Ireland vs Scotland

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Ireland vs Scotland

RWC 2023, Pool B

Saturday 7 October, 8pm
Stade de France, Saint-Denis

Referee: Nic Berry
Assistant Referee 1: Wayne Barnes
Assistant Referee 2: Jordan Way
TV Match Official: Brett Cronan

Ireland

15. Hugo Keenan, 14. Mack Hansen, 13. Garry Ringrose, 12. Bundee Aki, 11. James Lowe, 10. Johnny Sexton, 9. Jamison Gibson-Park

1. Andrew Porter, 2. Dan Sheehan, 3. Tadhg Furlong, 4. Tadhg Beirne, 5. Iain Henderson, 6. Peter O’Mahony, 7. Josh van der Flier, 8. Caelan Doris

Replacements:16. Ronan Kelleher, 17. David Kilcoyne, 18. Finlay Bealham, 19. James Ryan, 20. Jack Conan, 21. Conor Murray, 22. Jack Crowley, 23. Stuart McCloskey

Scotland

15. Blair Kinghorn, 14. Darcy Graham, 13. Huw Jones, 12. Sione Tuipulotu, 11. Duhan van der Merwe, 10. Finn Russell, 9. Ali Price; 1. Pierre Schoeman, 2. George Turner, 3. Zander Fagerson, 4. Richie Gray, 5. Grant Gilchrist, 6. Jamie Ritchie (capt), 7. Rory Darge, 8. Jack Dempsey.

Replacements: 16. Ewan Ashman, 17. Rory Sutherland, 18. WP Nel, 19. Scott Cummings, 20. Matt Fagerson, 21. Luke Crosbie, 22. George Horne, 23. Ollie Smith.

Tramptastic wrote:

EST wrote:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67024241

Anyone seen this? Have to say I think that whatever confidence they are trying to portray/engender within the camp this type of talk in the media is mind-bendingly stupid, we are not exactly coming at this with a track record which backs up that statement and they've just handed Farrells team talk to him on a plate.   

Sometimes I don't think our boys are that smart.

I get that but then isn't that just our cultural nihilism coming in to the mix? "dont celebrate ourselves cause it'll just go wrong!". The guys have to believe they can beat Ireland otherwise whats the point?

I totally agree that the guys need to believe they can win, and by all means talk about that in camp - actually saying they will win in such categorical terms at a press conference, when we haven't beaten them in the last 8, just creates a rod for our own back and added pressure I don't think we need. Watch Sexton rain down bombs on Kinghorn all day long.

Collapse2005 wrote:Scotland fans, I wonder what the mood in Scotland would be if Scotland beat Ireland by a point but go out?

If we beat the no1 ranked team in the world by 1point in a hard fought, nail bitingly close game and exit the tournament then there will be a sense of pride inboth the result and the performance. There will also be anger and frustration about our failure to show up for the Boks match.

The real question is how would we feel if we beat you by 6 points.

Collapse2005 wrote:Scotland fans, I wonder what the mood in Scotland would be if Scotland beat Ireland by a point but go out?

I think i would feel ok about it. Like being stuck in a pool with no1 in the world and the current title holders... cards stacked against us etc. Taking a win against the world no1 and still going out proves the scale of the challenge the Scotland team faced.

If however they get brutally done in and dont pull the trigger at all then it'd be shades of japan 2019 again. Soul searching to be done etc.

I wish we were in Englands pool...

jimbopip wrote:

Collapse2005 wrote:Scotland fans, I wonder what the mood in Scotland would be if Scotland beat Ireland by a point but go out?

If we beat the no1 ranked team in the world by 1point in a hard fought, nail bitingly close game and exit the tournament then there will be a sense of pride inboth the result and the performance. There will also be anger and frustration about our failure to show up for the Boks match.

The real question is how would we feel if we beat you by 6 points.

Dinni. I just went in to a spiral reading your real question... "hello darkness, my old friend".

Two of my favourite motivational phrases originate in Oz; "Have a go, ya mug" and "Don't die wondering".

Mbawza has been telling the world that Scotland won't die wondering tomorrow. Fair enough. If we really have a go, get stuck right into them, trust our abilities and leave nothing out there...there's no shame in not making the knock out rounds. The only regrets would be if, as Tramp said, we have another Japan 2019.

