PGA Tour: The Olympic Game: Notes from the Ballwasher

First topic message reminder :

1).Notes this week from the Land That WiFi Forgot; but the beach cricket pitches are spectacular - if anyone only knew how to play. So: Notes very short, if not sweet.

2).Last week's entertainment in Memphis was predictably unpredictable. Good to have Dustin Johnson back in Victory Lane, but a short stint in front of the telly would have suggested that, if Rory had made just half the putts he missed under five feet, he'd have probably won.

3).Glimmer of form from two unlikely Aussie sources with Nick O'Hern registering his first top 25 finish of the season. Expect him also to play well in Hartford in a fortnight. And Robert Allenby was back on the leaderboard after a couple of months in the weeds. Allenby, who could always be depended upon for his ball-striking - and his unpredictable short game. Now the whole lot has been unpredictable. Maybe that will change with some confidence from a good result..

4).More good results from Greg Owen, now almost certain to qualify, not just for The Barclays, but for the Deutsche Bank also.

5).Dustin Johnson now has six wins since 2007 - only Woods (16), Mickelson (10), Stricker (9) and Zach (7) have more. About 3/1 against one of those five increasing his total this week?

6).Robert Karlsson has sunk to #50 in the World Rankings, perhaps just a continuation of his rotten form away from leaving for the Top 50 for the first time in over 4 years. The leaders in consecutive weeks in the top 50 might surprise:
Mickelson - 968
Donald - 406
Poulter - 299
Stricker - 275
Zach Johnson - 270
Westwood - 249
Kaymer - 229

7).No-one has won the US Open after winning on the PGA Tour the previous week, in recent history at least. Dustin Johnson has a lot to prove and his successes (and an ultimate disappointment) at Pebble Beach suggest that he's a strong candidate to upset that line in the record book. But the past two US Opens at Olympic have been won by Scott Simpson and Lee Janzen, top-class golfers to be sure but known better for steady play and sometimes excellent short games. Furyk-like, Donald, Stricker? Not sure I've got the faintest idea, but Olympic will certainly test the patience.

8).More as an item of interest than an indicator for this week, the 1998 leaders from this week's field include:
5th: Stricker
7th: Westwood
10th: Cink, Mickelson
14th: Furyk, Kuchar
18th: Woods
23rd: Casey Martin
25th: Bjorn, Singh,
32nd: Durant, Harrington
43th: Olin Browne
49th: Els

9).The forecast for Thursday and Friday at least suggests cool, breezy weather with temps not reaching 70F until the weekend. Combined with the traditional "heavy" ocean air, the course yardage of approx 7,100 yards will play much longer, especially given the very narrow actual landing areas on some fairways caused by the sloped landing areas. I'd guess that will favour a Westwood over a Donald, a Mahan over a Stricker, but really can't think of any "favourite".

10).So who are we going to be staying up late to see crowned "US Open Champion"? Not McIlroy or Donald for me, and not Bubba or even Tiger, despite his return to winning form at Memorial. In 2009 he won each of his last pre-Major start but came up empty; it would be a brave punter who bet on a repeat, but this may not be the opportunity for him. Best bet might be e.w. on someone like Peter Hanson. Or even a real stretch, Spencer Levin. And by that time I’ll have returned to the land of wi-fi.



From incontinentia (merged from another thread):


Site: The Olympic Club (Lake Course)

The course: The Lake Course was designed in 1924 by Willie Watson and Sam Whiting, and then Whiting redesigned it three years later because of significant storm damage. Its main characteristics are sloping, tree-lined fairways as the property works its way down toward Lake Merced. There is only one fairway bunker on the entire course, at the par-4 sixth. There have been minimal renovations over the years, except for a new hole created for the par-3 eighth that now plays 200 yards and was moved to the right. Hundreds of trees have been removed, opening views down toward Lake Merced.

Length: 7,170 yards
Par: 34-36—70

Last time at Olympic Club: Lee Janzen overcame a five-shot deficit against Payne Stewart and closed with a 2-under 68 for a two-shot victory. Janzen got a huge break in the final round when his ball, stuck in a tree on the fifth hole, was dislodged as Janzen was headed back to the tee to play his third shot. It was his second U.S. Open title.

U.S. Open champions at Olympic Club: Jack Fleck (1955), Billy Casper (1966), Scott Simpson (1987), Lee Janzen (1998).

