Andre Ward vs.....

by **hampo17** Mon 16 Mar 2015, 6:21 pm

First topic message reminder :

Ricardo Mayorga.

Don't care how long he's been out of the ring this is a BS fight. Was only two fights ago that Cotto stopped him. furious

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Wed 18 Mar 2015, 7:25 am

I seen an email from Roc Nation about another possible opponant.

You say this is a rumour....but honestly....I can see some truth to this

by Derbymanc Wed 18 Mar 2015, 7:56 am

Where did you see the email SOF? can you post a link to it

by hazharrison Wed 18 Mar 2015, 8:32 am

Andre Ward will not fight Mayorga - nothing more than an internet rumour. Hilarious how petty people can get over a Chinese whisper (standard 606).

by Derbymanc Wed 18 Mar 2015, 9:00 am

An internet rumour I believe started by Mayorga himself, if enough people say it's Poopie now then there's less chance of it being made, if we all sit back and say nothing then we're gonna get fed said Poopie.

by **ShahenshahG** Wed 18 Mar 2015, 9:30 am

Aye, Fingers but that anyone could believe it without batting an eyelid is a indictment of the sport...or indictment of the quality of our posters Laugh

by TopHat24/7 Wed 18 Mar 2015, 9:43 am

tunes666 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:If true, Ward's joke of a career SINCE unifying 168 continues to spiral into mediocrity.

hmm really?. he has fought everyone there is to fight in this division... it was not long ago people were thinking that he has to go up a weight in order to find someone to fight... Now after a year out he gets him self an average opponent to get things going again and its a joke?

He is arguably the best P4P fighter there is... who you want to see him fight?

1. Try reading properly, maybe grab a dictionary if you're struggling.
2. He doesn't appear on any (credible) p4p lists as he hasn't fought in over a year, maybe even 2 by now.

by milkyboy Wed 18 Mar 2015, 9:59 am

Ridiculous that anyone could believe this. The idea that andre ward might actually fight someone is preposterous.

by Derbymanc Wed 18 Mar 2015, 10:10 am

Genuinely belly laughed at that Milky.

by hazharrison Wed 18 Mar 2015, 12:21 pm

milkyboy wrote:Ridiculous that anyone could believe this. The idea that andre ward might actually fight someone is preposterous.

The Son Of God doesn't need to fight to be POUND FOR POUND something or other.

by tunes666 Wed 18 Mar 2015, 6:32 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:
tunes666 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:If true, Ward's joke of a career SINCE unifying 168 continues to spiral into mediocrity.

hmm really?. he has fought everyone there is to fight in this division... it was not long ago people were thinking that he has to go up a weight in order to find someone to fight... Now after a year out he gets him self an average opponent to get things going again and its a joke?

He is arguably the best P4P fighter there is... who you want to see him fight?

1. Try reading properly, maybe grab a dictionary if you're struggling.
2. He doesn't appear on any (credible) p4p lists as he hasn't fought in over a year, maybe even 2 by now.

The Irony.

you do know what "arguably" means right? ..

Anyone who knows boxing will know that when he was active which was just under a year and a half ago, he was one of if not the best P4P fighter there was. Just because he has not been able to fight for a while it does not mean he is no longer one of the best it means he was rightfully removed from the lists because he was inactive.. I presume you will be rooting for Froch then if they right, as clearly Ward is past it now! Rolling Eyes

by TRUSSMAN66 Wed 18 Mar 2015, 6:38 pm

tunes666 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:
tunes666 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:If true, Ward's joke of a career SINCE unifying 168 continues to spiral into mediocrity.

hmm really?. he has fought everyone there is to fight in this division... it was not long ago people were thinking that he has to go up a weight in order to find someone to fight... Now after a year out he gets him self an average opponent to get things going again and its a joke?

He is arguably the best P4P fighter there is... who you want to see him fight?

1. Try reading properly, maybe grab a dictionary if you're struggling.
2. He doesn't appear on any (credible) p4p lists as he hasn't fought in over a year, maybe even 2 by now.

The Irony.

you do know what "arguably" means right? ..

