Wales 6 Nations Squad

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Forwards:
Rob Evans (Scarlets), Paul James (Ospreys), Gethin Jenkins (Cardiff Blues), Tomas Francis (Exeter Chiefs), Aaron Jarvis (Ospreys), Samson Lee (Scarlets), Scott Baldwin (Ospreys), Kristian Dacey (Cardiff Blues), Ken Owens (Scarlets), Jake Ball (Scarlets), Luke Charteris (Racing 92), Bradley Davies (Wasps), Dominic Day (Bath Rugby), Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys), Josh Turnbull (Cardiff Blues), Taulupe Faletau (Newport Gwent Dragons), James King (Ospreys), Dan Lydiate (Ospreys), Ross Moriarty (Gloucester Rugby), Justin Tipuric (Ospreys), Sam Warburton (CAPT) (Cardiff Blues).
Backs:
Aled Davies (Scarlets) *, Gareth Davies (Scarlets), Lloyd Williams (Cardiff Blues) Dan Biggar (Ospreys), Rhys Priestland (Bath Rugby), Cory Allen (Cardiff Blues), Jonathan Davies (Clermont Auvergne), Tyler Morgan (Newport Gwent Dragons), Jamie Roberts (Harlequins), Hallam Amos (Newport Gwent Dragons), Alex Cuthbert (Cardiff Blues), Tom James (Cardiff Blues), George North (Northampton Saints), Gareth Anscombe (Cardiff Blues), Matthew Morgan (Bristol Rugby), Liam Williams (Scarlets).

MO12,seems to me that with Gats stating publicly that his coaching team is world class RobH and RMB won't be going anywhere else soon.Against that their contracts haven't been extended to 2019 like SE.Given that Rob H can list a successful Lions campaign on his CV a successful NZ campaign(???) may lead to his coronation rather than dethronement.Let's hope the 6N shows Welsh back play in a more positive light.Not fully optimistic but not long to find out.

maestegmafia wrote:I think the philosophy he was talking about was "earning the space out wide".

And this mantra is what sees us ignore space we've created if we've done it earlier (phase wise) than we were expecting to. Instead of going wide, we give it to a forward up the middle again, giving time for the opposition defence to reorganise, and the space out wide is gone.

We seem to think that we have to truck it up a set number of times regardless of where the space is.

With JD back we may be inclined to run the ball a little more - I'd prefer to reserve judgement rather than to castigate what has been a largely successful tenure under Gatland. With Scott Williams to come into the mix we have the potential to be far more dynamic and I thin a lot of us would like to see a back row with Sam and Tips and a mid field with Scott and Foxy. The future for me looks bright if we get the platform to play from.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:I think the philosophy he was talking about was "earning the space out wide".

And this mantra is what sees us ignore space we've created if we've done it earlier (phase wise) than we were expecting to. Instead of going wide, we give it to a forward up the middle again, giving time for the opposition defence to reorganise, and the space out wide is gone.

We seem to think that we have to truck it up a set number of times regardless of where the space is.

I agree. It's painting (or rather rugby) by numbers. As soon as we've done it a few times the opposition know what's coming. They know to absorb the phases and get ready to defend out wide. Don't commit too many to the rucks so that they can have numerical advantage in the defensive line, knowing that we've committed at least 2 (man with the ball and player clearing out), but often more, players to the ruck.

RubyGuby wrote:With JD back we may be inclined to run the ball a little more - I'd prefer to reserve judgement rather than to castigate what has been a largely successful tenure under Gatland. With Scott Williams to come into the mix we have the potential to be far more dynamic and I thin a lot of us would like to see a back row with Sam and Tips and a mid field with Scott and Foxy. The future for me looks bright if we get the platform to play from.

Future looks bright with Owen Watkin showing good skills, as well as more established lads like Tyler Morgan.

That Watkin is some lump and he has some quick feet - we just need a front 5 who can provide a platform, we're not far off

15. Gareth Anscombe 14. George North 13. Jonathan Davies 12. Jamie Roberts
11. Tom James 10. Dan Biggar 9. Gareth Davies

1. Rob Evans 2.Scott Baldwin 3. Samson Lee 4. Luke Charteris 5.Alun Wyn Jones
6. Sam Warburton 7.Justin Tipuric 8. Taulupe Faletau

Replacements: Ken Owens, Gethin Jenkins, Tomas Francis, Bradley Davies, Dan Lydiate,
Lloyd Williams, Rhys Priestland, Alex Cuthbert

Pretty gutted not to see Williams and Amos in the mix.

