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English 6 Nations

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Post by No 7&1/2 Wed Jan 05, 2022 2:52 pm

First topic message reminder :

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2022/jan/05/six-nations-rugby-covid-rob-baxter

A potential answer to a potential problem. Baxter has said that if there is a risk of cancellations or playing in front of 1 man and his dog you may as well play all the games in England.

I suppose an interesting suggestion. If they could agree a slice of revenue from whichever grounds would host along with some teams giving up home advantage would people want to see this? It doesn't reduce the risk at all, merely increases it surely, gives England an advantage. It's unlikely the Government will bring in further restrictions as their hands are tied by the back benchers so reduces the risk of last minute changes. Just a big melting pot of cross contamination.


'Rob Baxter, Exeter’s director of rugby, believes that playing this season’s Six Nations in one country has “got to be better than cancelling it”.

The tournament is due to kick off in Dublin and Edinburgh on 5 February but currently finds itself shrouded in uncertainty. Under current Welsh Government restrictions imposed due to the pandemic and, specifically, the omicron variant, Wales would have to play scheduled home games against Scotland, France and Italy behind closed doors. Scotland are in a similar position for games at Murrayfield, while it has been reported that Wales could consider moving their home against Scotland, France and Italy to England.

Financial implications of behind-closed-doors home games for the Welsh Rugby Union would be significant. They faced an identical situation for last season’s tournament, with the shutters being down for matches against Ireland and England. Full crowds were, however, allowed at the Principality Stadium for Wales’ recent Autumn Nations Series before fresh restrictions took effect from Boxing Day.

Capacity crowds are currently allowed in England, provided spectators can prove full vaccination status or provide a negative lateral flow test. Against such a backdrop, playing the whole competition – it takes place across five weekends between early February and mid-March – in one country with permitted crowds has also been mooted in some quarters.

“The whole beauty of the Six Nations has been that change of environment, that change of weather conditions, going to play in Scotland, Wales, Ireland – those are the great challenges,” said Baxter. “That’s what makes the Six Nations such a great competition to win. You’ve seen French teams in that one week they can beat anyone in the world in Paris, and then the next week it doesn’t go quite so well in Cardiff. That’s the beauty of the tournament, that’s what from a rugby perspective I am sure we would all want to see happen.

“That said, we can’t all sit here and pretend the world is in an ideal place at the moment. For the national bodies, their responsibility goes beyond the professional sport, it goes right down to grassroots rugby, so if playing the tournament provides a level of income that cancelling it or no crowds doesn’t create, then we’ve got to look at the next best scenario. If the next best scenario is playing it in one country, where you can have sellout crowds, you can raise some revenue and you can keep that income stream going for all the bodies, then it’s got to be better than cancelling it.


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“I think with every sporting body, it’s revenue that is the biggest thing that has been damaged, so anything that can keep revenue online has got to be preferable to just binning things for a season,” Baxter added. “We’ve all had to try and find a way to keep going, to try and keep revenue coming in. It’s the same with any business, you’ve got to explore those options.”

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Post by Barney McGrew did it Sun Feb 06, 2022 8:55 pm

I’m getting an uneasy feeling that Eddie might have taken England as far as he could last RWC, and that since has just been muddling through. Who’d have thought then that 3 years later we’d have a centre partnership that Mathew Tait would have fitted into nicely; a SH edging into his pension years; a BR that the Saffas would have thrown around for fun (ok that’s a bit harsh, and they’ve already done that); and a defensive organization that gets a newboy lock to mark Hogg, and puts a hooker out to defend the high ball to the wing 10 metres or so from the line.

It didn’t help that it was a hooker who didn’t fancy the catch, or the tackle, and has a deficit in the grey matter.

And who suggested Marler chuck it into the LO like he’s getting shot of a dog toid.

And don’t get me started on the perennial return of the prodigal son that is Manu – he’s a last 15 minute finisher at the very best these days (let the poor soul retire and concentrate on club).

Scotland were good and deserved the win, but if Eddie keeps telling us he’s working to win the next RWC then these are the games we really have to start to win. I’m still hoping for 2 wins, but I can’t see better than that - so that's an improvement from 5th to 4th.

