What are your thoughts on the new trump course?

First topic message reminder :

So trump has officially opened his new course on the menie estate and among the first players to tee off were Monty and Paul Lawrie. It is sad to see that Paul lawrie makes another decision which only someone unable to comprehend a wider world could make. For Monty, associating with the obtuse just seems normal and unfortunately he seems comfortable with this.

Lawrie skips the US open and then fails to realise what a terrible raping of the land he is condoning. He can help all the young Scottish folks in the world but it does not seem to help him to expand his mind.

There is no doubt I will get the usual backlash from those who see environmentalists as over sensitive or only repeating what the guardian told us to. But I would hope everyone, regardless of whether you think destroying an sssi is ok, can see that a great fraud has been committed against the people of Aberdeen and the country as a whole in the building of this course. The levels of corruption needed to gain planning permission for this course are just unacceptable and the government should never be held to ransom by one individual businessman.

Why any pro golfer would want to be seen standing by trump is a mystery, well it is not really; they no doubt had their wallets sufficiently stuffed. You would just hope they had a bit more integrity.

McLaren wrote:Navy

I noticed that but couldn't be arsed to change it.


Mysti

it is my own fault really as I choose not to work, as I do not want to work in a capitalist system. So I just have to live of the dole.

Mac, all I can say is I'm afraid you've gone right down in my estimation. I enjoy reading some of your comments, but to say you'd rather be on JSA taking handouts from a system you refuse to work in, is imo a joke. You don't have to live off the dole, you are choosing to!

Does this also mean you are choosing to accept council tax & housing benefits to pay for your home, or do you rely on your lady to pay bills, rent, to feed and clothe you. Either way its bad form. Its different if you lost your job, and its a stop gap whilst you actively seek employment but to say its how you choose to gain your money over working for it because you don't like the system but are happy to take from it is odd at best. I just hope you are joking.

Back to the thread, any other good courses in the are my mates and I should consider, as were booking trumpton for the last week in August but looking to play a couple of others in order to make the trip worthwhile

Fader, royal Aberdeen, murcar and possibly newburgh on ythan, cruden bay too.

I think mac is joshing too, pretty sure he's a civil servant.

Cheers for the courses SR, I hope he's joshing but you never know!

I think he's of the opinion there is nothing wrong with sitting on the dole, which is pretty disgraceful, but he's in favour of unfettered immigration too so he may well be a lead swinging dole bludger.

There is everything wrong with being workshy and sitting on the dole. If you unemployed through loss of work but actively seeking employment then fair enough as you've contributed to paying your JSA, but those that can't be bothered as they get everything for nothing really annoys me.

Exactly Fader, it's a safety net, not a lifestyle. About time we capped how long people can be on it who are perfectly healthy. It's not hard to get a job.

Too often, to many are using as a means of income to subsidise their lifestyles, sadly they always seem better off than those that work hard. i'd rather work in McDonalds than be jobless but thats me.

Funny how those on benefits always have plenty cigarettes, a 50inch TV and a satellite dish, even if their kids are starving.

It's funny how you don't begrudge oil companies stealing billions but can't stand people claiming benefits. Odd way of seeing the world.

exactly SR that never ceases to amaze me how people plead poverty when on the rock n roll, saying can't feed kids, can't clothe them, yet both parents have 20 a day, sky tv, a new car and all the latest gear themselves.

Diggers wrote:It's funny how you don't begrudge oil companies stealing billions but can't stand people claiming benefits. Odd way of seeing the world.

How are Oil companies stealing billions?

super, you know I was taking the urine?

I don't think you are on the rock n roll Mac, I don't know what you do for work, something that involves being a member of a union I imagine.

dont you work as some admin assitant for the council mac?

Expoitation Super, self gain at the expense of others. You knock dole whallers for having the exact same ethical code as the industry you work in.

Diggers, for heavens sake. Is it exploitation or is it opportunity. Exactly who are being exploited and how?
Nobody is forcing governments to sell their licence blocks, besides Oil companies generate wealth. Dole cheats do not.

Besides you, whether you like it or not are dependent on oil for your very existence.

By the way i signed on every time i lost a job, or come back from travelling,etc when i was younger..

But it lasted for a max of 2 months a time. Nothing wrong with it at all, But obviously never a long term option. But what strikes me is how hard it can be to find these employees these days with so many unemployed. I have called the local Rock and Role office 3 times and put an add in for trainee engineers and sales staff. And lol I got a total of 10 engineer interview and about 20 sales interviews- 25 of them never turned up for the interview!!

Its a joke.

super_realist wrote:Diggers, for heavens sake. Is it exploitation or is it opportunity. Exactly who are being exploited and how?
Nobody is forcing governments to sell their licence blocks, besides Oil companies generate wealth. Dole cheats do not.

Besides you, whether you like it or not are dependent on oil for your very existence.

