Ulster Rugby v Glasgow Warriors, 13 September

Ulster Rugby v Glasgow Warriors
 
Friday 13th September 2013, KO 19:05
Ravenhill Stadium, Belfast
 
Referee: Ian Davies (WRU, 9th competition game)
Assistant Referees: Gary Conway, Kevin Beggs (both IRFU)
Citing Commissioner: John West (IRFU)
TMO: Peter Ferguson (IRFU)

Live on BBC NI and BBC ALBA
 
A. Teams:
 
1. Ulster  
 
15 J Payne
14 D McIlwaine
13 D Cave
12 L Marshall
11 M Allen
10 P Jackson
09 I Porter
 
01. C Black
02 R Herring
03 D Fitzpatrick
04 J Muller (Captain)
05 D Tuohy
06 R Wilson
07 S Doyle
08 N Williams
 
16. N Annett
17. T Court
18. R Lutton
19. I Henderson
20. C Henry
21. P Marshall
22. J McKinney
23.  R Andrew

 
2. Glasgow  
 
15. Stuart Hogg
14. Tommy Seymour
13. Sean Lamont
12. Mark Bennett
11. DTH van der Merwe
10. Ruaridh Jackson
9. Henry Pyrgos (Captain)
 
01. Ryan Grant  
02. Pat MacArthur
03. Ed Kalman
04. Tim Swinson
05. Jonny Gray
06. Rob Harley
07. Tyrone Holmes
08. Josh Strauss
 
16. Dougie Hall
17. Gordon Reid
18. Moray Low
19. James Eddie  
20. Chris Fusaro
21. Richie Vernon
22. Chris Cusiter
23. Gabriel Ascarate
 
B. Form - head to head:
 
27 Played 27
15 Wins 11
11 Losses 15
1 Draws 1
49 Tries 43
31 Conversions 29
71 Penalties 64
2 Drop Goals 7
526 Points 486
26 Avg. Age 26
 
C. Form - last season:
 
Friday 31 August 2012, 19:05: Ravenhill
Ulster Rugby 18 - 10 Glasgow Warriors
 
Friday 22 February 2013, 19:35: Scotstoun
Glasgow Warriors 20 - 14 Ulster Rugby
 
D. Glasgow fans lexicon:
 
Time on these boards has demonstrated that Glasgow fans use an uncommonly broad selection of nicknames and slang to describe the various members of their team.
 
For those unfamiliar with this gibberish:
 
Alphabetty Spaghetti - D.T.H. van der Merwe, wing
Angel - Gabriel Ascarate, centre
Angela - Jon Welsh, prop
Barry - Byron McGuigan, wing
Big Boab - (see Ginger Tackle Monster, the)
Big Mike - (see Coo, the)
Big Naka - Leone Nakarawa, lock/loosie
Bluto - Josh Strauss, loosie/no.8
Centre, the - (see Lesser Messiah, the)
Coo, the - Michael Cusack, prop
Cooseetah - (see Cus)
Cus - Chris Cusiter, scrum half
DTH - (see Alphabetty Spaghetti)
Flippy - (see Toonie)
Fozzy - Christopher Fusaro, loosie
Furra Lineeeee - Peter Horne, centre
Ginger Tackle Monster, the - Rob Harley, loosie
Guns - Tim Swinson, lock
Henners - Henry Pyrgos, scrum half
Hoggy - Stuart Hogg, full back/wing/centre
Ickle Jon - Jonny Gray, lock
Jedi - James Eddie, loosie
Lesser Messiah, the - Richie Vernon, loosie/no.8
Mark of Nazareth - (see Messiah, the)
Meatball, the - Duncan Weir, fly half
Messiah, the/   - Mark Bennett, centre
Niko - Nikola Matawalu, scrum half
Niko's Mate - Jerry Yanuyanutawa, prop
No Maits - Sean Maitland, wing
Rhubarb - Ruaridh Jackson, fly half
Ruck Inspector, the - Alastair Kellock, lock
Schlong - Sean Lamont, centre/wing
Sherlock - Tyrone Holmes, loosie
Shrek - Gordon Reid, prop
Toonie - Gregor Peter John Townsend MBE, head coach
Wee P - Pat MacArthur, hooker
Weegie from Fiji, the - (see Niko)

I can imagine that Ulster will be smarting going into this fixture after their unexpected loss to the Dragons, so I'm expecting a massive response from them. Against that, Glasgow will need to be right on top of their game to get anything from this match, and a repeat of Friday evening's winning performance against the Blouses will simply not be good enough.