So, less ‘in Eddie we trust’ anymore, so much as we’re kinda stuck with him?
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Post by Sharkey06 Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:04 pm

England lost because despite having 54% possession and 62% territory we hardly created any line breaks or try scoring opportunities.  Our forwards were ok – won most of our lineouts, had parity at the scrums, didn’t give away many penalties at the breakdown, etc.  But I just don’t see what they excel at, or where they are going to dominate opponents.  I am sure France and Ireland won’t be losing too much sleep about our pack.

Our backs are a mess.  We have a scrum half who is told by the coach to kick the ball endlessly and aimlessly.  Our centres had little cutting edge and a Slade/Daly combination looks unbalanced.  We then have Malins and Marchant – neither of whom are specialist wingers – and didn’t have the cutting edge that the Scottish wingers had, that Conway and Hansen had for Ireland, and that Villiere and Penaud had for France.

If someone can explain what our game plan is, I would be interested to know, because I don’t see one.  When you look at Ireland and France  - there is a clear plan.  As Barney McGrew said, since the world cup, England have been largely clueless – there is a constant churn of coaches and no solution in site for the fact Manu is broken 90% of the time.

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Post by Yoda Sun Feb 06, 2022 9:52 pm

Barney McGrew did it wrote:I’m getting an uneasy feeling that Eddie might have taken England as far as he could last RWC, and that since has just been muddling through. Who’d have thought then that 3 years later we’d have a centre partnership that Mathew Tait would have fitted into nicely; a SH edging into his pension years; a BR that the Saffas would have thrown around for fun (ok that’s a bit harsh, and they’ve already done that); and a defensive organization that gets a newboy lock to mark Hogg, and puts a hooker out to defend the high ball to the wing 10 metres or so from the line.

It didn’t help that it was a hooker who didn’t fancy the catch, or the tackle, and has a deficit in the grey matter.

And who suggested Marler chuck it into the LO like he’s getting shot of a dog toid.

And don’t get me started on the perennial return of the prodigal son that is Manu – he’s a last 15 minute finisher at the very best these days (let the poor soul retire and concentrate on club).

Scotland were good and deserved the win, but if Eddie keeps telling us he’s working to win the next RWC then these are the games we really have to start to win. I’m still hoping for 2 wins, but I can’t see better than that - so that's an improvement from 5th to 4th.

So, less ‘in Eddie we trust’ anymore, so much as we’re kinda stuck with him?

The only bit I heartily agree on is Youngs, great servant over the years but need to move on now. It's a bit harsh as Eddie has been affected by injuries since a promising autumn. Our back row wasn't man handled by Scotland I don't think and bar a really poor decision by LCD we were in a good position to win. I like to think that it was fin Russell's brilliance that unpicked us and let's be honest he is quality.

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Post by hugehandoff Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:36 am

What changes do you want to see for Italy and then for Wales 2 weeks later? I would welcome Randall starting and seeing how he goes with Smith. I am not sold on our midfield and we need a better balance. Too early for Manu as he needs to prove fitness and form at Sale. If he goes ok then Ireland could see him back? Atkinson?
Hopefully Lawes is available and he needs to play to get him ready for Wales. Launchbury is back playing and could be an option for Wales? Hill should be available for Wales as well.
Ludlam impressed so I would just swap Dombrandt for Simmonds in the starting slot and look to have Simmonds on the bench (hopefully not all pre-planned subs). Start Nowell as well in place of Marchant. Start George in place of LCD but keep the starting props who went well.

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Post by Geordie Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:47 am

Randall isnt good enough...if Quirke is fit...play him

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Post by No 7&1/2 Mon Feb 07, 2022 11:55 am

I'm assuming that we're allowed to call up who we like or is it limited to injury replacements?

This won't happen of course as there's clearly a plan now by Jones. I'd like Tuilagi, Quirke, Launchbury, Radwan, H-Cs and Ojamoh/Kelly involved. I'd have quite liked to see Micthell too but Randall will do.

In terms of Lineup Lawes should be a lock, Dombrandt should be the starting 8. No surprises that I don't think Youngs should be in the squad, Marchant as a midfielder, and out and out wingers on the wing.

