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Pro 16 needs to pull the plug on Premier Sports

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Post by bsando Thu 11 Mar 2021, 6:20 pm

First topic message reminder :

Pro 16 needs to pull the plug on Premier Sports - Page 8 Error_10

If the Pro 16 wants to compete with the likes of the other top leagues in Europe and further abroad, they need to part ways with Premier Sports. The current Premier Sports contract with the Pro 14 finishes at the end of this season it still remains to be seen if this will be renewed or another broadcaster will takeover the rights.

Many fans have voiced their dislike of the online platform which after several seasons appears to be stable via Sky or Virgin sports packages but less so as an outright online viewing package. Coupled with annoying multiple login requirements to swap from devices and random lost connection error codes before, during and even when trying to watch on demand matches, it would be a real shame to see the new Pro 16 format begin in this manner.

Do you feel the upcoming Pro 16 competition would be a good addition to BT Sports or Sky Sports or even one of the streaming platforms like Amazon Prime?

Would it be better for a return to the domestic networks in a similar format as before?

Could CVC play a part in this decision with their recent investment in the Pro 14 league and 6N?

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Post by No 7&1/2 Wed 05 May 2021, 11:42 am

RugbyFan100 wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Doesn't really make sense since they went past Exeter soundly enough..

Exeter operate on approximately half the annual playing budget that Leinster do.

La Rochelle spend more. Hey presto, Leinster firsts get beaten.

Exeter won last year?

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Post by LordDowlais Wed 05 May 2021, 11:43 am

RugbyFan100 wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Doesn't really make sense since they went past Exeter soundly enough..

Exeter operate on approximately half the annual playing budget that Leinster do.

La Rochelle spend more. Hey presto, Leinster firsts get beaten.

Do La Rochelle have a higher budget ?

It has been spoken that Leinster probably have the highest on the Pro14.

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Post by BigGee Wed 05 May 2021, 11:46 am

The Pro14 has been pretty poor this year, but there are reasons for that. It has been a much better competition in other years gone by and I am not talking about ancient history here. Glasgow took them all the way in the last season when we had a proper league of fixtures.

Leinster are however the stand out team at the moment and it is up to the others to catch them up. There are signs that some of the other teams are getting a lot closer now. Ulster in particular and Scarlets and Ospreys, if they played to their potential, would not be far away. I am even hopeful that Glasgow and Edinburgh can have a decent run next season.

The SA sides will hopefully add a new dimension to the league and we can judge it properly again after 2 seasons ruined by the Covid epidemic.

They just got beaten by a better side at the weekend. Don't underestimate how good La Rochelle are, they could easily win the tournament.

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Post by BamBam Wed 05 May 2021, 11:54 am

The Oracle wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:That's a line written by Paul Abbandonato though LD. Walesonline have lifted BOD's quotes and added some flavour to stoke some fans antipathy.

Not sure that this is the original but was posted before WOL and gives no mention to Welsh, Scottish and Italian sides https://www.otbsports.com/rugby/brian-odriscoll-pro-14-leinster-1189585
You have an issue with the writer and not BOD.


Yep, this is what WOL do.  And then people lap it up as gospel.  I'm surprised they haven't had more lawsuits over the years for copyright infringement and lack of acknowledgement given to the sources they copy and paste!

Wow that’s unbelievable. Comic books hold themselves to higher standards

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Post by Old Man Wed 05 May 2021, 12:14 pm

Pete330v2 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote:BOD - Great player and I only ever liked what he did on the pitch, apart from that he's a bit of a .... alright.

HOWEVER!!!!
He's not completely wrong, the only thing that was missed on that piece was a mention of the other Irish sides as well and it was WOL that failed to mention the Irish sides, not BOD. He blames the entire competition which obviously includes their provincial rivals.
Leinster regularly put out less than full strength sides and still, for the most part, win convincingly. The introduction of the Saffers, if it ever happens, will bring much needed physicality and force all current Pro14/12 sides to look at alternative game plans.
YES!! Even Leinster.


Did BOD mention the Irish provinces ? If he did they are not reported, it's sounds as though he is blaming everybody else rather than including the Irish teams for Leinster being beat by La Rochelle.

He didn't mention any nation, he simply said that the Pro14 isn't a good enough tournament to prepare teams for the big French and English sides. You're the one that brought nationality into the conversation regarding him not blaming the Irish sides when he does.
Does he think the SA sides elevate the Pro 14/16?

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Post by LordDowlais Wed 05 May 2021, 12:15 pm

Some interesting comments coming from other platforms, the majority of which are having a go at Leinster's self entitlement. People are suggesting that Leinster need to be more humble and treat teams with more respect, and they are pointing out the game against Ospreys a few weeks ago as a prime example.

Perhaps Leinster need to get their feet back on the ground, also, BOD has done nothing for the league here, as all the haters are agreeing with him.

