Official Ramirez v Ovil for IBF Title 02/10/2015

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 9:32 am

The IBF have stripped Yoan Pablo Hernandez of his title and made Victor Ramirez full champ.

His first defense will be against 'The Upsetter' Ovil McKenzie. Who has never tasted defeat at cruiser.

Could he live up to his moniker? I'll hold my hands up and say I havent seen Ramirez fight so am not sure what sort of chance he has?

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR OVIL

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 9:59 am

25-12......Shameful..

Wonder if there will ever come a time anybody takes Cruiser seriously.

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 10:07 am

His record at cruiser is near to 11-0 6KO

by Coxy001 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 10:08 am

Well boxrec'd Truss.

And doubtful. A "natural" CW is always going to be moving up to HW or killing themselves down to LHW as that's where the £ is. Cruiser has a history of not exactly being stacked with talent and can't ever see it being a top division.

by TopHat24/7 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 10:15 am

Oh dear.

You know what this means?

Ovil wins setting up the FINAL PART IN THE TRILOGY with Tony Bell-end. Who will probably win.

Dear god....

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 10:28 am

Just done some boxrecing and Ramirez is only 5"7 with a 69" reach Shocked

by TopHat24/7 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 10:44 am

WTF????

by wheelchair1991 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 10:45 am

Where is this taking place?

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 10:46 am

Sorry its in Argentina

Here is Ramirez http://boxrec.com/boxer/352748

by wheelchair1991 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 11:06 am

Can't see Ovil winning over there

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 11:37 am

Coxy001 wrote:Well boxrec'd Truss.

And doubtful. A "natural" CW is always going to be moving up to HW or killing themselves down to LHW as that's where the £ is. Cruiser has a history of not exactly being stacked with talent and can't ever see it being a top division.

I did look up his record....But I've seen him lose plenty of times....

Do we really want this guy as a champion...How low can boxing go

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 11:41 am

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Coxy001 wrote:Well boxrec'd Truss.

And doubtful. A "natural" CW is always going to be moving up to HW or killing themselves down to LHW as that's where the £ is. Cruiser has a history of not exactly being stacked with talent and can't ever see it being a top division.

I did look up his record....But I've seen him lose plenty of times....

Do we really want this guy as a champion...How low can boxing go

Hard working boxer who has never really had a promoters backing and has worked his way to contention.

It would be a 'feel good' story if he picks up the win and I certainly wouldn't begrude him that.

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 11:44 am

Do people still think belts are a big deal in boxing?

The alphabet belts are a load of sh1t.

Too many ordinary fighters getting to fight for "world titles" these days!

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 11:50 am

AdamT wrote:Do people still think belts are a big deal in boxing?

The alphabet belts are a load of sh1t.

Too many ordinary fighters getting to fight for "world titles" these days!

Its still the pinnacle achievement of a boxers career.

Am sure if Ovil picked up the W he would benefit financial from it.

On further 'Boxrecing' Ramirez had trouble prior to the Afolabi fight with unknown American Deon Elam who had him down twice in the 1st round but turning the tide and stopping him in the second.

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 11:55 am

Naw I know mate, just too many fighters classed as "World champions" now.

Any other era they wouldn't be close.

For example Froch is a fantastic fighter, one of our greatest in recent years. If today was like the 60's, he would of just been seen as a top contender rather than THE champion.

Plenty of old time fighters who were never a world champ, probably don't get a mention.

Rant over, sorry to hijack the thread.

Fair play to Ovil. Hope he wins.

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 1:01 pm

Soldier_Of_Fortune wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Coxy001 wrote:Well boxrec'd Truss.

And doubtful. A "natural" CW is always going to be moving up to HW or killing themselves down to LHW as that's where the £ is. Cruiser has a history of not exactly being stacked with talent and can't ever see it being a top division.

I did look up his record....But I've seen him lose plenty of times....

Do we really want this guy as a champion...How low can boxing go

Hard working boxer who has never really had a promoters backing and has worked his way to contention.

It would be a 'feel good' story if he picks up the win and I certainly wouldn't begrude him that.

I begrudge perennial losers being able to get World champion status when plenty of talented fighters fell short in the past because they had to fight quality..

"Hard working" ... Yep not many boxers work hard..

by TopHat24/7 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 1:04 pm

Adrien Broner

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 1:11 pm

Soldier you were against the hard working Paul Smith getting a shot.

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 1:19 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Soldier you were against the hard working Paul Smith getting a shot.

Smith got that fight due to his promoters (well his former promoters) backing something Ovil has never had.

