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A bit of perspective

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Post by whatahitson Sat 13 Feb 2021, 8:49 pm

First topic message reminder :

All I am seeing on twitter is England fans going mad at Farrell, Youngs, Eddie Jones, Vunipola et cetera.

I have to say I am surprised. England and Jones have huge amounts of credit in the bank and I think English fans need a bit of perspective on where we are as a team.

I know this might sound controversial but England are miles ahead of any other team in Europe eventhough Scotland beat them last week. Jones came in to England with a remit to do what Stuart Lancaster couldn't which was to make England world champions after it went horribly wrong on home soil. Jones started off with back to back six nations wins and then found his side struggled to manage with Lions recovery and the added pressure of teams knowing what was coming and preparing gameplans specifically for England, like Scotland did in 2018. But he turned it around after a losing streak and brought in fresh blood maybe a little fortuitously (although I think everyone suspected Haskell and Robshaw would struggle to stay the course) but nevertheless England showed what they could do in the 18/19 season against South Africa, New Zealand and Ireland and kept enough powder dry for Japan the season after. We all know what happened there and falling at the final hurdle means there is only one thing left to do for Eddie Jones and that is WIN the cup.

So now where are England? Apparently they're in their worst ever position and are a disgrace? What?1?! furious censored

England have won both tournaments available to them after the 2019 world cup and yes they were a little bit fortunate but they could add a third this year considering how results have gone as long as they beat the French. All of that without even trying to change anything dramatic since 2018/19? If you play badly and win that's a sign of a good team. I don't mean to put this the wrong way but if the six nations is the 'bread and butter' of rugby then continuing to worry too much about the bread and butter means they will be too full to deal with off the main course when it arrives in 2023. No other coach has as much credit in the bank as he does.

Jones says England want to be the best team ever but I think its obvious HE wants to be the best England coach ever. He wants to have what Clive Woodward has and to beat his record as well which means he only needs one more title but not if it means sacrificing the world cup. The world cup is what matters. The difference between winning a world cup is huge in terms of prestige and standing and for his legacy. It's the only thing Eddie has left to do with England and he had 4 years to do it after that night in Japan.

So I think some perspective is needed. If the Lions goes ahead this year England will lose maybe 20 players or more to the tour and that means injuries. He already say that two thirds of the Japan squad would not make it to France. Youngs will probably not tour. Look at the way Jamie George, Curry, and Underhill played despite Hartley, Haskell, and Robshaw playing for so long under Eddie.

I just think the abuse needs to stop. England are not trying to win the six nations with everything theyve got if anything Jones is taking a risk that the Lions tour will go ahead this year by just keeping things ticking over. Everyone ELSE needs to try to show what their level is because Wales won it 2 years ago and Ireland 3 years ago but they're different teams with different coaches. No one else has shown their standard so every other team is in a different boat to England who went with the continuity option. Pivac is desperate for wins that's why Lydiate has come back. France are building to a home world cup and do not want to experience what England did in 2015 so they need to show their level and not just potential. Farrell has been backed by Ireland and needs to repay them and that starts with the six nations. Scotland need to finally become competitive after 6 years of showing promising signs. Italy need to just win to get the media off their back.

No one else is in England's position. No one else has 'win the world cup' as their next step. England and Eddie Jones do. Yes they cannot stand still but given what happened with the Lions last time out and how England prepared in house and built a gameplan by playing one 'tactic' at a time in certain matches, like they are now, before putting it altogether against a NZ or SA, I just think a bit of perspective is need. rose


whatahitson

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Post by No 7&1/2 Wed 24 Feb 2021, 2:34 pm

If you qualify for a team, you're fine to play for them. Nationalistic rubbish is just that. Rubbish.

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Post by whatahitson Wed 24 Feb 2021, 2:41 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:If you qualify for a team, you're fine to play for them. Nationalistic rubbish is just that. Rubbish.

I don't know what you mean by this but I would prefer if the UK played as one rugby team and northern Irish people could decide to play for the UK or Ireland which is their right. I would do it for football even if it's not popular and rugby as well even if rugby is a small sport we are one country Brexit has shown that there is no real border within Britain. The nationalism and hatred I see in the UK isn't coming from England let's just say that and the problem with having so many Englishmen playing for Wales and Scotland would be fixed by having a British team.

What is the point of international rugby otherwise. What is the point of a game between England and Scotland (which are part of the same country) taking place with the Scots celebrating a try scored by a South African? The answer: none. We're cheering on colours not countries now. The UK has a unique situation and we shouldn't be separate teams it's that sort of thing that increases nationalism. There's nothing wrong with being patriotic.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Wed 24 Feb 2021, 2:45 pm

Best just stop watching then whatahitson.

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Post by whatahitson Wed 24 Feb 2021, 2:47 pm

Why would I do that? I support England and at least the English team is almost totally English.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Wed 24 Feb 2021, 2:51 pm

Course you are. Stop trolling.

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Post by RiscaGame Wed 24 Feb 2021, 3:47 pm

The amount of reports on this, mean the thread isn't worth keeping open. There have been a number of posts on this forum recently, where people are accusing people of being something or other and it doesn't help matters.

If you think a post is a WUM, then report it. Commenting that it is, adds nothing to the post and if anything just disrupts the forum further.

A few posters on here might want to review their posting styles before further action is taken.

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