Wales

First topic message reminder :

We're actually going to win the world cup. I'm not even joking.

"and if you think that the scraped win against Australia (and Wales' scraped loss against SA) will count for anything on Saturday, you're sadly mistaken...."
miaow


Posts: 249
Join date: 2011-03-31

What is a scraped loss??

You are sadly misguided if you think that a couple of cold baths in a Polish Gulag will win you a WC. Where do you get the idea that Wales are fitter than anyone else? If you are trying to make out that Ireland will wilt in the face of these new Welsh supermen you are certainly grabbing at straws.

As I mentioned, I would have thought that the best indicator of current form would be a team's last competitive outing.

A 15-6 point win is not scraping home. It is a comprehensive victory. Being unable to close out games is a serious handicap, especially at this level.

Whether you can see that or not is of no concern to me.

Whatever way the game goes, someone has to go to the semi-final. I am giving my reasons for why I think it will be Ireland.

mankiaow wrote:
You are sadly misguided if you think that a couple of cold baths in a Polish Gulag will win you a WC.

roddersm wrote:

mankiaow wrote:
You are sadly misguided if you think that a couple of cold baths in a Polish Gulag will win you a WC.

I would think it must have been very refreshing indeed.

The England warm up games showed that Wales were much fitter than their opponents. I'd suggest that Wales were also fitter than SA, and are likely to be against Ireland, however, as the SA game proves, fitness is a useless attribute if it results in a loss; SA may have been blowing harder than Wales, but they still nicked the try and closed out the game in the last ten minutes by choking Wales of the ball. No superior fitness would be able to turn over the ball when SA were securing it and stifling it as well as they did in those last ten minutes.

But I still think it's fair to say Wales are one of, if not the, fittest team in the torunament. Might not mean much, might not mean anything, but that's just how it is.

miaow wrote:The England warm up games showed that Wales were much fitter than their opponents. I'd suggest that Wales were also fitter than SA, and are likely to be against Ireland, however, as the SA game proves, fitness is a useless attribute if it results in a loss; SA may have been blowing harder than Wales, but they still nicked the try and closed out the game in the last ten minutes by choking Wales of the ball. No superior fitness would be able to turn over the ball when SA were securing it and stifling it as well as they did in those last ten minutes.

But I still think it's fair to say Wales are one of, if not the, fittest team in the torunament. Might not mean much, might not mean anything, but that's just how it is.

Fittest team my arse. they are all professionals.

miaow wrote:

But I still think it's fair to say Wales are one of, if not the, fittest team in the torunament. Might not mean much, might not mean anything, but that's just how it is.

What reason do you have for saying this.In the S.A. game you went ahead and then S.A. upped the tempo and score a try to retake the lead,they then closed out the game efficiently.S.A. finished the game stronger and it looked to me that even if Wales had got a drop goal or penalty S.A. would have had the ability to go up the other end and retake the lead again.

Wales have been going on about how fit they are compared to everyone else since the Lions when someone said the Welsh guys needed bigger suits than all the other players yet they've never showed it in any game that really mattered.

miaow wrote:The England warm up games showed that Wales were much fitter than their opponents.

How does Wales playing England twice in RWC warm up game show they are fitter than all their opponents?

roddersm wrote:

miaow wrote:The England warm up games showed that Wales were much fitter than their opponents.

How does Wales playing England twice in RWC warm up game show they are fitter than all their opponents?

Good point - they also lost one of those games.

The apparently fitter (and apparently therefore better) Welsh team lost to England who are by all accounts terrible right now.

Sorry Miaow, but you can't have take the fact that we're fitter than we were to mean that we're fitter than others are.

biltongbek wrote:I often wonder how does one measure fitness before a match, or rather suggest that one team is fitter than another. This is professional rugby, all teams are fit.

Granted wales feels that this has been their best prepration ever before a RWC, but how does one suggest one team will be fitter than another?

He has the stats to prove it BB.

Wales traditionally had issues with fitness. the Polish camps took them to another level and clealry his conditioning coaches have the numbers to prove that they are fitter than ever, not sure if Gatts is claiming they are fitter than other teams is he? Just that they are fitter than ever before.

Well we're asking miaow why he thinks Wales are fitter than everyone else.I think you've nailed it,Gatland has said that Wales are fitter than they've ever been and a few people seem to think that means they're fitter than everybody else.

