England Saxons v Irish Wolfhounds - Kingsholm

First topic message reminder :

25th January 2014 - Live on Sky Sports 1 (4:45pm Kick Off)

Saxons XXIII to face Ireland Wolfhounds:

1. A Waller
2. J George
3. T Mercy
4. C Matthews
5. G Kruis
6. C Clarke (c)
7. L Wallace
8. D Ewers
9. J Simpson
10. F Burns
11. C Sharples
12. S Hill
13. M Hopper
14. A Watson
15. E Daly

16. D Ward 17. N Catt 18. S Wilson 19. E Stooke 20. S Dickinson 21. D Lewis 22. H Slade 23. R Miller


Ireland XXIII

15. Felix Jones (Shannon/Munster)
14. Fergus McFadden (Old Belvedere/Leinster)
13. Robbie Henshaw (Buccaneers/Connacht)
12. Darren Cave (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster)
11. Craig Gilroy (Dungannon/Ulster)
10. Ian Madigan (Blackrock College/Leinster)
9. Isaac Boss (Terenure College/Leinster)
1. David Kilcoyne (UL Bohemians/Munster)
2. Rob Herring (Ballynahinch/Ulster)
3. Martin Moore (Lansdowne/Leinster)
4. Iain Henderson (Ballynahinch/Ulster)
5. Dan Tuohy (Ballymena/Ulster)
6. Rhys Ruddock (St. Mary’s College/Leinster) (capt)
7. Tommy O’Donnell (UL Bohemians/Munster)
8. Robin Copeland (Cardiff Blues)

Replacements:

16. Richardt Strauss (Old Wesley/Leinster)
17. Jack McGrath (St. Mary’s College/Leinster)
18. Stephen Archer (Cork Constitution/Munster)
19. Robbie Diack (Malone/Ulster)
20. Jordi Murphy (Lansdowne/Leinster)
21. Kieran Marmion (Corinthians/Connacht)
22. Ian Keatley (Young Munster/Munster)
23. Simon Zebo (Cork Constitution/Munster)

Boss MOTM. Who'd have thunk it?    

Well played England. Nearly phhoked it away Ireload, but a great worout.

Standouts: Boss, McFadden, Madigan, Ruddock.

Wow was the English player who decided to dive into touch and throw the ball away?

Miller and Dickenson were really good coming off the bench. And Daly at 13 looked impressive. 

Wolfhounds were really poor in attack.

Oh Freddie   

What happened there did burns pass to the linesman!!!!

That was an escape in the end from Ireland but what was with the kicking away of possession with so little time left? That was terrible.

Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

Is that Freddie Burns? Thats unfortunate...

Burns was fairly awful all game. Fitting end

Do not know why Freddie Burns even tried that. He'd never have made the kick if he had scored anyway so why snatch at the ball for the glory try??

ME-109 wrote:Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

He simply has to start, best winger in Ireland and one of the best counter attackers in rugby.

Why wouldnt joe pick him?

Nachos Jones wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

He simply has to start, best winger in Ireland and one of the best counter attackers in rugby.

Who will start over him? I would be very surprised if he isn't a starter for most of the 6 nations.

ME-109 wrote:Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

Great talent. But McFadden is in based on his work-rate and talent alone. Gilroy null pois. Hes out in the cold.

I can't believe the man of the match didn't go to someone wearing a number between 4 and 8.

MOTM is a kiwi. There's a surprise.   

Nachos Jones wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

He simply has to start, best winger in Ireland and one of the best counter attackers in rugby.

Yeah but Joe doesn't like threesomes...,i bet we get McFadden

Class from Rob Miller at the end. Score about right there.

I have to say McFadden was pretty poor today, Gilroy too. Zebos stock has risen while McFaddens and Gilroys falls.

I thought Boss very poor, Gibbo and Stewart Barnes are watching a different game

Zebo was the best of the backs despite not much time one. Henshaw was solid. Backrow was brilliant. Everything else was a mix of blah and solid.

150 tackles made. Hopefully the first team can hold onto the ball a lot more so we dont have to make that many

LeinsterFan4life wrote:People seem surprised that it is such a bad game... Its like this every year!

I can't say you didn't warn us.

