Montreal Masters

First topic message reminder :

Started yesterday. Who's going to win it then?

Federer not playing. I voted for Djokovic.

Order of play here. Kyrgios v Verdasco looks interesting.

http://www.couperogers.com/en/schedules-and-results/order-of-play/

For sledging to work players have to be close enough together to be able to speak and be heard without it being picked up by microphones.

In cricket it works because the wicket keeper is behind the batsman, and fans at the edge of the pitch are about half a mile away.

In football it works because you can stand next to your opponent, or even whisper in their ear.

Tennis is a bit tricky. You could try the changeover as you walk past a player but the risk is you are near the umpire, and the crowd, and perhaps one or more microphones at that point.

By the way, all BB's comments about Kyrgios are spot on. He is hitting the nail on the head every time.

By the way, something else I wanted to moan about. The other day I was watching an interesting looking match, Thiem-Gulbis I believe it was, good looking match up, good to watch players, youngsters etc. When suddenly the TV decided to cut to a blatantly way less interesting match, I think it was Raonic-Karlovic, or some shoddy serve fest.

I hate this idea that TV must go with the show court match. The match is only on a show court because Raonic is Canadian but I am watching outside Canada so why should I care.

Isner beats Krygios - untouched on serve and took advantage of a shocking game in each set from Krygios.

Murray/Peers take the first set against Murray/Paes - not confusing at all!

Can I just squeeze one more moan in - it's annoying how the BBC refrains what quoting what the inappropriate comments actually were in this and other cases. All that achieves is waste 5 minutes of my time while I go and find the deleted tweet/ you tube video/ tabloid report of the same incidents. Come on BBC, either report the quoted comment or don't bother reporting the story, it's annoying.

This 'Grind Henman Bill's gears' was brought to you by Arby's.

Arby's..... where getting dysentery is more pleasant.

JS  .

Henman Bill wrote:By the way, something else I wanted to moan about. The other day I was watching an interesting looking match, Thiem-Gulbis I believe it was, good looking match up, good to watch players, youngsters etc. When suddenly the TV decided to cut to a blatantly way less interesting match, I think it was Raonic-Karlovic, or some shoddy serve fest.

I hate this idea that TV must go with the show court match. The match is only on a show court because Raonic is Canadian but I am watching outside Canada so why should I care.

Having returned from Canada after 15mths living there, this is only half of it HB, the advertising for tennis with bliddy Raonic was I was watching a match when Rafa was playing in the deciding game of a match they switched over for a Canadian who was playing, mind you even that was more understandable than switching over for Ice Hockey !!!!

Born Slippy wrote:Isner beats Krygios - untouched on serve and took advantage of a shocking game in each set from Krygios.

And dare I also speak for BB

So QF:

Djoko v Gulbis
Isner v Chardy
Nadal v Kei
Murray v Tsonga

Novak has looked untouchable and I think will win in 2.
Isner to win in 3.
Kei is favourite for me against Rafa. Think he will win in 2.
Tsonga v Murray is tough to call. However, Tsonga won in Canada last year and I think he will repeat that win in 3.

Born Slippy wrote:So QF:

Djoko v Gulbis
Isner v Chardy
Nadal v Kei
Murray v Tsonga

Novak has looked untouchable and I think will win in 2.
Isner to win in 3.
Kei is favourite for me against Rafa. Think he will win in 2.
Tsonga v Murray is tough to call. However, Tsonga won in Canada last year and I think he will repeat that win in 3.

Loaded bottom half!

Djokovic in 2
Isner in 3
Nishikori in 3
Murray in 2

Rafa v Kei is an interesting match. Both players seem to be in improving form. I lean toward Rafa on this one.

I also wouldn't be surprised by an Isner run to the final. He seems to be a decent dark horse in North America.

I think Murray is due a HC title though. The losing streak v Novak (if that's who he faces) has gone on way too long and I think it will finally snap in this North American swing.

Worth noting that if Murray does reach the final he will be up to Number 2 with Fed defending the title in Cinci. If so, have to assume he will be second seed for the US Open.

HM Murdoch wrote:Rafa v Kei is an interesting match. Both players seem to be in improving form. I lean toward Rafa on this one.

I also wouldn't be surprised by an Isner run to the final. He seems to be a decent dark horse in North America.

I think Murray is due a HC title though. The losing streak v Novak (if that's who he faces) has gone on way too long and I think it will finally snap in this North American swing.

Nishikori will be the big test for Rafa. He's yet to beat anyone that would suggest he's back to anywhere near his best. A win over an in form Nishikori would get my (and probably his rivals) attention.