Gatts I accept a team manager can prepare his team better, but I don't buy the fact that one team can boast being fitter than another, until it is actually proven

Jesus some people do nothing all day but nitpick.Does it really matter if some posters think that Wales are fitter than others.

biltongbek wrote:Gatts I accept a team manager can prepare his team better, but I don't buy the fact that one team can boast being fitter than another, until it is actually proven

I wonder if we know anyone who can produce those comparative stats for us....

It is a shame Gatts, I can't think of anyone

biltongbek wrote:It is a shame Gatts, I can't think of anyone

Well if you can't do it then I would suggest that the stats do not exist, that it cannot be proved Wales are not fitter than any other side and that we can all move on.

Next!!

Gatts wrote:

biltongbek wrote:Gatts I accept a team manager can prepare his team better, but I don't buy the fact that one team can boast being fitter than another, until it is actually proven

I wonder if we know anyone who can produce those comparative stats for us....

Brynmor Williams.... he's got an amazing telly.

Still feeling positive about the Bokke?

I won't say confident, to be honest I am in a state of denial really, I have been talking crap on other team's threads just so I don't have to think about our game

I like Wales 100% more when that dirty scumbag Byrne is not playing !

denial about what, bakkies and steyn huge losses but you are still very strong...i remain confident about SA. Really don't know why but there it is.

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:I like Wales 100% more when that dirty scumbag Byrne is not playing !

explain?

Yeah, i would like to know too, i like byrne, in fact i am quite shocked that he isn't in the 22.

Im not shocked hes not in the 22, as a bench option Hook and Scott Williams both cover more positions. I think it must have been a tight call to pick Halfpenny over Byrne but hes more accurate with his kick return than Byrne is these days, hes safe under the high ball and hes a better attacking option. Whether his positioning sense is top drawer I guess we find out on Saturday.

I do think Gatlands picked a team that is going to try and run Ireland off the park. I cant see Shane or Georgie doing anything but taking it up. In fact outside of Priestland and Halfpenny Wales dont have a kicking game. That could be a real weakness in tyeh wet.

Weather forecast in Wellington is good for Saturday

I hope it stays like that!

steven where are you?? hope they dont come to regret leaving you out of this one

I have never said they were fitter than everyone else. But they are one of the fittest teams in the tournament, and, hopefully, you wathed the game and how superior fitness can win you games; it means players get away from the tackle area quicker, concede fewer penalties, and don't make errors as concentration levels are not hindered by tiredness. Wales made 4 errors all game.

We're going to win the world cup. Again, it's embarrassing to see bitter posters on here trying to drag down the sole British and Irish team left in the competition. Inevitable, but still disappointing...

Confidence miaow...
Still the winners of 5 titles to play on the other side so early days yet.
Wales have done brilliantly and look the real mccoy.
They will need to dig much deeper over the next two weeks ad will we all.
One things for sure wales winning this will sure be a revelation and brilliant for the game.
Good luck

Draigoch wrote:

AlynDavies wrote:No we wont this is Wales we are talking about, next week is a 50/50 game against Ireland, and after that it will be a 50/50 semi final against france or england, and after that a 99/1 game against new zealand so no we wont win it.
We can however be very proud, all we asked is to compete with south africa and try not to lose to the island teams, we have done far far more than any welsh fan had dreamed of. We can be very proud.

Sorry mate, but I'm fed of this balls. For too long we praise mediocrity and have suffered for it. I'm not saying we will do anything, but we have to at least frickin try.

+1 mate absolutely agree. For ages now weve been getting excited over 'nearly lossed' to the southern hemisphere teams. We've now proved we ARE on a par with them after the SA game so why can't we actually believe?!? we've been waiting long enough for something to be excited about.

Also we've just seen hpw hard the Argentinians pushed a Carterless NZ.. they are more than beatable!!!!!

miaow wrote:I have never said they were fitter than everyone else. But they are one of the fittest teams in the tournament, and, hopefully, you wathed the game and how superior fitness can win you games; it means players get away from the tackle area quicker, concede fewer penalties, and don't make errors as concentration levels are not hindered by tiredness. Wales made 4 errors all game.

We're going to win the world cup. Again, it's embarrassing to see bitter posters on here trying to drag down the sole British and Irish team left in the competition. Inevitable, but still disappointing...