GC - where do you get all your stats from?

Don't worry I'm not going to ask you to do an Edinburgh thread again (unless you really want to!), so would be good to know your source.

Totally, Asbo. If you looked at the Dragons match, it looked like the Ulster team had just met in the car park 10 minutes beforehand. Never seen that from them before and I can't imagine it will be repeated too soon. Take nothing away from Dragons mind you - Tovey was amazeballs and their pack was clearly up for a massive dust-up.
 
This will depend a lot on the sides named. Nick Williams went back to NZ for family reasons before the Dragons match and Ulster fans will need to opine on whether he'll be back in time for this one. He absolutely hammered us last year so whilst I hope things are all right for him at home, I'd rather that he didn't play against us.
 
I can only imagine that next week we'll see some or all of Hogg, Maitland, DTH, Grant, Hall, Welsh, Strauss and Ryder in the XXIII this time. Of that shower, Strauss, Welsh, Hall and Ryder all played for their club sides last week so they're surely likely to be available. Fortunately for Ulster, Matawalu and Cusack are likely to still be injured.

RDW_Scotland wrote:GC - where do you get all your stats from?

Don't worry I'm not going to ask you to do an Edinburgh thread again (unless you really want to!), so would be good to know your source.

All from official Rabo website. Perhaps I should make a few up just to keep everyone guessing.

Nick Williams is back in Belfast so will be available barring injury. Henderson and Olding are back in the panel too. Unsure as to whether Gilroy and Afoa are available.

Glasgow are rightly favourites for this one but it is a massive game for ulster given last weeks result and first competitive game in the new stadium. We need to up our game.

Standulstermen wrote:Nick Williams is back in Belfast so will be available barring injury. Henderson and Olding are back in the panel too. Unsure as to whether Gilroy and Afoa are available.

Glasgow are rightly favourites for this one but it is a massive game for ulster given last weeks result and first competitive game in the new stadium. We need to up our game.

No, no, no, Stand, not at all - I'll see your mahoosive underdog and raise you to underdog squared - Ulster are monstrous at Ravenhill, very rarely do teams travel there and get a result - Ulster clear favourites

I don't think we are favourites but that's a measure of the regard ihave for Glasgow. If the ulster backline clicks and we kick our points it will be very difficult but that's a massive if

Mutual respect, Stand. We will always give you a game but there's no way in the world we're favourites at Ravenhill - our record there sucks.

Ulster will be a big test for Glasgow. It both sides put out a strong team, it could be a cracker.

For Glasgow, I'd expect there to be a few changes. Our Lions might get onto the bench, but I don't think any of them will be starting.

Here's what I'd like to see

Welsh
MacArthur
Low
Swinson
Gray
Harley
Fusaro
Strauss
Cusiter (c)
Jackson
S Lamont
Dunbar
Bennett
Seymour
Murchie

Subs - Grant, Brown, Kalman, Nakawara, Vernon, Pyrgos, Russell, Maitland, Hogg.

Wight was very poor on Friday, so I'm not even sure I want him on the bench. Russell covers 10 and 12, S Lamont and Hogg cover 13, Maitland and Hogg cover the back three. Gray's earned a place in the first XV now that Kellock is injured, and it's great to have Cusiter back. Hopefully Jackson can bring the centres into the game this time, as I thought Dunbar was very quiet versus the Blues. Bennett can keep smacking over the place kicks from 55m!

Not sure you will get away with 9 on the bench though.......

Standulstermen wrote:I don't think we are favourites but that's a measure of the regard ihave for Glasgow. If the ulster backline clicks and we kick our points it will be very difficult but that's a massive if

Trying to lull them into a false sense of security? Then hit them with Afoa and Williams....

Good team, Captain. I would err on the side of caution and put Swinson and Ryder in the boiler room with Ickle Jon on the bench - that's a combo that worked well last season.
 
If Afoa plays, then I'd really like to see Ryan Grant start against him, although Welsh should have the stuff to cope. I'd also start with Hall instead of Wee P. Dougie is about 10kg heavier than Pat and we'll need the weight against Ulster. There was little to choose between them at hooker last year - two good options.
 
I agree that the Lions are more likely to come on from the bench if it looks like we're in the poop with 30 to go. I assume that the Rhubarb will be taking over goalkicking duties but it's interesting to see that the Messiah adds another 10-15 meters to Jackson's usual range.

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:Not sure you will get away with 9 on the bench though.......