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Post by mikey_dragon Wed 05 May 2021, 12:22 pm

Old Man wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote:BOD - Great player and I only ever liked what he did on the pitch, apart from that he's a bit of a .... alright.

HOWEVER!!!!
He's not completely wrong, the only thing that was missed on that piece was a mention of the other Irish sides as well and it was WOL that failed to mention the Irish sides, not BOD. He blames the entire competition which obviously includes their provincial rivals.
Leinster regularly put out less than full strength sides and still, for the most part, win convincingly. The introduction of the Saffers, if it ever happens, will bring much needed physicality and force all current Pro14/12 sides to look at alternative game plans.
YES!! Even Leinster.


Did BOD mention the Irish provinces ? If he did they are not reported, it's sounds as though he is blaming everybody else rather than including the Irish teams for Leinster being beat by La Rochelle.

He didn't mention any nation, he simply said that the Pro14 isn't a good enough tournament to prepare teams for the big French and English sides. You're the one that brought nationality into the conversation regarding him not blaming the Irish sides when he does.
Does he think the SA sides elevate the Pro 14/16?

You'd imagine that he and everyone else thinks so. Cheetahs brought a lot of good most seasons, and they didn't have any internationals. The top SA sides will certainly bring a lot of good and will be difficult to overcome. Sharks and Bulls perhaps the best, but I could be wrong.

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Post by Pete330v2 Wed 05 May 2021, 1:02 pm

"The Ireland and Lions great feels the lack of credible week in, week out competition against Welsh, Scottish and Italian sides has been a key factor in Leinster failing to reach the European Champions Cup final this year. wrote"

This is just woeful journalism, BOD didn't say anything of the sort, he pointed the finger at all other Pro14 sides, any half decent journo would safely assume that meant the Irish sides too.

He's also probably feeling that loss a little bit, he is after all Leinster through and through so is grasping at straws for reasons for his wee heart hurting so much. After so much dominance in the Pro14 he perhaps thought that the Leinster 1st XV were an unstoppable freight train. They were against less physical, street-wise teams but against ROG's hugely physical LaRochelle they met more than their match, it's that simple. Do you slug it out with a heavyweight or do you box clever and tire him out? Had Leinster have had a few heavyweights in the Pr014 they may have utilised a box clever game plan against them but they never needed to.
The Saffers bring the heavyweight factor, all sides will have to learn how to box clever and I think it'll be advantageous for both the quality of the current Pro14 sides and the national teams.

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Post by Old Man Wed 05 May 2021, 4:03 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
Old Man wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
Pete330v2 wrote:BOD - Great player and I only ever liked what he did on the pitch, apart from that he's a bit of a .... alright.

HOWEVER!!!!
He's not completely wrong, the only thing that was missed on that piece was a mention of the other Irish sides as well and it was WOL that failed to mention the Irish sides, not BOD. He blames the entire competition which obviously includes their provincial rivals.
Leinster regularly put out less than full strength sides and still, for the most part, win convincingly. The introduction of the Saffers, if it ever happens, will bring much needed physicality and force all current Pro14/12 sides to look at alternative game plans.
YES!! Even Leinster.


Did BOD mention the Irish provinces ? If he did they are not reported, it's sounds as though he is blaming everybody else rather than including the Irish teams for Leinster being beat by La Rochelle.

He didn't mention any nation, he simply said that the Pro14 isn't a good enough tournament to prepare teams for the big French and English sides. You're the one that brought nationality into the conversation regarding him not blaming the Irish sides when he does.
Does he think the SA sides elevate the Pro 14/16?

You'd imagine that he and everyone else thinks so. Cheetahs brought a lot of good most seasons, and they didn't have any internationals. The top SA sides will certainly bring a lot of good and will be difficult to overcome. Sharks and Bulls perhaps the best, but I could be wrong.
Yes, the Lions are in a rebuilding phase, Stormers just had their sponshorships renewed so I wouls expect them to improve a lot

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Post by Dollar Bill Wed 05 May 2021, 5:48 pm

So it’s all the other Pro14 sides fault that Leinster were pumped by La Rochelle....

He was happy for it to pay his wages, for him to pick and choose when he played, and was strangely quiet about the quality of the Pro14 when Leinster were winning the HC...Perhaps if the rest of the Pro14 were afforded Leinster’s budget the league might be more competitive. Nothing to do with Pro 14 teams being decimated by International call ups either?

If the AP is so good he can perhaps explain why other than Financial dopers Saracens, and a well coached Exeter, the English record in the HC is pretty dire, or why all four finalists in Europe this season are from France?

England really pulling up tree stumps Internationally too!!

Come on BOD, enough with the click bait...you’re better than that!!

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Post by Brendan Wed 05 May 2021, 7:26 pm

Dollar Bill wrote:So it’s all the other Pro14 sides fault that Leinster were pumped by La Rochelle....