Noteworthy: The four players who finished second in the U.S. Opens at The Olympic Club won a combined 27 majors. The four winners won a combined seven majors.

Quoteworthy: "Now we are going to get back to where it's not going to be so much fun and games out there. It's going to be hard work."—Johnny Miller on Olympic Club.

Key statistic: The U.S. Open is the only major Tiger Woods has not won in consecutive years.

Key coincidence: The U.S. Open champion played with Phil Mickelson in the opening two rounds twice in the last four years.

Tiger tales: Tiger Woods has gone four years without winning a major. The longest Jack Nicklaus went without a major was five years, a drought that began at age 41.

Not Transistions, I think it was the Disney Miracle something or other but it was an impressive win anyway.

I'm not sure about that Cone. Poults had never won a PGA strokeplay event and Westy only has a couple. I think they'd take Memorial myself.

yeah it was a very impressive win cone.. and really showed that he had bottle(donald)

Watched an hour or so early on and amazed at how little golf was on in between the chat.Hope that improved later.Average to good for Rock spolit by a double on his last hole.Thats what you get for turning up early and being prepared.

Maybe i'm being bias Diggers as the BMW is set in England and I have a soft spot for the event.

I know Poulter's won a WGC but surprised he's never won a PGA event after being out there so long? That must surely rankle with him highly.

winning PGA titles is big deal coney.

The BMW has had brilliant fields the last few years and the world no.1 has won it the last 2- it says alot for its quality and test for the best. however the top europeans all would rather top up there pga win tallys i am sure!

Its prestigious to win em

mystiroakey wrote:winning PGA titles is big deal coney.

The BMW has had brilliant fields the last few years and the world no.1 has won it the last 2- it says alot for its quality and test for the best. however the top europeans all would rather top up there pga win tallys i am sure!

Its prestigious to win em

Just dont agree with that at all. Yes some of the PGA tour events are better than some European tour events but to say that Europeans would rather win a run of the mill PGA event rather then the flagship event on the European Tour, just aint correct at all.

players are judged on pga wins. sad but true.

all our top boys have question marks over there lack of PGA wins.

Yet all 3 of the top 3 players in the world are all European. Go figure. Your speaking like from an Americans viewpoint. Yes some of the events are stronger but you only had to look at the field for the BMW to see how the top european players hold it in importance.

I hold it in prime importance, I have been to it most years of my life!!

And i think it should retain is higher ranking points- because it needs the incentive for players to keep playing it

But when it boils down to it- it is what it is, some of our top boys are judged by the lack of pga wins(and obviously majors and wgc's)

Sand wrote:Yet all 3 of the top 3 players in the world are all European.

That may well be true but its also very much a rarity and the world number one has certainly been primarily a PGA player which is what Coco will become as well.

mystiroakey wrote:I hold it in prime importance, I have been to it most years of my life!!

And i think it should retain is higher ranking points- because it needs the incentive for players to keep playing it

But when it boils down to it- it is what it is, some of our top boys are judged by the lack of pga wins(and obviously majors and wgc's)

Yes but all im saying is yes the PGA tour is a stronger tour, you only have to look at the strength of the european players at the top of the rankings and the growth of the European tour in recent years to show the gap has closed. There are some very big events in European which of course hold some clout over some of the PGA tour events yet half the battle is the top Americans or Americans in general dont travel whatsoever, means that sometimes these events dont get the spotlight they deserve.

Kaymer is about the only full time european in the top 30.

www.majorschampionships.com/usopen/2012/news/Some-players-surprised-at-change-to-US-Open-cut-rule.cfm

Wow, that these players didn't know!

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

He's delivered twice in the last 3 years. Mighty impressive

I wonder will they try and make it a tad more scoreable today?

McLaren wrote:Kaymer is about the only full time european in the top 30.

Maybe so but there is also Hanson (has played a few PGA events hes still basically full time) at 25 and Lawrie at 29. Outwith the top 30, there is also F.Molanari, Bjorn, Colsaerts and Quiros all in top 40.

super_realist wrote:

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

He's delivered twice in the last 3 years. Mighty impressive

And in those 3 years of doing nothing he still done much better in the majors than Donald....go figure it.
Considering the press around his marriage break up and his injurys and form slump I think if Woods were to win a major and and get back to number one it would be right up there with one of the greatest comebacks in sport.