Worth a try

Silly me, probably cut Hogg from the bench, then.

Who's Russell? Could you cut him and have Hogg cover 10?

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:Not sure you will get away with 9 on the bench though.......

Always worth a try, Jen! In our recent intra-village pub vs pub cricket match, I managed to get 15 on the pitch for a while before the oppo pub noticed - probs too pis*ed tbh

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:Who's Russell? Could you cut him and have Hogg cover 10?

Russell is Finn Russell, an up&coming youngster, a natural 10

Well then......

Captain_Sensible wrote:

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:Not sure you will get away with 9 on the bench though.......

Worth a try

Silly me, probably cut Hogg from the bench, then.

Nah, cut Murchie from the 23 altogether and Hoggy starts - tough on Murch, but it's tough at the top

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:Who's Russell? Could you cut him and have Hogg cover 10?

Russell's a very promising youngster, can play at 10 or 12. I'd rather develop him than shunt Hogg round the backline and away from his best position at 15. Maitland is better suited to the bench anyway because he covers wing and fullback.

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:

Captain_Sensible wrote:

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:Not sure you will get away with 9 on the bench though.......

Worth a try

Silly me, probably cut Hogg from the bench, then.

Nah, cut Murchie from the 23 altogether and Hoggy starts - tough on Murch, but it's tough at the top

Fair point. I've no idea if Hogg is ready to be starting games yet, fitness wise. If he is, then definitely bring him into the first XV. Same for Maitland and DTH, but dropping S Lamont or Seymour would be difficult, they both played very well last week.

All this talk of when to bring Lions back makes me wonder whether we are too soft on them in Scotland – the French based Lions have played the last 2 games, the English Lions played at the weekend and we’re talking of giving them another week or two off!

I agree they shouldn’t play if their conditioning isn’t up to speed yet (particularly Hogg) but I don’t think they should be left out too long.

Bench this week, starting next!

Count your blessings. We won't see our lions till Round 4 at the earliest

You should count your own blessings – Edinburgh didn't have any Lions! 

 

RDW_Scotland wrote:You should count your own blessings – Edinburgh didn't have any Lions! 

One or two donkeys, though.

To be fair, the players that stood an outside chance of the Lions (Greig Laidlaw, Tim Visser, Matt Scott) are all currently injured anyway, so we are suffering too!

RDW_Scotland wrote:All this talk of when to bring Lions back makes me wonder whether we are too soft on them in Scotland – the French based Lions have played the last 2 games, the English Lions played at the weekend and we’re talking of giving them another week or two off!

I agree they shouldn’t play if their conditioning isn’t up to speed yet (particularly Hogg) but I don’t think they should be left out too long.

Bench this week, starting next!

You'd think so, particularly given that the Scots Lions were hardly overworked on the tour!

True, Hogg and Maitland will have been holding tackle bags for the last 2 weeks, and Grant probably only had a sore arse from sitting on a bench for 80 minutes in the 2nd test!

It's all starting to make sense now. Gatland didn't select those players because he's such a big Glasgow fan and wanted them fresh for the new season. You should all send him a hamper.

Lucky, it's in the post  

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:It's all starting to make sense now. Gatland didn't select those players because he's such a big Glasgow fan and wanted them fresh for the new season. You should all send him a hamper.

I strongly suspect that out of the many things that Gatland undeniably needs, more food is not one of them.

RDW_Scotland wrote:True, Hogg and Maitland will have been holding tackle bags for the last 2 weeks, and Grant probably only had a sore arse from sitting on a bench for 80 minutes in the 2nd test!

Very much looking forward to Grant dragging Adam Jones through the mud again this season. Will there be any comment from Gatland about this? Of course not.

Was reading an older Q&A with J Strauss just now online, and was happy to read the following from him...

Why did you sign for the Glasgow Warriors?
"They took a very professional approach to sign me. After it was announced that the Lions were relegated from Super Rugby, they contacted me regularly. They even flew officials down to Johannesburg to have a few chats. I was very impressed. I had a stint in France before I played for Boland and the Lions. I enjoyed it and always wanted to go back to Europe. I'll also have the chance to qualify for Scotland ahead of the 2015 World Cup."

Which other teams were interested?
"The Crusaders showed interest, but there wasn’t an official offer. There were plenty of European clubs who wanted to sign me, but at the end of the day, Glasgow was my preferred choice."

This was really pleasing to read. By making that little bit of extra effort, Glasgow got themselves one of the best no.8's in NH club rugby. I look forward to more of his big carries this season.

