland were under pressure. The stats may say one thing but having watched his performances I believe he has been one of Irelands most consistent and best performers this 6N.

Sin

Most of the questions you ask, I already have answered in my post. The answer to the question is in the section you've quoted. Most are simple differences of opinion, and there's not really any point in going over them as neither of us will change an opinion.

Other ones like we don't have an out half as good as Sexton to come in or a hooker as good as Best = Schmidt can't make a game plan to suit the players he has! Wouldn't be too sure that conclusion logically follows on from the premise. He can make a game plan for a team with guys like Cronin and Reddan and Madigan starting but those guys just aren't as talented as the guys they replace. Even with the perfect game plan, they reduce our chances of victory if they come in for our frontline players. Like most coaches, he's going to want to get his best players on the field.

I would have liked to see Tuohy or Henderson in for their ball carrying, but we talk about giving Best an out when he's under pressure- Ross Ford can be got at as well. Toner is a hard guy to get it over if he's marking your main jumper. Hamilton is also one of the best defensive lineout operators around, so even if we had a hooker with Flanery level consistency he would still be a good option. I don't entirely agree that merits the omission of another ball carrier, but I can see the logic behind the decision. Lineout is one of the major strengths of Scotlands game and we struggled at it last week.

It strikes me that Schmidt is in exactly the same position as Kidney was in 2010, he needs to evolve the game plan or we will lose ground. Thats basically international rugby in a nutshell. You need to evolve your game as other teams adapt to it and thats why Kidney ultimately failed- thats why 99% of international coaching careers end in failure, bit like politics. Up until the Wales game he's been one step ahead of the opposition the whole way, but the execution was off and the tactics were figured out. But these tactics are not easy to counter-act, even if they are figured out you can still win if you execute better than your opponent. We don't need to throw the baby out with the bathwater, I think we've seen a degree of variation throughout his time as coach. There's a lot of quite subtle variation from game to game, but what's been missing here are the set plays from last season. We scored off a couple of pretty intricate attacking set plays but those have been largely missing this year. If you're an optimist, he's saving them for the World Cup and if you're a pessimist its because our 10-12-13 combination is still gelling together and is less familiar with Schmidts playbook than when we basically had the Leinster midfield. I would say the latter, which is why I feel we should keep these centres together right through until after the World Cup. Familiarity is everything in terms of encouraging more attacking play.

I do think we've taken a bit of a backwards step in that we are attacking more conservatively and with less width. I think the only solution to this is time together and familiarity. I think we've gone back to basics and I remain hopeful that we will add the fancy set plays back in as this back line continues to gel.

The massive concern is that we are not good enough at ball carrying to open up the space to attack into. I do want to see more gain line success from the forwards but I don't think Scotland are nearly as good defensively as Wales and if we spend as much time in their 22 as we did in Cardiff, we'll get a few scores. But I'm still worried we don't have enough physicality to break down the best sides. I'm wondering how long it will be before we see McCloskey, Henderson and even CJ Stander once he qualifies becoming mainstays. The first two have the physical attributes, but still have a huge amount to learn about the game.

Fitzgerald comes in to what I would see as quite a limited attacking strategy from Ireland better than Zebo. So far, we've been cutting back inside a lot, and I mean a lot, with the backs. Fitzgerald isn't an out and out wing like Zebo I agree- I think he is there to come off his wing and get involved carrying in midfield a bit more. This change is a bit of a non-event. Its a 50/50 call to start with.

Healy for McGrath seems straight forward to me. If you're not going to change the back five of the pack, you need another ball carrier in there somewhere. He can attack the fringes a bit better.

BlueMuff wrote:

Notch wrote: I would have dropped Zebo and O'Brien and brought in Tommy O'Donnell and Dave Kearney if I had to choose players to come in. quote]



HAHAHAHA I come back in for an aul nose and I see Notch looking for Daverage to be brought back  Good luck

I thought the other two would go for it for sure, but I was disappointed.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

Sin é wrote:

wolfball wrote:

SecretFly wrote:Carlos.  Ah how we've missed you.