Diggers wrote:

super_realist wrote:

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

He's delivered twice in the last 3 years. Mighty impressive

And in those 3 years of doing nothing he still done much better in the majors than Donald....go figure it.
Considering the press around his marriage break up and his injurys and form slump I think if Woods were to win a major and and get back to number one it would be right up there with one of the greatest comebacks in sport.

Couldn't agree more with this post, to put up with what he had to do and get back to where he is golfing wise, shows how good he really is.

monty lad thats silly- winning the money title and beating up simpson down the stretch with a 6 or 7 under back 9 was stuff of heros. that was a very important bottle moment- no its not a major- but certainly up there

sand i echo your sentiment- but i am just facing facts. Its all about USA in todays game

sirbenson wrote:

Diggers wrote:

super_realist wrote:

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

He's delivered twice in the last 3 years. Mighty impressive

And in those 3 years of doing nothing he still done much better in the majors than Donald....go figure it.
Considering the press around his marriage break up and his injurys and form slump I think if Woods were to win a major and and get back to number one it would be right up there with one of the greatest comebacks in sport.

Couldn't agree more with this post, to put up with what he had to do and get back to where he is golfing wise, shows how good he really is.

Yeah even though half of his problems were self inflicated by shagging around...

I don't think you can really question Donald's bottle, you can question Westy's but to be honest Donald has yet to be in a real good position to win a major yet, maybe Medinah years ago.

Sand wrote:

sirbenson wrote:

Diggers wrote:

super_realist wrote:

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

He's delivered twice in the last 3 years. Mighty impressive

And in those 3 years of doing nothing he still done much better in the majors than Donald....go figure it.
Considering the press around his marriage break up and his injurys and form slump I think if Woods were to win a major and and get back to number one it would be right up there with one of the greatest comebacks in sport.

Couldn't agree more with this post, to put up with what he had to do and get back to where he is golfing wise, shows how good he really is.

Yeah even though half of his problems were self inflicated by shagging around...

But this brings up the debate on whether the media and press should have created a boundary and let him get on with his personal life.

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

Eh?? I'd have thought in Murray's case there were three very good reasons not to do with his own mentality - those being Djokovic, Nadal and Federer.

Andy Murray will never have the right attitude to win a slam, Donald has the right attitude to win a major.

Not that you can compare though

navyblueshorts wrote:

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

Eh?? I'd have thought in Murray's case there were three very good reasons not to do with his own mentality - those being Djokovic, Nadal and Federer.

Not sure, he beaten those 3 regularly outside of the slams, he's even beaten Nadal a couple of times at slams. It is a tough gig for him to win one of them but I would say its the mental side that is his problem.

“I think if Woods were to win a major and and get back to number one it would be right up there with one of the greatest comebacks in sport.”


Yeah, and remember the other great sporting comeback of recent times involved the assistance of performance enhancing drugs. Oh wait there was that doctor……………………………

sirbenson wrote:Andy Murray will never have the right attitude to win a slam, Donald has the right attitude to win a major.

This does beg the question why at the age of 34 Donald has never really been in contention to win a major. Murray has made 3 slam finals which is pretty close. I think murray has problems mentally but to me he is the more likely of the two to win a major.

McLaren wrote:“I think if Woods were to win a major and and get back to number one it would be right up there with one of the greatest comebacks in sport.”


Yeah, and remember the other great sporting comeback of recent times involved the assistance of performance enhancing drugs. Oh wait there was that doctor……………………………

Who are you referring to Mac?

Diggers wrote:

sirbenson wrote:Andy Murray will never have the right attitude to win a slam, Donald has the right attitude to win a major.

This does beg the question why at the age of 34 Donald has never really been in contention to win a major. Murray has made 3 slam finals which is pretty close. I think murray has problems mentally but to me he is the more likely of the two to win a major.

Golfers have longer careers and Donald has just entered his prime in golfing terms, and I believe Donald will content in plenty of majors to come and close one out

Armstrong and then woods dodgy doc.

McLaren wrote:Armstrong and then woods dodgy doc.

Oh I right, they both had the same doctor who was caught up with drugs.

sirbenson wrote:

Diggers wrote:

sirbenson wrote:Andy Murray will never have the right attitude to win a slam, Donald has the right attitude to win a major.