I keep hearing how professional Glasgow are when going about their business. Really annoying from an Edinburgh perspective!!

I'd love to have been a fly on the wall when the SRU phoned Toonie to say: "Well we've offered Sean Maitland to Edinburgh and apparently, with Lee Jones on the books, they don't need him. Do you want him?"

Toonie:"     

Ummm, yeh, go on then".

Edinburgh chairman - "no thanks Ma'a Nonu, we've already got Ben Atiga!"

Edinburgh chairman: "No thanks Bryan Habana, we've got Jack Cuthbert".

 

The depressing thing is that we could keep going with this joke for a long time.

True!

On the plus side I'm looking forward to seeing Hilterbrand and Blaauw. I think our front row could be a real strength this season. Good at the set piece and good in the loose.

I'm also keen to install Visser and Walker on the wings, and after Atiga's asthmatic performance, I'd happily shift NDL to 12 and give Fife a crack at 13. Matt Scott can't return soon enough!

Think we really should make our own match thread so to not upset the natives...

RDW_Scotland wrote:Think we really should make our own match thread so to not upset the natives...

That doesn't bother me in the slightest.....

 

I think Glasgow should go for:

1. Grant
2. MacArthur
3. Welsh
4. Gray
5. Swinson
6. Harley
7. Fusaro
8. Strauss
9. Cusiter
10. Jackson
11. Lamont
12. Dunbar
13. Bennett
14. Maitland
15. Hogg

16. Yanuyanutawa
17. Brown
18. Low
19. Nakarawa
20. Holmes
21. Pyrgos
22. Russell
23. Seymour
Our Lions were barely involved in the latter stages of the tour and probably played less high intensity ruby than the Scotland tourists and they've all played

Good team selection, though I think DTH would have to be added to the mix.

After last Friday I was ready to wield the axe... I thought guys like Dan Tuohy, Chris Henry, Paul Marshall looked very out of sorts amongst others. But thats the problem. They are undercooked, not quite match fit and not yet match sharp. But so is the entire squad.

So I would actually keep the same team for Ulster with the exception of Chris Farrell out for Darren Cave. I think the biggest problem for us is a lack of match practice and pre-season rust and I don't think bringing in Iain Henderson or Nick Williams will a) improve this, guys who have had less gametime will be even rustier than the ones they come in for or b) improve our breakdown work which was very poor as these guys are out and out ball carriers who have both been criticised for their workrate at the ruck. I do love the impact of bringing those two off the bench however. There are no realistic options in the half-backs and the back three had little chance. So I'd only change the centres. But I'd go with six forwards on the bench. I thought all three replacement front rows were pretty poor for us last week and Declan Fitzpatrick especially bad- no harm in seeing what Bronson Ross can do.

1. Callum Black
2. Rob Herring
3. Ricky Lutton
4. Johann Muller (c)
5. Dan Tuohy
6. Robbie Diack
7. Chris Henry
8. Roger Wilson
9. Paul Marshall
10. Paddy Jackson
11. David McIlwaine
12. Luke Marshall
13. Darren Cave
14. Andrew Trimble
15. Jared Payne

16. Niall Annett 17. Tom Court 18. Bronson Ross 19. Iain Henderson 20. Sean Doyle 21. Nick Williams 22. Ian Porter 23. Stuart Olding

The performance was very poor last week, with the intensity of a pre-season game. I really do believe the fact we've been forced to have a shorter pre-season has hurt us this year and I think we have to back the same players again to come good. I think everyone in the squad needs more gametime, so the next four rounds are not only about righting the ship and getting some wins on the board but making sure the whole squad is match fit and sharp for the Heineken Cup. One or two defeats may be able to be clawed back in the Pro12- Heineken Cup defeats have more immediate ramifications.

Hopefully Anscombe has made sure they've had a tough week with some tough words and they are coming out with a lot of anger. I've been at pains to give credit to the Dragons, but Friday wasn't acceptable by the standards these players have set amongst themselves. We need to see a big backlash in front of a capacity crowd, in hopefully adverse weather conditions.

Numbers, I'd go for exactly the same squad, but swap Seymour and Maitland.

RDW_Scotland wrote:Think we really should make our own match thread so to not upset the natives...

Nah, we don't care. More the merrier and one of the things I enjoy about the Pro12 is you get an insight into a different team each week.

Notch wrote:After last Friday I was ready to wield the axe... I thought guys like Dan Tuohy, Chris Henry, Paul Marshall looked very out of sorts amongst others. But thats the problem. They are undercooked, not quite match fit and not yet match sharp. But so is the entire squad.