I thought Madigan was really exposed with regard to his inability to control games.  He had a massive wind behind him in the first half but just doesn't seem to have any tactical or territorial kicking game.  Which is exactly what a 10 needs with a strong wind.  He is  great with ball in hand, but game management just isn't there.

On a dry pitch that would have been a massacre, England were clueless

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Nachos Jones wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

He simply has to start, best winger in Ireland and one of the best counter attackers in rugby.

Who will start over him?  I would be very surprised if he isn't a starter for most of the 6 nations.

Dont think so. Needs more game time and to show his early promise... then maybe. But, he has his hands full with McFadden (far more complete player), Kearney - in hot form and last but not least... Fitz is back to his best. Twill be interesting chaps...

Bowe is in trouble here when he gets back. All good. Its all we ever wanted. Fierce competition driving us higher.

Dickinson and Miller stand out cameos for Engalnd.

Burns and Simpson were just atrocious. Utterly atrocious. Terrible game management, terrible handling and terrible kicking.

The coaches were the only thing worse. Who the Frak thought up those tactics for todays game? Do they not see the weather forecasts? Bloody appalling.

Only saw the last 20,

how did Copeland play?

Ireland have excellent depth in the backs. With Dave and rob Kearney. Zebo,Gilroy, McFadden, bowe etc. dangerous as hell......

ME-109 wrote:

Nachos Jones wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

He simply has to start, best winger in Ireland and one of the best counter attackers in rugby.

Yeah but Joe doesn't like threesomes...,i bet we get McFadden

I would be amazed if McFadden gets picked ahead of him. Zebo brings so much more counter attacking threat than McFadden.

England from 6-10 were awful.

Nachos Jones wrote:

ME-109 wrote:

Nachos Jones wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

He simply has to start, best winger in Ireland and one of the best counter attackers in rugby.

Yeah but Joe doesn't like threesomes...,i bet we get McFadden

I would be amazed if McFadden gets picked ahead of him. Zebo brings so much more counter attacking threat than McFadden.

Be well prepared to be amazed. Its a done deal bro.   

Gibson wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

Nachos Jones wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo showed in 10 seconds why he should start for Ireland but i bet holy Joe wont pick him.

He simply has to start, best winger in Ireland and one of the best counter attackers in rugby.

Who will start over him?  I would be very surprised if he isn't a starter for most of the 6 nations.

Dont think so. Needs more game time and to show his early promise... then maybe. But, he has his hands full with McFadden (far more complete player), Kearney - in hot form and last but not least... Fitz is back to his best. Twill be interesting chaps...

That's all we need, head down endeavour...why go for the exciting option when you can get the usual...hmm sounds familiar to another coach we had

  

Ja... roysh.

There is only one team in this really. Ireland are just physically, mentally and skillfully stronger then England.

I actually have a pure hatred for Stuart Barnes. He made more of a deal from that lucky try by Watson that the tries from Madigan and Boss. He is so biased and just a joke a as commentator. Making out that Watson put him self in that situation purposely.
Get a grip ffs Barnes

Also Freddie has been another example of an English 10 who has come under the lime light too soon been made up to be the next big thing by the English media and has allowed the pressure get to him. I really just wish the they would leave these boys alone and allow them to develop at their own pace. I really feel for Freddie because they have pressured him into the set up at a young age and has been hyped up about so much that he has had such high expectations put on him. But when he isn't on form or is having a bad patch the same people criticise and him and put him down when he can't handle the pressure that has been put on him.
It's happened to Cipriani, Farrell, Freddie he past few seasons and i'm sure the same is going to happen to Ford

ME-109 wrote:On a dry pitch that would have been a massacre, England were clueless

For who? You're not gonna win many games if you have that little possession or territory. Great defence, great effort to make 150 tackles or whatever but we really didn't manage the game well. The Saxons were very wasteful.

I just don't know what to make of Madigan. Brilliantly talented player. General at 10? Some of the stuff he does is excellent. Not sure he should be involved in the Ireland 23 right now.

I'll say this; if there was ever a Barbarians game with Niko Matawalu and Ian Madigan at 9 and 10 I'd pay to go and see it.

English fans, what did ye get from that game?  Pushed a far more experienced squad to the edge no?

Standout players?

Is there not a significant chance that with Bowe not yet returned, Schmidt will go with McFadden at 14 and Zebo at 11?