Forgot Barbeary.


Last edited by No 7&1/2 on Mon Feb 07, 2022 12:48 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by lostinwales Mon Feb 07, 2022 12:00 pm

Lets think

My overall thoughts are that we did OK, more than OK in some respects. The scoreboard was obviously the principle negative... We fecked up at the end and didn't switch to a good defensive pattern when Scotland got some possession, but there was good too.

I do think there is definitely room for tweaking. We need a little more inspiration somewhere, the kind of thing we used to rely on, say, May or Manu for.

Front row was fine. We are rightfully upset about the penalty try but where TF was Malins? Or another back?

Second row. Isiekwe was OK. To be honest it was hard for either front 5 to really put a marker down. I think we shaded it, based on possession and retention. But he didn't put down an unassailable case to continue.

Back row was also fine. Ludlam wasn't as good as he was in the summer. Curry was OK in parts but with the possession stats he didn't show that side of his game so much. Simmonds did what he was brought in to do. I am not against Dombrandt starting instead but I don't think it will make any difference

I am not going to go into the SH issues. Of the outside backs I can't remember Daly doing much beyond that nice little charge down on Hogg. I'd rather have Marchant back at 13 and an out an out winger, or two playing on the wings. Malins has done well in his opportunities to date but I can't help wanting a little more when things don't work.



Atkinson is a dead end.


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Post by dummy_half Mon Feb 07, 2022 12:24 pm

Centres have been an issue for England for ages, especially when Manu is injured. Slade was probably the main culprit for kicking the ball away in attacking positions and Daly didn't do much. We need someone with a bit of X-factor either to bulldoze the opposition or to use pace and guile to get through gaps and find supporting runners - basically 20 year younger Greenwood and Tindall. It's a shame that Sam Simmonds didn't decide to change to being a centre a few years ago, as he has the physical attributes we need but obviously no experience.

With the penalty try, you have to give Scotland some credit for dragging the defence out of shape to begin with, with Russell's kick tot he left wing and DvdM's penetrating run, which left Cowan-Dickie isolated on the opposite wing. Still a complete brain fade that he didn't at least try to catch the ball or stand off and make the tackle on Graham - had he knocked on accidentally, I think we still win the game

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Post by lostinwales Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:29 pm

Any news on squad changes?

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Post by Geordie Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:37 pm

lostinwales wrote:Any news on squad changes?

They have discovered Andre Esteruizens English granny and hes now in the squad.

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Post by lostinwales Mon Feb 07, 2022 3:43 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:
lostinwales wrote:Any news on squad changes?

They have discovered Andre Esteruizens English granny and hes now in the squad.

I guess filling your squad with SA mercenaries seems to work for everyone else.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Mon Feb 07, 2022 4:43 pm

lostinwales wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
lostinwales wrote:Any news on squad changes?

They have discovered Andre Esteruizens English granny and hes now in the squad.

I guess filling your squad with SA mercenaries seems to work for everyone else.

When was his last cap for SA? He could qualify on residency in time for 2027.

Atkinson would be a stop gap, a poor man's Andre. I don't think every player in the squad necessarily needs to be the future in that position. Atkinson might just get us through this tournament and then never play for us again. What we need is a physical presence to help Smith out and hopefully generate him some space. There's some young talented centres we can bring in for the summer again but it's easier to do that on the back of a good 6N.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Mon Feb 07, 2022 4:48 pm

You can't qualify on residency once capped.

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Post by Sharkey06 Mon Feb 07, 2022 5:15 pm

Based on the number of Saffers plying their trade in England, France, etc is it really too hard to identify a young inside centre in South Africa who hasn't played for the senior side and has an English grandparent?  It seems to be the only answer to our problem.  If Atkinson is the only specialist inside centre in the squad and can't get a look in when Farrell and Manu are injured, then I don't think he has much of a future.

Sam Warburton seems to sum it up well "It is ridiculous. A country who has got 12 pro teams, three players per team contracted full-time who can play 12, so 36 inside centres.  Let's say six aren't English qualified. You have got 30 inside centres professionally contracted and they can't find someone to replace Manu Tuilagi. It's inexplicable."

