Big chip on shoulder

Jonny Wilkinson has had his day - Jonathan Davies
You very sad man JD!

Yeah, good post, very informative. How hasn't he then?

I don't think it deserves any more comment old chap

Why is it everyone who automatically loses an argument on here uses old chap in a vain attempt to patronise?

Why is a chip a French fry when the idea came from Belgium? And in the UK shouldn't it be a crisp on your shoulder?

Question about Jiffy... I've seen him doing publicity for the Lions as the Welsh representative, wearing the lions t-shirt etc.... he never played for the Lions (whether he wasn't around at the time of the tours in not the point, Mike Tindall was probably good enough in the early 00s to have been selected had he not been injured/a tour been around at his peak... doesn't mean he is a lion).

I know the Lions like to throw out a Hastings as the Scotland representative and Robinson as the England representative but surely with their history, Wales could send out any number of the greats... rather than someone who wasn't a lion.

There is literally dozens of valid candidates. I've seen Edwards a few times but Jiffy more often this season.

fa0019 wrote:Question about Jiffy... I've seen him doing publicity for the Lions as the Welsh representative, wearing the lions t-shirt etc.... he never played for the Lions (whether he wasn't around at the time of the tours in not the point, Mike Tindall was probably good enough in the early 00s to have been selected had he not been injured/a tour been around at his peak... doesn't mean he is a lion).

I know the Lions like to throw out a Hastings as the Scotland representative and Robinson as the England representative but surely with their history, Wales could send out any number of the greats... rather than someone who wasn't a lion.

There is literally dozens of valid candidates. I've seen Edwards a few times but Jiffy more often this season.

Jiffy is the unofficial face of Welsh rugby and Scrum V, so he wasn't a lion, neither was I but I have a shirt and will wear it when I land in Sydney on the 13th June!!

He is a professional pundit, and is one of the most popular in Wales for his highly contraversial (in England only) and passionate Welsh bias, so therefore is representing the Welsh representation.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Why is a chip a French fry when the idea came from Belgium? And in the UK shouldn't it be a crisp on your shoulder?

So many innacuracies in one sentence...

Yes but if its a lions thing and all the other representatives are lions legends it does look a little odd that they chose Jiffy for their PR. Hastings, Robinson are not the unofficial faces of rugby in their respected nations so why was it obvious they went straight to Jiffy??? Its just bizarre that he was chosen.

fa0019 wrote:Yes but if its a lions thing and all the other representatives are lions legends it does look a little odd that they chose Jiffy for their PR. Hastings, Robinson are not the unofficial faces of rugby in their respected nations so why was it obvious they went straight to Jiffy??? Its just bizarre that he was chosen.

Well name me another Welsh pundit with the popularity of Jiffy and has the ability to pundit.

Can Hastings or Robinson pundit?

No... but they do know what a lions tour is like, they know what a lions test is like etc. I've seen Edwards do it before. Gibbs is a pundit himself. Evans is also a pundit on TV right, at least he used to be?? Ex Wales captain, 3 times tourist, 2 times winner, 7 caps, winning try in 89 (albeit the jammiest try in history... nae matter they all count the same).

thebluesmancometh wrote:

fa0019 wrote:Yes but if its a lions thing and all the other representatives are lions legends it does look a little odd that they chose Jiffy for their PR. Hastings, Robinson are not the unofficial faces of rugby in their respected nations so why was it obvious they went straight to Jiffy??? Its just bizarre that he was chosen.

Well name me another Welsh pundit with the popularity of Jiffy and has the ability to pundit.

Scott Gibbs, Scott Quinnell, Ieuan Evans, Martin Williams also comes across excellently....

I dont have a problem with Davies bias (Brian Moore is the same and hes one of my fave commentators)...with Davies its the fact his opinion is right and thats the end of it...

Technically Jiffy was a Lion for RL...

george doors wrote:Jonny Wilkinson has had his day - Jonathan Davies
You very sad man JD!

Even if Jiffy's wrong (and I don't think he is), why do you say he has a chip on his shoulder? I'm not sure you know what the phrase means.

He may not be the player he once was, he may have had his day... but he's still a better 10 then both Flood and Farrell which he's proved in the HC recently... one of which was chosen to go.

Over the hill perhaps, still better then most of the rest mind and on a pure who are the best 10s argument he should have gone (had he not had the issue with Toulon etc etc).

It was a bit odd for Jiffy to say JW was over the hill after his HC performances suggested anything but, chip not so sure. Running backline or not... he was never the most adventurous 10 anyhow... but what he does is win matches, did then, still does now.

thebluesmancometh wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Why is a chip a French fry when the idea came from Belgium? And in the UK shouldn't it be a crisp on your shoulder?

So many innacuracies in one sentence...

Indeed but I thought it fitting with the OP.

I used to walk around with a crisp on my shoulder, in an attempt to steal my neighbour's parrot.

Classic lucky. Aunt bessies make the best oven chips.