Murray hasn't looked at his best so far, still think he'll beat Tsonga. Would be interested in a Murray v Nishikori match up.

Doesn't Djokovic just need to win Cincinnati to complete the collection of Masters? I wonder if he will make that his priority.

^Yep, a win in Cincy would give Novak the full set of (current) Masters level tournaments.

I believe he'll be the first player to have won all nine of whatever the active Master tournaments are at a given point but I stand to be corrected on that.

I don't think he'll prioritise though. If he's injury free, he'll be in it to win it.

Incidentally, I see winning all 9 Masters appears to have been designated the "Golden Career Masters". Yuck.

I was very disappointed by Sock's performance yesterday.

He often gets considered along with Kyrgios and Kokkinakis as one of the younger powerful players who may shake up the game but he got routinely swatted aside by Novak.

I had the beginnings of optimism about the future of the game after Wimbledon but I'm feeling more pessimistic now.

The post-FedererNadalDjokovic era really may well be a bit of a wilderness. We are having to resort to looking for players who "might be good if..." rather than seeing evident blossoming talent.

Not Golden Career Masters, just Career Masters. Golden comes in when he also has the Olympic Gold Medal. So Agassi and Rafa are the only two male players with Golden Career Slams. If Novak wins Cincy and then wins Olympic gold next year then he will have the Golden Career Masters.

Maybe after Fedal/Djoko, we will be back to an era like that from 2000 to 2003, ie one where no one dominates and many one slam wonders.

Belovedluckyboy wrote:Not Golden Career Masters, just Career Masters. Golden comes in when he also has the Olympic Gold Medal.  So Agassi and Rafa are the only two male players with Golden Career Slams.  If Novak wins Cincy and then wins Olympic gold next year then he will have the Golden Career Masters.

While logical, that is in fact wrong!:

http://www.atpworldtour.com/en/video/novak-djokovic-chases-career-golden-masters-in-cincinnati

I have no idea what gold has to do with it but that's what it seems to be called!

When I say prioritise, I mean prepare better for. I don't think the top players ever tank a match - i just think they show up for tournaments at 80% fitness or 90% practised. A small drop off is enough for them to lose. Wonder if this week Djokovic may lose to an Isner but win Cincinatti.

Only caught the end of Djokovic-Sock and the sky commentry team were throwing the word 'masterclass' around. Seemed like they thought Djokovic has just played really well. Maybe hyperbole though.

Guest82 wrote:Only caught the end of Djokovic-Sock and the sky commentry team were throwing the word 'masterclass' around. Seemed like they thought Djokovic has just played really well.  Maybe hyperbole though.

He did play well.

But I remember when Djoko and Murray were the young players coming up against Federer, Roger would often win but you could tell Novak and Andy had the game and were going to be very good.

There was no hint of that with Sock at all.

There was a point where Sock ran around his backhand and hit inside out forehand, Djokovic nailed a backhand down the line and he was in all sorts of bother. Petchey was saying that he needs to either hit better shots off the forehand or hit more backhands.

Think Sock is all serve/forehand. He's a good doubles player though so must be good at the net.

He had completely given up when I started watching though.

I'm not normally bothered about doubles but I really hope Nadal and Verdasco beat the Bryans later.

I know it happened yesterday but had to of course chime in with those that feel Kyrgios was way out of order. Although this has happened before I think Andre in his book talks about how Boris once told Steffi when she was watching Andre's match to basically she should go out with a real man like Boris. Del Po never said anything about Andy's mother, I was watching the match live and heard the comment. Andy was crying to the ref about something and Del Po told him to go cry to his momma. He didn't really say anything other than Andy being a crybaby basically.

What bothers me about the comment beyond the fact it is rude is that it is so silly and high school like behavior that it brings into question Kyrgios' mental makeup and intelligence. Dumb people rarely succeed to the absolute heights of sport especially a sport like tennis. His lack of intelligence and maturity if not addressed will keep him from dominating a tour like tennis nowadays. I know Connors and Mac were bad, but they were funny and often right, Kyrgios just shows real low brow schoolboy mentality for even thinking that let alone saying it. If you look at people who have been number 1 they have all been very bright, focused, and driven individuals who find away to lessen the distractions and manage their games and lives. Kyrgios so far doesn't show the iq to be a tennis great in a game that requires a great deal of smarts and intelligence. Everyone at this level is physically gifted and gifted shot wise, not everyone has it between the ears to be a great.

To get back to the masters. Isners been edged out by Chardy in a tight, VERY rain delayed match, is this Chardys first Masters semi?