Anyone who knows boxing will know that when he was active which was just under a year and a half ago, he was one of if not the best P4P fighter there was. Just because he has not been able to fight for a while it does not mean he is no longer one of the best it means he was rightfully removed from the lists because he was inactive.. I presume you will be rooting for Froch then if they right, as clearly Ward is past it now!

In fairness he only knows Boxing from 2010 onwards....

by Hammersmith harrier Wed 18 Mar 2015, 7:06 pm

tunes666 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:
tunes666 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:If true, Ward's joke of a career SINCE unifying 168 continues to spiral into mediocrity.

hmm really?. he has fought everyone there is to fight in this division... it was not long ago people were thinking that he has to go up a weight in order to find someone to fight... Now after a year out he gets him self an average opponent to get things going again and its a joke?

He is arguably the best P4P fighter there is... who you want to see him fight?

1. Try reading properly, maybe grab a dictionary if you're struggling.
2. He doesn't appear on any (credible) p4p lists as he hasn't fought in over a year, maybe even 2 by now.

The Irony.

you do know what "arguably" means right? ..

Anyone who knows boxing will know that when he was active which was just under a year and a half ago, he was one of if not the best P4P fighter there was. Just because he has not been able to fight for a while it does not mean he is no longer one of the best it means he was rightfully removed from the lists because he was inactive.. I presume you will be rooting for Froch then if they right, as clearly Ward is past it now!

We don't know any of that do we until he gets back in the ring and in your opinion beating a useless no hoper is going to prove he's still one of the best.

by TRUSSMAN66 Wed 18 Mar 2015, 8:42 pm

Mayorga isn't a great choice but at least Ward has beaten the best......

We got fighters on here being deified who haven't beaten anyone ....

Why pick on a guy who has ??

Cut him some slack...

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Wed 18 Mar 2015, 10:08 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Mayorga isn't a great choice but at least Ward has beaten the best......

We got fighters on here being deified who haven't beaten anyone ....

Why pick on a guy who has ??

Cut him some slack...

Truss I have been giving you the benefit recent but wtf Shocked

Am not you can even defend this possible opponant while slagging Murray off for GGG

by TRUSSMAN66 Wed 18 Mar 2015, 10:46 pm

Not defending his opponent.

by TopHat24/7 Thu 19 Mar 2015, 9:43 am

tunes666 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:
tunes666 wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:If true, Ward's joke of a career SINCE unifying 168 continues to spiral into mediocrity.

hmm really?. he has fought everyone there is to fight in this division... it was not long ago people were thinking that he has to go up a weight in order to find someone to fight... Now after a year out he gets him self an average opponent to get things going again and its a joke?

He is arguably the best P4P fighter there is... who you want to see him fight?

1. Try reading properly, maybe grab a dictionary if you're struggling.
2. He doesn't appear on any (credible) p4p lists as he hasn't fought in over a year, maybe even 2 by now.

The Irony.

you do know what "arguably" means right? ..

Anyone who knows boxing will know that when he was active which was just under a year and a half ago, he was one of if not the best P4P fighter there was. Just because he has not been able to fight for a while it does not mean he is no longer one of the best it means he was rightfully removed from the lists because he was inactive.. I presume you will be rooting for Froch then if they right, as clearly Ward is past it now!

Arguably? Hardly. Only a complete and utter moron ranks a retired fighter.

By 'anyone who knows boxing', do you mean 'anyone that can check boxrec'??

After Dawson I had him p4p#3. The point is SINCE then he's done the square root of FA.

Don't see much point in the Froch fight, he was comprehensively and quite easily beaten last time out, but if I had to pick between two fighters I'm not that interested in then yes, I'd probably opt for the home fighter.

Unless by 'rooting', you mean 'picking' (again, dust off that dictionary), in which case clearly I'll be picking Ward. Have never once come close to saying anything like him being past it. And frankly he could probably beat Froch, in Nottingham, in his comeback fight - if he has the ambition.

by Scottrf Thu 19 Mar 2015, 11:00 am

You're struggling to tell the difference between 'appears in P4P lists' and 'is one of the best boxers P4P'.

by TopHat24/7 Thu 19 Mar 2015, 2:08 pm

Is SRL one of the best boxers p4p? 'Cos he's as active as Ward right now. Totally pointless argument.

by Scottrf Thu 19 Mar 2015, 2:14 pm

I think you're getting confused.

