Team Changes for Ireland

So does anyone think Joe is going to make any changes to the starting 15 for Ireland v England?

Personally I think our backline have show no creativity and except for individual cameos from various players has been at best stodgy. In the original squad I and others voiced concerns over leaving Zebo and others out. However I think now that given the way the team has won its first two games and all players have done well Joe cannot change the starting 15 as it would give a wrong message players....so steady as she goes Joe or do we try to play like the harlem globetrotters....

We'll have to see what happens with injuries and form over the Rabo games,I'd like to see Zebo in on the left wing,Trimble deserves to keep his place,will Bowe be back for England?
Henderson to come in for Tuohy imo and that would be about it I'd say.

Henderson for Tuohy on the bench- Zebo for Kearney, maybe, but he needs an almost flawless performance on the wing for Munster this weekend to have a hope.

I would keep it the same.

Zebo was brilliant the other night against Cardiff (playing FB). McCarthy might get in ahead of Henderson (only based on JS comments of namechecking McCarthy and Ryan).

Cant see DK getting dropped for Zebo. Possible he might include Luke Fitz if he gets fit as he was pencilled in for the first two games.

I think McCarthy will come into the squad. Luke Marshall might return too.


Overall I don't see too many changes for England. I think he'll make a few changes against Italy though.

Is Bowe ever fit?

ME-109 wrote:So does anyone think Joe is going to make any changes to the starting 15 for Ireland v England?

Well I'd say Henderson or more likely McCarthy comes in for Touhy on the bench.

Reddan will come on the bench, possibly Madigan too.

Might be changes to the wings.

Plan will be to kick, kick, kick in first half then up the pace around the 60min mark a la Leinster's old away approach.

Would like to see Henderson in.

I reckon Boss will stay on the bench JS (and O'Connor not)always used him for away games for the Leinster approach.

How did Gilroy play last Friday night?

Id go with the french team if you can.

If anyone should come it is Bowe. He wont though as he didnt play for Ulster v Ospreys. Very few players deserve to be dropped though to be honest. That said I wouldnt be surprised if there are one or two changes. Tohey has a broken arm so Henderson should be on the bench anyway.

ME-109 wrote:How did Gilroy play last Friday night?

Same as all season, average and not deserving of being considered for Ireland. Even when Gilroy was first choice under Kidney and Trimble wasn't in the Ireland squad at all, Trimble was always better than him. Any time Gilroy and Trimble were in the same Ulster team Gilroy was the second best winger in our team.

You'd probably have to go back to the quarter-final at Thomond to even find a one-off game where Gilroy was better than Trimble. I rate Gilroy but he's not delivering on his potential at all.

ME-109 wrote:How did Gilroy play last Friday night?

As well as any winger has played in a monsoon.... i.e. not very.

....Correction Jonah Lomu had a slightly better game in 1996 against Australia in the last game played in similar conditions.

ME-109 wrote:Zebo was brilliant the other night against Cardiff (playing FB).

Nonsense, he was decent at best. What about Conway, not beating his drum are you? .... double standards sir!

rodders wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo was brilliant the other night against Cardiff (playing FB).

Nonsense, he was decent at best. What about Conway, not beating his drum are you? .... double standards sir!

What do you expect.

I would keep the same side myself with the exception of bringing Marshall back at 12. I do like his style of play and think that he will cause the England defence some problems.

Don't mind what changes are made so long as everyone keeps focused on executing the plays and schemes on the field.

Historically JS tends to be conservative in his away team selections. This comes from the Top14 upbringing where you have to really set up defensively to stop the onslaught if you have any chance of getting something from the game.

Kearney/Henshaw, Bowe/Zebo/Trimble/McFadden/DKearney, Darcy/Marshall I want them able to hop in and out without skipping a beat.

This game gets won or lost up front however. Tight 5 for the set pieces and one pass defence. Backrow for breakdown competition and turnover ball.

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Id go with the french team if you can.

Even Lancaster might get suspicious at the names "Hugh O'Jay" or "F. O'Fana" popping up on the teamsheet...

I'm not sure that the players should feel betrayed if some of them now give way to a few other alternatives.  They all know what they signed up to and I'm sure Schmidt laid it on the line.  There will be a certain degree of rotation.  Rotation doesn't mean lost faith in the players that played.  It means what it means - rotation... keep the opposition guessing.  Don't allow them to get overly familiar with the pattern of players they meet.

I wouldn't mind at all a few strategic changes.  As bandwagon says.. it's that the intensity stays at the levels they are at and even increase through the competition.  That's more important than the players involved - and if there is no decernible fall off in performance (or even an increase in performance levels) then that will be even more promising to see.  Squad players must be kept in the loop if they're making statements in Provinces.

