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Scotland v Ireland 6N Championship Sunday 14th march 2021

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Scotland v Ireland 6N Championship Sunday 14th march 2021 - Page 4 Empty Scotland v Ireland 6N Championship Sunday 14th march 2021

Post by BigGee Tue 9 Mar - 8:49

First topic message reminder :

Scotland v Ireland
6N Championship

14th March 2021
BT Murrayfield
Edinburgh
KO 15.00


Well we are getting to the business end of the championship and we have two sides who need a win.

Scotland started very brightly in their first game, ending their Twickenham hoodoo at long last, then managed to lose a game they were winning comfortably against Wales, have all the old doubts about the steel of this Scotland side, who can look very good when on song, returned?

Ireland did not have a good start to the tournament and no one will be convinced by a strong win over Italy either, which should really be a given atm They have not really found their style yet under Farrell and still perhaps seem to reliant on their old stagers and be a little reluctant to move on to the next generation.

So in effect, both sides seem a bit fragile still, which might make this a fascinating contest.

Scotland don't have a good record against Ireland in recent times and the lack of a crowd won't give much, if any advantage to the home side. On that basis you would have to fancy Ireland for a narrow victory, though I would imagine it will be close.

I think we might see a scotland team with not many changes, something along these lines, with the highlight hopefully being seeing Dobie win his first cap off the bench:

1. Sutherland
2. Turner
3. Nel
4. Cummings
5. Gray J
6. Ritchie
7. Watson
8. Fagerson M
9. Price
10. Russell
11. VDM
12. Johnson
13. Harris
14. Maitland
15. Hogg

Subs:

Keeble
Cherry
Berghan
Skinner
Haining
Dobie (a first cap off the bench)
Lang
Jones H

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Post by BigGee Sun 14 Mar - 16:34

Scott Steele playing in the back row!

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:35

tigertattie wrote:Take the scrum my god take the scrum

It's really unfortunate that both McInally and Brown are missing for Scotland. They're getting dominated physically in the contact and tackle area and the lineout could have been a form of respite for them. Instead they're doing to their 3rd and 4th hookers and it's showed. It's hard to tell how different the game might have been if they had their best hookers available and could use the lineout as both a platform and a defensive weapon like they did against England.

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Post by tigertattie Sun 14 Mar - 16:35

I mean that sums it up.

Steele in to the back row
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Post by tigertattie Sun 14 Mar - 16:37

Surely with Duhan and Huw on the pitch at the same time means there’s still tries out there for us
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Post by BigGee Sun 14 Mar - 16:38

Take the points

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Post by tigertattie Sun 14 Mar - 16:40

Tap and go again
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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:40

You have to go for the try. Scotland have literally not been in this position all game and it's the 71st minute. Have to go for the try to level the game.

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:41

Ireland will be kicking themselves here. They've let the game drift in the last 15 minutes. Sheer lack of leadership, particularly from Sexton. 13 point lead could become 16 and a 3 score game with a drop goal - but no, they didn't take it, and now they're suffering.

Sometimes the easy and obvious choice is the winning one.

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Post by BigGee Sun 14 Mar - 16:43

Try??

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Post by tigertattie Sun 14 Mar - 16:43

Roman has lost his pea
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Post by tigertattie Sun 14 Mar - 16:44

Why am utterly bonkers game of rugby
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Post by BigGee Sun 14 Mar - 16:44

Hamish Watson what a player, he is in the Lions now for sure

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:44

Poite's had a great game. He's really played his part in making this a great game to watch.

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Post by tigertattie Sun 14 Mar - 16:46

We can’t even take price off. We’ve run out of players.

Sad sad times
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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:46

Ireland will be kicking themselves here.

It doesn't feel like we're done yet though. I can see Ireland getting in the lead and then a finish similar to the Wales game here.

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Post by TightHEAD Sun 14 Mar - 16:46

whatahitson wrote:Poite's had a great game. He's really played his part in making this a great game to watch.

Good refs do make all the difference.
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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:47

Right on cue.

Ireland will have been kicking themselves to allow Scotland to get level. That penalty wasn't unexpected.

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Post by BigGee Sun 14 Mar - 16:48

Sexton rarely misses those ones!

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Post by NeilyBroon Sun 14 Mar - 16:48

Price FFS.
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Post by doctor_grey Sun 14 Mar - 16:48

BigGee wrote:Hamish Watson what a player, he is in the Lions now for sure
Agree - terrific game. best player on the pitch today.