Gulbis on the chopping block to Novak, his first decent run for the year though.

4-2 down, now 6-5 up! Gulbis serving for the set!

Real good match between these two. Gulbis was a set and a break but looked to have thrown it away but somehow saved set point and is at 5-5 int he 2nd!

Nadal v Nishikori. Nadal looks a mere shadow of his past, down 6-2, 4-1, but 0-40. Very impressive hitting from Nishikori.

Nishikori wins 6-2, 6-4.

Rafa's game looks outdated compared to the current breed of players'. He needs to revamp his game, if not he won't be beating the current power game. He has the tools to play the current power game if he chooses, as shown in the later part of the second set, just has to do it consistently and from the get go and not wait till it's too late.

Nishi beats him with pace and power, taking the ball early and hitting flatter and harder thus quicker. Rafa's shots looked like powder puff shots compared to Nishi's; it only when Rafa decided to take more risk and hits harder that he managed to win some points nearing the end.

I don't like this Rafa, what happened to his serve? It's like he couldn't think out there anymore and only when left with no choice then he turned aggressive. He and his team have to wake up and realize that his game is no longer enough for him to beat the top guys; take a leaf out of Fed's book, do a revamp of his game however minor that may be. Rafa has to come to terms that he's slower and not that powerful anymore, so he has to move up the court more often since he's good at the net.

Now I hope Nishi can win the title here and maybe, just maybe, wins his first slam at this USO.

Both Nole and Rafa had tough outings.

Nole had to save two MPs against Gulbis in the second set TB (one on Gulbis's serve) - who would have expected that?

Rafa was beaten quite comprehensively by Nishi.  In spite of that I thought it was - compared to his this year's performances - better than average Rafa performance.  Still, he left too many balls short and Nishi knew what he wanted to do with those.  But I also think that Rafa would have beaten most players with today's performance.  He continues to play at the level of a roughly #5-#8 player in the world.

Andy and Tsonga started a few minutes ago - just before midnight.

Early stages but Tsonga playing like a god so far. Backhand has been far more dangerous than normal.

I say that and he makes a run of errors in a row! Still on serve though. Murray playing solid stuff.

...and now he gets broken (Tsonga I mean).

Standard dipped a bit in the last couple of games, after a very promising start.

Going back to the previous match. Nishi looked very good for most of that match. Very aggressive without looking like he was forcing the issue above what he was capable of - kind of similar level to what he played against Nole in the USO last year. I wonder if he could threaten Andy or maybe even Nole if he plays like that.

Born Slippy wrote:Standard dipped a bit in the last couple of games, after a very promising start.

Yeah. not really very good from either player now.

Good stat that - Tsonga has had 44% unreturned serves in previous rounds. 13% in this match.

Insane backhand smash from Murray. Better than his standard smash!

Relatively routine first set to Murray.

I'm still trying to figure out how six in the poll thought current nadal is capable of going through 3 top 5 players on a hard court to win the title (even if it's a hard court that suits him).

TRuffin wrote:I'm still trying to figure out how six in the poll thought current nadal is capable of going through 3 top 5 players on a hard court to win the title (even if it's a hard court that suits him).  

Yeah, it was always going to be hard to beat Kei-Andy-Novak back-to-back-to-back. Kei won quite easily, and the score could perhaps have been even more one-sided in the second set.

Kei and Stan are the two second tier guys who I think have a chance against anyone when they play really well.  They are not as consistent as the big buys - not by a long shot.  But at their best I think they can trouble anyone.  Neither of them was there a few years ago.

All in all, pretty straightforward for Andy.

Well, Djoker almost lost to Gulbis so anything is possible.

I thought had Rafa played the way he played nearing end of second set, right from the get go, he would have his chances. Too bad, he served poorly to begin with, and waited till too late to turn aggressive. A lesson for him, he should look at how he played here two years ago.

Montreal is not a HC that suits Rafa, its a quick HC. Toronto is much slower.

@BLB
Have you any idea how the doubles went with Rafa/Nando v Bryant's
cant seem to find any results anywhere

Rafa/Nando lost in third set super TB, after losing first set and won sec set in a TB.

Awww thanks BLB
Not a bad performance then?

Exciting match between Djokovic and Gulbis.

Ernie served for it at 6-4 in the 2nd set TB but Novak played a typical Djoko point to win save it - stepped in on the return, pushed Ernie back with a shot that landed right on the baseline and then hit a nice IOFH winner when the short ball came.

Not spectacular but exactly the kind of pattern that this year has been built on. To play such tight margins on match point down showed a commendably cool head.