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Post by hugehandoff Mon Feb 07, 2022 5:31 pm

[quote=Sam Warburton seems to sum it up well "It is ridiculous. A country who has got 12 pro teams, three players per team contracted full-time who can play 12, so 36 inside centres.  Let's say six aren't English qualified. You have got 30 inside centres professionally contracted and they can't find someone to replace Manu Tuilagi. It's inexplicable."[/quote]

Too true and to be fair to EJ it is not really his fault that we have not unearthed any quality options at 12 since he took over in 2016. Slade & Manu remain the best bet until that changes. Slade & Marchant as the 2nd choice.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Mon Feb 07, 2022 9:07 pm

First choice inside centres in the Prem;

Newcastle - Lucock and Burrell - both average
Sale - Manu - already capped and plays when fit
Tigers - Kelly - young capped and improving but not quite ready for international rugby
Saints - Francis and Dingwall - Francis never quite made the grade, Dingwall developing and not ready yet.
Worcester - no EQ options - Lawrence is a 13 that could step in at 12 but has had injury issues.
Wasps - Gopperth and MLB - neither viable options, possibly Mills if he was ever fit.
Glaws - Atkinson and Twelvetrees - 36 is past his best and Atkinson is included.
Bristol - O'Conor and Bedlow - neither have shown sufficient form but both could develop into viable options.
Bath - Redpath and Ojomoh - Redpath opted for Scotland and Ojomoh is still developing.
Chiefs - Devoto - been selected and dismissed by Eddie, I think he's currently injured as well.
Saracens - Tompkins - opted for Wales.
LI - opted for a Saffa.
Quins - opted for a Saffa.

So there's some players that could develop into good options, particularly Kelly and Ojomoh but no obvious stand out candidate. Devoto were he not injured or Piers O'Conor had his form not fallen off a cliff this season could have been options. Kelly and Ojomoh would be ideal options for the summer games.

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Post by Geordie Tue Feb 08, 2022 8:59 am

Sam theres some crackers coming through but most wont be ready for this world cup.

You've listed Kelly and Ojomoh, theres also Hartley at wasps whos a big unit and only 19, Seb Atkinson, and i still have hope for Ollie Lawrence (only 22)...and Odogwu (at 13 admittedly)

Surely out of those one of them will really come through finally.

PS
Newcastle - Lucock and Burrell - both average
Thats being kind....

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Post by geoff999rugby Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:03 am

England need to get Kelly and Ojomoh up to speed - they look like the best 12 prospects to me

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:06 am

geoff999rugby wrote:England need to get Kelly and Ojomoh up to speed - they look like the best 12 prospects to me

2 quite different players, I would depend who is playing outside them. Kelly is a bit Barritt-esq imo, solid....but would require some magic inside and out to fully work. Ojomoh looks a bit special ball in hand.....maybe a little too much outside Smith?

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Post by geoff999rugby Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:09 am

lostinwales wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
lostinwales wrote:Any news on squad changes?

They have discovered Andre Esteruizens English granny and hes now in the squad.

I guess filling your squad with SA mercenaries seems to work for everyone else.

What SA mercenaries do other teams have then?
Particularly interested in the Ireland list.

We do have Rob Herring who moved to England aged 19 and played 2 Currie Cup games for Western Province.
Joined Ulster aged 22 and has an Irish grandparent.
So by no stretch of the imagination a top flight player who moved north for International recognition.
He achieved it because he worked hard at his game here in Ireland.

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:15 am

geoff999rugby wrote:
lostinwales wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
lostinwales wrote:Any news on squad changes?

They have discovered Andre Esteruizens English granny and hes now in the squad.

I guess filling your squad with SA mercenaries seems to work for everyone else.

What SA mercenaries do other teams have then?
Particularly interested in the Ireland list.

We do have Rob Herring who moved to England aged 19 and played 2 Currie Cup games for Western Province.
Joined Ulster aged 22 and has an Irish grandparent.
So by no stretch of the imagination a top flight player who moved north for International recognition.
He achieved it because he worked hard at his game here in Ireland.

