Rabbo Direct Newbies to watch 2013/14

First topic message reminder :

I know there has been a thread set up by Geordie Falcon, this is to hone in on the Rabbo for the coming season, who should we be looking out for at your province/region/club?

For the Dragons I would say

Hallam Amos - made his debut at 17 and I think will feature a fair bit this season following on from a good JWC this summer, cuts very good angles

Ieuan Jones - Big ball carrying number 8 who burst on to the scene last year, fully hope he steps up and puts some pressure on one Faletau in the coming season.

Jack Dixon - Another who debuted at a young age, a big lad for his age but will be interesting to see if he has the skill set to go along with his physicality.

Elliot Dee - another Welsh u20 who showed up well last season and had a good season with Bedwas, probably 4th choice hooker at present behing Rhys Thomas Sam Parrry and Gustafason s may be limited to LV games

rodders wrote:Muller has aged a bit for me

Insightful stuff rodders  

Would you say the majority of our players are older than last season?   

Hehehe...

Notch wrote:

rodders wrote:Muller has aged a bit for me

Insightful stuff rodders  

Would you say the majority of our players are older than last season?   

Hehehe...

Well apart from Paddy Jackson, who's a year younger, I suppose you have a point.... 

rodders, PJ couldn't get any younger, he's baby-faced enough as it is?!

I saw on twa-tter that Afoa has started his own pre-season down under, so that sounds positive?

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:I saw on twa-tter that Afoa has started his own pre-season down under, so that sounds positive?

I think Ulster are bending over backwards too keep him happy. Apparently his wife did not enjoy Northern Ireland, especially being pregnant and away from her family. So when your homesick wife moves home with your young kids and newborn baby, it's hard. I think he's a professional and to be honest as much as the wantaway stuff is distracting I think most players wouldn't be honouring their contract in those circumstances. Ulster have asked him to honour his contract and he is going to- I don't know if other allowances will be made during the season.

If Ulster have given him a pre-season programme to do before he gets back, he's professional enough to get it done- no doubt about that. He gets to spend some time with the baby before flying back to Belfast and as long as he arrives in top nick everyone is happy... right?

You would imagine so, Notch

You've got to question his fitness come the start of the season surely - there's a big difference between training on your own for weeks and training with the squad and all the strength and conditioning coaches.

Notch,

we have quite a few front row players which we would swap for..... hmmm lets see? I know Ruan Pienaar - we need his kicking but he might not get a game  

RDW_Scotland wrote:You've got to question his fitness come the start of the season surely - there's a big difference between training on your own for weeks and training with the squad and all the strength and conditioning coaches.

He's not training on his own, he's with the Auckland Blues I think.

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Notch,

we have quite a few front row players which we would swap for..... hmmm lets see? I know Ruan Pienaar - we need his kicking but he might not get a game  

Pienaar? Straight swap for Matawalu + Kellock. Long term replacements for him and Muller. Take it or leave it, no haggling  

Notch wrote:

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Notch,

we have quite a few front row players which we would swap for..... hmmm lets see? I know Ruan Pienaar - we need his kicking but he might not get a game  

Pienaar? Straight swap for Matawalu + Kellock. Long term replacements for him and Muller. Take it or leave it, no haggling  

Someone get this man a job at the Ulster branch

Not sure that's a deal Notch. Although we would swap you Luke Marshall for all of the tea in China.
 
Or Byron 'Barry' McGuigan for a large white chocolate Toblerone.

Very much looking forward to the fixture announcement, which I think is due soon.

As always hoping for a good start from Edinburgh - one of the main reasons we struggled last year was that we had such a crap start and never recovered.

Which teams do people think will be hardest hit with regards to Lions players not being back until the 3rd or 4th game?

RDW_Scotland wrote:Very much looking forward to the fixture announcement, which I think is due soon.

As always hoping for a good start from Edinburgh - one of the main reasons we struggled last year was that we had such a crap start and never recovered.

Which teams do people think will be hardest hit with regards to Lions players not being back until the 3rd or 4th game?

Dragons - Toby AND Lydiate

Seriously though, I see Toby starting the first game of the season, can't keep him down, machine of a player

Blues will be missing Roberts (off to France) and possibly Warbs and Halfpenny but will gain Gethin (if fit)

Tips could well be back for the O's and the Turks have to learn to live without Gogzilla. I doubt JD will be start first game either

Leicester may be without alot of players. Oh well, eh ?

Apart from the fact Lydiate is off to Racing...!