You've been later than usual showing up, just got in there with one more day left!  Cutting it fine!!!  But it's good to see you all the same

carlos spencer? Schmidt coached him a decade ago? Relevant...

The Blues won a Super Rugby title with Spencer at out half playing great rugby, the following season Schmidt came in as backs coach, dropped Spencer because he lost all confidence and the Blues have been Poopie since. Schmidt apparently couldn't 'get Spencer' at all.

Same has happened with Fionn Carr who also had a bit of dazzle (not a world break now), who by the time he left Leinster looked about the 1/4 the player he was when he arrived back at Connacht. I also think it might be the reason why Conway got out of Leinster.

Lol great stuff,keep it going Sin lets see how many times you can repeat the same stupid thing,I'd say you've mentioned this at least ten times on the fourm by now.

I was asked a question, and I answered.

I do hope the stewards at Murrayfield are aware that there are more likely to be fracas between the Irish fans than between the Irish and the Scots.

The infighting among the Irish is unbelievable!!

Do they even talk to other fans on here or just bicker among themselves?

I'm always quite shocked at the reactions of our neighbours (the English, Scots and Welsh) when they are joined to us in a common thread - like this one here when our sides are meeting.

They always seem surprised at the 'energy' of the bickering that the Irish engage in - amongst themselves.  That's Provincialism for you - it's its strength and, perhaps at times too, its weakness.

The ref may be involved, harsh decisions against us may be involved, a ballboy might get the upper hand on us, the culprit might be rain, or ice on the pitch or foot and/in mouth desease.

But none of those reasons ever beat the plain solid truth that if we lose, there is always - ALWAYS - a nice juicy Munster player target to throw the muck at.  It's traditional and what keeps Irish fans interested in rugby union to begin with.

Notch wrote:Sin

Most of the questions you ask, I already have answered in my post. The answer to the question is in the section you've quoted. Most are simple differences of opinion, and there's not really any point in going over them as neither of us will change an opinion.

But according to you it is just provincial cowpat, not difference of opinion. You are right. I am wrong. Fullstop.

Other ones like we don't have an out half as good as Sexton to come in or a hooker as good as Best = Schmidt can't make a game plan to suit the players he has! Wouldn't be too sure that conclusion logically follows on from the premise. He can make a game plan for a team with guys like Cronin and Reddan and Madigan starting but those guys just aren't as talented as the guys they replace. Even with the perfect game plan, they reduce our chances of victory if they come in for our frontline players. Like most coaches, he's going to want to get his best players on the field.

My point about both Best and Cronin is that both of them are there for being able to do someone else's job. How come neither player has improved with their throwing and how come Sean Cronin has never learned how to hook - he has been with Schmidt & Feek long enough.
Duncan Casey can both throw accurately and hook. Why is he not in the squad at least?

I would have liked to see Tuohy or Henderson in for their ball carrying, but we talk about giving Best an out when he's under pressure- Ross Ford can be got at as well. Toner is a hard guy to get it over if he's marking your main jumper. Hamilton is also one of the best defensive lineout operators around, so even if we had a hooker with Flanery level consistency he would still be a good option. I don't entirely agree that merits the omission of another ball carrier, but I can see the logic behind the decision. Lineout is one of the major strengths of Scotlands game and we struggled at it last week.

Well, Tuohy is injured and Henderson doesn't have the concentration levels to handle a Schmidtball game plan yet. Surely both Best & Cronin must have failed their work-on, but yet they get selected and there is no effort to develop or improve them.

It strikes me that Schmidt is in exactly the same position as Kidney was in 2010, he needs to evolve the game plan or we will lose ground. Thats basically international rugby in a nutshell. You need to evolve your game as other teams adapt to it and thats why Kidney ultimately failed- thats why 99% of international coaching careers end in failure, bit like politics. Up until the Wales game he's been one step ahead of the opposition the whole way, but the execution was off and the tactics were figured out. But these tactics are not easy to counter-act, even if they are figured out you can still win if you execute better than your opponent. We don't need to throw the baby out with the bathwater, I think we've seen a degree of variation throughout his time as coach. There's a lot of quite subtle variation from game to game, but what's been missing here are the set plays from last season. We scored off a couple of pretty intricate attacking set plays but those have been largely missing this year. If you're an optimist, he's saving them for the World Cup and if you're a pessimist its because our 10-12-13 combination is still gelling together and is less familiar with Schmidts playbook than when we basically had the Leinster midfield. I would say the latter, which is why I feel we should keep these centres together right through until after the World Cup. Familiarity is everything in terms of encouraging more attacking play.