Why are there no crisps in the pharmacy. Because the paracetamol.

george doors are you honestly surprised by Jonathan Davies' comments?

I think it's quite appropriate that Jonathan Davies represents Wales and Welsh rugby.


I think probably the most sensible pundit is Will Greenwood.

beshocked wrote:george doors are you honestly surprised by Jonathan Davies' comments?

I think it's quite appropriate that Jonathan Davies represents Wales and Welsh rugby.


I think probably the most sensible pundit is Will Greenwood.

thebluesmancometh wrote:

fa0019 wrote:Yes but if its a lions thing and all the other representatives are lions legends it does look a little odd that they chose Jiffy for their PR. Hastings, Robinson are not the unofficial faces of rugby in their respected nations so why was it obvious they went straight to Jiffy??? Its just bizarre that he was chosen.

Well name me another Welsh pundit with the popularity of Jiffy and has the ability to pundit.

Popularity only being in Wales as Jiffy is also hated in Scotland and not just England!!

beshocked wrote:george doors are you honestly surprised by Jonathan Davies' comments?

I think it's quite appropriate that Jonathan Davies represents Wales and Welsh rugby.


I think probably the most sensible pundit is Will Greenwood.

Maybe Jiffy should stick to BBC Wales / Cymru in that case...and stop talking about the Lions.

As only 25% of the Lions support take notice of him and due to the fact that Sky have the good sense not to employ him, the rest of us can just carry on ignoring him.

But then I can't be too self-righteous, after all we gave the world John Inverdale

I saw John Inverdale at Wimbledon a couple of years ago, he was running somewhere. I know it's not worth mentioning. I'll shut up now.

I think you left out the relevant part of that anecdote luckless: you were chasing him with a knife.

Only because I wanted him to sign it.

Jonny plays well in his armchair behind Toulon's massive pack but remember what he was like when he last played for England. He was pants!

He may yet get the call to play for the Lions but it will be based on his reputation not his current ability. I would prefer to see Flood, Biggar, Priestland, Lawson, Twelvetrees or Madigan go instead.

PS
I think BOD is in the same boat, he was sublime against Wales at the start of the 6N, but went downhill from there to the extent that he looked decidedly over the hill by the end of the tournament.

you can't argue that wilkinson is probably worth 15-18 points per game

Seagultaf wrote:


I think BOD is in the same boat, he was sublime against Wales at the start of the 6N, but went downhill from there to the extent that he looked decidedly over the hill by the end of the tournament.

Given that many players either went up hill or down hill but few remained constant in last 6N (apart from Halfpenny) I wouldn't class O'Driscoll as being alone in the skittish form on display then. Neither would I blame him for being bruised and battered by the end as he tried to keep his misfiring and totally dejected side firing to the last whistle.
You saw a trip 'downhill', I saw true Captain stock at work big time and I was very very proud of our old Warrior dragging himself to a standstill when his younger team-mates had thrown in the towel ages before him.
Plus... given that 6N form wasn't the recruiting grade required for all Lions, I think it's safe to suggest Gatland might have been taking post-6N form into the equation - on that score sheet (playing in a well coached team) he's doing pretty damn fine and had the Leinster crowd chanting for "One more year! One more year!" during the Amlin semi-final.
Wilkinson didn't want to go with the Lions as a passenger (or mid-weeker) - O'Driscoll certainly isn't going with the intention of being a passenger either.

Even though Jonathan Davies is very irritating he does have a point.

Wilkinson decided not to go onto the Lions tour because he doesn't want his already battered body to getting even more rough treatment.

Toulon are paying him to play for them. Wilkinson is showing his faith in them.

I think Jonny could have done a job for the Lions going by current form but it would be a short term solution.

Gatland IMO should have picked 3 fly halves -Sexton,Farrell and Biggar.

beshocked wrote:Even though Jonathan Davies is very irritating he does have a point.

Wilkinson decided not to go onto the Lions tour because he doesn't want his already battered body to getting even more rough treatment.

Toulon are paying him to play for them. Wilkinson is showing his faith in them.

I think Jonny could have done a job for the Lions going by current form but it would be a short term solution.

Gatland IMO should have picked 3 fly halves -Sexton,Farrell and Biggar.

Isn't that the whole point of a Lions tour?

How long term shoudl it be, Beshocked ?

I still think Wilko will be on Gatlands to ring list if we lose Sexton or Farrell.

But Jiffy is nothing more than a wum.

HongKongCherry wrote:

beshocked wrote:Even though Jonathan Davies is very irritating he does have a point.

Wilkinson decided not to go onto the Lions tour because he doesn't want his already battered body to getting even more rough treatment.

Toulon are paying him to play for them. Wilkinson is showing his faith in them.

I think Jonny could have done a job for the Lions going by current form but it would be a short term solution.

Gatland IMO should have picked 3 fly halves -Sexton,Farrell and Biggar.

Isn't that the whole point of a Lions tour?

HKC and gregortree I suppose you asre right.