I seriously don't think we'll see any Lions player until the 3rd or 4th game - there's just over 6 weeks until the start of the season and they get at least 3 or 4 weeks off starting when they got back. There's no way they'll play after only 3 weeks pre-season!

George Carlin wrote:Not sure that's a deal Notch. Although we would swap you Luke Marshall for all of the tea in China.
 
Or Byron 'Barry' McGuigan for a large white chocolate Toblerone.

I'll give you half a medium-sized white toblerone, and bear in mind I hate white chocolate  

Sorry Barry!

I know RDW  

Toby had to be told he needs a rest by the Dragon's coaches when he came back from the RWC, I can honestly see him wanting to start at least, he'll have competition for his place too with our new signing (from Embra)

Talei is a great player... when he can be bothered. All too often this season he phoned in his performances.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Talei is a great player... when he can be bothered. All too often this season he phoned in his performances.

The crowd at Rodney Parade will remind him to pull his socks up

RDW_Scotland wrote:Very much looking forward to the fixture announcement, which I think is due soon.

As always hoping for a good start from Edinburgh - one of the main reasons we struggled last year was that we had such a crap start and never recovered.

Which teams do people think will be hardest hit with regards to Lions players not being back until the 3rd or 4th game?

I think Cardiff have little enough quality in their squad, and really the absence of their Lions is a constant thorn in their side at the best of times. Also Leinster, obviously, bit of a mystery which Leinster will turn up with a new coach and a raft of senior players missing.

After the tour to New Zealand last year, Irish internationals only came back from Round 3 onwards. So given there was a tour to USA/Canada AND a tour to Georgia we may be looking at pretty weak the first couple of games unless the IRFU makes guys available quicker. I think they must!

An Ulster side without Lions, Ireland tourists, Emerging Ireland and Ruan Pienaar (Springbok) would have 18 players missing including all of the scrum-halves and hookers on full contracts  

This is exactly why I hope Edinburgh manage a good start to the season - yes we'll be missing key players like Laidlaw, Denton, Visser and Matt Scott for the first few games but the majority of the squad will have had a full pre season.  The likes of Ross Ford, De Luca and Ross Rennie (praying he is back in full fitness) will have had a good rest and a full pre-season to so should be firing on all cylinders and good to go from the start.

neilthom7 wrote:

Notch wrote:

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Notch,

we have quite a few front row players which we would swap for..... hmmm lets see? I know Ruan Pienaar - we need his kicking but he might not get a game  

Pienaar? Straight swap for Matawalu + Kellock. Long term replacements for him and Muller. Take it or leave it, no haggling  

Someone get this man a job at the Ulster branch

Sorry Sparky's job is taken Neil....

rodders wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:

Notch wrote:

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Notch,

we have quite a few front row players which we would swap for..... hmmm lets see? I know Ruan Pienaar - we need his kicking but he might not get a game  

Pienaar? Straight swap for Matawalu + Kellock. Long term replacements for him and Muller. Take it or leave it, no haggling  

Someone get this man a job at the Ulster branch

Sorry Sparky's job is taken Neil....  

 

 

Notch wrote:
I think Cardiff have little enough quality in their squad, and really the absence of their Lions is a constant thorn in their side at the best of times.

If Gethin Jenkins is fit then we won't be missing too many

Cuthbert didnt play the last 2 tests - so should be fit fairly soon

We will miss Halfpenny and Warburton - but Navidi has been a good deputy and Patchell's goal kicking has been good

We will have a poor back 3 though without Halfpenny, Cuthbert and James (left) at the start of the season.

wales606 wrote:

Notch wrote:
I think Cardiff have little enough quality in their squad, and really the absence of their Lions is a constant thorn in their side at the best of times.

If Gethin Jenkins is fit then we won't be missing too many

Cuthbert didnt play the last 2 tests - so should be fit fairly soon

We will miss Halfpenny and Warburton - but Navidi has been a good deputy and Patchell's goal kicking has been good

We will have a poor back 3 though without Halfpenny, Cuthbert and James (left) at the start of the season.

Thats the thing- the WRU are a lot more relaxed about releasing players than the IRFU, or rather they have no power not to do so because you don't have central contracts.

Irish Lions in 2009 missed as many as four or five games. Mike Phillips played in Game 1.

rodders wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:

Notch wrote:

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Notch,

we have quite a few front row players which we would swap for..... hmmm lets see? I know Ruan Pienaar - we need his kicking but he might not get a game  

Pienaar? Straight swap for Matawalu + Kellock. Long term replacements for him and Muller. Take it or leave it, no haggling  

Someone get this man a job at the Ulster branch

Sorry Sparky's job is taken Neil....  

