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GGG vs Canelo

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Post by AdamT on Wed 30 Aug 2017, 12:41 pm

First topic message reminder :

Now that the sideshow is out of the way, we have a serious fight just around the corner.

I have been watching both guys in their workouts and they are looking insane!

I said I find it hard to pick a winner. I still do, but I am leaning to GGG. Canelo is looking like a beast, but he might be too fired up. GGG just looks much more at ease, at least when he is being interviewed. No matter what I have said about Gennady, he is a very hard fighter to beat and he is obviously very focused for the biggest fight of his career.

Both guys are brilliant boxers and both guys have serious power. I just think GGG's experience and aura at 160 will give him a slight edge. Canelo is very tough, but I expect GGG to come from behind on the scorecards and stop a tiring Canelo very late.

Can't wait for this now and no doubt by the time this fight comes round, I could be leaning to Canelo. It's a great fight!

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Post by AdamT on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 1:10 pm

LionsV2 wrote:Sorry but he most certainly didn't definitely lose to Trout, had him winning that comfortably as well as the Cotto fight, never understood the basis for him losing either fight.

I think With Trout, he was up on the cards and coasted to victory. He definitely beat Cotto, but it was closer than the cards suggested.

I think Lara won the fight with his jab, but Canelo landed the better shots. Must watch it again my memory is a bit hazy with the fight. I remember Lara jabbing and moving often.

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Post by 88Chris05 on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 2:13 pm

I don’t think anyone can or would dispute that Alvarez has been operating with some extra protection from the judges which hasn’t been afforded to his opponents.

It’s not that any particular fight (well, up until Saturday night, I guess) has been a huge travesty or highway job in and of itself – it’s that in all of these instances, Canelo has consistently got the luck which, going by the law of averages, should have been spread more evenly between him and the other guys he’s been fighting. It appears that to get a verdict against him, you’ve got to absolutely shut him out, twelve rounds to nil ala the Mayweather fight…And even then, one judge still managed to give him a draw.

I felt he just edged Trout very narrowly, basically due to the knockdown. So can’t quibble with Alvarez getting his hand raised overall – but unanimously, with a 116-111 and, even more ridiculously, a 118-109 card thrown in? Similarly, I had the Lara fight a draw, and felt it was an opportunity missed for the Cuban – but again, a 117-111 card? He definitely beat Cotto for my money, but once more, the scores were just too wide.

Then of course we had the farce at the weekend. A small smattering of observers thought he might have been worth a draw, though they are significantly outnumbered (correctly in my view) by those who felt he lost, but absolutely nobody could say he won, much less by the ludicrous margin that Mrs. Byrd came up with.

I think we’ve reached a point now where it’s becoming a bit of a joke with Alvarez, and where it’s far too much of a frequent occurrence to be chalked down to coincidence. I do like the guy, and he can fight, but it’s about time he was left solely to his own devices rather than having this trademark safety net whenever he’s in a remotely close or competitive fight.
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Post by hazharrison on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 2:40 pm

88Chris05 wrote:I scored if 116-113 to Golovkin. Gave him the fourth through to the eighth, the tenth and the eleventh. Gave Alvarez the first two, the ninth and the twelfth, with the third round even.

A couple of rounds could be quibbled over either way, but I have no doubt that no matter how many times I watched it I'd be coming to the same conclusion; Golovkin, while not totally running away with it, won a close-ish but still clear enough fight. I've seen some people (not on here, but elsewhere) trying to equivocate for the verdict with the usual old straw man arguments of 'Well, there have been worse decisions', or 'Golovkin should have made sure he won by more, he only has himself to blame' etc. Drives me mad. That other fighters might have been ripped off worse, or that Golovkin could have won by six or seven points instead of three or four (which seems to be the going rate) are both totally irrelevant. The verdict leaves a stench and Alvarez has been a very lucky boy.

I thought Golovkin was a little slow out of the blocks, and took a lot of leather in the closing stages as he tried to get a stoppage (which never really looked likely, to be honest), but in the middle stages he moved Canelo around the ring whenever and wherever he wanted. Alvarez started and finished the fight well enough, but in the middle stages was running like a rabbit, reverting back to his habit of fighting in spurts, eating the jab etc. Golovkin had complete control for that stretch.