Just because I am dependant on something doesnt mean I have to fawn and drool at the way the companies go about doing business. Im not going to sit here and give you chapter and verse of the crimes of the oil companies...and in the past there have defintely been crimes......research it yourself if you care that much. I suspect you'd rather ignore it as it suits your own purposes to do so.

Diggers, I don't deny that in the past, around the 50-60's there was probably a good deal of exploitation in the industry especially in West Africa, just as there was in lots of industries of the time.

however, those same countries would be considerably worse off without their presence these days.

The industry is so heavily regulated these days.

You mean like the banks are regulated ?

Why do people care about those that dont bother to work and just collect benefits when the unemployment rate is currently about 8%? Meaning there is not a job out there for everyone.

Would you rather all those people really wanting a job, who cant get one, also had to compete against those who have no motivation to work? As x% of the bums would get jobs over those willing to work.

I also ask what benefit there is to your economy of having a less motivated and less reliable work force?

You should maybe be thankful these inefficient labour units take themselves out the game.

Mac, by having perpetual benefits you create a proportion of the population who will never work.

I've no problem with benefits as a safety net, but they are handed out with abandon to the long term useless who know how to abuse the system.

Love to see how Salmond intends to deal with this if he gets what he wants (hopefully he won't) because the benefit system will be the biggest drain on his exchequer.

its kind off obvious what you do with benefits- they clean th parks and streets for there bunce! or if there are on incapacity benefits they can work as admin staff in council offices, or they can work for local businesses a couple of days a week and they can pay the benefits(id be happy to do that- no dramas)..

Everyone should do something for there benefit!

Mac

I don't have a problem with benefits per se but I do have a problem with the expectation that those claiming them should be entitled to huge plasma TVs, Sky, iPhones etc etc. I've had enough recent exposure to part of the system and a lot of it stinks....badly.

Anyway, why are we discussing this benefits bollards on the Trump thread??

navyblueshorts wrote:Mac

I don't have a problem with benefits per se but I do have a problem with the expectation that those claiming them should be entitled to huge plasma TVs, Sky, iPhones etc etc. I've had enough recent exposure to part of the system and a lot of it stinks....badly.

That sums up my issues exactly.

"What are your thoughts on the new Trump Course?"

Dunno yet but the booking process seems simple enough, I'll let you know what I think of the course mid-September. I've decided to head North after the Tassie for a few days and take in Royal Aberdeen, Cruden Bay and Trumpton. Playing it on Monday the 10th.

I'll judge the course on it's merits not on the ego, reputation or wealth of it's Proprietor.

The fact is, it's now there, it can't be undone so enjoy it if you can.

I've never quite understood the environmentalists arguments and can't help thinking they've just got a wee bit above themselves in the past few years...did Braid or Colt ever get opposition when they were cutting swathes through dunes or the Berkshire/Surrey sand belt forests??

I've asked this before...Given it's apparent vital importance...were there ever coach trips for environmentalists or ornithologists or or some other group of sandal wearing hippies up to see the sssi???

Saunton in a way is a bit similar i.e. a huge mass of dunes. There are 2 lovely courses on the fringes of the dunes. There's enough space to put another half a dozen courses but an sssi prevents any further development. But the sssi wasn't there when the first 2 courses were built, what's changed?

JAS -
I've asked this before...Given it's apparent vital importance...were there ever coach trips for environmentalists or ornithologists or or some other group of sandal wearing hippies up to see the sssi???

Yes, when I studied at Aberdeen, we surveyed the dunes here as part of a continuous exercise.

I hear and see that the course is remarkable. You'd hope so for £100M. My problem is that it's been created by yet another ethically corrupt organisation. Someone questioned what was wrong with it if it created jobs? Does that person work in the arms trade? Heck, that creates jobs, so what's the problem?

OK, that's taking the point to the extreme but I am sick and tired of hearing about businesses operating in a dubious manner, at best, and a downright illegal one at worst. Trump is the most unpleasant of individuals - arrogant, conceited, bullying,... and to say that he's actually very astute... I've no doubt he is but does that mean he has to be an ar$ehole with it?

I'll not be playing the course and I'd not play it even if it was paid for. It's a point of principle.

thedamned3putt wrote:JAS -
I've asked this before...Given it's apparent vital importance...were there ever coach trips for environmentalists or ornithologists or or some other group of sandal wearing hippies up to see the sssi???

Yes, when I studied at Aberdeen, we surveyed the dunes here as part of a continuous exercise.

I hear and see that the course is remarkable. You'd hope so for £100M. My problem is that it's been created by yet another ethically corrupt organisation. Someone questioned what was wrong with it if it created jobs? Does that person work in the arms trade? Heck, that creates jobs, so what's the problem?

