Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

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Post by super_realist on Tue 01 Sep 2015, 1:50 pm

First topic message reminder :

It's more the leaving it to the last minute which is nonsense. It is appalling business practice for the buyer to do this, as the seller knows they can keep the price high.

What is the point in the window being open for two months if nothing gets done until the last day? Just make it a day long, the opposite of a DFS sale.

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Post by Mad for Chelsea on Thu 04 Feb 2016, 7:52 pm

I was just about to post about this guy kwini, but you beat me to it.

I think the term "oxygen thief" comes to mind. It's very rare for me to genuinely wish ill on people, but I would be genuinely happy if this guy keeled over and died right now, the world would then be a significantly better place.

Apologies for any offence caused, but it makes me incredibly angry to see someone not just obscenely profiteering from people's suffering, but actively revelling in it vomit vomit vomit vomit

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Post by super_realist on Thu 04 Feb 2016, 8:12 pm

McLaren wrote:

And no, of course I don't wear Hugo boss to get on the bus.  Wink

Will you get on a Ford or VW bus?

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Post by MontysMerkin on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 8:52 am

kwinigolfer wrote:When it comes to doing stupid things, Bubba is a rank amateur compared to this guy:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2016/02/04/martin-shkreli-congressional-testimony-turing-pharmaceuticals-valeant-fda-drug-prices/79808004/

It really takes something (can't think of anything else offhand) to unite Dems and Repubs in Congress, but this berk has seemingly done the impossible; trust he'll get his comeuppance in short order.
He's done nothing that hasn't been going by big pharma for years. Just cos he hasn't got a cosy relationship with congress, he's been found out. the things they asked him were incredible!
Read Dr Ben Goldacre (bad science, big pharma) check him on youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRTVTuGHzYA
Yet another way to get tax payers money into private hands...
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Post by navyblueshorts on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 9:31 am

McLaren wrote:Navy

I guess I will ask you the same question that super failed to answer.  I assume if you are going to criticize my position you have an example of someone who you know to be homophobic, racist or sexist and who you still respect and make time to listen to their opinion.  

If not then both you and I are in exactly the same position in practical terms.


Not many things in life are simple, I grant you that, but writing someone off for being homophobic seems like one of life's simple conclusions.
Honestly, you don't get it do you? You're conflating two separate issues. I tend to find I listen to what someone says and take it on its merits, rather than prejudice my thinking based on another opinion the speaker might have on a completely different subject.
If, for example, Hitler were to have commented on German immigration policy (I'm sure he did) during the late 1930s, I suspect I might have wondered if his übermensch thinking might have in some way biased his immigration theorising and taken it with a pinch of salt.
If Bubba comments on course design, I'm really not going to take into account his thinking on homosexuals if what he says is worth listening to.
You say above "still respect". You're confusing general respect for someone with respect for the content of something they say.
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Post by navyblueshorts on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 9:41 am

MontysMerkin wrote:
kwinigolfer wrote:When it comes to doing stupid things, Bubba is a rank amateur compared to this guy:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2016/02/04/martin-shkreli-congressional-testimony-turing-pharmaceuticals-valeant-fda-drug-prices/79808004/

It really takes something (can't think of anything else offhand) to unite Dems and Repubs in Congress, but this berk has seemingly done the impossible; trust he'll get his comeuppance in short order.
He's done nothing that hasn't been going by big pharma for years. Just cos he hasn't got a cosy relationship with congress, he's been found out. the things they asked him were incredible!
Read Dr Ben Goldacre (bad science, big pharma) check him on youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRTVTuGHzYA
Yet another way to get tax payers money into private hands...
Big Pharma, generally, doesn't buy up the rights to an out-of-patent drug and hike the price by ~5000% purely to make money out of what are often people who're the least able to pay. They also don't have the same, public, **** you attitude while they're doing what they do. I wouldn't p!ss on this guy if he was on fire. Hopefully they catch up with him re. the embezzlement (or whatever) he's being investigated for at the moment.
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Post by MontysMerkin on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 11:27 am

navyblueshorts wrote:
MontysMerkin wrote:
kwinigolfer wrote:When it comes to doing stupid things, Bubba is a rank amateur compared to this guy:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2016/02/04/martin-shkreli-congressional-testimony-turing-pharmaceuticals-valeant-fda-drug-prices/79808004/