So, let's just hope there are no typhoons lurking off Galway bay.

jimbopip wrote:Two of my favourite motivational phrases originate in Oz; "Have a go, ya mug" and "Don't die wondering".

Mbawza has been telling the world that Scotland won't die wondering tomorrow. Fair enough. If we really have a go, get stuck right into them, trust our abilities and leave nothing out there...there's no shame in not making the knock out rounds. The only regrets would be if, as Tramp said, we have another Japan 2019.

So, let's just hope there are no typhoons lurking off Galway bay.

We know Dodson will read that and threaten to sue the Irish government, FFR, World Rugby and the met office.

EST wrote:

Tramptastic wrote:

EST wrote:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67024241

Anyone seen this? Have to say I think that whatever confidence they are trying to portray/engender within the camp this type of talk in the media is mind-bendingly stupid, we are not exactly coming at this with a track record which backs up that statement and they've just handed Farrells team talk to him on a plate.   

Sometimes I don't think our boys are that smart.

I get that but then isn't that just our cultural nihilism coming in to the mix? "dont celebrate ourselves cause it'll just go wrong!". The guys have to believe they can beat Ireland otherwise whats the point?

I totally agree that the guys need to believe they can win, and by all means talk about that in camp - actually saying they will win in such categorical terms at a press conference, when we haven't beaten them in the last 8, just creates a rod for our own back and added pressure I don't think we need. Watch Sexton rain down bombs on Kinghorn all day long.

Genuinely not sure Kinghorn saying literally anything in a press conference would add any more pressure to what is essentially a knock out game, against the top ranked team in the world at a world cup.

I agree with the others that they have to go out believing they can and will win this game, even if the majority of us think otherwise.

If Kinghorn was asked the question, to keep that mindset he probably has to answer in the positive, because to say anything else allows doubt to creep in.

EST wrote:

Tramptastic wrote:

EST wrote:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67024241

Anyone seen this? Have to say I think that whatever confidence they are trying to portray/engender within the camp this type of talk in the media is mind-bendingly stupid, we are not exactly coming at this with a track record which backs up that statement and they've just handed Farrells team talk to him on a plate.   

Sometimes I don't think our boys are that smart.

I get that but then isn't that just our cultural nihilism coming in to the mix? "dont celebrate ourselves cause it'll just go wrong!". The guys have to believe they can beat Ireland otherwise whats the point?

I totally agree that the guys need to believe they can win, and by all means talk about that in camp - actually saying they will win in such categorical terms at a press conference, when we haven't beaten them in the last 8, just creates a rod for our own back and added pressure I don't think we need. Watch Sexton rain down bombs on Kinghorn all day long.

Would you prefer him to say "Ah we've no chance but we'll end up finishing 3rd in the pool which is what we expected?"

Oakdene wrote:

EST wrote:

Tramptastic wrote:

EST wrote:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/67024241

Anyone seen this? Have to say I think that whatever confidence they are trying to portray/engender within the camp this type of talk in the media is mind-bendingly stupid, we are not exactly coming at this with a track record which backs up that statement and they've just handed Farrells team talk to him on a plate.   

Sometimes I don't think our boys are that smart.

I get that but then isn't that just our cultural nihilism coming in to the mix? "dont celebrate ourselves cause it'll just go wrong!". The guys have to believe they can beat Ireland otherwise whats the point?

I totally agree that the guys need to believe they can win, and by all means talk about that in camp - actually saying they will win in such categorical terms at a press conference, when we haven't beaten them in the last 8, just creates a rod for our own back and added pressure I don't think we need. Watch Sexton rain down bombs on Kinghorn all day long.

Would you prefer him to say "Ah we've no chance but we'll end up finishing 3rd in the pool which is what we expected?"

I'd prefer him to say something like 'The Irish are on a great run of form, it will be a tough contest but we believe we can beat them'. Not 'They have been on a good run of form recently, but we'll end that on Saturday'. Que Farrell posting that up on the team wall before kick off and adding more fuel to the fire - we've got enough to deal without giving them another incentive.

Nah man, the Irish don't use fuel for the fire. Those guys have an internal motivation that is unreal. The best sides produce it and whereas previous Irish sides would use the seige mentality, everyone against us motivation, the current set up seem absolutely, ruthlessly focused on themselves.

Somebody might mention it to them in passing and i expect they will shrug their shoulders and move on.