As for Adelaide Byrd's 118-110 card for Canelo....I don't know, I could throw around the usual words like disgrace, fixed, incompetent etc., but it just seems a pointless waste of time to do so. It says much about the dire straits boxing is in that this card, after the initial big talk, will just be met with a shrug of the shoulders. Nothing will come of it and Byrd will be back at ringside to judge another big fight in no time at all. I couldn't care less about defaming her character and suchlike - she clearly either decided beforehand that she was going to score the fight to Alvarez in the event of the fight going the full twelve, or she was instructed by Canelo's handlers to score the fight in his favour. Everyone knows this.

As others have said, the whole thing just make you want to say 'F**k off boxing' for good. No wonder the sport is on its arse.

Golovkin was a close but clear winner - something like 115-113. Have to say, though, Ward-Kovalev I was exactly the same (close but clear win for Kovalev with some very tenuous arguments from those who managed to score for Ward).

Scoring is a real issue in boxing but ultimately, you should have a sense of who deserves the victory come the final bell. Golovkin won that fight. Just like Kovalev beat Ward.

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Post by LionsV2 on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 2:53 pm

I don't think Ward-Kovalev I was in the same ball park as this fight; you can't make an argument for Alvarez winning but you can for Ward, it's only tenuous when you don't agree.

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Post by Mochyn du on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 3:34 pm

LionsV2 wrote:It makes zero difference to the overall record and ignores the sheer volume of rubbish in Marciano's 49-0.

Yet Marciano is a certified top 25 ATG whereas Calzaghe, only 3 less wins but also a ledger full of bums is not even in people's top 100.

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Post by LionsV2 on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 3:37 pm

There's nobody less deserving of their legendary status than Marciano, his record isn't very good.

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Post by Dipper Brown on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 4:29 pm

Brilliant fight!

Were it not for the bizarre Byrd card & the fact Canelo has profited from generous cards in the last, I don't think the draw would be that controversial a result. If you added a Canelo +1 or 2 card, to the existing two judges' scorecards, I don't think people could really grumble. It's just that the 118-110 smacks of a card that was filled in prior to the event.

Personally I had Canelo winning by 2. I gave him 1-4, one of the middle rounds, 11 & 12. I think HBO gave GGG every round from 3-9. I guess they favoured his aggression throughout. To be fair, I scored Kov Ward 1 to Ward, maybe it's down to taste.

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Post by Dipper Brown on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 4:31 pm

Also, massive tip o' the cap to GGG for not flinching when Canelo landed his best shot of the night, in the 9th round. That looked to have some serious sting. I winced for him, just watching.

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Post by milkyboy on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 4:46 pm

hazharrison wrote:

Golovkin was a close but clear winner - something like 115-113. Have to say, though, Ward-Kovalev I was exactly the same (close but clear win for Kovalev with some very tenuous arguments from those who managed to score for Ward).

Scoring is a real issue in boxing but ultimately, you should have a sense of who deserves the victory come the final bell. Golovkin won that fight. Just like Kovalev beat Ward.

Depends what you're referring to in terms of having a sense of who deserves the win? You can think one guy deserves it overall but tot your  card up and round by round you get it narrowly for the other guy or a draw. I used it earlier but the best example of this for me is macklin sturm. Macklin was the better man on the night people screamed robbery ... but round by round it was really close.

I scored Ward kov narrowly to kov, I thought there were numerous close rounds that could give a fairly comfortable win for kov or a razor thin one for Ward depending  on how you saw them.

I felt you needed to give Ward the benefit of doubt in all the close rounds to do it... but it was conceivable. Who deserved to win over the fight as a whole?  Kov definitely, though credit to Ward for finding a way back into it.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 5:33 pm

I'm very much in the minority I thought Canelo edged it though I could see a draw

I thought Canelo was excellent defensively very good rope fighter other than a fairly big right hand in the fifth Golovkin couldn't get his shots off all night

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Post by AdamT on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 5:44 pm

I can't make a case for Canelo, but he fought brilliantly in spurts.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 5:54 pm

Landed the better punches. Not a great fight felt very early on Canelo had him under control

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Post by AdamT on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 6:26 pm

Landed better, but less. Also was on the backfoot often;

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 6:39 pm

Each to their own you obviously favour the fighter who's on the front foot even when the pressure's not effective lol

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Post by kingraf on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 6:53 pm