Griff wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:I think the philosophy he was talking about was "earning the space out wide".

And this mantra is what sees us ignore space we've created if we've done it earlier (phase wise) than we were expecting to. Instead of going wide, we give it to a forward up the middle again, giving time for the opposition defence to reorganise, and the space out wide is gone.

We seem to think that we have to truck it up a set number of times regardless of where the space is.

I agree.  It's painting (or rather rugby) by numbers.  As soon as we've done it a few times the opposition know what's coming.  They know to absorb the phases and get ready to defend out wide.  Don't commit too many to the rucks so that they can have numerical advantage in the defensive line, knowing that we've committed at least 2 (man with the ball and player clearing out), but often more, players to the ruck.

That is what they mean by improving execution. A coach is not on the pitch, he can yell as loud as any of the other 80,000 fans telling players what to do but they wont hear. The players need to react to the situations. The players need to spot when they have earned the space they crave, they have to spot the overlaps and the space in the situation. They have to create the opportunities....

That is what Howley and every other coach means when they refer to clinical precision.

It's what they're particularly god at here in Oz.
They recognise an opportunity straight away. It's engrained in how their rugby is played.

RubyGuby wrote:That Watkin is some lump and he has some quick feet - we just need a front 5 who can provide a platform, we're not far off

Great to see such a young front row selected for the Ireland game.

Interesting team.

Good to see Tom James getting a shot,

Shocked to see Rob Evans leap-frogging Gethin and James

Warburton - Tipuric backrow will be interesting.

I would change the following -

Owens to start - more leadership on the field with Gethin benched
Lydiate start - Tipuric would be more effective against tired Irish legs
Amos on the bench - Cuthbert out - Amos is in form and also covers FB.

For me Owens has been uninspiring and not as effective in the majority of his starts for Wales. He often looks good coming off the bench though. I agree with your next choices though munkian, with AWJ as captain for this one.

munkian wrote:I would change the following -

Owens to start - more leadership on the field with Gethin benched
Lydiate start - Tipuric would be more effective against tired Irish legs
Amos on the bench - Cuthbert out - Amos is in form and also covers FB.

mikey_dragon wrote:For me Owens has been uninspiring and not as effective in the majority of his starts for Wales. He often looks good coming off the bench though. I agree with your next choices though munkian, with AWJ as captain for this one.

I agree with your points lads, I am inclined to agree regarding Owens leadership over Baldwins lack of and that is a worry for me... We need a bit more Brain in the front row. Gethin is a hell of a player and game reader.

Lets be honest here we would all want Liam and Amos in there somewhere but the coaching staff have obviously aired on the side of caution with recent injuries - They made the mistake with Liam at the RWC and brought him back to early so we have to accept this. Anscombe doesn't convince me and no odes tom James but we have little back up and Gatland likes 'em big so the Dragons winger and Mathew Morgan will have to wait a while. Priestland and Biggar can cover FB but I think  someone else for Cuthbert would have been useful, maybe Cory Allen if he's fit and I may have even taken a punt at Dan Evans instead of Cuthbert on the bench, although I think Patchell would have covered far more positions that Cuthbert.

I certainly agree with Amos being involved. I think that gametime and injury may have dictated Lydiate's bench selection.
I personally love the Tips/Warbs comnination, and Tips is there on merit at the moment.

Owens' performances from the bench are to the detriment of his non starting selection. He makes a genuine impact for the last 30/25.

I think that size has taken precedence in the back three due to Ireland's kicking game.

Tom James under the high ball

Good team, with a pretty hard running and direct group of backs.

Good to see Tipuric starting in the 6 Nations. Wonderfully skillful operator.

RubyGuby wrote:Tom James under the high ball

Don't worry, if he's not up to it, we can bring on the rock that is Alex Cuthbert...

Going out to play attacking rugby in a very windy Ireland worries me slightly, especially without Sanjay/Amos/Halfpenny under the high ball.

Our back row though...

Not having Liam Williams on the bench will come back and bite us on the @rse.

LordDowlais wrote:Not having Liam Williams on the bench will come back and bite us on the @rse.

If he isn't fit it would bite us harder.

munkian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Not having Liam Williams on the bench will come back and bite us on the @rse.

If he isn't fit it would bite us harder.