It really takes something (can't think of anything else offhand) to unite Dems and Repubs in Congress, but this berk has seemingly done the impossible; trust he'll get his comeuppance in short order.
He's done nothing that hasn't been going by big pharma for years. Just cos he hasn't got a cosy relationship with congress, he's been found out. the things they asked him were incredible!
Read Dr Ben Goldacre (bad science, big pharma) check him on youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRTVTuGHzYA
Yet another way to get tax payers money into private hands...
Big Pharma, generally, doesn't buy up the rights to an out-of-patent drug and hike the price by ~5000% purely to make money out of what are often people who're the least able to pay. They also don't have the same, public, **** you attitude while they're doing what they do. I wouldn't p!ss on this guy if he was on fire. Hopefully they catch up with him re. the embezzlement (or whatever) he's being investigated for at the moment.
Your naivety does you no credit. picard
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Post by McLaren on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 11:37 am

Monty

I have also read bad pharma and did come away with the impression that the main sin of big pharma was excessive price hikes for vital drugs.  I appreciate they (along with governments) could do more to ensure drugs are available to all, but the bigger crime was the abandonment of the scientific method.

Outcome switching, removal of blinding, pulling trials early, binning data, p hacking, cherry picking, manipulation of clinicians etc are the sort of areas big pharma really fail patients.


I would almost argue that thinking all big pharma does is ramp up prices of drugs that work is the naive view, when the real crime is getting drugs to market without having carried out robust randomized controlled clinical trials.
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Post by kwinigolfer on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 11:47 am

Mac,
Just asking because I don't know:
Is it legal to advertise prescription drugs on TV, on-line and and newsprint in Britain?

Shkreli is treading a dangerous line biting the hand that has fed his gazillions: Congress, who have fallen over themselves to give tax breaks to hedge funds and drug companies.

Monty might well accurately describe the situation in North Lincs, but in the US this bloke (with behaviour that has been sanctioned by Congress) is a pariah.

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Post by MontysMerkin on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 11:48 am

Good effort Mac, but they are all part and parcel of the same thing. Check out Alltrials.net for the current work in the area. I teach critical appraisal of medical literature to clinicians and often have to bite my tongue at the scandalous and criminal behaviour that goes on in medical publishing and big pharma (a cosy little relationship). Check out the record fines in the last few years that big pharma has had to pay out. To keep some drugs (the expensive ones usually) within patent these companies have been known to change the flavour and are awarded a further 7 years to print money. Who in their right mind could argue against this guy - http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/jan/26/big-pharmas-worst-nightmare
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Post by MontysMerkin on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 11:51 am

kwinigolfer wrote:Mac,
Just asking because I don't know:
Is it legal to advertise prescription drugs on TV, on-line and and newsprint in Britain?

Shkreli is treading a dangerous line biting the hand that has fed his gazillions: Congress, who have fallen over themselves to give tax breaks to hedge funds and drug companies.

Monty might well accurately describe the situation in North Lincs, but in the US this bloke (with behaviour that has been sanctioned by Congress) is a pariah.
I've no doubt kwini but it does show how large corporations have bought the silence of policy makers.
The best we can hope for is that his (admittedly repulsive) behaviour brings to light the corruption and downright criminality of these pharma companies. But to say he is doing something that no one else is doing is, well I don't want to be rude.
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Post by kwinigolfer on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 11:59 am

Agreed Monty,
Happily, he is now the de facto poster child for decades of abusive behaviour, facilitated as you say by buying Congress, by hedge funds and health care operations.
Bernie couldn't have scripted it better.

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Post by McLaren on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 12:12 pm

I will take drugs that have been shown to work using proper evidence and let the politicians worry about how much they cost.

Lets face it, if the politicians were not best mates with sort of people who invest heavily in big pharma shares I am sure the NHS could get a few more discounts on drug prices.

As a skeptic I am more interested in how pharma tries to prove the efficacy of its new drugs rather than the fact they trade in a failed market.