He was happy for it to pay his wages, for him to pick and choose when he played, and was strangely quiet about the quality of the Pro14 when Leinster were winning the HC...Perhaps if the rest of the Pro14 were afforded Leinster’s budget the league might be more competitive. Nothing to do with Pro 14 teams being decimated by International call ups either?

If the AP is so good he can perhaps explain why other than Financial dopers Saracens, and a well coached Exeter, the English record in the HC is pretty dire, or why all four finalists in Europe this season are from France?

England really pulling up tree stumps Internationally too!!

Come on BOD, enough with the click bait...you’re better than that!!

One of the finalists are English which unsurprisingly are well coached and know what they are doing.

There is no shame in losing to La Rochelle in France as alot of teams have done this season.  They seem to be a team that learns in the first half and adapts in the second.

I don't think the league helps Leinster the same way the Premiership has not helped Sarries because they are so much stronger then their peers.  With Sarries gone Exeter have struggled because know they are stronger then everyone else.

Leinster aren't challenged in the league but it's up to the rest of us to make the Pro16 better.  Just like the Kings and Cheetahs up the league with fast attacking rugby the new 4 teams will bring lots of bulk.

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Post by Pot Hale Thu 06 May 2021, 1:26 am

Can’t see what all the fuss is about. The PRO14 has become a poor poor league - particularly in last couple of seasons.

Many fans think the advent of SA teams, creation of 16 team comp, 2 Conf of 8, 18 regular season games not played in test windows is a good thing.

Leaving that aside, Leinster’s problem is not just confined to having more competitive matches, they need to buy in a couple more foreign players. With Fardy going, they will only have a Samoan-capped TH prop next season with everyone else Irish qualified. And that’s not enough to win semis and finals against the top teams in Europe.
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Post by mikey_dragon Thu 06 May 2021, 10:19 am

Pot Hale wrote:With Fardy going, they will only have a Samoan-capped TH prop next season with everyone else Irish qualified.  And that’s not enough to win semis and finals against the top teams in Europe.  

It would depend if they're international quality, which most (if not all) of them are. Leinster will still be up there. England and France are helped by the fact they have a host of club players who are international quality, and if they don't then they usually buy them in (mostly the French).


On what BOD said.... I know he didn't single anyone out, but if he isn't referring to the Welsh, Scottish and Italian teams then who is he referring to? Did he overreact? It was literally a KO game and Leinster lost to the best in Europe, that's just the way it goes sometimes.

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Post by Pete330v2 Thu 06 May 2021, 11:22 am

"I know he didn't single anyone out, but if he isn't referring to the Welsh, Scottish and Italian teams then who is he referring to? "

He's referring to the Welsh, Scottish, Italian and other Irish sides.

As I've said before he's not entirely wrong but I've always thought that the constraints on the Irish sides on NIQ players would come back to bite eventually. You need a good home grown foundation but you need the marquee talent as well as the English and French top sides have proven. There's a fine balance to be had and I truely think it's tipping away from Ireland's favour. Tough domestic competition makes for better sides and better players, the Pro16 should become a little tougher but will it be enough? Time will tell.

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Post by Brendan Thu 06 May 2021, 2:25 pm

Pete330v2 wrote:"I know he didn't single anyone out, but if he isn't referring to the Welsh, Scottish and Italian teams then who is he referring to? "

He's referring to the Welsh, Scottish, Italian and other Irish sides.

As I've said before he's not entirely wrong but I've always thought that the constraints on the Irish sides on NIQ players would come back to bite eventually. You need a good home grown foundation but you need the marquee talent as well as the English and French top sides have proven. There's a fine balance to be had and I truely think it's tipping away from Ireland's favour. Tough domestic competition makes for better sides and better players, the Pro16 should become a little tougher but will it be enough? Time will tell.

I agree that you need the outside ideas and standards to keep the domestic players improving.  De Allende and Snayman will hold a much bigger sway in the team because they are WC winners.  They also impart ways of dealing with things. If you lose that you generally plateau.

Leinster's problem is that 90+% of the kids come through the same school system, 90+% of their team come through their academy and alot of the coaches/backrow are all connected with the systems.  When Lancaster came in he brought new ideas.

O'Gara talks about coaching at Racing and bringing a new way of thinking to the AB players of how to defend.  Because of what he taught them he got the job at Crusaders where he helped to bring new ideas and also got some of his own.  It is no surprise that they are the one team who plays more NH in defence.  He also talks about culture which I am sure is a mix of Munster and Crusaders influence.

Gats on the other hand seems to have tried to but his plan on the Chiefs rather then adapting resulting in them not doing great until he took his break.

