Wales 28 man squad for Australia

First topic message reminder :

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/welsh/15809004.stm

Wales coach Warren Gatland has named eight injured players in a 28-man squad for Australia's visit to the Millennium Stadium on 3 December.

Backs Jamie Roberts, George North, Rhys Preistland and Leigh Halfpenny are included despite fitness doubts.

So too are forwards Dan Lydiate, Adam Jones, Luke Charteris and Huw Bennett.

Pre-World Cup captain Matthew Rees returns after injury, but Sam Warburton retains the captaincy for a match that will end Shane Williams' Wales career.


Forwards: Gethin Jenkins, Adam Jones, Ryan Bevington, Scott Andrews, Lloyd Burns, Huw Bennett, Matthew Rees, Bradley Davies, Luke Charteris, Ian Evans, Sam Warburton (captain), Dan Lydiate, Justin Tipuric, Lewis Evans, Toby Faletau, Ryan Jones

Backs: Tavis Knoyle, Lloyd Williams, Rhys Priestland, Dan Biggar, Jamie Roberts, Jonathan Davies, Scott Williams, Shane Williams, George North, Alex Cuthbert, Leigh Halfpenny, Liam Williams


...............................................

Good squad, especially if players can return from injury.


Return to the squad for Ian Evans and Dan Biggar

Newcomers are wingers Alex Cuthbert, Liam Williams and flanker Lewis Evans

Interesting to see that Brew is left out, as is Ken Owens and Jason Tovey

Smirnoffpriest wrote:I didn't say Stephen Jones' situation is rubbish - I said what some fans have been saying about him is rubbish.

I know he'll only retire when he's good and ready (or not at all) and I respect him for it, and IMO he'll be back in the 6N squad unless somehow Biggar/Tovey have absolute stomers in the meantime.

Sorry Mate, I didnt mean to twist what you had said.

But to be fair watching Tovey and Matthew Morgan, even youngsters like Steffan Jones at the Dragons, not so much Biggar but he does kick goals, there are some excellent talents nipping at his boots. Jones without a regular starting place in big games will be lucky to get selected ahead of guys getting regular rugby.

Felt sorry for Tovey on friday, he didnt play badly but Wayne Evans was having a shocker inside him.

It's ok maes, just wanted to make sure I got my point across clearly, which sometimes i don't.

But maes I think the important thing is that at the moment Stephen Jones does bring things to the table that the other 10's don't (even Priestland), even if he does have weaknesses as well. Also the other options behind Priestland are all developing, so I'm sure Jones will be around the squad for another season while the other 10's develop.

It certainly cant hurt to have a player of his experience at our disposal. Whether he will out perform young contenders I am not so sure. He hasnt been a welsh first choice for over a year now.

Whens he naming the side

maestegmafia wrote:

Smirnoffpriest wrote:I didn't say Stephen Jones' situation is rubbish - I said what some fans have been saying about him is rubbish.

I know he'll only retire when he's good and ready (or not at all) and I respect him for it, and IMO he'll be back in the 6N squad unless somehow Biggar/Tovey have absolute stomers in the meantime.

Sorry Mate, I didnt mean to twist what you had said.

But to be fair watching Tovey and Matthew Morgan, even youngsters like Steffan Jones at the Dragons, not so much Biggar but he does kick goals, there are some excellent talents nipping at his boots. Jones without a regular starting place in big games will be lucky to get selected ahead of guys getting regular rugby.

Felt sorry for Tovey on friday, he didnt play badly but Wayne Evans was having a shocker inside him.

I don't agree Maesteg I think Evans was under alot of pressure from a very good Scarlets 9 but it didnt help when Tovey was persistently out of position, his support play and judgement of where he should have been position-wise was pretty shocking and when he had the ball he didnt make one decisive opportunity for his backline.

I havent seen much of Tovey, so can't really make a judgement call, but what little I have seen he has impressed me, but Jones on Friday was a country mile ahead of him

Aye, Jones was...