" often have to bite my tongue at the scandalous and criminal behaviour that goes on in medical publishing and big pharma"

So exactly what I said in the post you were responding to?
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Post by navyblueshorts on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 12:29 pm

MontysMerkin wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
MontysMerkin wrote:
kwinigolfer wrote:When it comes to doing stupid things, Bubba is a rank amateur compared to this guy:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2016/02/04/martin-shkreli-congressional-testimony-turing-pharmaceuticals-valeant-fda-drug-prices/79808004/

It really takes something (can't think of anything else offhand) to unite Dems and Repubs in Congress, but this berk has seemingly done the impossible; trust he'll get his comeuppance in short order.
He's done nothing that hasn't been going by big pharma for years. Just cos he hasn't got a cosy relationship with congress, he's been found out. the things they asked him were incredible!
Read Dr Ben Goldacre (bad science, big pharma) check him on youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRTVTuGHzYA
Yet another way to get tax payers money into private hands...
Big Pharma, generally, doesn't buy up the rights to an out-of-patent drug and hike the price by ~5000% purely to make money out of what are often people who're the least able to pay. They also don't have the same, public, **** you attitude while they're doing what they do. I wouldn't p!ss on this guy if he was on fire. Hopefully they catch up with him re. the embezzlement (or whatever) he's being investigated for at the moment.
Your naivety does you no credit. picard
I beg your pardon? Ben Goldacre is not the fount of all knowledge re. evidence-based science and how bad the pharma industry is. Feel free to dance in the rain while chanting the next time you're unwell....
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Post by MontysMerkin on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 12:52 pm

"They also don't have the same, public, **** you attitude while they're doing what they do. " Erm yes they do.
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Post by MontysMerkin on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 12:53 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
MontysMerkin wrote:
navyblueshorts wrote:
MontysMerkin wrote:
kwinigolfer wrote:When it comes to doing stupid things, Bubba is a rank amateur compared to this guy:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2016/02/04/martin-shkreli-congressional-testimony-turing-pharmaceuticals-valeant-fda-drug-prices/79808004/

It really takes something (can't think of anything else offhand) to unite Dems and Repubs in Congress, but this berk has seemingly done the impossible; trust he'll get his comeuppance in short order.
He's done nothing that hasn't been going by big pharma for years. Just cos he hasn't got a cosy relationship with congress, he's been found out. the things they asked him were incredible!
Read Dr Ben Goldacre (bad science, big pharma) check him on youtube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRTVTuGHzYA
Yet another way to get tax payers money into private hands...
Big Pharma, generally, doesn't buy up the rights to an out-of-patent drug and hike the price by ~5000% purely to make money out of what are often people who're the least able to pay. They also don't have the same, public, **** you attitude while they're doing what they do. I wouldn't p!ss on this guy if he was on fire. Hopefully they catch up with him re. the embezzlement (or whatever) he's being investigated for at the moment.
Your naivety does you no credit. picard
I beg your pardon? Ben Goldacre is not the fount of all knowledge re. evidence-based science and how bad the pharma industry is. Feel free to dance in the rain while chanting the next time you're unwell....
No but a good place to start for the layman (ben goldacre not dancing in the rain...!) Having said that dancing in the rain may achieve more when you look at the over medication of the western world.
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Post by 1GrumpyGolfer on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 1:18 pm

kwinigolfer wrote:Mac,
Just asking because I don't know:
Is it legal to advertise prescription drugs on TV, on-line and and newsprint in Britain?

Kwini, no. Family and friends are always amazed at the number of drug adverts on TV when they come to visit. Typically in the UK the doctor says I'm prescribing this to treat whatever symptom. If you're getting something to treat high cholesterol you won't get the chance to ask for Crestor over Lipitor, or vice versa, you get what they give you.

At least that was my experience/knowledge prior to moving over here. Mrs Grumps got asked why she was taking a particular blood pressure medication. She said it's what the doctor in England prescribed. The response was that's interesting, we typically prescribe that to old men.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 1:29 pm

Grumps,
Mrs kwini works at our local medical centre and she reckons advertising of Prescription drugs is among the biggest contributory factors in the cost of health care here, not to mention it causes patients to request drugs they've seen on TV. Plus the number of prescribed pain killers that morph the patient from rehab into addiction.
To which I would add that the %age (sometimes over 75%) of health-care ads on TV news broadcasts is extraordinary, plus the number of quasi-advertising "news" features, some of which refer to drugs that are subsequently discredited. Ridiculous. Media just as corrupt as the ne'er do wells they cover.

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Post by MontysMerkin on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 1:34 pm

I was amazed when visiting the states, at the number (and length of associated disclaimers!) of adverts for medicine. I think it could well be the root cause of the over medication of the public.
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Post by kwinigolfer on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 1:44 pm

Spot on, on every count.
If you listened to the "disclaimers" (some of which include possible death!) you would rather not take the advertised risks.