Kidney was trying to grow the squad in 2010 (which he did manage to do). Unfortunately, Sexton was way off form for the world cup and couldn't be used. Lets not forget that very good win against Australia down there at the world cup. Kidney was undone because BOD didn't back him and the Leinster supporters could never forgive him for leaving them and going back to Munster.

I do think we've taken a bit of a backwards step in that we are attacking more conservatively and with less width. I think the only solution to this is time together and familiarity. I think we've gone back to basics and I remain hopeful that we will add the fancy set plays back in as this back line continues to gel.

The problem is with the centres. Payne is not working out. Bringing Luke in is really trying to have 3 centres on the pitch because neither Payne or Henshaw are much use going forward in tight defences.

The massive concern is that we are not good enough at ball carrying to open up the space to attack into. I do want to see more gain line success from the forwards but I don't think Scotland are nearly as good defensively as Wales and if we spend as much time in their 22 as we did in Cardiff, we'll get a few scores. But I'm still worried we don't have enough physicality to break down the best sides. I'm wondering how long it will be before we see McCloskey, Henderson and even CJ Stander once he qualifies becoming mainstays. The first two have the physical attributes, but still have a huge amount to learn about the game.

I don't think CJ is good enough to be anything other than a fringe player.

ROG's thoughts on the dropping of Zebo.

ronan o'gara wrote:He’s been hard done by. Whatever way it’s dressed up, he’s the fall guy for the Welsh defeat and that’s hard to justify. He was one of the best three players in Ireland’s victory over England and it’s not that he was the standout poor performer in Cardiff either.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/ronan-ogara/ronan-o39gara-all-a-player-wants-is-a-chance-to-atone-319473.html

ROG has been up to now a Schmidt cheerleader.

Sin é wrote:

Notch wrote:Sin

Most of the questions you ask, I already have answered in my post. The answer to the question is in the section you've quoted. Most are simple differences of opinion, and there's not really any point in going over them as neither of us will change an opinion.

But according to you it is just provincial cowpat, not difference of opinion. You are right. I am wrong. Fullstop.

Other ones like we don't have an out half as good as Sexton to come in or a hooker as good as Best = Schmidt can't make a game plan to suit the players he has! Wouldn't be too sure that conclusion logically follows on from the premise. He can make a game plan for a team with guys like Cronin and Reddan and Madigan starting but those guys just aren't as talented as the guys they replace. Even with the perfect game plan, they reduce our chances of victory if they come in for our frontline players. Like most coaches, he's going to want to get his best players on the field.

My point about both Best and Cronin is that both of them are there for being able to do someone else's job. How come neither player has improved with their throwing and how come Sean Cronin has never learned how to hook - he has been with Schmidt & Feek long enough.
Duncan Casey can both throw accurately and hook. Why is he not in the squad at least?

I would have liked to see Tuohy or Henderson in for their ball carrying, but we talk about giving Best an out when he's under pressure- Ross Ford can be got at as well. Toner is a hard guy to get it over if he's marking your main jumper. Hamilton is also one of the best defensive lineout operators around, so even if we had a hooker with Flanery level consistency he would still be a good option. I don't entirely agree that merits the omission of another ball carrier, but I can see the logic behind the decision. Lineout is one of the major strengths of Scotlands game and we struggled at it last week.

Well, Tuohy is injured and Henderson doesn't have the concentration levels to handle a Schmidtball game plan yet. Surely both Best & Cronin must have failed their work-on, but yet they get selected and there is no effort to develop or improve them.