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Post by king_carlos Sun 14 Mar - 16:49

BigGee wrote:Hamish Watson what a player, he is in the Lions now for sure
He's absolutely brilliant. Such a fun player to watch.

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:49

BigGee wrote:Sexton rarely misses those ones!

Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

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Post by tigertattie Sun 14 Mar - 16:52

Well the first half decided that game.

Far better second half from Scotland but our total lack of platform in the first half did us in
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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:52

whatahitson wrote:It doesn't feel like we're done yet though. I can see Ireland getting in the lead and then a finish similar to the Wales game here.

Close enough!

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Post by LordDowlais Sun 14 Mar - 16:53

whatahitson wrote:Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

And that is why I am against him being a Lion's starter. He can be sublime, but then he can be awful, like today. Saying that, Ireland are going to be truly screwed when Sexton finally decides to call it day.

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sun 14 Mar - 16:54

Congrats Ireland, can’t say that wasn’t a deserved win.

We were rank awful for large parts of that game. Scored some points towards the end to perpetuate the myth that we’re better than we actually are, but when the chips are down we come up empty as usual.

Hamish Watson colossal as ever. Nice to see Huw Jones continuing his recovery from Dave Rennie. Ali Price I have no words for


Last edited by TheMildlyFranticLlama on Sun 14 Mar - 16:57; edited 1 time in total

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Post by westisbest Sun 14 Mar - 16:54

We made hard work of that.
Good defending in the end. Thought we were going to throw it away.
Fair play to Scotland for coming back to 24 all.
Scotland will be disappointed to lose, as would have Ireland.
England will be tough next weekend.

On another note, thought Keenan was good in the air.

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:55

tigertattie wrote:Well the first half decided that game.

Far better second half from Scotland but our total lack of platform in the first half did us in

I thought Scotland were poor second half. It was only really the last 20 minutes, as Ireland tired and took their foot off the gas, where they came in to the game. If anything, the third quarter was Scotland's worst, but Ireland did lay the platform in the first half. In the end the scoreline shouldn't have been as close as it was at half time, and then Scotland somehow gave themselves an unlikely chance with 5 minutes to go.

Strange game. Great to watch for the neutral, a good old battle. Not overly impressed with the game management of either team though. Ireland took the pressure off at the moment where they needed to kill the game, and Scotland are almost totally reliant on Hogg to create something from nothing.

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Post by NeilyBroon Sun 14 Mar - 16:56

Yup, my restored faith is definitely crushed now. I feel like putting a flutter on Italy to upset us. France will absolutely destroy us when we get to play.
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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 16:56

doctor_grey wrote:
BigGee wrote:Hamish Watson what a player, he is in the Lions now for sure
Agree - terrific game.  best player on the pitch today.

Best Scot for me, but plenty of impressive Irish performances as well. Iain Henderson, Beirne, Connors, Henshaw, and Gibson Park were all mightily impressive. Watson was doing a Parisse job for the middle 40 minutes of the match.

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Post by BigGee Sun 14 Mar - 16:56

LordDowlais wrote:
whatahitson wrote:Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

And that is why I am against him being a Lion's starter. He can be sublime, but then he can be awful, like today. Saying that, Ireland are going to be truly screwed when Sexton finally decides to call it day.

Russell was not awful today, nor did he fold. I thought he played a very good game without much decent ball. Pretty much all he did wrong was miss that kick for goal

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Post by sensisball Sun 14 Mar - 16:56

Great game. Scotland came back really well.Hats off to Bhatti didn't let anyone down when he came on. Turner bound to have bad lineout some time. Surely Farrell will drop Lowe after yet more defensive mistakes?

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Post by jimbopip Sun 14 Mar - 16:58

Well, Turner may have had an outside chance of the Lions this morning but that's gone now.
Scotland finished with a winger at full back, full back at 1o, 8 in the second row and scrum half in the back row. All part of Toonie's master plan no doubt.
Hugh Jones is the Gerd Muller of international rugby.

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 17:00

LordDowlais wrote:
whatahitson wrote:Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

And that is why I am against him being a Lion's starter. He can be sublime, but then he can be awful, like today. Saying that, Ireland are going to be truly screwed when Sexton finally decides to call it day.

I don't know what's happened to Carbery he has the talent to replace him.

Russell for me won't be touring with the Lions. He's a Carlos Spencer type player. Great for club rugby but test rugby isn't really his game. It's much more about game management and doing the basics well than it is trying to constantly do the flash stuff at this level. The media loves Russell as he's box office but he's not had a good six nations. Hogg covered for him yet again, as he did against England. Hogg is world class, Russell is a luxury player IMO.