Have to agree to disagree on this one.  I agree they have more than enough internal motivation to put in a performance, but I don't buy that if Peter O'Mahony reads that it doesn't have an effect.

Most of these guys have a 90%+ win rate against Scotland, we would be wise to do our talking on the pitch.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6c/Ladri_di_biciclette_%28film%29.jpg/253px-Ladri_di_biciclette_%28film%29.jpg

O'Mahony and dan Sheehan getting ready for the captain's run.

I wonder if the pressure might make Ireland tighten up just a bit.

The first 2 games were relatively easy, the 3rd game was a bit of a free pass because it was a very tough game sure but if they won they still had to beat Scotland to go through and if they lost they had to beat Scotland to go through so didn't make much difference table wise.  

I wonder now this weekend with all the pressure piled on them to win it will it potentially make them tighten up and play more restricted than they usually do.  This is a very pressurised thing for them, everything they have accomplished so far, beating South Africa, winning a test series in New Zealand, the grand slam, the 16 games unbeaten, the world number 1 status has all led to this world cup and a loss tomorrow despite all that and they most likely would be out of the tournament.  The chokers tag would get thrown about again etc

If it does cause them to tighten up that could be a real big in for Scotland and they could play on it, they really have very little to lose tomorrow.  They might as well go throw everything they have at it.  They are the underdogs and people would expect Ireland to win so go out there and play free and put in everything. If you lose but put up a good perforamance people can't really criticise you for a game where you played well v the worlds number one side or for not getting out of a group with 2 of the best teams in the world in it.  On the other hand if you win you have pulled off something huge, a real mark for your career and you make the knockout's.

It's a very interesting dynamic.

For me as a Scotland fan there has been an air of inevitability about this for years. All building up to this moment. Yes we have a chance but its a slim one. Where is the Ireland weakness to attack? Ermmmmmmmmm. Where in the matchups are Scotland better? Back 3 by one of Duhans a bawhairs?

The key points. Can Scotlands pack get us enough of the ball in decent field position? Can Finn find enough space to put the back 3 away?

Who will win the battle of the handbags between Mbwaza and POM?

How would I feel?

Gutted but not surprised.

Would be the typical Scotland glorious defeat. Sure we won the game but means nothing as we’re out.

Of curse what is actually likely to happen is ireland suffocate us and win comfortably controlling the game

I'd take us winning in glorious defeat than absolute abysmal defeat like years gone by. Let's be honest chaps, we're not getting through barring a very unlikely significant win. If we scrape past the best team in the world by one point and they go on to win the WC I'd not be too unhappy.

If we were against England or Wales however...

I'd bite your hand off for a 1 point win. We've been saying for years that we need to work out how to take the next step and beat the top teams instead of glorious failure. The fact that we need 8 points is just a function of many other factors, some outside of our control.

Beating this Ireland team by any margin would be one of the greatest wins in the professional era for Scotland.

Tramptastic wrote:Nah man, the Irish don't use fuel for the fire. Those guys have an internal motivation that is unreal. The best sides produce it and whereas previous Irish sides would use the seige mentality, everyone against us motivation, the current set up seem absolutely, ruthlessly focused on themselves.

Somebody might mention it to them in passing and i expect they will shrug their shoulders and move on.

POM needs no extra motivation against the Scots / Glasgow lads. Nothing anyone in the scots camp says will make the slightest difference.

No issues with Kinghorns confidence, he is a top player.

Score predictions? I got Ireland by 15. 25-10

Greetings from Hobart Tasmania! My folks are over in Australia from the UK right now and are having a great time, albeit pretty overwhelmed as previous to this they've never left Europe. Tasmania is probably the closest thing to Scotland as you could get which is ironic as it's almost as far away from Scotland as you can get.

Me and my old man are getting up at 6am tomorrow to watch the game which will either be an iconic moment in our lives or a massive letdown and disappointed which has plagued our rugby loving lives. Either way there will be an absolute epic sunrise view from our hotel over Hobart harbour, which those who are on my socials will have the opportunity to like later on.

'mon Scotland!

Would love to go there, heard its beautiful.

RDW wrote:Greetings from Hobart Tasmania! My folks are over in Australia from the UK right now and are having a great time, albeit pretty overwhelmed as previous to this they've never left Europe. Tasmania is probably the closest thing to Scotland as you could get which is ironic as it's almost as far away from Scotland as you can get.