Ireland seem to have moved on from the SA ringers to NZ/Aus ones.....it's important not to stand still in rugby Geoff Wink

To be fair, I think Toonie has somebody based at every international airport checking arrivals from SA....Scotland have the South Africa imports fully wrapped up.

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Post by geoff999rugby Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:28 am

To be clear I am not fan of mercenaries.
I'd rather Baloucoune was playing than Hansen
Rather Murray was playing than JGP
Rather Henshaw, or McCloskey were playing than Aki

People coming over as kids fair enough but already professional rugby players moving and getting capped doesn't sit well with me

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Post by Geordie Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:29 am

For the Summer: Australia i believe...

9 Quirke
10 Smith
11 OHC
12 Ojomoh / Kelly
13 Odogwu
14 Radwan
15 Steward

Subs
Lawrence- 12/13

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:29 am

I'm with you there Geoff thumbsup

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Post by lostinwales Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:30 am

geoff999rugby wrote:
lostinwales wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
lostinwales wrote:Any news on squad changes?

They have discovered Andre Esteruizens English granny and hes now in the squad.

I guess filling your squad with SA mercenaries seems to work for everyone else.

What SA mercenaries do other teams have then?
Particularly interested in the Ireland list.

We do have Rob Herring who moved to England aged 19 and played 2 Currie Cup games for Western Province.
Joined Ulster aged 22 and has an Irish grandparent.
So by no stretch of the imagination a top flight player who moved north for International recognition.
He achieved it because he worked hard at his game here in Ireland.

There is truth in that.

I will also say I don't have a problem with the 'mercenaries' on the whole.

You do get cases (like Flutey for England back in the day) when players only reach their potential in a different environment.

Many players have family links, which is historically the case for most of the England SA contingent. On the other hand we did have Botha and that flanker whose name escapes me, and Ribbans is on the fringes of the national team.

Looking at the different squads now you have Willemse and Le Roux in the French squad, Steyn for Italy and a few in the Scotland squad. None in the Welsh squad or English squad that I know of.

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Post by WELL-PAST-IT Tue Feb 08, 2022 10:48 am

lostinwales wrote:
geoff999rugby wrote:
lostinwales wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
lostinwales wrote:Any news on squad changes?

They have discovered Andre Esteruizens English granny and hes now in the squad.

I guess filling your squad with SA mercenaries seems to work for everyone else.

What SA mercenaries do other teams have then?
Particularly interested in the Ireland list.

We do have Rob Herring who moved to England aged 19 and played 2 Currie Cup games for Western Province.
Joined Ulster aged 22 and has an Irish grandparent.
So by no stretch of the imagination a top flight player who moved north for International recognition.
He achieved it because he worked hard at his game here in Ireland.

There is truth in that.

I will also say I don't have a problem with the 'mercenaries' on the whole.

You do get cases (like Flutey for England back in the day) when players only reach their potential in a different environment.

Many players have family links, which is historically the case for most of the England SA contingent. On the other hand we did have Botha and that flanker whose name escapes me, and Ribbans is on the fringes of the national team.

Looking at the different squads now you have Willemse and Le Roux in the French squad, Steyn for Italy and a few in the Scotland squad. None in the Welsh squad or English squad that I know of.

I wouldn't put Mouritz Botha in the category, he came over here to work and started playing rugby at championship level for Bedford Blues in 2006, played there for a few years and then joined Sarries in 2009, worked his way up, not a mercenary, developed into a much better player over here that is all. As far as I can see, he only played 11 games of first class rugby in SA.

Not sure Ribbans fits that category either, he came over here at around 20 years old having been on the periphery of Stormers and Western Province sides. Again he has played nearly all his senior rugby for Saints.
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Post by lostinwales Tue Feb 08, 2022 11:08 am

I was going to mention Alex Groves but a quick search shows that he has just left the Bristol academy (announced yesterday)

No information as to why or where he's going (or what he is going to do).

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Post by Gooseberry Tue Feb 08, 2022 11:15 am

Jabba the Hutt Waldrom was one of the slightly dodgier ones, only found out he was eligible just before getting a call up.