I suppose it is but ultimately having Jonny at fly half doesn't help the development of fly halves in the NH.

We need guys like Sexton,Farrell and Biggar to take up the mantle. Shouldn't rely on Jonny for one last swansong.

It's better for the British and Irish Lions if they give experience to the likes of Sexton,Farrell and Biggar.

I know the Lions isn't a development tour but relying on Jonny is just as risky as going with the younger options in my opinion.

It's been a long season.

It's neither about loyalty to Toulon or Wilkinson's battered body. It's about code. Gatland said that Wilkinson said no. Wilkinson kinda said no during the aftergame interview (HC semi)

But....... Gatland said they might have a chat again if injuries occur further down the line. So first it's an absolute negative and then a quick 'might' thrown on at the end when hopefully nobody is listening.

What I've been reading from all that from the start is that Wilkinson said to Gatland - no, I'm not going to be a mid weeker. I don't need that in my life at my stage in my career. I'm not a making-up-the-numbers man any more and I'm not going to do the gig of playing minor games to fight for a test spot. If you genuinely want me for a test or two and you have an injury that needs filling then... come talk to me then.

Wilkinson is laying down his ground rules for involvement. He might make himself available as an injury replacement, but I'd assume only for a test or the tests.

I think a few commentatiors might be annoyed because they see that code operating in the background too. And they don't like the idea of a player calling the shots. (An argument for another day).

Jiffy is probably of the opinion that if Wilkinson doesn't want to commit to the whole process then he shouldn't be involved in any of the process (the glory games). I think some are afraid that he might be involved come test time and, if so, proving that some players have more clout than either the Captains or the Coaches.

thebluesmancometh wrote:Why is it everyone who automatically loses an argument on here uses old chap in a vain attempt to patronise?

I wasn't aware I was in an argument old boy.

I have to say, I could care less if Wilko, O'Gara and Gavin Hastings played if the Lions win, development of young flyhalves can happen in the other 200 odd weeks until the next Lions tour.

I'm not entirely sure Gatland would have really wanted Wilko for the tour anyway, he would just dominate the media side of things.
I mean he asked him if he would consider leave the club which he has publically stated that he loves early to play in a Barbarians game, rather than potentially winning the clubs first major trophy ever.

Surely Gatland knew before asking.

beshocked wrote:

HongKongCherry wrote:

beshocked wrote:Even though Jonathan Davies is very irritating he does have a point.

Wilkinson decided not to go onto the Lions tour because he doesn't want his already battered body to getting even more rough treatment.

Toulon are paying him to play for them. Wilkinson is showing his faith in them.

I think Jonny could have done a job for the Lions going by current form but it would be a short term solution.

Gatland IMO should have picked 3 fly halves -Sexton,Farrell and Biggar.

Isn't that the whole point of a Lions tour?

HKC and gregortree I suppose you asre right.

I suppose it is but ultimately having Jonny at fly half doesn't help the development of fly halves in the NH.

We need guys like Sexton,Farrell and Biggar to take up the mantle. Shouldn't rely on Jonny for one last swansong.

It's better for the British and Irish Lions if they give experience to the likes of Sexton,Farrell and Biggar.

I know the Lions isn't a development tour but relying on Jonny is just as risky as going with the younger options in my opinion.

It's been a long season.

I don't care if they're young or old, if they're good enough they should go. Whilst Lions tours are every 4 years, the memory of each one lasts 12 years. It is no place to try and develop anyone for the good of the NH as failure will last for 12 years. I think Gatland has missed a trick slightly not picking some players. The Aussies have bad memories of Wilko and Sheridan and having them on tour I feel could have caused a few nerves. I always find it difficult when trying to make the case for a France based player, as like most people I don't have the obscure channel that shows T14 games and so can only base my judgement on the HC and journos. I appreciate Wilko has ruled himself out so regardless of Jiffy's thoughts he wouldn't have been there, but I'd have loved to see Sheridan go and line up with Hibbard and Jones.

I am slightly concerned by the Welsh bias to the squad, not because they don't deserve to be there, they do; they were clearly the best team in the 6N and based on performance and form they deserve to be there... But it could be argued that Welsh players hold no fear to the Aussies. Hence the reason why I feel the likes of Wilko and Sheridan would have added something to the squad. The Welsh players who are in the squad deserve to be there, but maybe the selection of some other players would have complemented them better.

Bathman_in_London wrote:I have to say, I could care less if Wilko, O'Gara and Gavin Hastings played if the Lions win, development of young flyhalves can happen in the other 200 odd weeks until the next Lions tour.

I'm not entirely sure Gatland would have really wanted Wilko for the tour anyway, he would just dominate the media side of things.
I mean he asked him if he would consider leave the club which he has publically stated that he loves early to play in a Barbarians game, rather than potentially winning the clubs first major trophy ever.

Surely Gatland knew before asking.

I think he did, anticipating the media backlash it was easire to make a phone call you know will be rejected than have to deal with the constant media backlash!