Not effective? Canelo was retreating because?
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Post by Herman Jaeger on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 7:00 pm

I'm very much in the minority so I think I'll keep my mouth shut but I didn't see much effective pressure didn't see much accuracy from Golovkin Canelo did a great job in avoiding his shots and made him look rather basic. Golovkin doesn't really know how to set up an attack

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Post by kingraf on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 7:07 pm

Out of curiosity, did you give Cotto that fight? This was for Canelo an inverted version of that fight. Cotto landed plenty clean on him, but he got battered backwards.
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Post by Herman Jaeger on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 7:44 pm

The Canelo Cotto fight that's one fight I missed unfortunately must get round to watching it some time

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Post by SugarRayBray on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 7:53 pm

Herman Jaeger wrote:I'm very much in the minority so I think I'll keep my mouth shut but I didn't see much effective pressure  didn't see much accuracy from Golovkin Canelo did a great job in avoiding his shots and made him look rather basic. Golovkin doesn't really know how to set up an attack

I agree with you. But Golovkin is so tough he is nearly impossible to stop much less back up. I wasn't too impressed by most of his work, a lot of pawing and prodding. Canelo definitely landed the best punches of the fight. Does a couple of humdingers cancel out half a dozen soft jabs? I dunno...

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Post by AdamT on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 8:19 pm

Golovkin is very impressive. When I say he isn't great, I refer to Jones Jr and Leonard types.

He is the best fighter at 160, but Canelo and Jacobs are close.

Canelo did land cleaner work, but he Is a better counter puncher.

Many on here, me included, said Canelo needs to fight for 3 minutes a round and not just in spurts. Golovkin was relentless, especially in the middle rounds.

I want to see it play out again

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Post by hazharrison on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 8:53 pm

LionsV2 wrote:There's nobody less deserving of their legendary status than Marciano, his record isn't very good.

I couldn't agree less with this. Marciano was a wonderful champion - everything you could want.

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Post by hazharrison on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 8:56 pm

Dipper Brown wrote:Brilliant fight!

Were it not for the bizarre Byrd card & the fact Canelo has profited from generous cards in the last, I don't think the draw would be that controversial a result. If you added a Canelo +1 or 2 card, to the existing two judges' scorecards, I don't think people could really grumble. It's just that the 118-110 smacks of a card that was filled in prior to the event.

Personally I had Canelo winning by 2. I gave him 1-4, one of the middle rounds, 11 & 12. I think HBO gave GGG every round from 3-9. I guess they favoured his aggression throughout. To be fair, I scored Kov Ward 1 to Ward, maybe it's down to taste.

Or maybe you're not very good at scoring fights! Joking aside, every man and his dog thinks they can score a fight correctly but there aren't many who can get it right consistently. The ones that can need to be drafted in for the biggest fights (and going back to 15 rounds for the super fights wouldn't hurt).

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Post by hazharrison on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 9:05 pm

milkyboy wrote:
hazharrison wrote:

Golovkin was a close but clear winner - something like 115-113. Have to say, though, Ward-Kovalev I was exactly the same (close but clear win for Kovalev with some very tenuous arguments from those who managed to score for Ward).

Scoring is a real issue in boxing but ultimately, you should have a sense of who deserves the victory come the final bell. Golovkin won that fight. Just like Kovalev beat Ward.

Depends what you're referring to in terms of having a sense of who deserves the win? You can think one guy deserves it overall but tot your  card up and round by round you get it narrowly for the other guy or a draw. I used it earlier but the best example of this for me is macklin sturm. Macklin was the better man on the night people screamed robbery ... but round by round it was really close.

I scored Ward kov narrowly to kov, I thought there were numerous close rounds that could give a fairly comfortable win for kov or a razor thin one for Ward depending  on how you saw them.

I felt you needed to give Ward the benefit of doubt in all the close rounds to do it... but it was conceivable. Who deserved to win over the fight as a whole?  Kov definitely, though credit to Ward for finding a way back into it.

Kovslev won that fight more comfortably than Golovkin beat Canelo. It's odd that Chris, as an example, is complaining about one but was on the other side of the argument with the other. Kovalev was a more comfortable winner - with a knockdown in his back pocket. Ward was rubbish that night (he was excellent in the return). Canelo on the other hand was excellent - he just didn't fight hard enough throughout.

