Can Ireland beat France?

First topic message reminder :

With France having lost three games in a row (Italy, Wales, England), they are now on the road to face Ireland.

One side of the argument suggests that France are "due a win" while the other says that they are on the ropes and a new look Irish side can add to their misery.

Can Ireland beat this French team?

mystiroakey wrote:btw wales played well second half as well.

Point being- when its half decent weather we can all look good.

Or when we play in a great stadium with a roof we can actually play rugby, even when the turf comes away

It is a bit sad when the cream of the NH can only pass and catch when it is dry.

well not sure about the weather next week. But one things for sure. Not one englishman or welshman is gonna care about any supposed quality!

Maybe the weather but after the first round I stopped watching the 6N. Its been one long yawn since then. I mean one fall over the line try in 46 points scored today Wales v Scotland... please...

mystiroakey wrote:well not sure about the weather next week. But one things for sure. Not one englishman or welshman is gonna care about any supposed quality!

+1... Is Joubert available next week though?

IMHO this is what makes this game so entruiging, Stadium is sheltered from weather, conditions will be very playable yet it will be an absolute slugfest based on brutality and brawn!!!

I'd take a 3 - 0 anyday of the week, even if it means England win the championship!

You've missed very little Taylorman.

Some players are really being wasted in these kind of games. The likes of Fofana has only had the chance to show glimpses of what he can do.

the france england game was a brutal intense game..

fofana was pretty awesome in that one..

Rory, I think It might be a barren year for Irish Lions. Healy, Best and Sexton for definite. BOD probably. Ryan and O'Brien in with a decent shout. If Bowe gets back to fitness then certainly given the poor standard of wings in the completion so far. With the poor standard of centres I wouldn't be surprised if Luke Marshall played his way to the squad if he plays well for Ulster. A possible bolter. Kearney not on the plane for me though a welcome return to form(ish) today.

Yeah I would say your calls are about right.

What do you think of Heaslip this year? I think he is surely the weakest 8 in the competition yet again.

MrsP wrote:How can not one single BBC commentator spot that the guy with the broken ankle is Eoin Reddan?

If they didn't recognise him they have a team sheet in front of them with the players names and numbers and should have noticed that Madigan was standing up and uninjured!

Hope the leg injuury isn't as bad as it looked.

Why don't you go to the game instead?

To be fair to Kidney, for once, we actually had a game plan that wasn't completely rudderless and clueless. We got it tactically right. The substitution of Murray was bizarre. But substitutions have always been completely unrelated to what's going on on the field with Deccie. Half the time his substitutions actually harm our chances. This was one of them.

What is a big concern for me is the fitness and conditioning of the Irish players. We always fade very badly in the second half. And we can't seem to finish a test match without a whole host of new injuries. We've been crippled by injuries pretty much constantly ever since the player welfare program came into being. It's been a complete failure and should be scrapped. It has brought no benefit to the national team. Quite the opposite as far as I can see.

Norfolklass wrote:

MrsP wrote:How can not one single BBC commentator spot that the guy with the broken ankle is Eoin Reddan?

If they didn't recognise him they have a team sheet in front of them with the players names and numbers and should have noticed that Madigan was standing up and uninjured!

Hope the leg injuury isn't as bad as it looked.

Why don't you go to the game instead?

And this would help the BBC commentary team identify players how exactly?

What a very strange comment.

Taylorman wrote:Maybe the weather but after the first round I stopped watching the 6N. Its been one long yawn since then. I mean one fall over the line try in 46 points scored today Wales v Scotland... please...

Yeah - Compared to that scintillating edge of the seat drama fest that was the NZ v France RWC Final

Come on be fair. Nz were at least part of one good Game last year

The subsitition of Murray was Saint-Andreesque - It was Murrays best game for a long time

If feel sorry for Heaslip. The Irish backrow is compromised by each of them bing asked to fulfil roles they don't excel in so their weaknesses are exposed and their strengths hidden. It can be no coincidence that POM had by far his best Irish game by being a round peg in a round hole. He was physical at the breakdown an didn't hide in centre or the wing. Heaslip is a good carrier and linkman but doesn't have the opportunity to show it. Even though individually the backrow played pretty well as a unit they don't work.

I'm a big fan of Falateau. An effective ball carrier and does his job efficiently and allows others around him to excel. That said Picanoles has been a class above. He dominated Wood against England and was head and shoulders above everyone on the pitch. Robshaw was good but not in his class. Same today. The best player on the pitch. The selection of Murray is interesting on two levels. It shows Kidney is utterly inept in using substitutions and doesn't react to what happens on the pitch. It also shows to RTE are on a other planet and an effort to give as little credit to Jackson as possible.

Norfolklass wrote:

MrsP wrote:How can not one single BBC commentator spot that the guy with the broken ankle is Eoin Reddan?