By saying they are one of the fittest teams in the tournament you are saying they are fitter than most of the other teams,how do you come to this conclusion?

It wasn't fitness that won the game,you were no fitter than Ireland.Wales conceded the same amount of penalties and 2 of our penalties were for not binding at the scrum,thats a technique problem not a fitness one.The difference was when you had the ball your backs were incisive and made your chances count,for all the possession and territory Ireland had they didn't have the pace and power in the backs to make this count.

going to have to disagree with you there shoulder, the last 15 mins showed that Wales were fitter, where Ireland ahd to ring the changes and get fresh legs on the field. Wales only made 2 substitutions and that was purely down to injury concerns. Being able to last the full 80mins without having to change your team apart from it being focred on you is incredible.

Fitness is not just about being able to run all over the pitch for 80 min it's also being mentally fit enough to stay alert during the later stages of the match.
Soft tries are scored because the opposition is not concentrating on the job in hand.

one game at a time.

That's all that the welsh camp need to focus on... who they are playing next.

rugbydreamer wrote:going to have to disagree with you there shoulder, the last 15 mins showed that Wales were fitter, where Ireland ahd to ring the changes and get fresh legs on the field. Wales only made 2 substitutions and that was purely down to injury concerns. Being able to last the full 80mins without having to change your team apart from it being focred on you is incredible.

Well a coach is always going to make subs to try something different when his team is chasing a game,it doesn't mean his players aren't fit enough.The team thats playing better always looks fitter but I guarantee that when these lads get back to their clubs and are playing against Leinster or Munster it'll look different.It won't be because Leinster and Munster are fitter it's because the better team always make things look easier.

we'll have to agree to disagree

rugbydreamer im going to agree with you this time. Think your stealing my thunder though agreeing to disagree with people

Yeah I suppose so,it's impossible to prove but let me put it this way Leinster beat Clermont at home in the Heineken Cup before Christmas.We were the better team all the way and only made subs at the end of the game to give guys a run.We didn't say we were a fitter team than then we just played a lot better on the day and it looked like that.

Reading an article in Muscle and fitness June 2011 edition a sports fitness guru had an article on how his trade works,
His name slips my mind but he was a guru for Man Utd among numerous other top professional sports people and currently involved with the British Olympic Weight Lifting team,
He has 3 sons one is a product of Man Utd youth and has played a few times for them,
One is going to represent GB in the 2012 Olympic weight-Lifting
and the other is a Power-Lifter who looks set to become a serious force.

His gym in Cheshire had 3 floors weights, fitness and conditioning.

He spoke in depth on how an athlete can hit certain strength levels and fitness levels with the rest of his competitors coming in at a similar level,
but the conditioning on explosive strength can give an advantage but foremost the mental edge and concentration levels will ultimately win you medals.

He had a touch pad machine on the floor 8ft x 8ft a pad in each corner and one in the centre you must touch the pad that lights up with in seconds.
It of course worked in no predictable manner and got faster,
he attributed this machine as the difference on what makes champions,a Russian weight-lifter with bags of strength and potential come to him for help because he failed lifts on the big day,
after a few months training with him and daily use of the touch pad machine the guy went on to win no end of competitions.

So i get Miaows point, some posters saying Wales just took a few cold baths etc. is just stupid because Gatland made them mentally tough to endure pain and concentrate.

P.S. didn't the Mighty All Blacks look very mortal today?

We're going to win the world cup. Fitness or no fitness, Priestland or no Priestland. We're going to win the world cup.

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

rugbydreamer wrote:going to have to disagree with you there shoulder, the last 15 mins showed that Wales were fitter, where Ireland ahd to ring the changes and get fresh legs on the field. Wales only made 2 substitutions and that was purely down to injury concerns. Being able to last the full 80mins without having to change your team apart from it being focred on you is incredible.

Well a coach is always going to make subs to try something different when his team is chasing a game,it doesn't mean his players aren't fit enough.The team thats playing better always looks fitter but I guarantee that when these lads get back to their clubs and are playing against Leinster or Munster it'll look different.It won't be because Leinster and Munster are fitter it's because the better team always make things look easier.

Clearly didnt watch the Ospreys beat Munster at the weekend or hasnt looked at the league positions since the world cup started. Ummmm we beat Munster and were top of the league.