They were very similar in the sense the scoring hung on one pivotal round. Kov-Ward hinged on round 10 - which everyone gave to Kovalev bar the judges. GGG-Canelo hinged on round 7 - a clear Golovkin round that the 114-114 guy gave the other way (even Byrd got that one right).


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Post by LionsV2 on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 9:06 pm

hazharrison wrote:
LionsV2 wrote:There's nobody less deserving of their legendary status than Marciano, his record isn't very good.

I couldn't agree less with this. Marciano was a wonderful champion - everything you could want.

Aside from talent and significant fights but he had one thing going for him.

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Post by hazharrison on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 9:09 pm

AdamT wrote:Golovkin is very impressive. When I say he isn't great, I refer to Jones Jr and Leonard types.

He is the best fighter at 160, but Canelo and Jacobs are close.

Canelo did land cleaner work, but he Is a better counter puncher.

Many on here, me included, said Canelo needs to fight for 3 minutes a round and not just in spurts. Golovkin was relentless, especially in the middle rounds.

I want to see it play out again

Golovkin disappointed (despite winning the fight). He was made to wait too long for the big ones I feel - he's just gone over the edge. He has a touch of greatness but isn't a patch on someone like Hagler. Canelo is a good fighter but not a great one. He's a lot tougher than I thought and has improved immeasurably but he's no great.

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Post by hazharrison on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 9:13 pm

LionsV2 wrote:
hazharrison wrote:
LionsV2 wrote:There's nobody less deserving of their legendary status than Marciano, his record isn't very good.

I couldn't agree less with this. Marciano was a wonderful champion - everything you could want.

Aside from talent and significant fights but he had one thing going for him.

His competition is underrated. Great champion. Came from behind to stop Walcott (before obliterating him in the return). Came back from the brink to stop Ez Charles (both Walcott and Charles are top 20 all time at heavyweight, for me). Electrifying performer, bone-breaking power, heart, guts, character - he was sensational.

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Post by LionsV2 on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 9:17 pm

Meanwhile back in the real world he was bang average.

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Post by 88Chris05 on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 9:21 pm

hazharrison wrote:Kovalev won that fight more comfortably than Golovkin beat Canelo. It's odd that Chris, as an example, is complaining about one but was on the other side of the argument with the other. Kovalev was a more comfortable winner - with a knockdown in his back pocket. Ward was rubbish that night (he was excellent in the return). Canelo on the other hand was excellent - he just didn't fight hard enough throughout.

They were very similar in the sense the scoring hung on one pivotal round. Kov-Ward hinged on round 10 - which everyone gave to Kovalev bar the judges. GGG-Canelo hinged on round 7 - a clear Golovkin round that the 114-114 guy gave the other way (even Byrd got that one right).

Not quite 'on the other side', Haz. At least not to the extent you're suggesting. I had Ward a point up against Kovalev, but had Sergey got the decision you wouldn't have heard me complaining at all. Ward-Kovalev I was a fight which could have gone narrowly to either man, in my opinion.

Golovkin-Alvarez doesn't quite fit that description, for me. I think giving Canelo a draw (particularly by virtue of a 118-110 card) is more fanciful than giving Ward a very narrow win over Kovalev first time out. I don't think the two fights are absolute parallels for those reasons. I could see a slim win for either man, or a draw for that matter, in the Ward-Kovalev fight, whereas I could genuinely only see one result at the weekend, which was Golovkin winning a competitive, relatively close but still clear enough verdict.
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Post by AdamT on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 9:54 pm

Golovkin impressed me.

He wasn't fighting Geale, or Macklin. He was in with a talented, strong prime middleweight.

He has actually went up in my estimation after Jacobs and Canelo. I don't care for someone rolling over, overmatched opponents.

I asked to see GGG in a tough fight and he delivered.

Is he the best boxer in the World? No but he isn't far off.

Is he the best Middleweight ever? No chance, but not many could probably beat him.

Two top p4p guys fighting each other is great, other than the farcical judging.

Can't wait for Lomachenko and Rigondeaux. I'm picking Rigondeaux.

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Post by hazharrison on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 10:39 pm

AdamT wrote:Golovkin impressed me.

He wasn't fighting Geale, or Macklin. He was in with a talented, strong prime middleweight.