Tovey had a tough time, but he is a great player. in my opinion the best behind Priestland with the future in mind.

He won't be back in the 6 Nations.

There is no point. Biggar and Tovey have to stand up. Or even Hook if he can learn to play 10.

I am afraid that like Nuggett SJ has been retired there is just no place for him in the future.

Hook is doing well at Perps but he wont be allowed training time off to play for Wales

flyhalffactory wrote:I havent seen much of Tovey, so can't really make a judgement call, but what little I have seen he has impressed me, but Jones on Friday was a country mile ahead of him

I have to take issue with this. Jason Tovey didn't do his claim for inclusion in the national squad any favours on the weekend - he didn't play well - but Stephen Jones hadly set the world alight either. Is it impossible for people to be objective when it comes to Welsh outside halves?

Luckless I'm in agreement with FHF - Jones controlled the ball and the game very well in what was a shoddy game with a poorly managed breakdown which gave only slow ball - Jones made the correct decisions when needed and made sure we played in the right areas - it was difficult for any player to shine - and as a result there was a lot of difficulty for the commentators to pick a MOTM - only Brew really stood out.

I like Tovey, but don't think he furthered his Welsh chances much, which is a shame as Gats seems to look for exuses to drop him rather than looking for reasons to pick him.

playing your own game as best you can when others are under pressure is what sets the level of players apart. jones controlled, used his experience, tovey was all over the shop, not enough experience to call on in certain situations, didnt show any thinking skills as the game progressed, same errors, same bad positioning.

I've already said that Jason Tovey didn't play well. I just didn't think Stephen Jones was 'a country mile ahead of him.'

its difficult to compare two players in two teams in different games, much easier when we switch them with roughly the same players at international level.

performace under pressure will nail it for the young ones, everyone is better in an armchair ride, behind the go forward pack. when the going gets tough.......no good feeling sorry for people, as one poster said about tovey, its the name of the game.

Team to be announced on Tuesday at 12:20

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/rugbynation/rugby-news/2011/11/28/wales-v-australia-live-team-announcement-12-20pm-tuesday-91466-29858339/

Welsh rugby can't bear another loss at this stage. The stakes are higher than ever.

Possibly wales's most important game of the professional era.

Unfortunately Australia were rampant last week, a real worldcup thistle in their paws. I fear a terrible thrashing for the welsh.

atuakiwikiwi wrote:Welsh rugby can't bear another loss at this stage. The stakes are higher than ever.

Possibly wales's most important game of the professional era.

Unfortunately Australia were rampant last week, a real worldcup thistle in their paws. I fear a terrible thrashing for the welsh.

wales can bear and you may be right but i wouldn't judge the game on a lamentable baa baa performance

I stand by it. Despite losing as many as they won and exhibiting the familiar trait of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory, the welsh world cup for some reason generated incredible optimism and the genuine feeling of a new dawn.

What they need now is another good result, something tangible, not yet another plucky loss, or forbid heavy defeat to signal another false dawn.

Lose now and lose the next generation to the same old mediocrity and disbelief.

yeah look i am not sure why you think losing on saturday would herald a lost generation, perhaps it is wishful thinking or maybe you just don't know much about welsh rugby, the new dawn you speak off is a misnomer, Wales new dawn started in 2005 but there has been a rollercoaster ride since largely due to mis management, troughing in 2007 back to a GS in 2008. Lack of strength in depth and, as you correctly point out, an inability to close out big games are major issues. A w in saturday really won't change that, an SH scalp will help but it is the 6 Nations that we must perform in. A bad loss, unliely at home in my view would set us back but one of the few advantages of our record is that we do bounce back quickly - 4th in 6 nations to 4th in RWC in the same year

The Aussies did play a soft Baa Baas team, they played very well against a soft Baa Baas team, we will take little from it in regards to knowing what they can do, other than run in tries if we miss tackles like the Baa Baas did.

But I agree, Wales made a big impression at the RWC cup, despite not winning their semi final or play off.