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Post by PhilBB Mon 10 May 2021, 9:56 am

Of course, the PrO'14 is such a garbage competition that it seems only Premier Sports wants to broadcast it.......
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Post by Pot Hale Mon 10 May 2021, 5:09 pm

PhilBB wrote:Of course, the PrO'14 is such a garbage competition that it seems only Premier Sports wants to broadcast it.......


That's not the reason apparently.

Also, eir Sport do not want to bid for the rights but RTE and TG4 do. Do you know why that has happened?
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Post by PhilBB Tue 11 May 2021, 11:33 am

Pot Hale wrote:
PhilBB wrote:Of course, the PrO'14 is such a garbage competition that it seems only Premier Sports wants to broadcast it.......


That's not the reason apparently.

Also, eir Sport do not want to bid for the rights but RTE and TG4 do.   Do you know why that has happened?

No idea. My point was more about Britain than Ireland.

I wonder if TG4 will pay more than the €900,000 they used to play for a season of live rugby. Let's hope so.
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Post by Pot Hale Tue 11 May 2021, 7:30 pm

PhilBB wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:
PhilBB wrote:Of course, the PrO'14 is such a garbage competition that it seems only Premier Sports wants to broadcast it.......


That's not the reason apparently.

Also, eir Sport do not want to bid for the rights but RTE and TG4 do.   Do you know why that has happened?

No idea. My point was more about Britain than Ireland.

I wonder if TG4 will pay more than the €900,000 they used to play for a season of live rugby. Let's hope so.

For only some of the games? Depends on what rights they get for ROI territory. 3 teams home games - 2 of them on delayed broadcast possibly. RTÉ should be the primary rights holder for ROI. They just swung a FTA rights deal with TV3/Virgin for 6 Nations which they were trumpeting yesterday.

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Post by Brendan Wed 12 May 2021, 12:16 pm

Do we know if the league gets more money from their relevant TV deals for being able to show the SA section of the rainbow cup.  Or was it in compensation for the less games per round and lost rounds due to Covid.

From and Irish point of view I think that the standard of the SA teams on show will force the 4 Irish teams to adapt as the only team they might bully at the ruck for quick ball is Lions which is Plan A for our teams.

Bulls also strike me as a team that will beat Munster comfortably on the field (but maybe not the scoreboard). Having backrow players like Duane Vermeulen, Marcell Coetzee, Arno Botha and Marco van Staten they would be hard to get parity with.

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Post by Old Man Wed 12 May 2021, 12:33 pm

Brendan wrote:Do we know if the league gets more money from their relevant TV deals for being able to show the SA section of the rainbow cup.  Or was it in compensation for the less games per round and lost rounds due to Covid.

From and Irish point of view I think that the standard of the SA teams on show will force the 4 Irish teams to adapt as the only team they might bully at the ruck for quick ball is Lions which is Plan A for our teams.

Bulls also strike me as a team that will beat Munster comfortably on the field (but maybe not the scoreboard). Having backrow players like Duane Vermeulen, Marcell Coetzee, Arno Botha and Marco van Staten they would be hard to get parity with.

I am concerned about our Franchises. The quality of rugby that has come from the. over the past months has been a let down for me. There were periods of play where they have shown skill, but then the very next match the skill levels were extremely poor.

Aerial ability for the most part has been woeful, yes the physicality is there but option taking is not great.

Compared to our varsity cup the games have been dire for the most part.

I think our domestic rugby is in trouble. Yes some big names have come home and will at least in some way impart their experiences on the younger generation, but our rugby culture is not evolving, our varsity players are more dynamic, play at a higher pace, showing brilliant offloading skills and option taking compared to the Professional Franchises.

I think it is time our Franchises embrace what is going on at our varsity levels and get those coaches in. It seems like our players are going backwards from school and varsity level when they join the professional ranks.

The other major factor is what is happening to one of our feeding grounds for rugby talent, the Cheetahs.

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Post by Brendan Wed 12 May 2021, 2:36 pm

Old Man wrote:
Brendan wrote:Do we know if the league gets more money from their relevant TV deals for being able to show the SA section of the rainbow cup.  Or was it in compensation for the less games per round and lost rounds due to Covid.

From and Irish point of view I think that the standard of the SA teams on show will force the 4 Irish teams to adapt as the only team they might bully at the ruck for quick ball is Lions which is Plan A for our teams.

Bulls also strike me as a team that will beat Munster comfortably on the field (but maybe not the scoreboard). Having backrow players like Duane Vermeulen, Marcell Coetzee, Arno Botha and Marco van Staten they would be hard to get parity with.

I am concerned about our Franchises. The quality of rugby that has come from the. over the past months has been a let down for me. There were periods of play where they have shown skill, but then the very next match the skill levels were extremely poor.

Aerial ability for the most part has been woeful, yes the physicality is there but option taking is not great.

Compared to our varsity cup the games have been dire for the most part.