Me and my old man are getting up at 6am tomorrow to watch the game which will either be an iconic moment in our lives or a massive letdown and disappointed which has plagued our rugby loving lives. Either way there will be an absolute epic sunrise view from our hotel over Hobart harbour, which those who are on my socials will have the opportunity to like later on.

'mon Scotland!

So, to translate for those who don't do subtexts;

I'm in a better version of Scotland, unlike you lot
my dad loves me, I'll leave that there,
I can afford to stay in hotels with windows, I'm not Glaswegian
I won't be that upset whatever the result.

Have fun Flounder. I'm not welljell. No not at all.

jimbopip wrote:

RDW wrote:Greetings from Hobart Tasmania! My folks are over in Australia from the UK right now and are having a great time, albeit pretty overwhelmed as previous to this they've never left Europe. Tasmania is probably the closest thing to Scotland as you could get which is ironic as it's almost as far away from Scotland as you can get.

Me and my old man are getting up at 6am tomorrow to watch the game which will either be an iconic moment in our lives or a massive letdown and disappointed which has plagued our rugby loving lives. Either way there will be an absolute epic sunrise view from our hotel over Hobart harbour, which those who are on my socials will have the opportunity to like later on.

'mon Scotland!

So, to translate for those who don't do subtexts;

I'm in a better version of Scotland, unlike you lot
my dad loves me, I'll leave that there,
I can afford to stay in hotels with windows, I'm not Glaswegian
I won't be that upset whatever the result.  

Have fun Flounder. I'm not welljell. No not at all.

Ha I'll give you 4/4!

I’ve been to dfs to buy a second sofa to hide behind as one just won’t cut it

Look. Let’s be honest here. We’re going to get thumped. Good old fashioned Scottish pessimism resigning myself to group stage exit yet again. Then if the highly improbable happens it’ll be a nice wee bonus

My other thinking is Ireland genuinely have a shot at winning the final if they get there. Would we not be a bit mean to our cousins to hoy them out the cup at this stage only for us to go to the quarter finals and get hoy’ed out ourselves. We all know we can’t pull off two good performances back to back

tigertattie wrote:I’ve been to dfs to buy a second sofa to hide behind as one just won’t cut it

Look. Let’s be honest here. We’re going to get thumped. Good old fashioned Scottish pessimism resigning myself to group stage exit yet again. Then if the highly improbable happens it’ll be a nice wee bonus

My other thinking is Ireland genuinely have a shot at winning the final if they get there. Would we not be a bit mean to our cousins to hoy them out the cup at this stage only for us to go to the quarter finals and get hoy’ed out ourselves.  We all know we can’t pull off two good performances back to back

And the Oscar for Understatement Of The Year goes to....

Not sure if I want 8pm to hurry up or never arrive .

I know we can win, I'm sure we will win. But in equal measures I know Scotland are capable of kicking us square in the Jewels and running away with the game.

But regardless of the result one thing will remain true. I absolutely love the Scottish threads on this board. The almost incomprehensible nicknames for your players, the dark gallows humour and the blind optimistic pessimism you have for every game.
Long may it continue.

Good luck gents, I'm going to start drinking now, think It's the only way I will make it to KO

Whose feccin threads has the Heartfelt Basoon being reading?

jimbopip wrote:Whose feccin threads has the Heartfelt Basoon being reading?

Who you calling a bassoon?

tigertattie wrote:

jimbopip wrote:Whose feccin threads has the Heartfelt Basoon being reading?

Who you calling a bassoon?

Been called a lot worse

Oh gawd!! I don't want to cheer Samoa/knock Engurlund in case instant karma malkies me later on.

Samoa hard done by there. Every time I cheer I sense another Ireland try.

jimbopip wrote:Samoa hard done by there. Every time I cheer I sense another Ireland try.

Well bloody stop doing it then

I don’t like this. Not at all

I think I almost prefer the days where we knew we were going to be spanked and could mentally prepare.

This hope thing is bloody disconcerting

Well I have taken care of my nerves by spending the day on a Greek beach, which is still surprisingly pleasant in October, the water being warmer than my usual swimming venue of the North Sea at the height of summer!

Driving back into Thessaloniki in the rush hour certainly got the nerves jangling s bit though.

