How did Kevin McLaughlin avoid a citing

I've just seen the footage on sky. How did he escape a citing.

http://www.skysport.co.nz/rugby/

There is clear footage of him attacking Richie McCaw's face up to three times in a maul early on in the game. I can understand that the officials might have missed the action live, but it appears blatant on replay and at least worth a citing. I think he's a lucky boy and he's dodged a bullet.

No idea, its been discussed on other threads a few times.

Totally agree, he is very lucky as other players have had hefty bans for similar offences.

In his defence he's certainly not a dirty player, but no excuses you can't put your hands round a players face like that. He's a lucky boy indeed.

He's Irish, since when do they get cited?

I went back on skyplus to have a look, expecting to see a bit of minimal contact to the face....but no, he went at McCaw’s face a few times and was only stopped because someone else flung McCaw out the side.....

I thought citings could be made over a longer period now? Anyway, it would have been down to McCaw, if he thought nothing happened to his eyes, then he probably feels it was a non issue?

And yet Dagg copped it big time. We have McCaw involved now in two clear cut 'facial' incidents and he/ABs havn't made anything of it. What's to gain from this stance?

What's done is done. I'm just a bit surprised that no one picked it or made an issue out of it. Maybe Liam Toland should watch it.

Obviously NZ didn't feel there was anything in it but I'm surprised the independent citing committee didn't pick up on it.

It is ridiculous when you see some of the "tip tackle" citings that this was missed.

I'm glad Kevin is out there for us but he should have been cited.

Also, I may add, anyone querying why McCaw wasn't gushing with praise in his after match speech may recall he did the same when rougerie that dirty scumbag tried to push McCaw's eyes to the back of his head.

BCL, I mentioned it in a thread a couple of days ago that TJ on Reunion just blew it off as 'an introduction to the game for McCaw'. Very unlike TJ and I was surprised myself he didn't go off on one. For me, it didn't look great. Maybe we like the Irish too much and are willing to bend over backwards for them as we secretly gag for them to finally win a game so we can drink guiness without feeling guilty

I think you would need tosee it closer up, but based on what I see in the clip, he deserves to be bannerd and I'm disappointed he isn't.

Thomond wrote:I think you would need tosee it closer up, but based on what I see in the clip, he deserves to be bannerd and I'm disappointed he isn't.

Agree it paints Ireland in a bad light. For all our bad mouthing Mealamu and Umaga for the O'Driscoll incident I think its a shame that on our last two tours to NZ we had Heaslip intentionally knee a player into the head (red card) and McLaughlin make very blatent contact with the eyes.

Doesnt reflect us in a good way.

EBOP interesting take on it. I'm not saying he should have been banned. I would have thought it was a case for due process and hearing to hear his explanation. I can't remember the citing process. If the AB's can cite and didn't then that's probably good enough for me.

Red Stag and Thomond. I don't think it reflects on you in a bad way. Even if it was bad, and whilst I think a hearing would have been good, I think he has a right to be heard. It's the action of one player and we all have players who do rash things.

blackcanelion wrote:Red Stag and Thomond. I don't think it reflects on you in a bad way.

Damn right! Jeebus stag it wasn't Enda Kenny who gouged McCaw man! You can't blame the whole country!

For sure, no hard feelings. Actually you guys put your hand up right away without trying to wriggle about. Couldn't ask for more than that. Ah well, done and dusted, although we'll store it in the memory banks whenever we get accused of something vile and dastardly

EBOP wrote: we'll store it in the memory banks whenever we get accused of something vile and dastardly

I didn't catch it but agree he should be cited and properly punished if it's true. Macaw's face was in a bad state alright.

Anyone see how Ross got his tomato eye?

I read on another forum that Trimble "gouged" Ross in the warm up.

McLaughlin is lucky by all accounts,I haven't seen a decent replay yet and the guy has a very clean record but if it's as bad as it looks then he should have got something.At the very least it looked reckless.

mankiaow wrote:I didn't catch it but agree he should be cited and properly punished if it's true. Macaw's face was in a bad state alright.

Anyone see how Ross got his tomato eye?

That happened in training apparently. An accident with Trimble. Must have only come up after the game.

RE the OP, McLaughlin was very stupid and deserves some time out.

well well well , isnt this just interesting.

What's interesting?

Just saw it. The three or four cracks he had don't look good. I can understand a stray hand going into the face but not raking and not the accuracy he had in getting McCaw's face three times. Definitely needed a looking at and to let the guys in charge sort out an appropriate penalty.

You need to waiting until someone gouge the NH player then we will have a new IRB directive and every time some touch to the face at all they will get the yellow!

I think this McLaughlin will have the target to his back now. But maybe show the All Blacks miss the enforcer? Brad Thorn would have been in there sort out the problem like he did for Quade Cooper.