Maybe he could ressurect old sparky? Or a very important job chief hairdye confiscator to make sure paddy wallace never finds that blond bleach ever again

neilthom7 wrote:

rodders wrote:

neilthom7 wrote:

Notch wrote:

21st Century Schizoid Man wrote:Notch,

we have quite a few front row players which we would swap for..... hmmm lets see? I know Ruan Pienaar - we need his kicking but he might not get a game  

Pienaar? Straight swap for Matawalu + Kellock. Long term replacements for him and Muller. Take it or leave it, no haggling  

Someone get this man a job at the Ulster branch

Sorry Sparky's job is taken Neil....  

Maybe he could ressurect old sparky? Or a very important job chief hairdye confiscator to make sure paddy wallace never finds that blond bleach ever again

I'll make sure paddy Jackson stays true to his 'roots' #GingerPride

Full list of transfers in the Irish provinces;

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/29513.php

Notch wrote:Full list of transfers in the Irish provinces;

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/29513.php

Looking at that Munster and Ulster's playing squad remains roughly the same, Connacht's squad is strengthened and Leinster's squad weakened. Connacht have made some good signings and have cleared away a lot of the players who are not good enough. The gap between Leinster and Connacht has closed a bit.

I thought connacht signed a new prop, Frik Veneter was it?

Notch wrote:Full list of transfers in the Irish provinces;

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/29513.php

Just reminding myself that there are some massive names leaving on those lists - e.g.:
 
1. Leinster
 
Jonathan Sexton (Racing Metro 92)
Isa Nacewa (retired)
Heinke van der Merwe (Stade Francais)
Andrew Conway (Munster)
 
2. Munster
 
Ronan O'Gara (retired)
Doug Howlett (retired)
Marcus Horan (retired)
Peter Stringer (Bath)
 
Ulster have done well to hold onto everyone and have to be the Irish province with the most continuity at the start of the season. Hopefully Afoa is fine after the op and his home life settles down to let him put in one more big season.

IRFU wrote: John Cooney, Brendan Macken, Ben Marshall, Jack McGrath, Jordi Murphy, Darren Hudson, Martin Moore, Jack O'Connell, Noel Reid (all Academy graduates)

McGrath, Cooney and Macken were not in the Academy having signed in previous years, and Marshall + Murphy signed full contracts about half way through last season.
Being pedantc like.

Anyone who likes to see young Irish players signed over foreign imports should be happy with Leinster's recruitment though

Looking at that list there are some cracking players in there.

Hudson will be under the radar for most non Leinster fans and even some who are.

Goot prospect. Can play accross the back 3 and looked realy good before serious injury early last season.

Hudson looked really good in that pre season game in Tallaght. Very unlucky to be injured nearly the entire season after that.

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:
Anyone who likes to see young Irish players signed over foreign imports should be happy with Leinster's recruitment though

I think its the way to go. In about 3 years time there'll be little need for NIQ players.


A also think Hudson is a quality player and could surprise a few people. Center remains a weak area for Leinster though. BOD and D'Arcy are away alot these days, O'Malley is always injured and on the small side, Macken is a one dimensional player and injured also, Goodman is a decent backup but isn't the quality Leinster need.

profitius wrote:

Notch wrote:Full list of transfers in the Irish provinces;

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/29513.php

Looking at that Munster and Ulster's playing squad remains roughly the same, Connacht's squad is strengthened and Leinster's squad weakened.

Munster losing their Club Captain and most capped player jumps out!

But this may give Rob Penney more license to leave his own stamp on the team in the long run.

What I'm noticing is Ulster and Leinster have signed on a lot of cracking young Academy players recently- the big young stars are already coming through at Ulster having signed on last year or the year before, whereas Leinster are looking to bring a few through this season- but still very top-heavy in the backs.

Guys like Iain Henderson and Dave Kilcoyne stand out because there are so few really good forward prospects at that age whereas we are overcome with quality and depth in the three-quarters specifically the back three.

To the extent the likes of Tommy Seymour, who I'm a big fan of, can leave Ulster cause he's fourth/fifth in the pecking order and be playing for Scotland in two years. We've such talent there.

But we can't play 15 wingers can we?

Notch wrote:

profitius wrote:

Notch wrote:Full list of transfers in the Irish provinces;

http://www.irishrugby.ie/news/29513.php

Looking at that Munster and Ulster's playing squad remains roughly the same, Connacht's squad is strengthened and Leinster's squad weakened.