He has actually went up in my estimation after Jacobs and Canelo. I don't care for someone rolling over, overmatched opponents.

I asked to see GGG in a tough fight and he delivered.

Is he the best boxer in the World? No but he isn't far off.

Is he the best Middleweight ever? No chance, but not many could probably beat him.

Two top  p4p guys fighting each other is great, other than the farcical judging.

Can't wait for Lomachenko and Rigondeaux. I'm picking Rigondeaux.

I'm not sure it would be fair to label these two the best fighters in the world. Crawford, Lomachenko and Ward are probably better than GGG (I wouldn't put Canelo in the argument).

Rigo is probably too small - which is a shame.

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Post by hazharrison on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 10:50 pm

88Chris05 wrote:
hazharrison wrote:Kovalev won that fight more comfortably than Golovkin beat Canelo. It's odd that Chris, as an example, is complaining about one but was on the other side of the argument with the other. Kovalev was a more comfortable winner - with a knockdown in his back pocket. Ward was rubbish that night (he was excellent in the return). Canelo on the other hand was excellent - he just didn't fight hard enough throughout.

They were very similar in the sense the scoring hung on one pivotal round. Kov-Ward hinged on round 10 - which everyone gave to Kovalev bar the judges. GGG-Canelo hinged on round 7 - a clear Golovkin round that the 114-114 guy gave the other way (even Byrd got that one right).

Not quite 'on the other side', Haz. At least not to the extent you're suggesting. I had Ward a point up against Kovalev, but had Sergey got the decision you wouldn't have heard me complaining at all. Ward-Kovalev I was a fight which could have gone narrowly to either man, in my opinion.

Golovkin-Alvarez doesn't quite fit that description, for me. I think giving Canelo a draw (particularly by virtue of a 118-110 card) is more fanciful than giving Ward a very narrow win over Kovalev first time out. I don't think the two fights are absolute parallels for those reasons. I could see a slim win for either man, or a draw for that matter, in the Ward-Kovalev fight, whereas I could genuinely only see one result at the weekend, which was Golovkin winning a competitive, relatively close but still clear enough verdict.

75% of press scored for Kovalev and Golovkin with consensus scoring between 116-112 and 115-113. They were both similar decisions: close but clear one way. Hearing arguments today about swing rounds and "if you gave that round the other way" which is exactly what happened with Ward.

Taking Byrd's score out of it, you still only had one judge who was in the minority (114-114 was just off - but only by a round). In the Ward fight, all three were in the minority! Yet we're saying that was perfectly reasonable and Canelo got a gift?

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Post by Baby faced assassin on Mon 18 Sep 2017, 11:01 pm

Lomachenko vs Rigondeux is probably the better fight comparative of their skills but at the end of the day there is a reason this was a huge fight

Are either of Canelo or GGG top 3 p4p......no.......are they world class fighters....yes
Do they both have entertaining styles and a big(ish) fanbase.... yes
Are they 2 of the best fighters i nthe world....I'd say yes

This is by far the better fight for me I mean they aren't as good as the other 2 but if you factor in fighter skill, competitiveness, name, size, style of fighting then it's always GGG - Canelo for me

Going back a bit in the comments but I disagree with the comment about Canelo losing to Cotto, Trout and Lara. I thought all 3 bouts we close but for me he comfortably beat Cotto and honestly thought he deserved the nod against Trout. Arguably he could've lost to Lara but again I think he jsut about did enough.

While you can say he's been a tad fortunate 3 times now (Lara, Trout and GG) it's easy to forget hardcore fans thought he would never step in against ANY of those and when the fights were announced many fans thought Canelo could be EXPOSED

I just hope they can sort a rematch as I think Canelo would want it (doesn't he always) but Goldenboy are probably worried
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Post by Herman Jaeger on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 7:30 am

As he steps up in class(Jacobs and Canelo) the myth of Golovkin the ko artist starting to implode like the twin towers lol

He was the dog in the fight with Canelo so if that's what people like then I accept that but don't tell me he hurt Canelo once in the fight

It's a nonsense to say he wasn't trying against Jacobs just look at the intensity on his face in the later rounds he was really going for it he needs to learn to feint more but you know what they say about old dogs and new tricks. He's looked short of great his last two fights imo needs to redeem himself in his next fight the suspicion now he's been doing it against lesser fighters maybe he was unlucky he couldn't get the big fights sooner