It strikes me that Schmidt is in exactly the same position as Kidney was in 2010, he needs to evolve the game plan or we will lose ground. Thats basically international rugby in a nutshell. You need to evolve your game as other teams adapt to it and thats why Kidney ultimately failed- thats why 99% of international coaching careers end in failure, bit like politics. Up until the Wales game he's been one step ahead of the opposition the whole way, but the execution was off and the tactics were figured out. But these tactics are not easy to counter-act, even if they are figured out you can still win if you execute better than your opponent. We don't need to throw the baby out with the bathwater, I think we've seen a degree of variation throughout his time as coach. There's a lot of quite subtle variation from game to game, but what's been missing here are the set plays from last season. We scored off a couple of pretty intricate attacking set plays but those have been largely missing this year. If you're an optimist, he's saving them for the World Cup and if you're a pessimist its because our 10-12-13 combination is still gelling together and is less familiar with Schmidts playbook than when we basically had the Leinster midfield. I would say the latter, which is why I feel we should keep these centres together right through until after the World Cup. Familiarity is everything in terms of encouraging more attacking play.

Kidney was trying to grow the squad in 2010 (which he did manage to do). Unfortunately, Sexton was way off form for the world cup and couldn't be used. Lets not forget that very good win against Australia down there at the world cup. Kidney was undone because BOD didn't back him and the Leinster supporters could never forgive him for leaving them and going back to Munster.

I do think we've taken a bit of a backwards step in that we are attacking more conservatively and with less width. I think the only solution to this is time together and familiarity. I think we've gone back to basics and I remain hopeful that we will add the fancy set plays back in as this back line continues to gel.

The problem is with the centres. Payne is not working out. Bringing Luke in is really trying to have 3 centres on the pitch because neither Payne or Henshaw are much use going forward in tight defences.

The massive concern is that we are not good enough at ball carrying to open up the space to attack into. I do want to see more gain line success from the forwards but I don't think Scotland are nearly as good defensively as Wales and if we spend as much time in their 22 as we did in Cardiff, we'll get a few scores. But I'm still worried we don't have enough physicality to break down the best sides. I'm wondering how long it will be before we see McCloskey, Henderson and even CJ Stander once he qualifies becoming mainstays. The first two have the physical attributes, but still have a huge amount to learn about the game.

I don't think CJ is good enough to be anything other than a fringe player.

ROG's thoughts on the dropping of Zebo.

ronan o'gara wrote:He’s been hard done by. Whatever way it’s dressed up, he’s the fall guy for the Welsh defeat and that’s hard to justify. He was one of the best three players in Ireland’s victory over England and it’s not that he was the standout poor performer in Cardiff either.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/ronan-ogara/ronan-o39gara-all-a-player-wants-is-a-chance-to-atone-319473.html

ROG has been up to now a Schmidt cheerleader.

SecretFly wrote:

I'm always quite shocked at the reactions of our neighbours (the English, Scots and Welsh) when they are joined to us in a common thread - like this one here when our sides are meeting.

They always seem surprised at the 'energy' of the bickering that the Irish engage in - amongst themselves.  That's Provincialism for you - it's its strength and, perhaps at times too, its weakness.

The ref may be involved, harsh decisions against us may be involved, a ballboy might get the upper hand on us, the culprit might be rain, or ice on the pitch or foot and/in mouth desease.

But none of those reasons ever beat the plain solid truth that if we lose, there is always - ALWAYS - a nice juicy Munster player target to throw the muck at.  It's traditional and what keeps Irish fans interested in rugby union to begin with.

Sin é is the most distorted manifestation of the Tribalism that being in a province creates. It doesn't even appear like he is trying to engage in a debate with anyone other than another irish poster.

Mind you with the result almost a forgone conclusion there isn't much to debate about the game with us Scots.

Sin é wrote:

ronan o'gara wrote:He’s been hard done by. Whatever way it’s dressed up, he’s the fall guy for the Welsh defeat and that’s hard to justify. He was one of the best three players in Ireland’s victory over England and it’s not that he was the standout poor performer in Cardiff either.