Munster losing their Club Captain and most capped player jumps out!

But this may give Rob Penney more license to leave his own stamp on the team in the long run.

ROG was past it for 2 seasons. JJ Hanrahan will be an improvement there. Howlett is being replaced by Conway and the South African and Luke O'Dea and Earls are returning from injury hit seasons. So there are more options in the backs.


I think Munster will be better this season.

Prof - what do you think the starting 15 will look like for Munster?

A lot of people are putting a lot of faith in Hanrahan. Paddy Jackson is talked down even though he's played in a Heineken Cup final and Ireland internationals and learned a huge amount- probably because people see a 21-year old who's not yet flawless and expect bigger things, right now. Jackson is a fine, fine player and a very hot prospect but any 10 coming through is going to have off-days.

Hanrahan looks to be as exciting a talent in many ways, another hot prospect, but he'll take his knocks alright. Every young outhalf does. Madigan was an understudy for 2 years before he really started leaving his mark. ROG was behind Jeremy Staunton for a good while in the pecking order for the Munster 10 jersey.

Don't expect too much from JJ too soon, and if he lives up to the hype it'll be a nice surprise.

Ulster with Jackson.

Leinster with Madigan.

Munster with Hanrahan.

Connacht with.. Dan Parks.

What a battle for the irish 10 shirt that is going to be. Of course, all 3 are behind Sexton to begin with. We are certainly not lacking depth at 10, and all of these players seem to be very talented guys.

It'll be Munster with Keatley at least for the first half of the season, mark my words.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Prof - what do you think the starting 15 will look like for Munster?

Something like

Zebo
Conway
Lualala
Downey
Earls

Keatley
Murray

Coughlan
TOD
POM
POC
Ryan
Botha
Sherry
Kilcoyne


That could change a lot over the course of a season. You have Hanrahan, Dave O'Callaghan, Jones, Van Der Heefer and a few props could force their way in. Of all the Munster players I think this season could be a big season for Mike Sherry. His throwing is really steady and he is good and mobile around the field and a good size.


Notch, I agree about putting too much pressure on young players. Jackson was thrown into HEC action a little bit too early. One or two bad games for Ireland and you have a complete overreaction with people writing him off. The signing of McKinney will take some of the pressure of Jackson and he'll get better over time. Hanrahan has some flaws to his game too. Inconsistency and kicking from the ground being his main problem area. It wouldn't surprise me to see him overtake Keatley this season but it looks like Munster are not rushing things there.

Is Van Der Heefer confirmed?

Paddy Jackson is all the stronger for that. Kidney handled his debut run of games horribly, even if you agree the call needed to be made. McLaughlin gambled big time on him when he hardly had an Ulster cap to his name. Experiences that would haunt some (see; Niall O'Connor, as much as I wanted him to succeed) but I feel strangely serene about his ability to not just survive them but thrive. He's just that kind of person it seems, hard to explain it. He's a guy who seems to bounce back hard. He's not necessarily a flashy player but he's creative, he has an excellent rugby brain, boot and a lovely pass. But it's his demeanor after he has a poor game the next time he takes to the pitch that makes me think he'll ultimately make the grade. When the pressure of responding to a bad game is on his shoulders he doesn't do anything different or try to win the game by himself. Just relaxes and does what he does well. His consistency and place kicking will only improve.

I don't care much if Jackson plays for Ireland this year on reflection. He'll be in and around the squad for sure but its another year of being first choice at Ulster that'll see him take more steps forward.

But Hanrahan could use a few big pressure games in the Rabo imo- if you do play Leinster before the HC, throw him in and see how he does. I don't expect him to swim perfectly but it'll be a barometer of where he is and if he does do well brilliant and if he doesn't do well he'll have to show what O'Gara showed after he lost his place to Staunton, after he missed that kick in 2000. The ability to come back from the knocks, fast and strongly. Munster can't get a Top 2 seeding in the league my gut tells me but a Cup run is very possible so use the Pro12 to give Hanrahan a chance to show these 'old men' Paddy Jackson and Ian Madigan what 10 play is all about!

Notch wrote:It'll be Munster with Keatley at least for the first half of the season, mark my words.

He will probably be the starting 10 for the entire season (for the big games anyway) but Hanrahan is the long term option for both Munster and Ireland. He has serious potential.

LeinsterFan4life wrote:Is Van Der Heefer confirmed?

All but confirmed.

Seven months age difference is a lot when you're 21!

Craig clarke is an excellent signing for connacht