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Post by McLaren on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 1:52 pm

The root cause of all the US healthcare systems problems is having nearly the whole thing privatized and at the mercy of insurance companies.
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Post by 1GrumpyGolfer on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 2:14 pm

I'd want to know what the risk of death from whatever it is that I have and compare it to what the risk is for whatever it is they want to give me. Scary stuff included in those disclosures.

The amount of adverts for mycoxafloppin during the evening news and golf coverage shows they know what their audience is.

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Post by navyblueshorts on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 9:27 pm

MontysMerkin wrote:"They also don't have the same, public, **** you attitude while they're doing what they do. " Erm yes they do.
No, they don't. Not in the context of this worm. They don't sit there in front of a Senate oversight ctte. (or whatever it was) and smirk their way through while claiming the 5th Amendment.
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Post by navyblueshorts on Fri 05 Feb 2016, 9:28 pm

1GrumpyGolfer wrote:...The amount of adverts for mycoxafloppin during the evening news and golf coverage shows they know what their audience is.  
Laugh
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Post by kwinigolfer on Sat 06 Feb 2016, 3:02 pm

nocoxafloppin in the Leicester dressing room.
As Jack Nicholson said to Man City:
"You can't handle the Huth."

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Post by super_realist on Sat 06 Feb 2016, 3:30 pm

Certainly makes a very boring league a lot more interesting having Leicester in there looking to win it.

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Post by McLaren on Sat 06 Feb 2016, 3:56 pm

Did Pep pick the wrong team? Looks like it is Leicester that would give him the ready made championship winning squad.
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Post by McLaren on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 4:32 pm

WTF is "The Jump"? Just noticed a whole load of posts on twitter about one of the contestants suffering a broken neck after a whole bunch more were injured. Has Super_realist been busy designing a reality contest to see off all the celebs he hates?
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Post by super_realist on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 4:42 pm

Mac, during my years I spent in the Alps I've seen enough disgusting injuries (broken legs, broken arms, dislocated hips, broken backs and even a broken neck) I wouldn't wish such an injury on anyone but a few of the people I least like.

I haven't seen the programme, but would wager pretty strongly that most of the injuries relate to shear lack of talent.

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Post by McLaren on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 4:45 pm

Super

Where have you been hiding such kindheartedness and compassion for your fellow man?
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Post by 1GrumpyGolfer on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 4:46 pm

Sounds like it is a tie in to the Eddie the Eagle movie celebrating his "achievements" in Calgary way back when. Don't know who won the gold medal but everyone knows who came last.

Think the winner will be the last one standing by the look of it.

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Post by super_realist on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 5:01 pm

Mac, i'm fortunate enough never to have broken a bone, but they are really tough things to witness, especially compound ones.

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Post by golfermartin on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 5:07 pm

I've seen an episode in the last series. The celebrities compete in winter sports (the one I saw was bob sleigh) and the two bottom placed do a ski jump to avoid leaving the show. It seems to be the ski jump where most accidents are occurring. I think they have a good deal of guts just to try it. Beth Tweddle (broken vertebrae and operation) and Becky Addlington (dislocated shoulder) are two retirees this year I understand

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Post by McLaren on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 5:37 pm

Super

What is the worst injury you have witnessed?
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Post by super_realist on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 6:52 pm

I saw a young kid break his back by the looks of it (though I can't confirm he did but his lack of movement made it look like it and he fell right onto it from about 20 ft.) and I saw a guy on ski's break both lower bones in one leg so badly that they had spiked through his tough gore tex ski 'trousers' (sorry, can't call them 'pants'). There was blood everywhere. If you want an analogy for it, then you'd be talking the horrific David Buust leg break when playing for Cov against Man U, but this was actually worse.

The most painful though was the dislocated pelvis, big guy, looked like he was tough but he was screaming like nothing I've ever heard.

Seen quite a few bad ankle breaks at 5 a side too.

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Post by Davie on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 9:05 pm

The Jump - a reality show where ex-gymnasts, ex-swimmers, ex-Corrie-actors and God knows who else think they can become winter sport experts all for the sake of money. Were they forced to enter such a contest? No of course not. The gene pool will get shallower.

