Italy vs Scotland | Cuttitta Cup

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Italy vs Scotland | Cuttitta Cup
In memory of Massimo Cuttitta

Date: Saturday 9th March 2024
Venue: Stadio Olimpico, Rome
Kick-off: 2:15pm (GMT)
Referee: Angus Gardner (Australia)
TV Coverage: Live on ITV (UK) and Virgin Media (ROI)

Teams

Italy
15 Ange Capuozzo, 14 Louis Lynagh, 13 Juan Ignacio Brex, 12 Tommaso Menoncello, 11 Monty Ioane, 10 Paolo Garbisi, 9 Martin Page-Relo, 8 Ross Vintcent, 7 Michele Lamaro (c), 6 Sebastian Negri, 5 Federico Ruzza, 4 Niccolò Cannone, 3 Simone Ferrari, 2 Giacomo Nicotera, 1 Danilo Fischetti

Replacements: 16 Gianmarco Lucchesi, 17 Spanish Mirco, 18 Giosuè Zilocchi, 19 Andrea Zambonin, 20 Lorenzo Cannone, 21 Stephen Varney, 22 Leonardo Marin, 23 Federico Mori

Scotland
15 Blair Kinghorn, 14 Kyle Steyn, 13 Huw Jones, 12 Cameron Redpath, 11 Duhan van der Merwe, 10 Finn Russell (cc), 9 George Horne, 8 Jack Dempsey, 7 Rory Darge (cc), 6 Andy Christie, 5 Scott Cummings, 4 Grant Gilchrist, 3 Zander Fagerson, 2 George Turner, 1 Pierre Schoeman

Replacements: 16 Ewan Ashman, 17 Alec Hepburn, 18 Elliot Millar-Mills, 19 Sam Skinner, 20 Jamie Ritchie, 21 Matt Fagerson, 22 Ali Price, 23 Kyle Rowe

Heaf wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:At least I can now support Ireland now.

Careful, they might think you're a jinx

Can you support Ireland next week too?

WTF Scotland. WT actual F.

Just read this which I'm guessing well sums up the mood

https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/68525291

Question is - is this a coaching problem or player problem? To have one second have collapse is bad. To do it twice shows a systematic problem.

It's sh!te being Scottish sometimes it really is!

RDW wrote:WTF Scotland. WT actual F.

Just read this which I'm guessing well sums up the mood

https://www.bbc.com/sport/rugby-union/68525291

Question is - is this a coaching problem or player problem? To have one second have collapse is bad. To do it twice shows a systematic problem.

It's sh!te being Scottish sometimes it really is!

Bit of both. Toonie lost the changing room so tried to appeal to it by giving the power back to the players. As the been article says it's down to a woeful lack of leadership that ultimately falls on the coaches.

We all knew Toonie should have gone after the WC, in my opinion should've after 2019's flop but I was definitely in the minority then. I know we've not got many options but we have to get our ship in order if we want to ever win anything. Without being dramatic this may well be our last chance ever.

ITV really are elite with their camera angles.

king_carlos wrote:

ITV really are elite with their camera angles.

Open the door for I am a bogus gas man!

It is worth noting that Italy scored a record number of points (for them) against England and a narrow loss of three points. Ok, got hammered by Ireland. Drew with France, should have won. Before edging out Scotland at home. Italy are playing well this 6N, they might even start as favourites Vs Wales next weekend. Losing to them isn't the aberration it might have been previously.

formerly known as Sam wrote:It is worth noting that Italy scored a record number of points (for them) against England and a narrow loss of three points. Ok, got hammered by Ireland. Drew with France, should have won. Before edging out Scotland at home. Italy are playing well this 6N, they might even start as favourites Vs Wales next weekend. Losing to them isn't the aberration it might have been previously.

Agreed, but once again we've been found wanting after managing to get a lead. It's all direction less stuff from Scotland at the moment, the two victories we've had we nearly lost one by letting them back in and the other England were utterly woeful for 65 minutes.

formerly known as Sam wrote:It is worth noting that Italy scored a record number of points (for them) against England and a narrow loss of three points. Ok, got hammered by Ireland. Drew with France, should have won. Before edging out Scotland at home. Italy are playing well this 6N, they might even start as favourites Vs Wales next weekend. Losing to them isn't the aberration it might have been previously.