If they didn't recognise him they have a team sheet in front of them with the players names and numbers and should have noticed that Madigan was standing up and uninjured!

Hope the leg injuury isn't as bad as it looked.

Why don't you go to the game instead?

Are we all going to have the pleasure of watching you being rude to people in every one of your posts? Anything to say about the rugby?

Apologies, the Apple Nazi spellchecker is ruining my grammar

So would you change anything in the irish back row for the near future? I still think Henry needs to start when fit.

Can Ireland Beat France ?

No

Rory it's selections and tactics. With effective tactics maybe this unit would excel. I've been really disappointed with SOB so far. He works really hard and is really committed and tackles like a train. However his ball carrying had been ineffective and his breakdown work below average. Heaslip is not playing well but not as poor as people make out. We need an effective unit and this might not mean the best individual players. Kidney picks square pegs for round holes. Why have Ulster been so excellent in the backrow this season when our best player has been injured? Good tactics and round pegs in round holes. Henry and Henderson or whoever do their jobs so Williams can do what he does best.

SOB is completely wasted at 7. He has been great since his return for Leinster and thats because Joe plays him at 6

The numbers on the back of the shirt are irrelevant. If a player has a job to do, does it effectively and outplays his opposite number then that's a goods day work. I don't think an Irish backrow player has done that yet though POM may have done it today. He was very good.

I don't understand why POM is doing the carrying in the 12/13 channel when SOB would be better? Why is SOB being constantly asked to carry static ball in close quarters when POM is a better footballer and better in this role? Why is a linkman and runner in open space in Heaslip doing the dirty work at the breakdown when it isn't a strength of his? Square pegs, round holes.

The number on the back of the shirt is irrelevant??? Its probably the most important thing lol.

Not in the backrow it isn't. David Wallace was an outstanding flanker but was a real 7? Was Alan Quinlan a traditional 6? Dan Lydiate and Stephen Ferris were outstanding 6's lay seasons and couldn't be more different in their styles. The numbers on a persons shirt don't mean that much. Whatever their tactical role in he team they have to do it effectively even if it is not the 'traditional' of a 6/7/8. Our players are not excelling in their roles.

RubyGuby wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Maybe the weather but after the first round I stopped watching the 6N. Its been one long yawn since then. I mean one fall over the line try in 46 points scored today Wales v Scotland... please...

Yeah - Compared to that scintillating edge of the seat drama fest that was the NZ v France RWC Final

And you only had to go back two years to find one?
We must be doing ok then...

The point I make about the lack of good rugby in the 6N- it may be exciting in a patriotic sense but the quality is poor generaly and Gatland must be pulling his hair out since the first round at the quality he has to pick from. All hes really seen is confrontational packs and good goalkicking.

In Oz he needs to know who's going to provide the basis of his attack and if tries are not being scored how will he know who to go with?

Tries, not penalty kicks, will be needed to beat Oz in Oz.

i was ready to post a retort to that taylor. but tbh I cant be bothered.

Your making me want to support the lions though. And I never have done before..

Taylorman wrote:Tries, not penalty kicks, will be needed to beat Oz in Oz.

Scotland have managed it without tries.

Only in Newcastle though.

I agree with you however, the more Scots chosen for the Lions... the tighter the series will be.

So to days France v Ireland game was a draw. Surely it would be better all around, if their was a rematch. rather than leave it as a draw?

Linebreaker wrote:Only in Newcastle though.

I agree with you however, the more Scots chosen for the Lions... the tighter the series will be.

Heh, maybe. It's about time the Scots dominated the Lions squad. With Ireland being how they are and the whole England/Wales bickering maybe Gatts will take the safe option.

3-0 to the Lions with all games being 9-8 to the Scots

ha ha. Yeah. I went 3-0 the other way but of course it will depend on the likelihood of another 3 hurricanes on those 3 dates.

Rugby should be played under cover, on hard grounds, with abundance of tries - really? It seems rugby has gone soft and lost all connection with its roots. Test rugby should be played in testing conditions and that's exactly what the 6N throws up every year.

Gatland isn't so foolish to think that pitting a scratch side of individuals against a settled Test team has any realistic chance of success. Irrespective of who he picks he can't lose, as success is purely down to luck.

Can anyone really say the quality of rugby has been good this year? Notch said before the opening weekend that the standard has been steadily decreasing and he was slaughtered after three exciting matches. But there has been pretty much nothing but dirge offered since. Games may have been absorbing with tight finishes but the wealth isn't there. Listen, some people will of course argue that it devalues whoever wins in the end due to the usual WUMMING. I think it will be England and they have won all their matches without really getting beyond third gear. They have improved markedly on last season and with two years before the World Cup they will get even better. But even good teams will struggle against the garbage they have faced do far. But make no mistake they haven't offered 'exciting' rugby so far, merely functional, efficient, disciplined rugby. We (Ireland) have one win and a draw and have reached a nadir under Kidney. England have three wins and will only get better under Lancaster. I know who I would rather be.