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Post by LordDowlais Sun 14 Mar - 17:00

BigGee wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
whatahitson wrote:Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

And that is why I am against him being a Lion's starter. He can be sublime, but then he can be awful, like today. Saying that, Ireland are going to be truly screwed when Sexton finally decides to call it day.

Russell was not awful today, nor did he fold. I thought he played a very good game without much decent ball. Pretty much all he did wrong was miss that kick for goal

Then you did not watch the game properly. He kicked a pen out on the full, he got away with a kick off that went out, and his general all around play was erratic. But when Scotland played Wales, for me he was one of the best players on the pitch, he is just not consistent enough.

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 17:01

BigGee wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
whatahitson wrote:Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

And that is why I am against him being a Lion's starter. He can be sublime, but then he can be awful, like today. Saying that, Ireland are going to be truly screwed when Sexton finally decides to call it day.

Russell was not awful today, nor did he fold. I thought he played a very good game without much decent ball. Pretty much all he did wrong was miss that kick for goal

Kick off out on the full (fortunate to be incorrectly overruled) followed up by a missed kick to touch. Add to that what he didn't do (control, leadership, putting the team in the right areas, adapting to the fact Scotland were dominated at the breakdown and the lineout wasn't working) and you get a full picture of just how bad he was. Emotions will naturally be high though so I don't blame you for missing these things.

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Post by Anglobraveheart Sun 14 Mar - 17:02

LordDowlais wrote:
whatahitson wrote:Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

And that is why I am against him being a Lion's starter. He can be sublime, but then he can be awful, like today. Saying that, Ireland are going to be truly screwed when Sexton finally decides to call it day.
"Awful"
Based on what exactly? Were you watching the same game?

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Post by NeilyBroon Sun 14 Mar - 17:02

jimbopip wrote:Well, Turner may have had an outside chance of the Lions this morning but that's gone now.
Scotland finished with a winger at full back, full back at 1o, 8 in the second row and scrum half in the back row. All part of Toonie's master plan no doubt.
Hugh Jones is the Gerd Muller of international rugby.

I'd start shug now. I think whilst Harris is a very solid player and has been playing some of his best rugby this year, he won't win us games. Jones is far more likely to, with a marginally higher risk in defence but that's the difference between getting a win and narrowly missing out.
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Post by Northgrill Sun 14 Mar - 17:02

BigGee wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
whatahitson wrote:Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

And that is why I am against him being a Lion's starter. He can be sublime, but then he can be awful, like today. Saying that, Ireland are going to be truly screwed when Sexton finally decides to call it day.

Russell was not awful today, nor did he fold. I thought he played a very good game without much decent ball. Pretty much all he did wrong was miss that kick for goal

Missed touch with a penalty finder kicking it dead. Knocked on when he got outside Furlong and he should have released it before contact. Very close to putting a ball out on the full on the restart. Wasn’t very impressive.

Scotland’s line out was well beaten. I thought James Ryan was excellent for the Irish stealing quite a bit of ball in the air. I think England will beat Ireland next week. English 8 will overpower them.

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 17:15

Heaslip talking about Ireland's ruck tactics at the breakdown being carried over from the Schmidt era, which is clear enough. He called it the 'shotgun' - two players going way beyond the ball. To me, it's sealing off. Scotland were unfortunate as they identified this to the referee but they weren't able to exploit it by getting those Irish players to go off their feet clearing out a Scot. That's testament to how well Ireland were at moving the ball forward and constantly moving Scotland behind the gainline so any sort of competition was basically reliant on individual brilliance, where Watson showed his class.

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Post by George Carlin Sun 14 Mar - 17:22

whatahitson wrote:
BigGee wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
whatahitson wrote:Of the two 10s today, when the pressure was on, Russell folded and Sexton stepped up.

And that is why I am against him being a Lion's starter. He can be sublime, but then he can be awful, like today. Saying that, Ireland are going to be truly screwed when Sexton finally decides to call it day.

Russell was not awful today, nor did he fold. I thought he played a very good game without much decent ball. Pretty much all he did wrong was miss that kick for goal

Kick off out on the full (fortunate to be incorrectly overruled) followed up by a missed kick to touch. Add to that what he didn't do (control, leadership, putting the team in the right areas, adapting to the fact Scotland were dominated at the breakdown and the lineout wasn't working) and you get a full picture of just how bad he was. Emotions will naturally be high though so I don't blame you for missing these things.
I think we can probably all do without the condescension.