This does beg the question why at the age of 34 Donald has never really been in contention to win a major. Murray has made 3 slam finals which is pretty close. I think murray has problems mentally but to me he is the more likely of the two to win a major.

Golfers have longer careers and Donald has just entered his prime in golfing terms, and I believe Donald will content in plenty of majors to come and close one out

I hope you are right but it would seem that in his prime he is actually performing worse in the majors which might suggest he doesnt have the right attitude. Who knows, personally I hope they both win several.

Sorry didn't mean to make it sound like they had the same doc.

I meant armstrong is a drugs cheat (fact) and woods came back without the use of drugs. Although tigers doc was caught up in some sort of epo/blood spinning scandal.

Diggers wrote:

sirbenson wrote:

Diggers wrote:

sirbenson wrote:Andy Murray will never have the right attitude to win a slam, Donald has the right attitude to win a major.

This does beg the question why at the age of 34 Donald has never really been in contention to win a major. Murray has made 3 slam finals which is pretty close. I think murray has problems mentally but to me he is the more likely of the two to win a major.

Golfers have longer careers and Donald has just entered his prime in golfing terms, and I believe Donald will content in plenty of majors to come and close one out

I hope you are right but it would seem that in his prime he is actually performing worse in the majors which might suggest he doesnt have the right attitude. Who knows, personally I hope they both win several.

I am no fan of either but I can warm to Donald, Murray I am afraid not, never will be able to!

McLaren wrote:Sorry didn't mean to make it sound like they had the same doc.

I meant armstrong is a drugs cheat (fact) and woods came back without the use of drugs. Although tigers doc was caught up in some sort of epo/blood spinning scandal.

Yeah I know man!

super_realist wrote:The leaderboard is not that yank dominated Ned. There are 9 internationals in the top 15 and even more just one shot further back.

Good day for Diggers favourite Poulter. Even his other favourite Garcia is not far away. This no mark Thompson will disappear and then its anyone's who is within 7-8 shots at the end of the day.
Judging by the gir stats its whoever can get up and down the best. Majority of players only holding 7-9 greens rather than the usual 12-14. Another plus for Poulter who has a great short game (even although he's a fudpiece).

The Euros came back in to it late on super, good finishes from McDowell, Rose and Poulter. I think when I posted that, there were ten players under par, nine Yanks and Ishikawa!

Really hoping we get the same steadily toughening conditions today as yesterday, otherwise it will play in to the hands of half the draw and Woods could run away with things.

Any good luck to Padraig today!

Diggers wrote:

navyblueshorts wrote:

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

Eh?? I'd have thought in Murray's case there were three very good reasons not to do with his own mentality - those being Djokovic, Nadal and Federer.

Not sure, he beaten those 3 regularly outside of the slams, he's even beaten Nadal a couple of times at slams. It is a tough gig for him to win one of them but I would say its the mental side that is his problem.

True, but MJ's assertion above is patently not correct. Federer's on the wane but the other two are simply significantly better than Murray; it would be immense as he'd almost certainly have to beat two of the three of them in the latter stages of an event. He could do it as he's capable of that level of tennis but over maybe two consecutive best-of-5 matches? I don't see that it has much to do with the mental side (in the sense of pressure negatively affecting him) except that it'd be hard not to feel you were the underdog against any of those three.

McLaren wrote:Sorry didn't mean to make it sound like they had the same doc.

I meant armstrong is a drugs cheat (fact) and woods came back without the use of drugs. Although tigers doc was caught up in some sort of epo/blood spinning scandal.

There you go again Mac. Armstrong is not a drugs cheat (fact). It's not been proven yet and unless you have first-hand knowledge from behind the scenes I'm not sure you're in a fit place to comment eh? Mind you, I have to say I'd like this allegation to stick.

sirbenson wrote:

Diggers wrote:

sirbenson wrote:

Diggers wrote:

sirbenson wrote:Andy Murray will never have the right attitude to win a slam, Donald has the right attitude to win a major.

This does beg the question why at the age of 34 Donald has never really been in contention to win a major. Murray has made 3 slam finals which is pretty close. I think murray has problems mentally but to me he is the more likely of the two to win a major.