Who was ROG?  Who was?  If there was a 'stand out poor performer' and ROG has the eye on him, who was he?

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Sin é wrote:

Notch wrote:Sin

Most of the questions you ask, I already have answered in my post. The answer to the question is in the section you've quoted. Most are simple differences of opinion, and there's not really any point in going over them as neither of us will change an opinion.

But according to you it is just provincial cowpat, not difference of opinion. You are right. I am wrong. Fullstop.

Other ones like we don't have an out half as good as Sexton to come in or a hooker as good as Best = Schmidt can't make a game plan to suit the players he has! Wouldn't be too sure that conclusion logically follows on from the premise. He can make a game plan for a team with guys like Cronin and Reddan and Madigan starting but those guys just aren't as talented as the guys they replace. Even with the perfect game plan, they reduce our chances of victory if they come in for our frontline players. Like most coaches, he's going to want to get his best players on the field.

My point about both Best and Cronin is that both of them are there for being able to do someone else's job. How come neither player has improved with their throwing and how come Sean Cronin has never learned how to hook - he has been with Schmidt & Feek long enough.
Duncan Casey can both throw accurately and hook. Why is he not in the squad at least?

I would have liked to see Tuohy or Henderson in for their ball carrying, but we talk about giving Best an out when he's under pressure- Ross Ford can be got at as well. Toner is a hard guy to get it over if he's marking your main jumper. Hamilton is also one of the best defensive lineout operators around, so even if we had a hooker with Flanery level consistency he would still be a good option. I don't entirely agree that merits the omission of another ball carrier, but I can see the logic behind the decision. Lineout is one of the major strengths of Scotlands game and we struggled at it last week.

Well, Tuohy is injured and Henderson doesn't have the concentration levels to handle a Schmidtball game plan yet. Surely both Best & Cronin must have failed their work-on, but yet they get selected and there is no effort to develop or improve them.

It strikes me that Schmidt is in exactly the same position as Kidney was in 2010, he needs to evolve the game plan or we will lose ground. Thats basically international rugby in a nutshell. You need to evolve your game as other teams adapt to it and thats why Kidney ultimately failed- thats why 99% of international coaching careers end in failure, bit like politics. Up until the Wales game he's been one step ahead of the opposition the whole way, but the execution was off and the tactics were figured out. But these tactics are not easy to counter-act, even if they are figured out you can still win if you execute better than your opponent. We don't need to throw the baby out with the bathwater, I think we've seen a degree of variation throughout his time as coach. There's a lot of quite subtle variation from game to game, but what's been missing here are the set plays from last season. We scored off a couple of pretty intricate attacking set plays but those have been largely missing this year. If you're an optimist, he's saving them for the World Cup and if you're a pessimist its because our 10-12-13 combination is still gelling together and is less familiar with Schmidts playbook than when we basically had the Leinster midfield. I would say the latter, which is why I feel we should keep these centres together right through until after the World Cup. Familiarity is everything in terms of encouraging more attacking play.

Kidney was trying to grow the squad in 2010 (which he did manage to do). Unfortunately, Sexton was way off form for the world cup and couldn't be used. Lets not forget that very good win against Australia down there at the world cup. Kidney was undone because BOD didn't back him and the Leinster supporters could never forgive him for leaving them and going back to Munster.

I do think we've taken a bit of a backwards step in that we are attacking more conservatively and with less width. I think the only solution to this is time together and familiarity. I think we've gone back to basics and I remain hopeful that we will add the fancy set plays back in as this back line continues to gel.

The problem is with the centres. Payne is not working out. Bringing Luke in is really trying to have 3 centres on the pitch because neither Payne or Henshaw are much use going forward in tight defences.

The massive concern is that we are not good enough at ball carrying to open up the space to attack into. I do want to see more gain line success from the forwards but I don't think Scotland are nearly as good defensively as Wales and if we spend as much time in their 22 as we did in Cardiff, we'll get a few scores. But I'm still worried we don't have enough physicality to break down the best sides. I'm wondering how long it will be before we see McCloskey, Henderson and even CJ Stander once he qualifies becoming mainstays. The first two have the physical attributes, but still have a huge amount to learn about the game.