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Post by AdamT on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 7:49 am

I did not mean Canelo and GGG were the top two guys. But among the p4p guys.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 8:00 am

His timing seemed way out on Saturday and the lack of variation was shocking plodding forward headhunting swinging and missing all night

Canelo was the superior body puncher in the fight too imo definitely made Golovkin wince in one of the later rounds

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Post by hazharrison on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 8:10 am

Herman Jaeger wrote:His timing seemed way out on Saturday and the lack of variation was shocking plodding forward headhunting swinging and missing all night

Canelo was the superior body puncher in the fight too imo definitely made Golovkin wince in one of the later rounds

I thought Golovkin was excellent technically, apart from his right hand (he couldn't land that chopping, Witherspoon-esque downward swipe and often let Canelo pivot away to his left).

Canelo was really slippery (as was Golovkin). GGG had to adjust in round three after his initial seek and destroy approach left him chasing shadows. After he got behind his jab, he was able to have more success but couldn't do as he pleased due to Canelo's excellent upper body movement.

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Post by hazharrison on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 8:16 am

Herman Jaeger wrote:As he steps up in class(Jacobs and Canelo) the myth of Golovkin the ko artist starting to implode like the twin towers lol

He was the dog in the fight with Canelo so if that's what people like then I accept that but don't tell me he hurt Canelo once in the fight

It's a nonsense to say he wasn't trying against Jacobs just look at the intensity on his face in the later rounds he was really going for it he needs to learn to feint more but you know what they say about old dogs and new tricks. He's looked short of great his last two fights imo needs to redeem himself in his next fight the suspicion now he's been doing it against lesser fighters maybe he was unlucky he couldn't get the big fights sooner

It's not easy to knock out elite fighters. Hearns couldn't knock out Hagler or Leonard - he was still a dynamite puncher. Look at Tito vs Oscar and Pea.

Golovkin doesn't have long left. It's a shame he had to wait so long for the big fights but it's great that he got there in the end. His style, that suffocating pressure fighting, isn't suited to fighters his age. The one criticism you could saddle him with is a lack of imagination.


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Post by Valero's Conscience on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 8:19 am

A great, great fight. Not an ATG classic but very enjoyable and kept me intrigued throughout.

I had, like many had GGG clearly winning. I've watched it twice now and just can't see how i can give Canelo 6 or more rounds. It reminded me of Pac vs JMM 3 whereby it was close but at the same time a clear win for GGG.

Luck is for the mediocre as Canelo said!

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Post by hazharrison on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 8:27 am

Valero's Conscience wrote:A great, great fight.  Not an ATG classic but very enjoyable and kept me intrigued throughout.  

I had, like many had GGG clearly winning.  I've watched it twice now and just can't see how i can give Canelo 6 or more rounds.  It reminded me of Pac vs JMM 3 whereby it was close but at the same time a clear win for GGG.

Luck is for the mediocre as Canelo said!

He doesn't need luck when he always has a card in the bag!


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Post by Valero's Conscience on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 8:30 am

hazharrison wrote:
Valero's Conscience wrote:A great, great fight.  Not an ATG classic but very enjoyable and kept me intrigued throughout.  

I had, like many had GGG clearly winning.  I've watched it twice now and just can't see how i can give Canelo 6 or more rounds.  It reminded me of Pac vs JMM 3 whereby it was close but at the same time a clear win for GGG.

Luck is for the mediocre as Canelo said!

He doesn't need luck when he always has a card in the bag!


Ha ha! he's a long line of cash cows that seem to have a least one card written out before the fight starts for them. Hopefully that crooked witch is never involved in boxing again

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Post by hazharrison on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 8:38 am

Valero's Conscience wrote:
hazharrison wrote:
Valero's Conscience wrote:A great, great fight.  Not an ATG classic but very enjoyable and kept me intrigued throughout.  

I had, like many had GGG clearly winning.  I've watched it twice now and just can't see how i can give Canelo 6 or more rounds.  It reminded me of Pac vs JMM 3 whereby it was close but at the same time a clear win for GGG.

Luck is for the mediocre as Canelo said!

He doesn't need luck when he always has a card in the bag!