Fecking spell checker. I don't know how you get wealth from quality but my fat fingers must be all over the place. You get my drift though

Since the first round 13 tries have been scored- 5 in the Italy Scotland match.
In the other 7 matches a try was scored once every 70 minutes.

At some point people will insist on seeing tries surely. We get the matches at 3am odd and to wait 70 minutes for a try over 7 matches- 2 matches had none from memory- cant be a good. Not asking for a tryfest...just a try...or two.

Dont watch it mate.

but if all you want is tries. watch the game tommorow..

mystiroakey wrote:Dont watch it mate.

but if all you want is tries. watch the game tommorow..

Yes that match will produce several I hope.

majesticimperialman wrote:So to days France v Ireland game was a draw. Surely it would be better all around, if their was a rematch. rather than leave it as a draw?

Sure the players would love that aye.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Yeah I would say your calls are about right.

What do you think of Heaslip this year? I think he is surely the weakest 8 in the competition yet again.

Heaslip was decent enough today, but again not the best 8 on the pitch. Picamoles is quality though.

Risca Rev wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Yeah I would say your calls are about right.

What do you think of Heaslip this year? I think he is surely the weakest 8 in the competition yet again.

Heaslip was decent enough today, but again not the best 8 on the pitch. Picamoles is quality though.

His ball carrying is so poor imo. He is a shadow of the player he was in 09/10.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Yeah I would say your calls are about right.

What do you think of Heaslip this year? I think he is surely the weakest 8 in the competition yet again.

Heaslip was decent enough today, but again not the best 8 on the pitch. Picamoles is quality though.

His ball carrying is so poor imo. He is a shadow of the player he was in 09/10.

That's because his role is so different. In general our offensive breakdown work is behind the provinces. Dfensively we can slow ball with the best of them, but our clearout work and unwillingness to commit only what is necessary to provide quick ball is killing us. We overcommit and overcrowd our own side if the ruck. It wasn't as glaring today due to the conditions.

Hard to be overly critical other than the Murray substitution which was surreal. I don't care if some of his kicks weren't as pinpoint as the first half the game was built for Murrays strengths, not reddans. POM I thought showed up well and thank god Jackson kicked his goals to keep the wolves at bay for another week. Marshall continues to impress at this level and I don't think hookies suggestion of a lions Bolter is outlandish considering the paucity if our options there although I suspect Barritt and Roberts will edge him.

Picamoles should have been motm. At about 60 minutes I thought we had kept him relatively quiet and then you see his stats

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:Can anyone really say the quality of rugby has been good this year? Notch said before the opening weekend that the standard has been steadily decreasing and he was slaughtered after three exciting matches. But there has been pretty much nothing but dirge offered since.

I plan on doing a retrospective article at the end. Hope those who put the boot in will join me in taking an unsentimental look at the whole thing!

Yes.

Notch wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:Can anyone really say the quality of rugby has been good this year? Notch said before the opening weekend that the standard has been steadily decreasing and he was slaughtered after three exciting matches. But there has been pretty much nothing but dirge offered since.

I plan on doing a retrospective article at the end. Hope those who put the boot in will join me in taking an unsentimental look at the whole thing!

Its actually an interesting point. Its almost like there was an unwritten agreement not to play this way for the rest of the tournament where Scotland refused to sign. Same teams, grounds and weather yet a complete reversal in the ability to create tries across the board.

Tries, not penalty kicks, will be needed to beat Oz in Oz.


Surely it is the "WIN" final score that makes the difference. Who ever has the most points on the board will win. dosent matter if tries are scored or not.

Taylorman wrote:Its actually an interesting point. Its almost like there was an unwritten agreement not to play this way for the rest of the tournament where Scotland refused to sign. Same teams, grounds and weather yet a complete reversal in the ability to create tries across the board.

I do not understand. You seem to be suggesting that unlike the other teams Scotland have been playing attacking rugby?

Well done Ireland. You looked the better team for most of that game. I think France should be the happier side with the draw.

LondonTiger wrote:

Taylorman wrote:Its actually an interesting point. Its almost like there was an unwritten agreement not to play this way for the rest of the tournament where Scotland refused to sign. Same teams, grounds and weather yet a complete reversal in the ability to create tries across the board.

I do not understand. You seem to be suggesting that unlike the other teams Scotland have been playing attacking rugby?

Its just from the second round onwards Scotlands 4 tries v Italy is very much the exception, but other than that a pretty quiet time for the trylines...