GunsGerms wrote:

rodders wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo was brilliant the other night against Cardiff (playing FB).

Nonsense, he was decent at best. What about Conway, not beating his drum are you? .... double standards sir!

What do you expect.

Exactly guns...anyone bother to look at the game

Zebo did some good things and bad things against Cardiff- it didn't persuade me he should be higher up the pecking order.

Notch wrote:Zebo did some good things and bad things against Cardiff- it didn't persuade me he should be higher up the pecking order.

off you go then...bad things first

 

This is rapidly becoming an extension of the famous POM is God one.

Madigan and Marmion...let's really spice things up for England...and Zebo.

Same, except Hendo for Tuohy. Madigan for Paddy J. We may need something special to break England.

Trimble and D. Kearney have pleased Joe. They followed his orders to a tee. Don't see any reason to shift either one of them.

I'd leave Boss there too. We will need his belligerence in the last 15/20 mins. Bring Reddan in for Italy.

But, he has just said he will freshen it all up. V England. At Twickers. Cocky basterd.

Believe.

ME-109 wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:

rodders wrote:

ME-109 wrote:Zebo was brilliant the other night against Cardiff (playing FB).

Nonsense, he was decent at best. What about Conway, not beating his drum are you? .... double standards sir!

What do you expect.

Exactly guns...anyone bother to look at the game

No.

ME-109 wrote:

Notch wrote:Zebo did some good things and bad things against Cardiff- it didn't persuade me he should be higher up the pecking order.

off you go then...bad things first

A few loose passes, a few balls hitting the ground that should have went to hand. Thats all really. He had a few good runs as well. He was alright, I've seen him play a lot better, but the thing is Kearney and Trimble have had a couple of games which were very solid.

Harsh but true, but the Six Nations is normally about the team that makes the least errors. The kind of space he was running into doesn't exist at test level and I'm not convinced one start makes him battle-hardened to slip in seamlessly.

TOD for Henry? Henry has been good but TOD offers a bit more around the park.

Notch wrote:

ME-109 wrote:

Notch wrote:Zebo did some good things and bad things against Cardiff- it didn't persuade me he should be higher up the pecking order.

off you go then...bad things first

A few loose passes, a few balls hitting the ground that should have went to hand. Thats all really. He had a few good runs as well. He was alright, I've seen him play a lot better, but the thing is Kearney and Trimble have had a couple of games which were very solid.

Harsh but true, but the Six Nations is normally about the team that makes the least errors. The kind of space he was running into doesn't exist at test level and I'm not convinced one start makes him battle-hardened to slip in seamlessly.

A few this and that....how many? I counted one loose pass and a dropped one from a difficult pass. Other than that he beat defenders at will (5 according to the stats) made 101 metres and caused havoc in the cardiff defense in the second half...however I am just highlighting this. I dont expect conservative Joe to make any changes as I have pointed out. But a more expansive game is going to be needed against defences like England and France...and we might even have trouble breaking the Italians down (although luckily they will be knackered by the time we get them).

LeinsterFan4life wrote:TOD for Henry? Henry has been good but TOD offers a bit more around the park.

Henrys "honest" endeavour will probably be more necessary against a large English pack and more expansive game.

Conservative Joe   

Yep, those two errors were what I was thinking of. I'm not saying he had a bad game, I'm just saying with the guys who have the chance now grabbing it with both hands he'd need to be exceptional to force his way in. Trimble made 72 meters against a much harder defence so that 101 metre stat isn't exceptional- although it must be said its better than it initially appears due to the conditions, and that also makes those mistakes more excusable. I just don't buy that Zebo is going to make us suddenly more dangerous in attack. I think a lot of our deficiencies in that area come from us not having that many powerful ball carriers in the back row or the centres. We have a great defensive back row and centre partnership but they are lacking in attack. One winger won't change that. I do think if we manufacture the overlaps the wingers we have can finish, for sure.

I'm a big fan of Zebo and think he'll force his way in as a starter in due course. But the thing is, he's competing with guys who have been starting for province and country for several months and he's just not going to be at their level of sharpness after one start.

For all that I'd actually like to see Zebo come into the team, but definitely against Italy not England.

True to an extent, however he did all that in the second half as conditions had changed, he didn't do too much in the first due to the weather. In the second half he just went for it

Joe needs to keep as many Ulstermen in the squad as he can - after all they are the ones who have scored all the tries

The Great Aukster wrote:Joe needs to keep as many Ulstermen in the squad as he can - after all they are the ones who have scored all the tries

Carried there by Munster men and Ladyboys...oh and sprinkling of Best for seasoning.