Too often the close second place, not often enough the impressive victor.

One point raised a few times by people in the press in regard to this Welsh team is that the youth seems to not have the hang ups of the old guard, they have no pretensions, they are also not afraid to see what they could achieve.

Hopefully this will be a great game...!

Yes and we need to dispel the new dawn label. We are competitive but not clinical. Something is missing, its a kicker!

Halfpenny will kick hopefully. Priestland is not bad. good teacher, improved the more time he spent with jenks

I have mixed feelings about Jenks

shared a urinal with him in 2005 in Lan Kwai Fong but we lost out on RWC becuause of kicking. Fact

Gatts wrote:I have mixed feelings about Jenks

shared a urinal with him in 2005 in Lan Kwai Fong but we lost out on RWC becuause of kicking. Fact

Only the French had a decent kicking average, the balls were funny not Jenks... Referring to the second half of your post not the first there by the way

So Im predicting this team being announced tomorrow,

1. Geth
2. Smiler
3. Andrews
4. Bradley
5. I Evans
6. Lydiate
7. Warbs (c)
8. Faletau
9. Ll Williams
10. Priestland
11. Shane
12. Roberts
13. JD
14. North
15. L Williams

16. Bevvington
17.Benett
18. Ryan
19. Tipuric
20. Tavis
21. Biggar
22. Cuthbert

TycroesOsprey wrote:So Im predicting this team being announced tomorrow,

1. Geth
2. Smiler
3. Andrews
4. Bradley
5. I Evans
6. Lydiate
7. Warbs (c)
8. Faletau
9. Ll Williams
10. Priestland
11. Shane
12. Roberts
13. JD
14. North
15. L Williams

16. Bevvington
17.Benett
18. Ryan
19. Tipuric
20. Tavis
21. Biggar
22. Cuthbert

Im fairly sure Halfpenny should be fit

If fit he will. pretty major op he went through post RWC

Yeah I was assuming he wont be ready yet from some of the sounds coming out of the press, but thats just me reading between the lines rather than anything definite. It feels like they are building liam up for his first cap.

Other than wanting to see Cuthbert in red Im quite excited about that team.

maestegmafia wrote:If fit he will. pretty major op he went through post RWC

? Halfpenny didnt have an operation - He was supposed to be back for the Blues a week ago - but obviously has taken a bit longer to recover, but I dont see why he would need 2 weeks more.

He had the pin taken out if his ankle that they put in to do the RWC didnt he...?

maestegmafia wrote:He had the pin taken out if his ankle that they put in to do the RWC didnt he...?

Oh, perhaps...cant really remember - still, not a major op (I should know, ive had similar) - and he was due to be back for the Blues last week.

*fingers crossed*

Well yes, fingers crossed. You have the experience, sounds bloody painful to me

Gatts wrote:A bad loss, unliely at home in my view would set us back

Well they tonked us last time they were in Cardiff.

Gatts wrote:yeah look i am not sure why you think losing on saturday would herald a lost generation, perhaps it is wishful thinking or maybe you just don't know much about welsh rugby, the new dawn you speak off is a misnomer, Wales new dawn started in 2005 but there has been a rollercoaster ride since largely due to mis management, troughing in 2007 back to a GS in 2008. Lack of strength in depth and, as you correctly point out, an inability to close out big games are major issues. A w in saturday really won't change that, an SH scalp will help but it is the 6 Nations that we must perform in. A bad loss, unliely at home in my view would set us back but one of the few advantages of our record is that we do bounce back quickly - 4th in 6 nations to 4th in RWC in the same year

No I disagree. The eyes of the world are on Wales now. They expect them to deliver on that promise of the world cup.

If they can't. We'll know the excuses made for the loss against France (blaming the referee), and the excuses made about the 3/4 play off were just that - excuses. And the excuse made against SA in the pool was just that - an excuse.

The Welsh coaching staff claimed that Wales would have beaten NZ in the RWC final. Well, here's a change to go some way to validate that lofty claim.