He looked pretty fit enough against Connacht last weekend. Unless he has got less fit over the last few days, as he ?

Yes, Connacht in the Pro 12 is exactly the same as Test match pace and intensity

munkian wrote:Yes, Connacht in the Pro 12 is exactly the same as Test match pace and intensity

I did not say he should start, but we have no decent cover for playing the high ball on the bench, if Anscombe has one of his once a game injuries, then who have we got to replace him in a windy, rainy Aviva stadium under the high ball ?

LordDowlais wrote:

munkian wrote:Yes, Connacht in the Pro 12 is exactly the same as Test match pace and intensity

I did not say he should start, but we have no decent cover for playing the high ball on the bench, if Anscombe has one of his once a game injuries, then who have we got to replace him in a windy, rainy Aviva stadium under the high ball ?

Amos would have been the natural choice for back-three cover, but I know you have reservations about him because he plays for the Dragons...

I think Amos would have been a better bet - apparently Sanjay is having another week of fitness training.

munkian wrote:I think Amos would have been a better bet - apparently Sanjay is having another week of fitness training.

I KNEW IT, I absolutely knew it. 

I did not mention Amos as I was waiting to see if a Dragons fan would mention him. Why put a wing at fullback when you already have a fullback you could use just in case.

Also, Amos is a very good winger, but he is does not fill me with confidence at fullback, he is not very good under the high ball.

Amos is class and has the skill set and temperament to play wing or FB - Its a shame he's just back

LordDowlais wrote:

munkian wrote:I think Amos would have been a better bet - apparently Sanjay is having another week of fitness training.

I KNEW IT, I absolutely knew it. 

I did not mention Amos as I was waiting to see if a Dragons fan would mention him. Why put a wing at fullback when you already have a fullback you could use just in case.

Also, Amos is a very good winger, but he is does not fill me with confidence at fullback, he is not very good under the high ball.

Why put someone on the bench that can barely play one position let alone two ? If Sanjay was fully fit he'd start over Halfpenny for me but hes not - hense Anscombe is starting but Amos should be on the bench over Cuthbert.

munkian wrote:Amos should be on the bench over Cuthbert

Yes I totally agree, Hallam Amos is a superior player.

munkian wrote:hense Anscombe is starting

Yes he is starting for the reasons you give, but a three quarters fit fullback is better than playing a winger there. Even if Liam had to come on for 15 mins, he would be a better choice.


Also, as an aside, can anybody tell me what Ansocmbe has done to warrant being in the Welsh squad ?

Anscombe isn't a winger - what are you babbling about ?

I've never said Amos should start.

munkian wrote:Anscombe isn't a winger - what are you babbling about ?

I've never said Amos should start.

I'm not babbling.

I am saying that Liam Williams should be on the bench, to cover fullback and wing if need be, but because we have not got a single fullback in the entire side it will come back to haunt us. I am saying a fit enough full back should be on the bench. You are saying we should put another winger on the bench to cover full back. 

Also, I never said that you said Amos should start.

He isn't just a winger though is he ? He regularly plays full back.

I personally wouldn't want to risk Williams if he isnt fully fit - and the coaches and medical team obviously have their concerns.

LordDowlais wrote:

munkian wrote:Anscombe isn't a winger - what are you babbling about ?

I've never said Amos should start.

I'm not babbling.

I am saying that Liam Williams should be on the bench, to cover fullback and wing if need be, but because we have not got a single fullback in the entire side it will come back to haunt us. I am saying a fit enough full back should be on the bench. You are saying we should put another winger on the bench to cover full back. 

Also, I never said that you said Amos should start.

Looking at the bench, Rhys Priestland is there to cover fly half, fullback. Cuthbert is there to cover the wing, and centre (with North moving into the centre), and Lloyd is there to cover scrum half, and wing (should we get lots of injuries, with other shuffling around). I think that way we have all the back positions covered by people who have played international rugby there before, and who are fully fit.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Rhys Priestland is there to cover fly half, fullback

Shivers down my spine.

LordDowlais wrote:

munkian wrote:Anscombe isn't a winger - what are you babbling about ?

I've never said Amos should start.

I'm not babbling.

I am saying that Liam Williams should be on the bench, to cover fullback and wing if need be, but because we have not got a single fullback in the entire side it will come back to haunt us. I am saying a fit enough full back should be on the bench. You are saying we should put another winger on the bench to cover full back. 

Also, I never said that you said Amos should start.