Inactive =/= retired.

by **hampo17** Thu 19 Mar 2015, 2:23 pm

Would be fair to describe Ward as "was one of the best P4P boxers". Not saying he won't be as good now, but nobody knows how that lay off will have effected him. Still, if he fights a total dud like this guy then he deserves all the criticism he gets.

by Scottrf Thu 19 Mar 2015, 2:25 pm

I think if he beats a total dud he will enter P4P lists again.

by TopHat24/7 Thu 19 Mar 2015, 2:31 pm

Scottrf wrote:I think you're getting confused.

Inactive =/= retired.

When it's over a year, almost 2, I consider it's the same. Floyd said he 'retired' and was out for not much longer than Ward has been now. He was removed from rankings for that period too.

by TopHat24/7 Thu 19 Mar 2015, 2:34 pm

Scottrf wrote:I think if he beats a total dud he will enter P4P lists again.

Floyd came out of retirement to fight JMM and Mosley. That got him back in lists.

by TRUSSMAN66 Thu 19 Mar 2015, 2:38 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:Is SRL one of the best boxers p4p? 'Cos he's as active as Ward right now. Totally pointless argument.

Leonard hasn't fought in 20 years....Ward a year and four months..........

Hagler hadn't fought for a year and one month when he fought Leonard............

Not that you'd know that..

by TopHat24/7 Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:11 pm

You don't see the irony in what you just posted, Truss?

Arguably the greatest MW ever fighting arguably the greatest WW ever in the context of Ward coming out of almost 2 years of retirement to fight Mayorga???

by Hammersmith harrier Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:18 pm

To be as pedantic as you've been recently, neither are arguably the greatest in their divisions and certainly not Hagler.

Ward isn't coming out of retirement either, through a combination of injuries, contractual issues, his promoter dying he's not been able to fight.

by hazharrison Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:41 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:To be as pedantic as you've been recently, neither are arguably the greatest in their divisions and certainly not Hagler.

Ward isn't coming out of retirement either, through a combination of injuries, contractual issues, his promoter dying he's not been able to fight.

Hagler and Leonard are both in the argument - they both make the top five. Loving your work though bro! Hug

by Derbymanc Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:44 pm

I'm confused are we saying that this is a good fight for Ward or not? Headscratch

by milkyboy Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:48 pm

No. We're saying ward should fight hagler. Any fool can see that.

by kingraf Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:48 pm

We are saying that it's not a good fight. But it's an okay fight. Or it isn't. But its nothing different to what Hagler and Leonard did. But that's okay. Or its not. But Ward isn't an ATG. So he can't be held to the same standards as them. Or he can, because they aren't the best in their weight. Or they are. Well definitely top five.

by Derbymanc Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:49 pm

That's what I thought Raf, just needed it clarifying Wink

Wouldn't Hagler need a warm up fight too though Milky?

by TopHat24/7 Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:54 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:To be as pedantic as you've been recently, neither are arguably the greatest in their divisions and certainly not Hagler.

Ward isn't coming out of retirement either, through a combination of injuries, contractual issues, his promoter dying he's not been able to fight.

Hagler not in the mix with Monzon, Greb & SRR? Can't be many WW's rated higher than SRL??

by milkyboy Thu 19 Mar 2015, 4:58 pm

Derbymanc wrote:That's what I thought Raf, just needed it clarifying

Wouldn't Hagler need a warm up fight too though Milky?

Yes. His warm up fight is Calzaghe. Can't you read?

by Derbymanc Thu 19 Mar 2015, 5:21 pm

My bad, should have realised that, I'm sure I heard Eubanks name mentioned somewhere as well or is that just a pipe dream?

by Hammersmith harrier Thu 19 Mar 2015, 5:33 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:
Hammersmith harrier wrote:To be as pedantic as you've been recently, neither are arguably the greatest in their divisions and certainly not Hagler.

Ward isn't coming out of retirement either, through a combination of injuries, contractual issues, his promoter dying he's not been able to fight.

Hagler not in the mix with Monzon, Greb & SRR? Can't be many WW's rated higher than SRL??