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 1:33 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:Adrien Broner

How this clown is a 3 weight world champ is a mockery of the sport.

by TopHat24/7 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 1:36 pm

AdamT wrote:
TopHat24/7 wrote:Adrien Broner

How this clown is a 3 weight world champ is a mockery of the sport.

https://www.606v2.com/t60313-is-adrien-broner-being-lined-up-to-become-the-world-s-worst-4-weight-champ-ever?highlight=broner

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 1:48 pm

Soldier_Of_Fortune wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Soldier you were against the hard working Paul Smith getting a shot.

Smith got that fight due to his promoters (well his former promoters) backing something Ovil has never had.

Doesn't really matter how Smith got the fight....He was more respected than Ovill

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:00 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Soldier_Of_Fortune wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Soldier you were against the hard working Paul Smith getting a shot.

Smith got that fight due to his promoters (well his former promoters) backing something Ovil has never had.

Doesn't really matter how Smith got the fight....He was more respected than Ovill

Not sure what your getting at?

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:04 pm

Let's leave it.....

by Rowley Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:05 pm

As Soldier has said if Ovil can win this it will give a hard working honest pro an opportunity to make a few quid before he gets out of the game. Cannot really begrudge him this. I get all the arguments about it devaluing titles, but that has already happened and then some. Boxing is broken, but it sure as hell was not broken by the likes of McKenzie. Good luck to him.

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:14 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Let's leave it.....

No you brought it up. So are you saying Smith is a more credible opponant or he's better known in boxing?

by TopHat24/7 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:24 pm

I think Truss is saying it looks hypocritical of you to say 'fair play' for someone as bang-average as Ovil to get a title shot when you were critical of a higher-profile boxer with a better cv (ish) getting a shot in Paul Smith.

And I think you're saying that the situation is different because the point you're making is that it's fair play Ovil as you're a hard-working nobody with no promotional backing whereas Smith Jr had one of the biggest promotional teams in the world backing him and getting him that shot.

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:25 pm

Rowley wrote:As Soldier has said if Ovil can win this it will give a hard working honest pro an opportunity to make a few quid before he gets out of the game. Cannot really begrudge him this. I get all the arguments about it devaluing titles, but that has already happened and then some. Boxing is broken, but it sure as hell was not broken by the likes of McKenzie. Good luck to him.

Well that's okay then... Give any old useless chump a belt...

Let's stop with this good honest pro crap......

by Rowley Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:27 pm

Truss as you know start a petition for us to have eight divisions and one champion per division and my name will be the first on it, but I get wound up with the system that exists, not the fighters who profit from that system.

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:33 pm

Just wondering where it's going to end??.......Peter Buckley was an honest pro...

Don't want one champion a division....Prefer 2 and I'd keep the junior divisions as well...

Get rid of cruiser though.

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:34 pm

I'd love one champ a divison.

Also 8 divisons would be amazing.

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:38 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Rowley wrote:As Soldier has said if Ovil can win this it will give a hard working honest pro an opportunity to make a few quid before he gets out of the game. Cannot really begrudge him this. I get all the arguments about it devaluing titles, but that has already happened and then some. Boxing is broken, but it sure as hell was not broken by the likes of McKenzie. Good luck to him.

Well that's okay then... Give any old useless chump a belt...

Let's stop with this good honest pro crap......

Why can't someone be commended for there dedication to there sport, especially when there at the lower end of the spectrum making ends meat?

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:40 pm

Who is going to rank the fighters...No thanks.

Teddy Kennedy had to threaten to investigate the WBC in order for Marc to get a shot.

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:41 pm

Sure we could have more belts.

Also 4 or 5 more weight divisons would do some good.

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:46 pm

Soldier_Of_Fortune wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Rowley wrote:As Soldier has said if Ovil can win this it will give a hard working honest pro an opportunity to make a few quid before he gets out of the game. Cannot really begrudge him this. I get all the arguments about it devaluing titles, but that has already happened and then some. Boxing is broken, but it sure as hell was not broken by the likes of McKenzie. Good luck to him.

Well that's okay then... Give any old useless chump a belt...

Let's stop with this good honest pro crap......

Why can't someone be commended for there dedication to there sport, especially when there at the lower end of the spectrum making ends meat?

Why can't we commend useless chumps without demeaning the title of World Champion

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:48 pm

A serious post this time.

I wish there were 8 divisons, at the very most maybe 10.

Also 2 belts at most.