Currently sitting in the Dubliner Irish pub in Thessaloniki waiting for ko. Mythos, the local brew is a pleasing 5 euros a pint here as well, which is about half what I spent last spring in Dublin!

It should be a great game and I can't wait. Just wanted to ssy good luck to both teams, though a little bit more to Scotland would not go amis!

Tiger, we're oot. The Samoan glorious defeat was a little taster. What sticks in my craw though is the utterly dross that both Engerlund and Wales have served up and they won. And are in the quarters.
Fecc me it's crazy Ted, crazy so it is.

Tasmania! Thessalonika!
Am I the only patriot watching in...Essex, oh. Never mind.

They are showing the match on RTE (unsurprisingly in an Irish pub!)

When I saw Matt William as the pundit, I was very glad we can't hear the sound!

BigGee wrote:Well I have taken care of my nerves by spending the day on a Greek beach, which is still surprisingly pleasant in October, the water being warmer than my usual swimming venue of the North Sea at the height of summer!

Driving back into Thessaloniki in the rush hour certainly got the nerves jangling s bit though.

Currently sitting in the Dubliner Irish pub in Thessaloniki waiting for ko. Mythos, the local brew is a pleasing 5 euros a pint here as well, which is about half what I spent last spring in Dublin!

It should be a great game and I can't wait. Just wanted to ssy good luck to both teams, though a little bit more to Scotland would not go amis!

You must have got the friends and family discount in Dublin out of respect for being a celtic cousin.  If you're English it's twice that again, if you're American.  Well just leave the card there on the counter sir, we'll take care of it.

jimbopip wrote:Tiger, we're oot.  The Samoan glorious defeat was a little taster. What sticks in my craw though is the utterly dross that both Engerlund and Wales have served up and they won. And are in the quarters.
Fecc me it's crazy Ted, crazy so it is.

It’s fecked up Jimmy boy. One of England or wales is likely to be in the final. Absurd

They’ll get utterly humped. But it’s still absurd

neilthom7 wrote:

BigGee wrote:Well I have taken care of my nerves by spending the day on a Greek beach, which is still surprisingly pleasant in October, the water being warmer than my usual swimming venue of the North Sea at the height of summer!

Driving back into Thessaloniki in the rush hour certainly got the nerves jangling s bit though.

Currently sitting in the Dubliner Irish pub in Thessaloniki waiting for ko. Mythos, the local brew is a pleasing 5 euros a pint here as well, which is about half what I spent last spring in Dublin!

It should be a great game and I can't wait. Just wanted to ssy good luck to both teams, though a little bit more to Scotland would not go amis!

You must have got the friends and family discount in Dublin out of respect for being a celtic cousin.  If you're English it's twice that again, if you're American.  Well just leave the card there on the counter sir, we'll take care of it.

Dublin has many charms, beer orices are not one of them

Pete330v2 wrote:SCOTLAND ARE GOING DOOOOOOOOOOON !!!!

Like Chinatoon.

Oh for fluff’s sake. Can we not just fast forward to the result and put everyone out of their misery.

BigGee wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:

BigGee wrote:Well I have taken care of my nerves by spending the day on a Greek beach, which is still surprisingly pleasant in October, the water being warmer than my usual swimming venue of the North Sea at the height of summer!

Driving back into Thessaloniki in the rush hour certainly got the nerves jangling s bit though.

Currently sitting in the Dubliner Irish pub in Thessaloniki waiting for ko. Mythos, the local brew is a pleasing 5 euros a pint here as well, which is about half what I spent last spring in Dublin!

It should be a great game and I can't wait. Just wanted to ssy good luck to both teams, though a little bit more to Scotland would not go amis!

You must have got the friends and family discount in Dublin out of respect for being a celtic cousin.  If you're English it's twice that again, if you're American.  Well just leave the card there on the counter sir, we'll take care of it.

Dublin has many charms, beer orices are not one of them

Hotel prices aren't either, I'd have been safer doing the same as you lot and jetting off somewhere the last time I booked one down there. I still wake up in sweats thinking about it at times

I’m sat behind both sofas. Can someone bring me a drink a packet of crisps please?

tigertattie wrote:I’m sat behind both sofas. Can someone bring me a drink a packet of crisps please?

I was here first. You go

That was obstruction by Bierne

Morning, crap start!

tigertattie wrote:I’m sat behind both sofas. Can someone bring me a drink a packet of crisps please?

Two pints of lager, is it?