I think our domestic rugby is in trouble. Yes some big names have come home and will at least in some way impart their experiences on the younger generation, but our rugby culture is not evolving, our varsity players are more dynamic, play at a higher pace, showing brilliant offloading skills and option taking compared to the Professional Franchises.

I think it is time our Franchises embrace what is going on at our varsity levels and get those coaches in. It seems like our players are going backwards from school and varsity level when they join the professional ranks.

The other major factor is what is happening to one of our feeding grounds for rugby talent, the Cheetahs.

I think the isolation over Covid hasn't been great. Once the Pro16 is up and going I think it will help focus the mind of the players. Also it's hard to get up for games when it's the 6th time you are playing the same team

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Post by LordDowlais Thu 13 May 2021, 8:37 am

Brendan wrote:Also it's hard to get up for games when it's the 6th time you are playing the same team

Another reason why the decision to play the competition in the way they did was a bad idea.

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Post by Old Man Thu 13 May 2021, 9:47 am

LordDowlais wrote:
Brendan wrote:Also it's hard to get up for games when it's the 6th time you are playing the same team

Another reason why the decision to play the competition in the way they did was a bad idea.

To be honest I think it was more a case of keeping the SA players match fit before the lIons series

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Post by geoff999rugby Thu 13 May 2021, 11:19 am

LordDowlais wrote:
Brendan wrote:Also it's hard to get up for games when it's the 6th time you are playing the same team

Another reason why the decision to play the competition in the way they did was a bad idea.

It was to limit travel - perfectly understandable under the circumstances

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Post by profitius Fri 14 May 2021, 4:45 pm

https://www.pro14.rugby/latest/news/planning-at-advanced-stages-for-historic-north-v-south-guinness-pro14-rainbow-cup-final

14 May 2021
Planning at Advanced Stages for Historic ‘North v South’ Guinness PRO14 Rainbow Cup Final



The Guinness PRO14 Rainbow Cup is set to culminate in an historic ‘North v South’ Final on June 19 so that the dual tournaments operating in Europe and South Africa will tie together to produce one winner.

Planning is now at an advanced stage and all written approvals are expected imminently for the game to take place at a European venue. At this stage in the process it was important for teams, their fans, broadcasters and sponsors to hear of these developments ahead of this weekend’s Rainbow Cup games in Europe and South Africa.

The Northern representative in the final shall be the team who finishes first in the table among the 12 teams in the Guinness PRO14 Rainbow Cup while the Southern representative shall be the side who ranks first in the Rainbow Cup SA competition.

Further details on the ‘North v South’ Guinness PRO14 Rainbow Cup Final will be provided next week.
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Post by Brendan Fri 14 May 2021, 8:53 pm

So Connacht strike again picking up 2 wins in the inter pros. Really opens the door up as to who will finish top (anyone but Leinster). Benetton could be top after this round.

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Post by Brendan Sun 16 May 2021, 12:09 am

Coming out of the derbies things are tight.

There will be a max of 10pts available.  Benetton need 7pts to secure top spot.  They might beat Connacht but Ospreys away will be tricky. BPs will be key and will most likely cause some interesting turns.

Round 4 has two key ties Munster v Blues and Benetton v Connacht.  Loser is out unless it's Benetton. Winners move a step closer.

Round 5 has Glasgow v Leinster with the losers out.

Round 6 then becomes a case of last team standing and could be anyone.

For SA I was surprised that the Bulls won so well and that really puts them on the front foot.  It will probably still come down to the final game as sharks have picked up more BPs

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Post by LordDowlais Mon 17 May 2021, 9:23 am

Will the final in June have the Lions players available ? Or even the SA internationals ?

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Post by thebandwagonsociety Mon 17 May 2021, 10:04 am

LordDowlais wrote:Will the final in June have the Lions players available ? Or even the SA internationals ?

Completely unknown.
Final on 19 June and it's could be a North v South final? So that final would be the same weekend as the premiership semi's, or final?

https://www.leinsterrugby.ie/guinness-pro14-rainbow-cup-set-for-north-v-south-final/

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Post by LordDowlais Mon 17 May 2021, 10:27 am

thebandwagonsociety wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Will the final in June have the Lions players available ? Or even the SA internationals ?

Completely unknown.
Final on 19 June  and it's could be a North v South final? So that final would be the same weekend as the premiership semi's, or final?

https://www.leinsterrugby.ie/guinness-pro14-rainbow-cup-set-for-north-v-south-final/

I thought a North V South final was confirmed ?

The first tour game is the 3rd of July. Wales play Canada on 3rd of July, and then Argentina on the 10th and 11th of July. Ireland have Japan and USA at the Start of July, Scotland have England, Romania and Georgia as well. The Lions will be playin Japan on the 26th of June as well.

I wonder if the Lions players and the international players will be released for this final that is getting shoe horned in to an already busy calendar ? Are South Africa playing any warm-up games ?