OK, that's taking the point to the extreme but I am sick and tired of hearing about businesses operating in a dubious manner, at best, and a downright illegal one at worst. Trump is the most unpleasant of individuals - arrogant, conceited, bullying,... and to say that he's actually very astute... I've no doubt he is but does that mean he has to be an ar$ehole with it?

I'll not be playing the course and I'd not play it even if it was paid for. It's a point of principle.

Ok fair enough...so what was the long term wider benefit to society from the outcomes of such study? Also...the dunes are still there, the course looks like it takes up a small part of it.
You've admitted yourself that your main problem is with the man himself and his organisation rather than the alleged damaging of the dunes. I hope I never get as twisted as I grow older. The fact is I love my golf and I don't have time for pointless conscientious objection. I bet Donald will be really upset that you don't wish to play his course!!

is that "when you grow older" or when you grow up, JAS?

Some excellent photos of the place: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=9a95714495c68ab58d40571d8976fcf9&topic=52814.0

Shotrock wrote:Some excellent photos of the place: http://www.golfclubatlas.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=9a95714495c68ab58d40571d8976fcf9&topic=52814.0

Pretty good. Looks potentially brutal, especially if there's any wind.

I can see them having the Scottish Open there pretty soon if the rumours surrounding sponsorship and fat Salmonds tax payers input to holding it at Castle Stuart are true.

The BBC reported Scottish Government financial backing as a matter-of-fact as a passing comment in this piece:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/golf/18829600

Best of luck with any call for a public enquiry...

Not looking for a public inquiry, and nor do I really care about the Plastic Scottish Governments financial intervention, but I do think it might be better supported if it spent a couple of years at say Carnoustie and then at Trump which I doubt would need any backing from Salmond, who once again is trying to jingo-ise everything with the word Scotland or Scottish in it for his own aims.

The fat nob.

super_realist wrote:...The fat nob.

Classic.

OK, starting to get some feedback now from guys who have played Trump in the last couple of weeks. To a man, everyone has been blown away by how good it is already. All comments are from guys how have played on a serious number of great courses in the UK and overseas.

"Best course I've played in the UK".

"Miles better than Castle Stuart and Kingsbarns".

"Best course I've played anywhere".

Sounds pretty awesome! Hoping to play it myself in August, so will report back. The rough is brutal at the moment. Very little first cut, so missing the fairway generally means a lost ball. A few spots on the fairways that need to mature/recover from the last few months of rain. Otherwise nothing but praise so far.

"All comments are from guys how have played on a serious number of great courses in the UK and overseas."

They may have played many great courses but can you confirm whether or not they are qualified to comment on the quality of the course? By this I mean a decent understanding of course design and how this will relate to the playability of the course for all abilities.

It is all very well playing many courses but I am only interested in the opinions of those with the required intellect to properly analyse the course. I have no doubt trump has played the top 100 courses in the world but his opinion is pretty much totally null and void due to being a uncultured and uneducated buffoon.

Mac, you are no more qualified than anyone else.

Stop this nonsense.

If 100% of people are saying it's amazing, then it's a pretty safe bet that it's been well designed.

Really, when Braid Hills is the extent of your wisdom, you really can't comment on whether other people are in a position to say.

Mac ... Appreciate your point, and yes, I can confirm the intellect of the guys involved

Happen to share some of your views on Trump as an individual. Re-inforced by a couple of conversations I had on Saturday night about people who were working on the development and couldn't wait to get it finished and away from the bully boy antics employed by Trump throughout. Was a total nightmare to work for.

I tend to agree about some of the comments on here about Trump, the only problem with nasty people like him, is how many people does he have in his pocket, would imagine, the list is very endless from Political parties, Police, councils, and god knows who else.

He has invested millions of pounds, on such a course, but how much was handed out in backhanders, so he could achieve his original designs.

I think it would be a dark day for Scotland, if his course was used to promote Scottish golf, his money is tainted, and Scotland should rise above this nasty person,

It's amusing how holier than thou some people are on here, I bet not a single person would turn down a free round.

super_realist wrote:It's amusing how holier than thou some people are on here, I bet not a single person would turn down a free round.

I would.

Sorry but I practice what I preach, no way would I be within 10 miles of his tainted property/course.

It's amazing how un-special an SSSI actually has to be to be given that status. There are more than 4000 in England and Wales alone.

I don't see the problem with modifying what is a very small part of this one to create what could be the UK's best course.

well in fairness it looks close to being the best course we have, i am abit jealous that its not close to me

I don't get the holier than thou status people take either, regardless if the guy who owns it is a tool, he has built what looks like a magnificent course and I can't wait to play it.

What logic. If something is good enough, it's OK no matter what went on to produce it. The end justifies the means and all that.
Not for me thanks.

NBS dude the problem is that you buy petrol for your car dont you, you may buy battery farmed chicken? you use banks to look after your money? you may eat cod fish?

whats the difference.

Its all well and good getting on your high horse but the problem is people end up becoming hypocritical..