Really though now theres far more players that have come through the England system getting picked up by other nations than vice versa. Not surprising given the player pool.

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Post by Rugby Fan Tue Feb 08, 2022 11:47 am

Mike Catt, Michael Horak, Hendre Fourie, Mouritz Botha and Brad Barritt are the main Saffers I can remember. Don Armand, while from Zimbabwe, came through South African school, university & club rugby.

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Post by lostinwales Tue Feb 08, 2022 11:56 am

Rugby Fan wrote:Mike Catt, Michael Horak, Hendre Fourie, Mouritz Botha and Brad Barritt are the main Saffers I can remember. Don Armand, while from Zimbabwe, came through South African school, university & club rugby.

Catt, Horak, Barritt all had an English parent. Not sure about Armand. Dave Ewers similar but has English grandparents.

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Post by doctor_grey Tue Feb 08, 2022 12:07 pm

lostinwales wrote:
Rugby Fan wrote:Mike Catt, Michael Horak, Hendre Fourie, Mouritz Botha and Brad Barritt are the main Saffers I can remember. Don Armand, while from Zimbabwe, came through South African school, university & club rugby.

Catt, Horak, Barritt all had an English parent. Not sure about Armand. Dave Ewers similar but has English grandparents.
Maybe we can change the record????

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Post by lostinwales Tue Feb 08, 2022 12:27 pm

doctor_grey wrote:
lostinwales wrote:
Rugby Fan wrote:Mike Catt, Michael Horak, Hendre Fourie, Mouritz Botha and Brad Barritt are the main Saffers I can remember. Don Armand, while from Zimbabwe, came through South African school, university & club rugby.

Catt, Horak, Barritt all had an English parent. Not sure about Armand. Dave Ewers similar but has English grandparents.
Maybe we can change the record????

What we actually need is an updated team announcement so we can argue about something else

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Post by lostinwales Tue Feb 08, 2022 12:34 pm

Bang on cue. Ludlam out with a rib injury. Launchbury called up as a replacement

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Post by Gooseberry Tue Feb 08, 2022 12:35 pm

OK which uncapped South Africans could do a better job at 12/13 for England?

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Post by Gooseberry Tue Feb 08, 2022 12:37 pm

lostinwales wrote:Bang on cue. Ludlam out with a rib injury. Launchbury called up as a replacement

Actually he played for a while in SA didnt he

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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue Feb 08, 2022 12:37 pm

Well it's good to see Launchbury called up. I would suspect he moves to the bench and Lawes liekly back to blindside. After grumbling about locks when you have Itoje, Launchbury, Lawes as options and then Isiekwe who showed up well, looks rosy again.

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Post by doctor_grey Tue Feb 08, 2022 12:45 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Well it's good to see Launchbury called up. I would suspect he moves to the bench and Lawes liekly back to blindside. After grumbling about locks when you have Itoje, Launchbury, Lawes as options and then Isiekwe who showed up well, looks rosy again.
If Launchbury is healthy and playing well, then there is the bulk in the scrum. I thought Isiekwe played very well last weekend and seemed to me to be the primary lineout option. With Lawes there, I agree, this would be a very good group of lineout options (for Marler to throw to?).

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Post by lostinwales Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:01 pm

Do we know if Lawes will be fit? If he is then I assume he'd go straight back to 6.

If he isn't then I guess we could see Launchbury pairing Itoje with Isiekwe at 6

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Post by BigTrevsbigmac Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:39 pm

lostinwales wrote:Do we know if Lawes will be fit? If he is then I assume he'd go straight back to 6.

If he isn't then I guess we could see Launchbury pairing Itoje with Isiekwe at 6

Lawes is apparently ‘less than 50%’ chance of playing.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:40 pm

It was concussion for Lawes wasn't it? If so given he was deemed 50 50 for the Scotland game I'd prefer not to take a risk with something so serious.

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Post by Geordie Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:42 pm

Can we not just keep the same pack and tweak the backs a bit so its just a little more specialized.

9 Quirke
10 Smith
11 OHC
12 Atkinson
13 Slade
14 Nowell / Radwan
15 Steward

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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:46 pm

Is the full squad automatically recalled each Sunday/Monday? If not then Quirke, and Radwan ain't in it to pick.