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Post by BigGee Mon 17 May 2021, 11:01 am

LordDowlais wrote:
thebandwagonsociety wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Will the final in June have the Lions players available ? Or even the SA internationals ?

Completely unknown.
Final on 19 June  and it's could be a North v South final? So that final would be the same weekend as the premiership semi's, or final?

https://www.leinsterrugby.ie/guinness-pro14-rainbow-cup-set-for-north-v-south-final/

I thought a North V South final was confirmed ?

The first tour game is the 3rd of July. Wales play Canada on 3rd of July, and then Argentina on the 10th and 11th of July.  Ireland have Japan and USA at the Start of July, Scotland have England, Romania and Georgia as well. The Lions will be playin Japan on the 26th of June as well.

I wonder if the Lions players and the international players will be released for this final that is getting shoe horned in to an already busy calendar ? Are South Africa playing any warm-up games ?

Two fixtures against Georgia.

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Post by LordDowlais Mon 17 May 2021, 11:09 am

BigGee wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
thebandwagonsociety wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:Will the final in June have the Lions players available ? Or even the SA internationals ?

Completely unknown.
Final on 19 June  and it's could be a North v South final? So that final would be the same weekend as the premiership semi's, or final?

https://www.leinsterrugby.ie/guinness-pro14-rainbow-cup-set-for-north-v-south-final/

I thought a North V South final was confirmed ?

The first tour game is the 3rd of July. Wales play Canada on 3rd of July, and then Argentina on the 10th and 11th of July.  Ireland have Japan and USA at the Start of July, Scotland have England, Romania and Georgia as well. The Lions will be playin Japan on the 26th of June as well.

I wonder if the Lions players and the international players will be released for this final that is getting shoe horned in to an already busy calendar ? Are South Africa playing any warm-up games ?

Two fixtures against Georgia.

Exactly, so how would this fair with player releases ?

This could be a final full of 2nd string or academy players. Doh

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Post by Brendan Mon 17 May 2021, 11:39 am

If the Northern team is Benetton then does the Lions matter.

The league was bad because there wasn't a North v South element now it is bad because there will be.

I am sure the Northern team will be able to keep their players for the one weekend just like the English and French teams can. I have no doubt the SARU will allow their winners (most likely the Bulls) play their strongest team available as last thing they want is their team losing badly.

For a competition teams supposedly don't care about the players seemed to enjoy the win or dissaapointed with the losses. 1 team in front with the next 6 separated by 1 point. I think all of the top 7 are going to be looking to get to that final. The Bulls definately do with the way they demolished the sharks in the second half to lay down a marker, they really want to show they are the top team in the new Pro16.

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Post by LordDowlais Mon 17 May 2021, 12:05 pm

Brendan wrote:If the Northern team is Benetton then does the Lions matter.

Hopefully, but I cannot see it being Benneton. Will be good if it is though.

Brendan wrote:The league was bad because there wasn't a North v South element now it is bad because there will be.

The league isn't very good .

Brendan wrote:I am sure the Northern team will be able to keep their players for the one weekend just like the English and French teams can. I have no doubt the SARU will allow their winners (most likely the Bulls) play their strongest team available as last thing they want is their team losing badly.

I do not think the Lions players will be released.

Brendan wrote:For a competition teams supposedly don't care about the players seemed to enjoy the win or dissaapointed with the losses. 1 team in front with the next 6 separated by 1 point. I think all of the top 7 are going to be looking to get to that final. The Bulls definately do with the way they demolished the sharks in the second half to lay down a marker, they really want to show they are the top team in the new Pro16.

I'm sorry, I cannot fathom what this is supposed to mean.  OK

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Post by Pot Hale Mon 17 May 2021, 2:04 pm

Brendan wrote:If the Northern team is Benetton then does the Lions matter.

The league was bad because there wasn't a North v South element now it is bad because there will be.

I am sure the Northern team will be able to keep their players for the one weekend just like the English and French teams can.  I have no doubt the SARU will allow their winners (most likely the Bulls) play their strongest team available as last thing they want is their team losing badly.

For a competition teams supposedly don't care about the players seemed to enjoy the win or dissaapointed with the losses.  1 team in front with the next 6 separated by 1 point.  I think all of the top 7 are going to be looking to get to that final.  The Bulls definately do with the way they demolished the sharks in the second half to lay down a marker, they really want to show they are the top team in the new Pro16.

The PRO14 is what people want to make of it.   Irish and Scottish fans seem to like it, some welsh fans don't - hey ho.

All of the teams are interested in fielding competitive sides because a) they want to get to the final b) Lions players want as much game time as possible c) other players want to get selected for their national tours.