I really hate your atitude towards the NH awop

McCaw didn't say anything because he doesn't have to. He's hard and beyond that and I'm sure he'll use it as motivation to play him off the park on Saturday.

anotherworldofpain wrote:You need to waiting until someone gouge the NH player then we will have a new IRB directive and every time some touch to the face at all they will get the yellow!

I think this McLaughlin will have the target to his back now. But maybe show the All Blacks miss the enforcer? Brad Thorn would have been in there sort out the problem like he did for Quade Cooper.

AWOP is a troll with a point, had this been a NZer doing that to an Irish player there would have been the very predictable uproar,sorta like some posters suggesting Dagg deserved more than a yellow for his charge down .But noo kiwis brushed it aside and didnt whinge,good on them

Cant help but think that McCaw would have regarded it as a victory, If McLaughlin is concentrating on his eyes then hes distracted from the game.

Bullsbok wrote:

anotherworldofpain wrote:You need to waiting until someone gouge the NH player then we will have a new IRB directive and every time some touch to the face at all they will get the yellow!

I think this McLaughlin will have the target to his back now. But maybe show the All Blacks miss the enforcer? Brad Thorn would have been in there sort out the problem like he did for Quade Cooper.

AWOP is a troll with a point, had this been a NZer doing that to an Irish player there would have been the very predictable uproar,sorta like some posters suggesting Dagg deserved more than a yellow for his charge down .But noo kiwis brushed it aside and didnt whinge,good on them

ONE Irish poster thought Dagg deserved more than a yellow. Everyone else thought it was fair enough.

Which miss the point.

If it was Irish player get the yellow and McCaw do the gouging we would hear recite the story that NZ are cheats who get away with it and have a different rules by the IRB!

It is the way the cookie crumbles, I remember the extreme uproar when Burger did it, there are still posters on here 3 years later that will tell you they hate Schalk Burger, it is the same with the Bakkies incident during the British and Irish tour in 2009, Jones injured his shoulder with Bakkies charging into him at a ruck, the outrage for something that happens in every match was ridiculous, it happened with Pocock last weekend, when(can't remember the plaeyr's name) launched into Pocock in a ruck.

I guess the lesson in this is people in glass houses shouldn't be so keen to throw stones.

biltongbek wrote:It is the way the cookie crumbles, I remember the extreme uproar when Burger did it, there are still posters on here 3 years later that will tell you they hate Schalk Burger, it is the same with the Bakkies incident during the British and Irish tour in 2009, Jones injured his shoulder with Bakkies charging into him at a ruck, the outrage for something that happens in every match was ridiculous, it happened with Pocock last weekend, when(can't remember the plaeyr's name) launched into Pocock in a ruck.

I guess the lesson in this is people in glass houses shouldn't be so keen to throw stones.

Aye looks like the northerners arent saints themselves or the southerners are just hard men

Ah come on now, no one is condoning McLaughlins actions here, everyone agrees he should have been cited and banned. No one wants to see that sort of stuff, regardless if it is Burger, McLaughlin or anyone else.

As Mick said above, only one poster suggested Dagg warranted more than a yellow....the concensus a amongst most posters across the board was that a penalty and yellow was more than sufficient punishment for Dagg.

By all means feel aggrieved that McLaughlin avoided a citing but lets not make stop up please

I never said anyone is condoning, it, my point is all nations have players who have brain farts, some judicial commission are obviously more astute than others, but acknowledge that it isn't only one or two "usuals" it is everyone, that way we may be a little more objective when we pull out the stones.

Yes but you are indicating that people are being inconsistant with their views with your glass stones comment...I don't see why you are bringing up the Burger incident?

Thats in the past and water under the bridge but most people have been fairly consistant here with that incident and this.

If there is an inconsistancy it lies with the citing commission so I don't know why a few people want to have a pop at the Irish fans specifically and NH fans generally?

Summing up? Dagg deserved yellow, McLaughlin red if it'd been seen, Burger red, Bakkies nothing and the guy who rain in to clean out Pocock nothing.

Those are my thoughts anyway. Now I'm just nervous about tomorrow!

The Aussie commentators thought it was a bit of a cheap shot on Pocock but that's about it. Didn't Butch James get a red card and a few weeks to think about what he did for a similar incident in super rugby earlier this season where he cleaned out coming in from the side without any arms?

The Dagg incident is unrelated, it was a nothing incident..a bit of cynical play that was dealt with on the pitch with a penalty and yellow. Sometimes they're given somtimes they aren't. Nothing else to see there.

This is a serious incident and McLaughlin should have been cited and banned as others have before him for similar incidents...malicious or otherwise. You can't put your hands round a players face like that. Its dangerous and inexcusable and that stuff needs to be stamped out.

I have no idea why it wasn't cited but that question needs to be directed to NZ and the citing commission.

rodders wrote:Yes but you are indicating that people are being inconsistant with their views with your glass stones comment...I don't see why you are bringing up the Burger incident?