So I would actually keep the same team for Ulster with the exception of Chris Farrell out for Darren Cave. I think the biggest problem for us is a lack of match practice and pre-season rust and I don't think bringing in Iain Henderson or Nick Williams will a) improve this, guys who have had less gametime will be even rustier than the ones they come in for or b) improve our breakdown work which was very poor as these guys are out and out ball carriers who have both been criticised for their workrate at the ruck. I do love the impact of bringing those two off the bench however. There are no realistic options in the half-backs and the back three had little chance. So I'd only change the centres. But I'd go with six forwards on the bench. I thought all three replacement front rows were pretty poor for us last week and Declan Fitzpatrick especially bad- no harm in seeing what Bronson Ross can do.

1. Callum Black
2. Rob Herring
3. Ricky Lutton
4. Johann Muller (c)
5. Dan Tuohy
6. Robbie Diack
7. Chris Henry
8. Roger Wilson
9. Paul Marshall
10. Paddy Jackson
11. David McIlwaine
12. Luke Marshall
13. Darren Cave
14. Andrew Trimble
15. Jared Payne

16. Niall Annett 17. Tom Court 18. Bronson Ross 19. Iain Henderson 20. Sean Doyle 21. Nick Williams 22. Ian Porter 23. Stuart Olding

The performance was very poor last week, with the intensity of a pre-season game. I really do believe the fact we've been forced to have a shorter pre-season has hurt us this year and I think we have to back the same players again to come good. I think everyone in the squad needs more gametime, so the next four rounds are not only about righting the ship and getting some wins on the board but making sure the whole squad is match fit and sharp for the Heineken Cup. One or two defeats may be able to be clawed back in the Pro12- Heineken Cup defeats have more immediate ramifications.

Hopefully Anscombe has made sure they've had a tough week with some tough words and they are coming out with a lot of anger. I've been at pains to give credit to the Dragons, but Friday wasn't acceptable by the standards these players have set amongst themselves. We need to see a big backlash in front of a capacity crowd, in hopefully adverse weather conditions.

Notch - I would have thought that you'd be more confident of the Dragons match being a blip?
Do you think it's true to say that Ulster will be focussing more on the Heineken this year?

And who should kick your goals if Jackson is shanking them all over the shop?

Notch wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:Think we really should make our own match thread so to not upset the natives...

Nah, we don't care. More the merrier and one of the things I enjoy about the Pro12 is you get an insight into a different team each week.

Well I've given ourself our own home and set up a GC inspired thread of my own!

https://www.606v2.com/t47844-edinburgh-v-dragons#2273580

George Carlin wrote:Notch - I would have thought that you'd be more confident of the Dragons match being a blip?
Do you think it's true to say that Ulster will be focussing more on the Heineken this year?

And who should kick your goals if Jackson is shanking them all over the shop?

I think we should stick with Jackson for at least the next 4 games. Looking at it long term, he's 21 now and I very much believe he has the talent to be first choice for Ireland. He has the all-round game, he has that presence of being the General of the backline at a very young age, but most importantly he has the temperament of a Test match international. Set backs just don't affect him. He is never flustered; he has mental strength. I want him to be competing for an Ireland jersey by the time he's 23, 24 but he can forget about test rugby until he gets his kicking percentage up.

It's our task to win games in the short term but we also have to develop players for our national side and for our own future, so I think we have to take the view that maybe allowing Jackson to work through his place kicking problems naturally might bring short-term pain but long-term gain for Ulster and Ireland. A few defeats may be suffered in the process of developing a player who has the potential to be the 10 for province and country for a generation but I don't see how he gets better without being allowed to kick at goal. We should have lots of players practicing kicking though so we always have a back-up on the pitch. McIlwaine, Porter and Olding could all fulfill this role.

But I don't see why we'd be focusing more on the Heineken Cup, no. Pro12 is different because you have to rotate and lots of players are used but not finishing in the Top 4 is not acceptable no matter what happens in Europe.

Anyway I don't think it was a blip, blips are one off things. I think the match was part of a trend. No real surprises for me in how we played based on last year and the pre-season and while I thought we would just do enough to fall over the line before hand, to be honest there were no surprises for me about the result either.

I do make us favourites to beat Glasgow though. Not saying I'd be surprised if we lose, just that I expect a win- maybe not by much, and maybe not with much panache but I expect us to lift our game enough to win.