The fact that we lost to Italy isn't a huge upset or anything to be ashamed of. It's the manner of defeat and especially given we were apparently a team who has learnt their lessons and in genuine contention for the title - if that was the case we shouldn't be losing to Italy.

Agree that as long as this isn't another false dawn for Italy, these wins may no longer be a shock. It does feel like Italy are where Scotland were 8-9 years ago and are about to have their golden generation.

NeilyBroon wrote:

king_carlos wrote:

ITV really are elite with their camera angles.

Open the door for I am a bogus gas man!

Choose life. Choose Picantes chips, cheese and curry sauce. Choose battling with your coach. Choose middle aged blokes fighting to get onto a tram. Choose so many busking bagpipers you can't hear your mates. Choose Rose Street pubs because you just seem to end up there.

NeilyBroon wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:It is worth noting that Italy scored a record number of points (for them) against England and a narrow loss of three points. Ok, got hammered by Ireland. Drew with France, should have won. Before edging out Scotland at home. Italy are playing well this 6N, they might even start as favourites Vs Wales next weekend. Losing to them isn't the aberration it might have been previously.

Agreed, but once again we've been found wanting after managing to get a lead. It's all direction less stuff from Scotland at the moment, the two victories we've had we nearly lost one by letting them back in and the other England were utterly woeful for 65 minutes.

I get that, but still Scotland could (should?) have all 4 wins and be fighting to hold off one-loss Ireland next week.

doctor_grey wrote:

NeilyBroon wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:It is worth noting that Italy scored a record number of points (for them) against England and a narrow loss of three points. Ok, got hammered by Ireland. Drew with France, should have won. Before edging out Scotland at home. Italy are playing well this 6N, they might even start as favourites Vs Wales next weekend. Losing to them isn't the aberration it might have been previously.

Agreed, but once again we've been found wanting after managing to get a lead. It's all direction less stuff from Scotland at the moment, the two victories we've had we nearly lost one by letting them back in and the other England were utterly woeful for 65 minutes.

I get that, but still Scotland could (should?) have all 4 wins and be fighting to hold off one-loss Ireland next week.

Exactly, which is a recurring theme under Toonie. He just doesn't prepare the players well for any games other than England. Look at the France and Wales games. We should be past the point of nearly there, he's been head coach for 7 years. Cotter took us from spoon to winning 3 games, a rwc quarter final (nearly a semi) in half the time it's taken Toonie to get us from 4th to 3rd, still only winning 3 games, and two pool stage drop outs with arguably more talent at his disposal.

Since he was Andy Robinson's assistant I was never convinced by Toonie. He strikes me as Scotland's unsuccessful brother to Clive Woodward, essentially a manager but not a leader and a poor one at that, especially given the groundwork to get the national team up to competitiveness.

Both games yesterday consolidated my view that under this management, Scotland is simply never going to win the Six Nations. I have no doubt that St Shug is correct and players like Townsend as a manager. But that doesn't mean that his coaching will lead to Scotland driving pressurised games to winning conclusions through sensible decision making. It's a position oft stated by experts but worth repeating - Ireland got to no. 1 in the world by being able to problem solve as the game progressed, in real time. We apparently cannot do that.

To deny this is a coaching problem seems fairly desperate at this stage. If someone tells you that you have something on your face, it's not particularly wise to immediately reply "no, I haven't".

It's easy to romanticise what other coaches may or may not have done (the 'substitutes bench' problem) but it's hard to think that Vern Cotter wouldn't have swapped out his leadership team by now. To ship huge swathes of unanswered points and turn on penalties like a tap is a psychological problem - a collapse is a collapse and it has happened time and time again.

To Sam's point, losing to a very good Italian side at home is not a disgrace but the manner in which they did absolutely is. You can only choose from the player pool that you have but it's very hard to know what to do about this. Come back David Sole and lace those boots up, son.

Incidentally, if Scotland really does have a sports psychologist working with them, whatever they're doing categorically isn't working.

Not posting on the the Welsh thread to keep the peace

Can someone, maybe someone who understands “the laws” explain why wales can score a try when one of their players runs into the French defender who tried to tackle the the Welsh attacker while we get a try chalked off when shoe runs into an Italian player that wouldn’t even be able to touch our attacker????

Not a wum. Genuinely confused by the difference