Thats in the past and water under the bridge but most people have been fairly consistant here with that incident and this.

If there is an inconsistancy it lies with the citing commission so I don't know why a few people want to have a pop at the Irish fans specifically and NH fans generally?

Rodders, do you have any idea how much flack I copped and still get for the Burger incident. I was reminded about it just this week on one of the threads. If I remembered the thread I would highlight it for you.

My point is about over reacting when it isn't one's own country men, similar to the Welsh vs Englaish threads we see on here at times. I am not saying everyone over reacts, but there are a fair few that do.

As far as this incident goes and the shoulder charge on Pocock, I am of the mind, things happen in rugby as it is a contact sport and it gets far too much attention.

Fair enough Biltong... there are few that shout about these things but I think they are in the minority.

I think incidents need to be looked at on their own merits but there does need to be more consistancy.

Maybe the SH have a more leniant view on things, I don't know. I can only speak for myself... I don't like to see gouging and think it needs to be dealt with fairly severely.... even if it is accidental because the risk of serious injury is so high.

Good point biltong. Being very general here, but some NH can be quick to jump down the throat of SH in these circumstances. Would be interesting to compare the Dagg YC thread and this one to see if there's any difference in tone/accusations. To be fair, the Irish weren't too harsh on Dagg, but it was a minor incident. Anyways, it's a citing issue really, think we all agree on that.

I think there were two polar opposite opinions on Dagg from two posters ( AWOP (no penalty) and Brenomac (red card)).... pretty much everyone else, regardless of nationality or hemisphere where somewhere in between with their views and felt yellow and/ or penalty was sufficient.

Everyone so far has agreed on McLaughlin. It was discussed on Irish threads previously.

I think there's a few people inventing a SH/NH thing here that doesn't exist, at least not in these two instances .

Rodders, where is everyone today???

(The irish i mean)

Drinking, I think they are getting in the "mood" or "zone" for tomorrow

PM for Clive

True rodders, I agree you guys have been level headed, I'm not having a dig at the irish. But some of the incidents that biltong mentioned with SA, boy oh boy, did that stir up a fuss. It's just an observation how some of us react to these things and it's probably not fair to paint NH with the same brush.

Sometimes it's like these incidents are used as lightening rods for team performances (i.e., losses). Because SH invariably win, we're more blasé, the NH lose, and they're ropable.

If we'd lost on Saturday, you may have seen a more vitriolic response to the McCaw incident. We won, McCaw can still read the paper, so hey, let's not worry about it too much. Still, the question has to be asked, what do the citing people do and do they even exist?

clivemcl wrote:Rodders, where is everyone today???

(The irish i mean)

Anseo!

Most people agreed Burger should have seen red, but some actually defended him at the time. No one here has condoned what Mclaughlin done, every Irish person here has condemned it. Both incidents deserve red. Let's get on with the game.

Btw, the Burger incident is kind of different, as us Irish can't be held accountable if the other nations media kicked up a lot of fuss(it was the Lions after all), that's not to say the Irish media weren't blameless, but we're usually more balanced and less sensational, my opinion of course.

biltongbek wrote:It is the way the cookie crumbles, I remember the extreme uproar when Burger did it, there are still posters on here 3 years later that will tell you they hate Schalk Burger, it is the same with the Bakkies incident during the British and Irish tour in 2009, Jones injured his shoulder with Bakkies charging into him at a ruck, the outrage for something that happens in every match was ridiculous, it happened with Pocock last weekend, when(can't remember the plaeyr's name) launched into Pocock in a ruck.

I guess the lesson in this is people in glass houses shouldn't be so keen to throw stones.

It's funny the different way people remember things.I remember the incidents as well but my main memory is of S.A. fans and coaches.I think the phrase they used was "it's not ballet dancing" and I remember a brain dead justice campaign by the S.A. players.On several forums and websites there were loads comments from S.A. fans telling the soft NH guys to get over it,maybe I just remember them because they were the ones that annoyed me.

If Irish fans were on here defending McLaughlin and our coaches said McCaw had nothing to complain about because once you step on a rugby pitch these things happen then I think there would be some comparison.

EBOP wrote:
If we'd lost on Saturday, you may have seen a more vitriolic response to the McCaw incident. We won, McCaw can still read the paper, so hey, let's not worry about it too much. Still, the question has to be asked, what do the citing people do and do they even exist?

I think thats a good point, when your team lose inevitably these things take on more significance...but of course that doesn't make them any more serious. People get more wound up when they lose, frustration and emotions can influence your view on things, whereas when you win you tend have a different perspective.

I suppose as the NH tend to lose more games that maybe would explain any discrepency in the reactions! ......

Guys,

I can't seem to get that video to play. Anyone else have probs or am I just doing something stupid?