The final on 19 June should feature most of the respective finalists' top players because there's only a limited number of Lions players in each team anyway.   Leinster only have 4, and Furlong, Henshaw, Conan and Porter have been playing their guts out.   There is generous rest time between matches as well.   Munster only have 2, Ulster (out of final consideration) and Connacht 1.   Irish sides won't be understrength because of Lions tour.  Benetton are not affected either.  Ospreys, Glasgow and Cardiff are the others in the running - would any of them be substantially affected by their Lions players not playing?
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Post by PhilBB Mon 17 May 2021, 4:01 pm

Pot Hale wrote:

The PRO14 is what people want to make of it.   Irish and Scottish fans seem to like it, some welsh fans don't - hey ho.

All of the teams are interested in fielding competitive sides because a) they want to get to the final b) Lions players want as much game time as possible c) other players want to get selected for their national tours.

The final on 19 June should feature most of the respective finalists' top players because there's only a limited number of Lions players in each team anyway.   Leinster only have 4, and Furlong, Henshaw, Conan and Porter have been playing their guts out.   There is generous rest time between matches as well.   Munster only have 2, Ulster (out of final consideration) and Connacht 1.   Irish sides won't be understrength because of Lions tour.  Benetton are not affected either.  Ospreys, Glasgow and Cardiff are the others in the running - would any of them be substantially affected by their Lions players not playing?

That word "some" is seriously misspelled.

The Welsh teams have sent out some joke selections in this Cup, by the way.
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Post by Brendan Mon 17 May 2021, 4:29 pm

PhilBB wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:

The PRO14 is what people want to make of it.   Irish and Scottish fans seem to like it, some welsh fans don't - hey ho.

All of the teams are interested in fielding competitive sides because a) they want to get to the final b) Lions players want as much game time as possible c) other players want to get selected for their national tours.

The final on 19 June should feature most of the respective finalists' top players because there's only a limited number of Lions players in each team anyway.   Leinster only have 4, and Furlong, Henshaw, Conan and Porter have been playing their guts out.   There is generous rest time between matches as well.   Munster only have 2, Ulster (out of final consideration) and Connacht 1.   Irish sides won't be understrength because of Lions tour.  Benetton are not affected either.  Ospreys, Glasgow and Cardiff are the others in the running - would any of them be substantially affected by their Lions players not playing?

That word "some" is seriously misspelled.

The Welsh teams have sent out some joke selections in this Cup, by the way.

Surely for Ospreys and Blues it's a chance of silverware which has to kick in at some stage. Ospreys have Connacht and Benetton so have missed the big Irish teams. Blues have Munster which is a bit harder.

Can see how a Welsh team wouldn't want to be playing in the final with lots of eyes watching. If they don't care it says more about them then the league. Can't see AWJ settling for poor performances from his team.

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Post by Pot Hale Mon 17 May 2021, 9:00 pm

PhilBB wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:

The PRO14 is what people want to make of it.   Irish and Scottish fans seem to like it, some welsh fans don't - hey ho.

All of the teams are interested in fielding competitive sides because a) they want to get to the final b) Lions players want as much game time as possible c) other players want to get selected for their national tours.

The final on 19 June should feature most of the respective finalists' top players because there's only a limited number of Lions players in each team anyway.   Leinster only have 4, and Furlong, Henshaw, Conan and Porter have been playing their guts out.   There is generous rest time between matches as well.   Munster only have 2, Ulster (out of final consideration) and Connacht 1.   Irish sides won't be understrength because of Lions tour.  Benetton are not affected either.  Ospreys, Glasgow and Cardiff are the others in the running - would any of them be substantially affected by their Lions players not playing?

That word "some" is seriously misspelled.

The Welsh teams have sent out some joke selections in this Cup, by the way.

Very true.
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Post by PhilBB Tue 18 May 2021, 11:35 am

Brendan wrote:

Surely for Ospreys and Blues it's a chance of silverware which has to kick in at some stage. Ospreys have Connacht and Benetton so have missed the big Irish teams.  Blues have Munster which is a bit harder.

Can see how a Welsh team wouldn't want to be playing in the final with lots of eyes watching.  If they don't care it says more about them then the league.  Can't see AWJ settling for poor performances from his team.

You've not paid attention to the selections, have you?
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Post by PhilBB Tue 18 May 2021, 11:35 am

It seems that BBC Wales are bidding for 15 live games next season, by the way.
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Post by LordDowlais Tue 18 May 2021, 11:50 am

PhilBB wrote:It seems that BBC Wales are bidding for 15 live games next season, by the way.