Ha ha!  he's a long line of cash cows that seem to have a least one card written out before the fight starts for them.  Hopefully that crooked witch is never involved in boxing again

I can't understand why she would want to be. If it was me, I'd issue a public apology and then retire.

Canelo IS Golden Boy Promotions - he's a one man industry. Tough not to imagine that influences these crazy cards in some way.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 8:41 am

I'm starting to think a draw might actually have been a fair result Golovkin pressure cancelling out the cleaner work of the Mexican

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Post by hazharrison on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 9:08 am

Herman Jaeger wrote:I'm starting to think a draw might actually have been a fair result Golovkin pressure cancelling out the cleaner work of the Mexican

Na, Golovkin won that fight. Forget Byrd, the guy who scored 114-114 scored the seventh the wrong way. 115-113 twice would have been spot on. Majority of press scored 116-112 (with just one going for Canelo).

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Post by AdamT on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 9:17 am

Why didn't Byrd score it 115-113?

Still be a robbery, but just goes down as a bad decision.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 9:22 am

Isn't it funny I just saw Golovkin swinging and missing all night. I remember a fairly good right hand in the fifth but aside from that I can't recall any other eye catching punches. Where's the snap gone his last two fights? And does he need a break? Perhaps it would be better if he didn't fight in December

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Post by superflyweight on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 11:29 am

Herman Jaeger wrote:As he steps up in class(Jacobs and Canelo) the myth of Golovkin the ko artist starting to implode like the twin towers lol

He was the dog in the fight with Canelo so if that's what people like then I accept that but don't tell me he hurt Canelo once in the fight

It's a nonsense to say he wasn't trying against Jacobs just look at the intensity on his face in the later rounds he was really going for it he needs to learn to feint more but you know what they say about old dogs and new tricks. He's looked short of great his last two fights imo needs to redeem himself in his next fight the suspicion now he's been doing it against lesser fighters maybe he was unlucky he couldn't get the big fights sooner

Hahahaha - hilarious!  

D1ck.

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Post by Herman Jaeger on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 11:41 am

Do you feel people are marking down Canelo's performance because he didn't fight a 'Mexican' fight?

If you watch the fight again expecting him to fight a defensive fight then you'll actually see he executed the game plan very successfully

But as I say I accept I'm very much in the minority on this one and would like to see the rematch as much as anyone else

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Post by Derbymanc on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 11:46 am

I thought it was very close Hermy and that GGG missed a lot due to Canelo's defensive work (something which i think is overlooked a lot of the time for a lot of boxers not named Mayweather).

think if it hadn't been for that ridiculous scorecard and it was called a drawer, we'd all be salivating over the rematch now, alas boxing has let us down again and as Adam alluded to, why bother which such a dodgy scorecard when a 115-114 etc would have been better

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Post by BoxingFan88 on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 11:58 am

Has boxing fallen so far that anyone actually thinks Canelo was in control of that fight?

Man that is so laughable, even taking opinions into it, if you are getting pushed back, getting forced to back up, scurry from one corner to the other, that is not controlling anything at all. The aggressor will miss punches, because he is chasing a world class fighter all over the ring. GGG was trying to force a fight, I don't know where boxing became this pot shot and run sport, but its very much turned into one. The point of defense and I've been banging on about it, is you make the opponent miss and make him pay.

Canelo landed the flashier punches, but not necessarily the harder ones as GGG hurt him a lot more than the other way around. There is a round where Canelo lands a flashy upper cut, later on GGG lands a far harder one that isn't as flashy, but its a better punch. Canelo had success when GGG had to chase him down and open up

Canelo was missing wildly when GGG was defensively responsible, he was just willing to go for it more, hence he put himself in risky situations, Canelo did not

Canelo was blowing from the 3rd round on wards, he was being forced to fight when he didn't want to

Canelo did brilliantly, but he just couldn't sustain an effort for more than like 30 seconds

So if landing a few good combinations, then doing nothing except move away the rest of the round wins it, then fair play, but I absolutely disagree


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Post by milkyboy on Tue 19 Sep 2017, 12:01 pm

If you're going to load a card you have to give anything you think you can get away with early, because you don't know what's coming later. So she gives Alvarez everything until he can't lose on her card... and then he has the temerity to do well in the last few rounds so it would look ridiculous giving them to golovkin when you'd given him nothing earlier.

At least she was consistent!

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