Weird game. Ireland certainly good for the victory and they seemed settled for the first time in the tournament. Helps if you're destroying the opponent's line out. James Ryan and Robbie Henshaw again set out why they should probably be Lions starters.

Surely, at last this has benched Ali Price for quite some time? Steele is twice as safe and George Horne is five times as impactful. This game did reveal once again that Townsend can be accused of choosing his favourites to the detriment of the team. Lots to think about for this side and we'll all need to sift through the wreckage tomorrow and break down what was good and bad systematically.
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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 17:32

George Carlin wrote:
I think we can probably all do without the condescension.

It's not condescension. It's giving you the benefit of the doubt which other posters who pointed out where you're wrong didn't do. But there we go, reject that benefit if you want...

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Post by majesticimperialman Sun 14 Mar - 17:39

I thought Ireland would win, but credit to Scotland they put up one hell of a fight. Congratulations to Ireland for the win.

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Post by NeilyBroon Sun 14 Mar - 17:42

Keep on topic and less of the personal attacks. We all have an opinion of how players played, respect the opinions of others.
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Post by NeilyBroon Sun 14 Mar - 17:43

majesticimperialman wrote:I thought Ireland would win, but credit to Scotland they put up one hell of a fight. Congratulations to Ireland for the win.

Yeah was deserved by Ireland but I just wish we'd put in a fight for more than 20 minutes!
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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 18:07

NeilyBroon wrote: Keep on topic and less of the personal attacks. We all have an opinion of how players played, respect the opinions of others.

That's all fair. I don't think it's an opinion when it comes to facts about 'what a player did wrong' and I don't think it's fair for a moderator to misinterpret a fair comment for the sake of, what?

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Post by Collapse2005 Sun 14 Mar - 18:07

king_carlos wrote:
BigGee wrote:Hamish Watson what a player, he is in the Lions now for sure
He's absolutely brilliant. Such a fun player to watch.

Yeah one of the players of the tournament

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Post by Collapse2005 Sun 14 Mar - 18:09

Ireland were poor enough, not well organised. Drop Lowe and Catt

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Post by LondonTiger Sun 14 Mar - 19:17

whatahitson wrote:
NeilyBroon wrote: Keep on topic and less of the personal attacks. We all have an opinion of how players played, respect the opinions of others.

That's all fair. I don't think it's an opinion when it comes to facts about 'what a player did wrong' and I don't think it's fair for a moderator to misinterpret a fair comment for the sake of, what?

The only facts are those on the scoreboard. Pretty much everything else is opinion and interpretation. Even the supposed nationality of any poster is often open to interpretation.

Now with reference to your argument above, you can either address the points made, or choose to be offended by one line. The choice is yours.

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Post by whatahitson Sun 14 Mar - 19:25

LondonTiger wrote:
whatahitson wrote:
NeilyBroon wrote: Keep on topic and less of the personal attacks. We all have an opinion of how players played, respect the opinions of others.

That's all fair. I don't think it's an opinion when it comes to facts about 'what a player did wrong' and I don't think it's fair for a moderator to misinterpret a fair comment for the sake of, what?

The only facts are those on the scoreboard. Pretty much everything else is opinion and interpretation. Even the supposed nationality of any poster is often open to interpretation.

I'm not sure about that. There are facts and there are opinions and there's a clear difference between. A fact would be 'Russell kicked the ball out on the full from a penalty kick to touch'. An opinion would be 'Russell didn't play badly eventhough he kicked a ball out on the full'.

LondonTiger wrote:Now with reference to your argument above,  you can either address the points made, or choose to be offended by one line. The choice is yours.

But I did do this and a moderator stepped in and told me I was being inflammatory.

I'll repeat it again in the hope that everyone can see where I'm coming from and to stop reading the absolute worst interpretation in to everything I say which seems to be happening at the moment.

The poster claimed the only thing Russell did was missed a kick at goal. Three posters replied to him with several other factual instances of mistakes that are literal, objective mistakes like kicking the ball out on the full. That's not opinion. I was the only one to provide a comment which, to my mind, made it less aggressive than simply stating facts which straight after a game could be seen to be poor sportsmanship.

Finally, I would like to make it clear that my comment about emotions running high was conciliatory and not inflammatory. It has been misinterpreted and that is absolutely not my fault. My intention was not to wind up it was to give him the benefit of the doubt and I would like this to be recognised by the moderating team please.

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