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Post by lostinwales Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:49 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Can we not just keep the same pack and tweak the backs a bit so its just a little more specialized.

9 Quirke
10 Smith
11 OHC
12 Atkinson
13 Slade
14 Nowell / Radwan
15 Steward

Ludlam is out so we have to change the pack.

We will have to agree to disagree on the IC position. Seems to just be Atkinson by default.

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Post by miltonkeynesengland Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:52 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Can we not just keep the same pack and tweak the backs a bit so its just a little more specialized.

9 Quirke
10 Smith
11 OHC
12 Atkinson
13 Slade
14 Nowell / Radwan
15 Steward

I can only assume you've been at the Brown Ale again. (Sorry)...I would suggest of the players in that back line only 2 will be playing in the positions listed there namely Messers Smith and Steward. and I think we all know who nice Uncle Eddie will be picking in the other 5 places.

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Post by miltonkeynesengland Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:52 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Can we not just keep the same pack and tweak the backs a bit so its just a little more specialized.

9 Quirke
10 Smith
11 OHC
12 Atkinson
13 Slade
14 Nowell / Radwan
15 Steward

I can only assume you've been at the Brown Ale again. (Sorry)...I would suggest of the players in that back line only 2 will be playing in the positions listed there namely Messers Smith and Steward. and I think we all know who nice Uncle Eddie will be picking in the other 5 places.

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Post by Rugby Fan Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:54 pm

One of the most disappointing aspects of yesterday's loss is England are once again out the running for a Grand Slam. Though the Six Nations title is still possible - as we managed in 2020 - when any team goes on a run for a Grand Slam, it builds a whole narrative for the tournament, generating more excitement and coverage in that country.

I can't shake the feeling that, if we had been playing Australia with a record of one win in four games against them, Jones would have had a more hard-nosed approach to earning a win. Perhaps that's unfair, as he clearly wanted to beat South Africa last year, and still took some selection risks.

Still, losing the opening Six Nations fixture three years in a row, when you have ambitions to beat everyone, seems like evidence of poor tournament preparation.

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Post by Geordie Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:54 pm

lostinwales wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Can we not just keep the same pack and tweak the backs a bit so its just a little more specialized.

9 Quirke
10 Smith
11 OHC
12 Atkinson
13 Slade
14 Nowell / Radwan
15 Steward

Ludlam is out so we have to change the pack.

We will have to agree to disagree on the IC position. Seems to just be Atkinson by default.

Ah yes...launchbury called up for him

Atkinson, yes hardly a long term option...but the only actual 12 in the squad.


Last edited by GeordieFalcon on Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:55 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by No 7&1/2 Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:54 pm

We stand back in awe as you correctly call the exact backline milton.

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Post by miltonkeynesengland Tue Feb 08, 2022 1:59 pm

[quote="No 7&1/2"]We stand back in awe as you correctly call the exact backline milton. [/quote
Well it is Paradise Lost!
I have a dread of seeing
Youngs
Smith
Merchant
Slade
Daily
Malins
Steward

And another afternoon of us aimlessly kicking the ball away when attacking

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Post by Barney McGrew did it Tue Feb 08, 2022 2:08 pm

I think LCD needs to sit on the naughty step until he realizes what he did.

If England with all our depth can’t handle some key injuries then we’re in more trouble than I thought.

It’s an arguable thought I know but IMO until we move on to the post Manu era we’re always going to be full of excuses and disappointments. Or if he absolutely insists, then bring him on as a last 15 minute finisher only if we need the points. I’d rather give the poor guy a break (in a nice way) and let him prolong his club days.

I’m hoping Eddie isn’t turning into a Lancaster type, with the latter wanting a team full of OS flankers, and Eddie preferring a team full of OCs. Just a bit too muddled for me – keep it simple Eddie with the fat boys, the tall boys and the fast boys all in their correct places.

And another thing Eddie, here in B&I we all want to win the 6N – spending 4 years working toward the next RWC (which we usually don’t win) and seemingly not worrying too much about the 6N doesn’t quite do it for me.
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