Happy days. Yahoo

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Post by LordDowlais Tue 18 May 2021, 11:59 am

Everyone's favourite news outlet is reporting it now:-

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/new-pro16-live-coverage-set-20620493

Live regional rugby looks set to return to BBC Wales with some 15 PRO16 games being shown on the channel next season. The BBC haven’t had live coverage of the cross-border competition for the past three years, with Premier Sports winning the rights in 2018. Premier’s three-year deal expires at the end of this season. It’s expected the subscription channel will continue to broadcast the competition, although it’s unclear whether they will show every single game live, which is the case at the moment. But it does appear there will be a significant increase in the terrestrial coverage of the tournament as part of the new deal. BBC Wales are set to show around 15 games involving Welsh teams, mainly in their traditional Friday night slot. There may well also be a greater number of live matches on S4C. The Welsh language channel have been showing games on the majority of weekends through the season, generally on Saturday evening. Now they could have an increased involvement, potentially with more than one game on some weekends. The BBC have been showing highlights of PRO14 matches on Sunday’s ScrumV programme for the past 18 months or so. But resuming live coverage will be a significant step. Are you happy to see PRO16 games returning to the BBC? What have you made of Premier Sports' coverage? Have your say in the comments section There has been a feeling that moving off the BBC saw a reduction in the public profile and awareness of the competition. Now we are heading for a new beginning to coincide with a major change to the tournament. From next season, it will be expanded to the PRO16, with the four South African Super sides - the Bulls, Sharks, Stormers and Lions coming on board. There will also be a new fixture structure, with the number of regular season matches going down to 18. That will involve teams playing the other 15 sides either home or away, plus three return derbies. The idea behind that is not to have any league matches on international weekends, thereby limiting the number of games played out between depleted second strings. With the BBC likely to show 15 fixtures live, they will be on board for most weekends of the season. Realistically, it will mean they won’t be providing live coverage of the Welsh Premiership, which they have done on Friday nights in recent seasons since losing the PRO14 rights. Meanwhile, negotiations are continuing over the TV rights for next season's autumn internationals and Six Nations, which are up for grabs. It's expected that Amazon will once again be involved in the autumn, but with coverage of the Six Nations remaining largely free-to-air. wrote:

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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue 18 May 2021, 12:36 pm

Why celebrate it being on the BBC if its rubbish anyway?

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Post by LordDowlais Tue 18 May 2021, 12:44 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Why celebrate it being on the BBC if its rubbish anyway?

I havent said it's rubbish. Headscratch

I have said it isn't very good, but thats because of the hash they have made with the organisation the past two seasons. The league has massive potential. Putting behind a paywall before it was really established on a totally obscure channel that nobody was familiar with put a hold on the potential.

It was just starting to get a foothold in Wales before they made the stupid idea to put it on a channel that nobody had ever heard of. Now that it is back on the BBC perhaps it will raise it's profile in Wales.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue 18 May 2021, 12:49 pm

Sorry. So is it a good idea if the league isn't very good. More people may watch it and come to that conclusion. Phil seemed to be saying above that alit of the Welsh population don't rate it. More people seeing it isn't going to change that.

Or is the real issue that people will just watch anything thats cheaper so the complaints aren't really about the league but grumbles for having to pay more for a product.

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Post by LordDowlais Tue 18 May 2021, 12:57 pm

OK look, you have your opinion, I have mine, this constant coming after me on here will get us both in trouble, so rather than do what you are doing, just be happy, that I am happy, that the BBC are getting games next season. OK

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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue 18 May 2021, 12:59 pm

It was actually more a point to Phil initially than yourself but the point still stands I think. More people getting the chance to see a product that 'isn't very good in your opinion or seemingly worse in Phils has the very real chance of putting a nail in the coffin.

Ps people don't have to agree with you or get in trouble for pointing out a real potential for a downside.

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Post by Brendan Tue 18 May 2021, 1:22 pm

LordDowlais wrote:
No 7&1/2 wrote:Why celebrate it being on the BBC if its rubbish anyway?

I havent said it's rubbish. Headscratch

I have said it isn't very good, but thats because of the hash they have made with the organisation the past two seasons. The league has massive potential. Putting behind a paywall before it was really established on a totally obscure channel that nobody was familiar with put a hold on the potential.

It was just starting to get a foothold in Wales before they made the stupid idea to put it on a channel that nobody had ever heard of. Now that it is back on the BBC perhaps it will raise it's profile in Wales.

I thought the league had been dying in Wales and Premiers Sports was going to be the death nail.

I didn't realize it was starting to become more popular in Wales in 2016

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Post by Brendan Tue 18 May 2021, 1:31 pm

PhilBB wrote:
Brendan wrote:

Surely for Ospreys and Blues it's a chance of silverware which has to kick in at some stage. Ospreys have Connacht and Benetton so have missed the big Irish teams.  Blues have Munster which is a bit harder.

Can see how a Welsh team wouldn't want to be playing in the final with lots of eyes watching.  If they don't care it says more about them then the league.  Can't see AWJ settling for poor performances from his team.

You've not paid attention to the selections, have you?

As you will note I said that winning silverware has to kick in at some point. Are you saying that if the Ospreys face Benetton in their last game and the winner gets into the final they will play a weak team in front of their own fans and allow Benetton to win.

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