Also same day weigh ins.

by Soldier_Of_Fortune Tue 22 Sep 2015, 2:48 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Soldier_Of_Fortune wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Rowley wrote:As Soldier has said if Ovil can win this it will give a hard working honest pro an opportunity to make a few quid before he gets out of the game. Cannot really begrudge him this. I get all the arguments about it devaluing titles, but that has already happened and then some. Boxing is broken, but it sure as hell was not broken by the likes of McKenzie. Good luck to him.

Well that's okay then... Give any old useless chump a belt...

Let's stop with this good honest pro crap......

Why can't someone be commended for there dedication to there sport, especially when there at the lower end of the spectrum making ends meat?

Why can't we commend useless chumps without demeaning the title of World Champion

So you would class Ovil as a useless chump if he went over to Argentina and KTFO Ramirez?

by Pedro147 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:01 pm

AdamT wrote:A serious post this time.

I wish there were 8 divisons, at the very most maybe 10.

Also 2 belts at most.

Also same day weigh ins.

Explain each of your three points. State how it'd work in reality and why it would be better. Also name your 8-10 weight classes including the weight limits in each.

Why two belts? How would you remove existing organisations?

Same day weigh ins while it will reduce a fighters ability to put on large amount of weight it does increase risk of brain injury. So why is it better?

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:06 pm

The old weight classes?

Maybe keep Super Middle and Light Middle!

If it is same day weigh in , then many won't try to cut huge amounts of weight. Also make fighters in similar weight fight more often.

Alos stop weight hopping.

Can't remove organisations, but a sport with 4 or more world champions is a farce.

"Hi my name is John Doe. I am the Wbo world champion, however I am really ranked about 20 on other respected scources."

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:12 pm

I think the FBI should investigate the WBC and WBA....like they investigated FIFA...

Eventually ban them from plying their trade in the USA and then we can have the American based WBO and IBF...

by Pedro147 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:12 pm

AdamT wrote:The old weight classes?

Maybe keep Super Middle and Light Middle!

If it is same day weigh in , then many won't try to cut huge amounts of weight. Also make fighters in similar weight fight more often.

Alos stop weight hopping.

Can't remove organisations, but a sport with 4 or more world champions is a farce.

"Hi my name is John Doe. I am the Wbo world champion, however I am really ranked about 20 on other respected scources."

So no Cruiserweight? I think maybe at lower weight a few divisions could be combined but that about it.

You've come a long way from when you first posted a few months ago and stated you didn't know too much about boxing to now being able to highlight the radical reforms you'd like to see implemented.

So you don't think that the higher risk of brain injuries from same day weigh ins is as serious as fighters weight hopping in divisions?

by Pedro147 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:14 pm

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I think the FBI should investigate the WBC and WBA....like they investigated FIFA...

Eventually ban them from plying their trade in the USA and then we can have the American based WBO and IBF...

Yep, divisions of Lamont Peterson's is what we need.

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:15 pm

Well you mention the risks about brain damage.

How about the risk of someone cutting 20 pounds of water and entering the ring with a huge weight increase. Could that cause brain damage?

Do you think Cotto and Canelo are the same size?

Also I still know f..k all about the history of the sport. However I do think some things can improve it.

by Rowley Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:17 pm

From what I have read the evidence to support the theory there are more injuries with day of fight weigh ins is shaky at best. From what I recall reading the amount of injuries are pretty consistent either way.

by Pedro147 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:19 pm

AdamT wrote:Well you mention the risks about brain damage.

How about the risk of someone cutting 20 pounds of water and entering the ring with a huge weight increase. Could that cause brain damage?

Do you think Cotto and Canelo are the same size?

Also I still know f..k all about the history of the sport. However I do think some things can improve it.

It reduces the risk of brain damage as they've rehydrated.

Where have I said I think Cotto and Canelo were the same size? I suppose in the 80s Duran and Leonard were the same size and that this is a recent phenomenon of one fighter being bigger than the other?

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:19 pm

Pedro147 wrote:
TRUSSMAN66 wrote:I think the FBI should investigate the WBC and WBA....like they investigated FIFA...

Eventually ban them from plying their trade in the USA and then we can have the American based WBO and IBF...

Yep, divisions of Lamont Peterson's is what we need.

What a strange post

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:21 pm

Pedro, the point is, less dehydration will happen, because 170 pounders will not be cutting 15 plus pounds.

They will fight at the divison they belong.

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:23 pm

Naive Adam....

Boxers always try to get as low as they can...

Rowley forgets fights like Sandoval - Canizales....

Think we'll stay as we are..

by AdamT Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:24 pm

Less chance of boxers using illegal techniques to make weight.

by TRUSSMAN66 Tue 22 Sep 2015, 3:27 pm

How do you know...

Boxers will always want to fight smaller guys if poss..

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