"Think of it as evolution in action" - and a Davie bonus point for anyone who can identify that quote without resorting to Google (that rules out Mac)

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Post by McLaren on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 10:37 pm

Davie

The Darwin awards?
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Post by 1GrumpyGolfer on Mon 08 Feb 2016, 11:49 pm

George Carlin?

I'm sure there are thousands of reasons that they're doing it but I'd rather be doing something else.

I've never broken a bone but have dislocated my shoulder several times. Whilst the joint is "out" the pain is debilitating and there is no comfortable position that you can remain in for a long period of time. The best, I think, was to be bent over at the waist and let the arm hang down like a dead weight. The pain can be relieved, switched off, in an instance by having the joint relocated. After one particular time I was laying on the ground shaking (had no idea I was doing that) in agony. As I started to get up it slipped back into place and the pain was gone. I wouldn't wish that kind of pain on anyone and I can't imagine what a dislocated pelvis would be like.

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Post by super_realist on Tue 09 Feb 2016, 6:47 am

Grumps, think of it as a useful thing to have, like Martin Riggs off Lethal Weapon in case you find yourself tied to a pier piling underwater, or just like 9C, you can self diagnose and pop it back in yourself, and carry on as normal.

As for these people on The Jump, I'm amazed there aren't special advisers (or if there are they aren't doing their job) stopping these people doing jumps they don't have the technique and skill to do. You could spot a mile off whether they have the capability, speed, body language etc to do it carry it off. I've seen over/under confidence coming to peoples injury a hundred times.

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Post by 1GrumpyGolfer on Tue 09 Feb 2016, 11:02 am

Was that the one with the stunt double loosely tied up in a swimming pool with divers behind the camera with oxygen masks just in case he took too long to get out of it?  

Never had the chance to try it as I got mine fixed; it was so loose I could slide it out rolling over on the sofa. Some ten weeks later, on my first day back at work, I fell on the stairs. I instinctively grabbed for the railing and of course it's the bad side. Hurt like Frak, pain similar to a dislocation but it never moved, thank Frak.

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Post by Bob_the_Job on Tue 09 Feb 2016, 11:31 am

Don't mention fraking (sic) around Super Smile
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Post by raycastleunited on Tue 09 Feb 2016, 3:04 pm

I saw a bit of this last year. It's a tough ask but the contestants were going through intensive training and weren't jumping off the full Olympic height ski jump.

It's a shame that the people getting injured are the likes of Addlington and Tweddle, and not the dregs of idiocy we see on big brother and other reality shows.

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Post by kwinigolfer on Tue 09 Feb 2016, 3:37 pm

Don't know anything about this but I can think of a dozen Republican Primary candidates who'd look good coming down a 110 metre hill.
Plus Cheney and Dubya of course. And Reagan's coffin.

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Post by navyblueshorts on Tue 09 Feb 2016, 4:59 pm

...and Bliar. Preferably with the landing area mined.
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Post by super_realist on Tue 09 Feb 2016, 5:04 pm

Prefer Celebrity Snake Charming, or Celebrity Shark Bait, or I'm A Celebrity Get me out of Darfur.

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Post by navyblueshorts on Wed 10 Feb 2016, 11:14 am

super_realist wrote:...I'm A Celebrity Get me out of Darfur.
Laugh That, I might tune in for.
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Post by McLaren on Wed 10 Feb 2016, 3:44 pm

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35541528

Will he have to find employment on the next season of the Jump?
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Post by pedro on Wed 10 Feb 2016, 8:19 pm

McLaren wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35541528

Will he have to find employment on the next season of the Jump?
I'll do his gf if he doesn't want.

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Post by pedro on Wed 10 Feb 2016, 8:23 pm

navyblueshorts wrote:
super_realist wrote:...I'm A Celebrity Get me out of Darfur.
Laugh That, I might tune in for.
What about "Celeb Gladiator". I'm sure they'd be allowed to stage it in Africa somewhere. Ratings would sky rocket if they did a special Geordie Shore episode.

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Post by McLaren on Wed 10 Feb 2016, 10:57 pm

pedro wrote:
McLaren wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-35541528

Will he have to find employment on the next season of the Jump?
I'll do his gf if he doesn't want.

Pedro, he is going to jail for doing his girlfriend. I think she was touch on the young side.
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Post by pedro on Wed 10 Feb 2016, 11:14 pm

Eeeh, I'm talking about the one in the picture. Apparantly he doesn't fancy her enough.

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