Aaahhh Gibbo, ye of the blue blood. Who would you honestly prefer the ball to go to in open play, McFadden or Zebo?

Do you think burns was playing, that way, under instructions from his coaches? Or is that his idea of how to play naturally?

Artful_Dodger wrote:Is there not a significant chance that with Bowe not yet returned, Schmidt will go with McFadden at 14 and Zebo at 11?

Possibly Dodge, possibly. I like Zebo. He just has that something special. Feic knows we need that. As MesserSchmidt alluded to.

Ruddock my motd. Touhy and Copeland also played very well.

Zebo to start next week, for sure.

Nachos Jones wrote:
Aaahhh Gibbo, ye of the blue blood. Who would you honestly prefer the ball to go to in open play, McFadden or Zebo?

McFadden would probably be the geezer winning it in the 1st place. That's the big differ ... Cant compare em at all. But handy to have the 2 in the same team mate. But what of Fitzy? He will push his way in.

He is a tried and trusted player at the highest level. The rest,  have it yet to prove.

Im loving these selection problems.

Used dream of it.

Gibson wrote:

Nachos Jones wrote:
Aaahhh Gibbo, ye of the blue blood. Who would you honestly prefer the ball to go to in open play, McFadden or Zebo?

McFadden would probably be the geezer winning it in the 1st place. That's the big differ ... Cant compare em at all. But handy to have the 2 in the same team mate. But what of Fitzy? He will push his way in.

He is a tried and trusted WC player at the highest level. The rest,  have it yet to prove.

Im loving these selection problems.

Used dream of it.

With you on that one, finally competition for spots and players pushing for their spot.

Dream ultimate Irish wingers for me? Zebo and Fitz. But its not all about the individual sexy bits in this game... Its all about the complete unit functioning as a smooth-running machine.

Did I just say that?

Gibson wrote:Dream ultimate Irish wingers for me? Zebo and Fitz. But its not all about the individual sexy bits in this game... Its all about the complete unit functioning as a smooth-running machine.  

Did I just say that?

Hows it going Deccy

wales606 wrote:Only saw the last 20,

how did Copeland play?

Made highest number of tackles - 18

So presuming the back row is POM, Henry and Heaslip, whos on the bench?  Ruddock, TOD or Henderson? Ruddock was really good today as was Henderson at lock. I think I'd have TOD though, he was only on for 50/60 minutes but he made more tackles than the others, was always a nuisance at the breakdown and has a good bit of pace.

Possibly have Henderson covering lock.

Would agree with notch, from Henderson out to Copeland we were superb. Madigan is great with front foot ball, but not so great when things get messy. I thought McFadden did really well defensively as did Cave and Henshaw. Jones and Gilroy haven't advanced their case. Tuohy, Henderson, Ruddock, O'Donnell and Copeland have in spades

What a dire game of rugby and it was chuffing freezing, so I left the ground pretty grumpy. England were woeful and predictable. I really feel for Freddie, he is so much better than his current form, but tonight was probably a low point for him despite his prior claim that he has his swagger back. I truly hope for his and England's sake he gets back to playing how he should.

Standulstermen wrote:Would agree with notch, from Henderson out to Copeland we were superb. Madigan is great with front foot ball, but not so great when things get messy. I thought McFadden did really well defensively as did Cave and Henshaw. Jones and Gilroy haven't advanced their case. Tuohy, Henderson, Ruddock, O'Donnell and Copeland have in spades

Would agree with all of that Stand. As much as it... ja.  Maddser was good. Very good, but Paddy J has the edge on him as Irish 2nd 10 at the minute. He did himself no harm here tho. Won us the game in the 1st half.

ROG Eile (Keatley) steadied the ship when he came on, but added nowt really.   Bring on Paddy J and Madigans' nemesis.  JJ.

Its all getting veh veh hot at 10 for our country. We have 4 of em now,  instead of just one, contrary, petulant, Cork,  bollix. And Paddy Bloody Wallace. How far we have come.

ROG Rocks btw. Even more now than he did before. Love how he told it as it is about the Welsh game. Everyone in rugby is thinking this. ROG just says it.

He will coach Ireland one day. Clever buachaill.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/ireland-legend-ronan-ogara-launches-6559407