If Wales can't beat Australia at home, I suspect the tag of "village idiots" may come back to roost.

Atuakiwikiwi,

I agree that Wales now have to stand and deliver. They want to prove they are the best, that the should be consistently in the top three or four of the IRB rankings, a serious threat in the RWC and unbeatable at home.

Aim high, these players aren't scared, they have no baggage of previous failure or expectation haunting them.

They'll give it a really good push, I recon that the Aussies won't be taking this game at all lightly either.

Yes as I say. Now is the time for Wales to deliver. I think a home loss would set Wales back some distance. That's why I think there is so much pressure on Wales. And the reason I think this is the most important game for Wales in the professional era.

Surely you must expect to win your home games at the end of the SH's long season, when the SH sides are playing developmental sides with core guys out of position.

For so long Wales have not been in that position, they were happy to keep it close and make a good account of themselves.

But to reach the level of aspiration - to claim you "would have won the world cup" means you have to deliver in this situations. And with some style.

A loss would be unthinkably devastating to those credentials.

But then again, so does every international team, all the time anyway. So really things are no different, only that the press and public are a little more excited after Wales finished fourth in the RWC.

atuakiwikiwi wrote:
A loss would be unthinkably devastating to those credentials.

I agree wholeheartedly.

Good luck to them eh...! I am sure no one would like to see the Aussies come off a game severely second best more than a passionate Kiwi like yourself...?

Make no mistake. The result of this game is *huge*. The time for near misses and excuse making must be over if Wales are to move out of their comfort zone down the IRB rankings and become real contenders for 2015.

A defeat, even a fairly narrow defeat, would be quite a blow. After good performances at the Wold Cup but, once again, losing to teams we're aiming to beat, if we lose to the Wallabies on the weekend, the question will be asked: what's changed?

It isn't huge, not at all...it's a throwaway game so the WRU could top up the coffers because they missed out on the AI's. They did the same last time in 07. I care more about the 2 weeks of Heineken Cup rugby after this match and hope no blues players pick up any injuries from this pointless outing.

The *Huge* matches start in February when the 6 nations begins, the best tournament in world rugby.

Don't believe it. Wales *must* beat Australia. It's an international. And a home one. For the successful returning Wales team.

Losing to Australia at the end of their long season with key players missing could put Wales' entire year into context...at that point it would be about one win over England and one win over Ireland at the RWC surely? That would seem more like a team desperately clinging on to their 8th place ranking, rather than contenders for world cup glory?

It is an important game to win, but as ever, we will be judged on the 6Ns.

The summer games in Aus are more important.

Wales 0 - 1 Australia

3 Games left to play

How will Wales' ranking be affected if they win this one? I would've thought they'd leap substantially.

atuakiwikiwi wrote:

Gatts wrote:yeah look i am not sure why you think losing on saturday would herald a lost generation, perhaps it is wishful thinking or maybe you just don't know much about welsh rugby, the new dawn you speak off is a misnomer, Wales new dawn started in 2005 but there has been a rollercoaster ride since largely due to mis management, troughing in 2007 back to a GS in 2008. Lack of strength in depth and, as you correctly point out, an inability to close out big games are major issues. A w in saturday really won't change that, an SH scalp will help but it is the 6 Nations that we must perform in. A bad loss, unliely at home in my view would set us back but one of the few advantages of our record is that we do bounce back quickly - 4th in 6 nations to 4th in RWC in the same year

No I disagree. The eyes of the world are on Wales now. They expect them to deliver on that promise of the world cup.

If they can't. We'll know the excuses made for the loss against France (blaming the referee), and the excuses made about the 3/4 play off were just that - excuses. And the excuse made against SA in the pool was just that - an excuse.

The Welsh coaching staff claimed that Wales would have beaten NZ in the RWC final. Well, here's a change to go some way to validate that lofty claim.

If Wales can't beat Australia at home, I suspect the tag of "village idiots" may come back to roost.

I suspect you are right, it will come back like some grey, ghostly apparition