Hagler is not in the mix with Monzon or Greb at all whilst there's a rather unarguable one and two at Welterweight in Robinson and Armstrong, being top five doesn't mean you're in the argument to be number one. In all of the original 8 weight classes there tends to be a very simple question when it comes to the divisional number one.

Flyweight- Almost unquestionably Wilde
Bantamweight- Jofre
Featherweight- Pep or Saddler
Lightweight- Duran or Leonard
Welterweight- Robinson
Middleweight- Greb or Monzon, some unattentive folk try putting Robinson in the mix
Light Heavyweight- Charles or Moore
Heavyweight- Ali or Louis

Would rather not get into an argument over some so minor but seeing as you've been doing it non-stop recently I thought i'd argue every single point you make just for the sheer sake of being a knobhead.

by **ShahenshahG** Thu 19 Mar 2015, 5:35 pm

Hammersmith harrier wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:
Hammersmith harrier wrote:To be as pedantic as you've been recently, neither are arguably the greatest in their divisions and certainly not Hagler.

Ward isn't coming out of retirement either, through a combination of injuries, contractual issues, his promoter dying he's not been able to fight.

Hagler not in the mix with Monzon, Greb & SRR? Can't be many WW's rated higher than SRL??

Hagler is not in the mix with Monzon or Greb at all whilst there's a rather unarguable one and two at Welterweight in Robinson and Armstrong, being top five doesn't mean you're in the argument to be number one. In all of the original 8 weight classes there tends to be a very simple question when it comes to the divisional number one.

Flyweight- Almost unquestionably Wilde
Bantamweight- Jofre
Featherweight- Pep or Saddler
Lightweight- Duran or Leonard
Welterweight- Robinson
Middleweight- Greb or Monzon, some unattentive folk try putting Robinson in the mix
Light Heavyweight- Charles or Moore
Heavyweight- Ali or Louis

Would rather not get into an argument over some so minor but seeing as you've been doing it non-stop recently I thought i'd argue every single point you make just for the sheer sake of being a knobhead.

Come now, hammer no point putting effort into doing waht comes naturally to you Wink

by milkyboy Thu 19 Mar 2015, 5:42 pm

is armstrong unarguable number 2 at welter? Unarguable top 5 p4p for sure.

I'm going to stop there. I'm no good at this being a knobhead bit*. I'm out of my depth here. Whistle

*I suspect this point might be challenged.

by Hammersmith harrier Thu 19 Mar 2015, 5:42 pm

I was ok until Azania came along, all been downhill since there, it does take effort Shah because i'm actually a C U Next Tuesday.

by tunes666 Thu 19 Mar 2015, 6:15 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:

Arguably? Hardly. Only a complete and utter moron ranks a retired fighter.

Are you for real?, first you ignore what I say, then make up stuff. Ward was not retired, he was in dispute with his promoters, hence why he did not fight, If you no longer think he ranks among the best then you dont know anything about boxing... Further more, you are completely contradicting your self but saying he was retired and then criticising him for not taking on a highly ranked opponent in is so called "come out of retirement" warm up. Clearly you are full of Brown Sauce mate!

By 'anyone who knows boxing', do you mean 'anyone that can check boxrec'??

No anyone who knows a little about boxing, and there is nothing wrong with Boxrec...

After Dawson I had him p4p#3. The point is SINCE then he's done the square root of FA.

and who has done so much more to push him completely out of the equation?... After Dawson I had him joint 1 with Mayweather... While in active then he drops out, but like I say, if you do not regard him still as one of the best now he is fighting again, then you know little about boxing.

Don't see much point in the Froch fight, he was comprehensively and quite easily beaten last time out, but if I had to pick between two fighters I'm not that interested in then yes, I'd probably opt for the home fighter.

Unless by 'rooting', you mean 'picking' (again, dust off that dictionary), in which case clearly I'll be picking Ward. Have never once come close to saying anything like him being past it. And frankly he could probably beat Froch, in Nottingham, in his comeback fight - if he has the ambition.