Golfers have longer careers and Donald has just entered his prime in golfing terms, and I believe Donald will content in plenty of majors to come and close one out

I hope you are right but it would seem that in his prime he is actually performing worse in the majors which might suggest he doesnt have the right attitude. Who knows, personally I hope they both win several.

I am no fan of either but I can warm to Donald, Murray I am afraid not, never will be able to!

Why not? If it's because of the England thing you've been reading The Sun too much.

super_realist wrote:

sirbenson wrote:

Diggers wrote:

sirbenson wrote:

Diggers wrote:

sirbenson wrote:Andy Murray will never have the right attitude to win a slam, Donald has the right attitude to win a major.

This does beg the question why at the age of 34 Donald has never really been in contention to win a major. Murray has made 3 slam finals which is pretty close. I think murray has problems mentally but to me he is the more likely of the two to win a major.

Golfers have longer careers and Donald has just entered his prime in golfing terms, and I believe Donald will content in plenty of majors to come and close one out

I hope you are right but it would seem that in his prime he is actually performing worse in the majors which might suggest he doesnt have the right attitude. Who knows, personally I hope they both win several.

I am no fan of either but I can warm to Donald, Murray I am afraid not, never will be able to!

Why not? If it's because of the England thing you've been reading The Sun too much.

I am Irish so it has nothing to do with that at all. I just can't stand him, my fave tennis player is Tsonga.

navyblueshorts wrote:

Diggers wrote:

navyblueshorts wrote:

monty junior wrote:Donald might be better at getting up and down to win the Bangkok invitational but when has he ever done holed a sloping 10 footer on the last get in to a major, playoff or something similar. He's kind of similar to Andy Murray mentality wise in that there's no reason why he shouldnt win a major tournament (they have both won plenty of good tournaments wins) but just don't have it between the ears imo to win one of the big four. Tiger may be streaky these days but when it matters he more often than not delivers.

Eh?? I'd have thought in Murray's case there were three very good reasons not to do with his own mentality - those being Djokovic, Nadal and Federer.

Not sure, he beaten those 3 regularly outside of the slams, he's even beaten Nadal a couple of times at slams. It is a tough gig for him to win one of them but I would say its the mental side that is his problem.

True, but MJ's assertion above is patently not correct. Federer's on the wane but the other two are simply significantly better than Murray; it would be immense as he'd almost certainly have to beat two of the three of them in the latter stages of an event. He could do it as he's capable of that level of tennis but over maybe two consecutive best-of-5 matches? I don't see that it has much to do with the mental side (in the sense of pressure negatively affecting him) except that it'd be hard not to feel you were the underdog against any of those three.

Not really. It depends whether you believe they are significantly better than him in terms of physicallity and talent or whether they are better than him mentally. Personally I think he is pretty much on a par with them for the first two and nowhere near them for the latter.

Can't stand Nadal (for his trophy biting and saying "no" at the end of sentences) and Tsonga for his stupid pointing celebration.

super_realist wrote:Can't stand Nadal (for his trophy biting and saying "no" at the end of sentences) and Tsonga for his stupid pointing celebration.

Each to there own! Out of the top 4 I would only like Federer

tennis is very different to golf as we all know.

there are countless major winners that i would consider worse than donald yet i cant think of to many tennis players that win a major that arnt considered at the top of the game. Its just the format of golf is so different to other sports

Andrew Cotter has recently done some crossover sport coverage for the BBC, and spoke to Andy Murray before the Aegon at Queen's (and has since flown off to San Fran to cover the US Open). I think they both have a great sense of humour, although Mr Murray tends to be more subtle about it on camera. Here's what Cotter had to say:


10 Jun Andrew Cotter ‏@MrAndrewCotter
Have performed my main task of the day, interviewing Andy Murray ahead of the Aegon Championships at Queens. We had a dour-off. I edged it.

Andrew Cotter ‏@MrAndrewCotter
We both started looking to our boxes and muttering.

sirbenson wrote:

super_realist wrote:Can't stand Nadal (for his trophy biting and saying "no" at the end of sentences) and Tsonga for his stupid pointing celebration.

Each to there own! Out of the top 4 I would only like Federer

Not fond of Federer, too smug despite being a brilliant player, and his wife is a fat dog.

There are currently (before anyone tees off)

41 americans inside the cut
18 europeans
13 internationals