Anscombe played full back in super rugby as he was deemed to be a better 15 than 10, i'd say hes more got more experience at 15 than 10. We threw an unfit Liam Williams in the Welsh team during the world cup and he came off injured in almost every game. If he's not deemed fit enough by the physios then he shouldn't be anywhere near the team.

ScarletsSpiderman - Can't you just leave us to argue instead of just writing a reasoned and sensible post - Its definitely not Scarlets like - Come on Walessssssssssssssssssssss

True Raven wrote:If he's not deemed fit enough by the physios then he shouldn't be anywhere near the team.

Liam Williams started against Connacht on the weekend and looked anything but not fit. Not having him on the bench will bite us.

RubyGuby wrote:ScarletsSpiderman - Can't you just leave us to argue instead of just writing a reasoned and sensible post - Its definitely not Scarlets like - Come on Walessssssssssssssssssssss

N'ah the last few Scarlets fans to do that on here have been escorted off the premises, so cold boring logic is all I can do.

LordDowlais wrote:

True Raven wrote:If he's not deemed fit enough by the physios then he shouldn't be anywhere near the team.

Liam Williams started against Connacht on the weekend and looked anything but not fit. Not having him on the bench will bite us.

Yet Gatland who has been with him all week thinks his conditioning isnt right for a test match hence hes not in the team at all.....and as SS said, Priestland will cover fullback if need be where he played quite well in his last cameo there (against England at Twickenham)

when's the Irish team announced?

True Raven wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

True Raven wrote:If he's not deemed fit enough by the physios then he shouldn't be anywhere near the team.

Liam Williams started against Connacht on the weekend and looked anything but not fit. Not having him on the bench will bite us.

Yet Gatland who has been with him all week thinks his conditioning isnt right for a test match hence hes not in the team at all.....and as SS said, Priestland will cover fullback if need be where he played quite well in his last cameo there (against England at Twickenham)

Somehow Warburton is deemed fit, and Williams who looked fit on the weekend, isn't. Strange.

mikey_dragon wrote:

True Raven wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

True Raven wrote:If he's not deemed fit enough by the physios then he shouldn't be anywhere near the team.

Liam Williams started against Connacht on the weekend and looked anything but not fit. Not having him on the bench will bite us.

Yet Gatland who has been with him all week thinks his conditioning isnt right for a test match hence hes not in the team at all.....and as SS said, Priestland will cover fullback if need be where he played quite well in his last cameo there (against England at Twickenham)

Somehow Warburton is deemed fit, and Williams who looked fit on the weekend, isn't. Strange.

Especially as Liam Williams's game was against Connacht in Galway, and Warburton's was against the mighty Calvisano at the Arms Park.

So what are our options if Anscombe picks up one of his usual injuries ? We all know he likes to get at least one injury per game, so when this happens what do we do ? 

The answer is, to stick Priestland or Biggar at fullback. Having Priestland anywhere on the pitch does not fill me with confidence.

True Raven wrote:when's the Irish team announced?

Tree o'clock on Tursday I tink.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

True Raven wrote:when's the Irish team announced?

Tree o'clock on Tursday I tink.

Cardiff Dave wrote:

True Raven wrote:when's the Irish team announced?

Tree o'clock on Tursday I tink.

Early for you Dave. Day off?!

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

True Raven wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

True Raven wrote:If he's not deemed fit enough by the physios then he shouldn't be anywhere near the team.

Liam Williams started against Connacht on the weekend and looked anything but not fit. Not having him on the bench will bite us.

Yet Gatland who has been with him all week thinks his conditioning isnt right for a test match hence hes not in the team at all.....and as SS said, Priestland will cover fullback if need be where he played quite well in his last cameo there (against England at Twickenham)

Somehow Warburton is deemed fit, and Williams who looked fit on the weekend, isn't. Strange.

Expecially as Liam Williams's game was against Connacht in Galway, and Warburton's was against the mighty Calvisano at the Arms Park.

Warburton had an extra week of crossfit though, so in Gatland's eyes is fitter.

Bench choice is just weird.

Talk about philosophy not changing, its just more of the same.

Big lumps. Now we have big lumps from 11-14 with a decent sized lump at 15. And another lumper on the bench.

Yet in Amos and Morgan we have something a little different, with Amos still being lumpy.

I accept Liam needs work but i would have expected to see either Amos or Morgan on the bench to run the Irish around in the last 1/4.