In that case I have no idea what your point is...

by Derbymanc Thu 19 Mar 2015, 6:26 pm

if you do not regard him still as one of the best now he is fighting again, then you know little about boxing

Without wanting to start a row Tunes, how can you say he is NOW one of the best whilst also saying he needs a tune up fight to see if he's lost a step?

and there is nothing wrong with Boxrec...
clap

why do people seem to think there's a major problem with using boxrec to check results etc????

by **ShahenshahG** Thu 19 Mar 2015, 6:31 pm

Welcome to the modern world where checking facts is a cardinal sin, but I believe that tophat was suggesting tunes got most of his knowledge from boxrec without context/knowledge of his own

by Hammersmith harrier Thu 19 Mar 2015, 6:36 pm

Doesn't help when Tunes is clueless and devoid of any knowledge.

by kingraf Thu 19 Mar 2015, 7:00 pm

I see Derby decided to write Tunes' comments in bold rather than risk trying to get the quote function right when you separate a quote.
Smart play

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Thu 19 Mar 2015, 7:45 pm

kingraf wrote:I see Derby decided to write Tunes' comments in bold rather than risk trying to get the quote function right when you separate a quote.
Smart play

It's not that hard Whistle

by tunes666 Fri 20 Mar 2015, 8:16 pm

Derbymanc wrote:if you do not regard him still as one of the best now he is fighting again, then you know little about boxing

Without wanting to start a row Tunes, how can you say he is NOW one of the best whilst also saying he needs a tune up fight to see if he's lost a step?

Because if you have a lay off then you are not going to be at your best, when you are at world level you need to be at your best. If he feels there are some things he needs to fine tune then its common sense to fight a guy who is competent but is not going to give you a really hard fight.. then you go for the big fight.

Ward has not ducked anyone, and has got a great list of victories.. why all of a sudden is he being treated like he just fights bums?

by tunes666 Fri 20 Mar 2015, 8:24 pm

ShahenshahG wrote:Welcome to the modern world where checking facts is a cardinal sin, but I believe that tophat was suggesting tunes got most of his knowledge from boxrec without context/knowledge of his own

We all know Ward has been out for a while, to be honest thoug if anyone here new the months he was out off by heart, that would be a little sad with all due respect... Boxrec is your friend Smile

It helps bring clarity when someone thinks that 1 year and 4 months is nearly two years...

by 3fingers Fri 20 Mar 2015, 9:00 pm

Tunes I'm with you in way, but i feel you're defending the indefensible simply because you've laid your stall out abit too early.

Agreed, everyone deserves an easy fight after a long lay off; inactivity effects everyone differently.

A come back fight should be against someone you can look good against (to pull the punters back in) but it should also be a test to assess where your fitness desire and sharpness are at (Bika would be ideal, credible and tough). Mayorga, however, would certainly make Ward look good but it wouldn't be a credible win. Promoters must make a delicate choice for come backing fighters.

..but at the end of the day it's a bullshii(t) rumour that doesn't warrant discussion.

by jimmy glitter pants Fri 20 Mar 2015, 9:36 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:27 months after beating the great "Larry Bonds" in a welter defence.....The guy who lost to Rocky Mosley Jr...

Leonard fought journeyman Kevin Howard........

No one complained about that....

Then again this site is full of idiots that think Boxing started in 2010...

Full of idiots who think beating Geale, Macklin, Murray, Munroe jr = Greatness....

Hard to debate with that kind of wally.....One idiot thinks Murray is a better win than Manny..

Whilst you attack Ward..............Do you want to tell me of a modern day Brit that is going to be rated above him...........??

Calzaghe sure as hell won't be and he's the nearest you've got..

You produce 99% crap over here............and when you get the 1% what do you do..

You pee on Hatton
You pee on Khan
You pee on Froch.........

Say's it all...

I respect Ward he is a great fighter.............Perhaps when you get some of your own.... Your views on him might change..

Boom boom...Boom boom boom....................I win !!

You really are a prize plonker!

by **hampo17** Fri 20 Mar 2015, 9:43 pm

Tunes it is an unknown whether Ward is still one of the best, he may well be but Mayorga isn't going to show us whether this lay off has done him any harm, there will still be questions should this fight happen.

by TRUSSMAN66 Sat 21 Mar 2015, 1:01 am

Does anybody fight tough opponents in tune ups ??..

Tune ups are fights to get you ready for tough opponents..

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