I don't think CJ is good enough to be anything other than a fringe player.

ROG's thoughts on the dropping of Zebo.

ronan o'gara wrote:He’s been hard done by. Whatever way it’s dressed up, he’s the fall guy for the Welsh defeat and that’s hard to justify. He was one of the best three players in Ireland’s victory over England and it’s not that he was the standout poor performer in Cardiff either.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/columnists/ronan-ogara/ronan-o39gara-all-a-player-wants-is-a-chance-to-atone-319473.html

ROG has been up to now a Schmidt cheerleader.

SecretFly wrote:

I'm always quite shocked at the reactions of our neighbours (the English, Scots and Welsh) when they are joined to us in a common thread - like this one here when our sides are meeting.

They always seem surprised at the 'energy' of the bickering that the Irish engage in - amongst themselves.  That's Provincialism for you - it's its strength and, perhaps at times too, its weakness.

The ref may be involved, harsh decisions against us may be involved, a ballboy might get the upper hand on us, the culprit might be rain, or ice on the pitch or foot and/in mouth desease.

But none of those reasons ever beat the plain solid truth that if we lose, there is always - ALWAYS - a nice juicy Munster player target to throw the muck at.  It's traditional and what keeps Irish fans interested in rugby union to begin with.

Sin é is the most distorted manifestation of the Tribalism that being in a province creates. It doesn't even appear like he is trying to engage in a debate with anyone other than another irish poster.

Mind you with the result almost a forgone conclusion there isn't much to debate about the game with us Scots.

I'm quite happy to engage in any subject that interests me. For instance, last week I got embroiled with the Welsh over the poor reffing of Leighton Hodges for Connacht while at the same time actually saying that I had no issue with the refing of the Ospreys v Munster game though some of the Welsh posters here declare that I had a problem with all Welsh refs. when the decisions whent against an Irish team!

SecretFly wrote:

Sin é wrote:

ronan o'gara wrote:He’s been hard done by. Whatever way it’s dressed up, he’s the fall guy for the Welsh defeat and that’s hard to justify. He was one of the best three players in Ireland’s victory over England and it’s not that he was the standout poor performer in Cardiff either.

Who was ROG?  Who was?  If there was a 'stand out poor performer' and ROG has the eye on him, who was he?

He was very subtle - he said Rory Best has the ability to come back from a bad day out! (That will get the Ulstermen hot under the collar!).

Sin é wrote:

The problem is with the centres. Payne is not working out. Bringing Luke in is really trying to have 3 centres on the pitch because neither Payne or Henshaw are much use going forward in tight defences.

Payne has the ability to work, I just feel that Schmidt's tactics negate his style. I still firmly believe that Earls is the best option for 13 right now though and I would love to see him partner Henshaw. Henshaw is more a 13 than 12 but he has done his job very well and I feel that Earls would feed off him a lot better. Earls (even though loads of people disagree with me on this) is actually a very good distributer and I feel that he is the key in unlocking both wings for Ireland. Having said that, I do agree that it would worry me if Schmidt got his hands on him and took away his natural attacking instincts.

Sin é wrote:

He was very subtle - he said Rory Best has the ability to come back from a bad day out! (That will get the Ulstermen hot under the collar!).

Yet nobody anywhere on the planet seems to want to give Cronin a start.  I'll tell you, the guy will have grey whiskers and arthritis and he'll still be sitting on a bench waiting for his 15 minutes of so of 'explosiveness'.

So Zebo ain't the only guy who should be feeling sorry for himself.  Join the queue Zeebs, at least a coach put enough faith in you as a man to actually let you start a few big games.

I certainly don't think Ireland will find too much trouble going forward. If Ireland kick as well as they did against England and we field said kicks as badly as we did against Wales this could be a disaster.

However I think we will do well with the ball in hand. Denton, Ashe, Ford and Gray will all carry with some impetus. It's just a question of whether or not our forwards can recycle the ball quick enough so we can spin it out to the danger men out wide.

My opinion, Ireland by 5.