I am not sure i would make any changes to be honest.

Maybe bring in Madigan for Darcy and give him(Darcy ) a rest. but that is it.

majesticimperialman wrote:I am not sure i would make any changes to be honest.

Maybe bring in Madigan for Darcy and give him(Darcy ) a rest. but that is it.

Schmidt is considering mixing it up a little to keep players interested and rewarded... so I don't think there will be much change but possibly some benchers might start, some starters might bench and a player or two might come in.  Two or three changes might be on.
Then again it's two weeks so much too far ahead to second guess him.

I'm not sure Zebo will come back into the squad. He missed out due to his attitude during the North American tour. That is categorical fact. Maybe Schmidt will feel he has made his point but apparently he is utterly ruthless when it comes to selection and may want to make Zebo sweat. Personally I understand why Zebo was less than full-throated when he knew he was about to be selected for the Lions, but obviously the new setup are making an example of him. It'll be interesting to see if there is much movement in the squad before the England match.

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:I'm not sure Zebo will come back into the squad.  He missed out due to his attitude during the North American tour.  That is categorical fact.  Maybe Schmidt will feel he has made his point but apparently he is utterly ruthless when it comes to selection and may want to make Zebo sweat.  Personally I understand why Zebo was less than full-throated when he knew he was about to be selected for the Lions, but obviously the new setup are making an example of him.  It'll be interesting to see if there is much movement in the squad before the England match.  

Been talking to Joe, cos that's the only way you would know its a categorical fact...love it when you come up with these facts...

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:I'm not sure Zebo will come back into the squad.  He missed out due to his attitude during the North American tour.  That is categorical fact.  Maybe Schmidt will feel he has made his point but apparently he is utterly ruthless when it comes to selection and may want to make Zebo sweat.  Personally I understand why Zebo was less than full-throated when he knew he was about to be selected for the Lions, but obviously the new setup are making an example of him.  It'll be interesting to see if there is much movement in the squad before the England match.  

Zebo' attitude annoyed me too back then..... but is this fact that he is being punished for America?  If so Hook, could you point me to the source?

Oh ME is already on to this one The field is yours ME.

SecretFly wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:I'm not sure Zebo will come back into the squad.  He missed out due to his attitude during the North American tour.  That is categorical fact.  Maybe Schmidt will feel he has made his point but apparently he is utterly ruthless when it comes to selection and may want to make Zebo sweat.  Personally I understand why Zebo was less than full-throated when he knew he was about to be selected for the Lions, but obviously the new setup are making an example of him.  It'll be interesting to see if there is much movement in the squad before the England match.  

Zebo' attitude annoyed me too back then..... but is this fact that he is being punished for America?  If so Hook, could you point me to the source?

Ah now, I'm not saying I agree with Schmidt.  If I was in Zebo' position on a reserve tour playing 3rd division international teams when I could be going on a Lions tour.....?  Hard to think many players wouldn't say the same.  

But yes, apparently this is absolute genuine truth.  I'm honestly not on the wind up, as much as I do enjoy a bit of that.  But I can't say who told me because a) it was in confidence; b) its ill mannered; and c) he'll tell me bugger all again and I get some proper juicy gossip from time to time. DOD can believe whatever he wishes on this, I don't really care and don't need to justify it. For the record, I'd have had him in the squad from the start, and in the starting XV.

Its bullcrap in other words..

ME-109 wrote:Its bullcrap in other words..

Whatever you like to believe big dog is up to you. I'm telling you I've been told it's categorically true. I'm only repeating what I've been told. The only people who know 100% for certain are Zebo & the coach and they'll never come out and public and tell anyone that in the future. But, believe what you wish, it's your prerogative after all. The Ulster lads on these boards will know I have a good inside track on info there too. But anyway, believe as you wish lad  

Well... we'll await further possible leaks on that one then before we decide what we think of it.

As regards understanding Zebo phoning in his interest in an Ireland tour because he was waiting for a Lions Golden Ticket:  I suppose you have to have a certain opinion about The Lions before you could understand that one.  I neither have that opinion about The Lions nor would I condone the attitude.

But I wouldn't ban him from the team either as punishment.. I'd readily take him onboard for the England game... and tell him, "the way you'll aim to play for us today is the way you'll aim to play for us at all times in the future, or else"

SecretFly wrote:Well... we'll await further possible leaks on that one then before we decide what we think of it.

As regards understanding Zebo phoning in his interest in an Ireland tour because he was waiting for a Lions Golden Ticket:  I suppose you have to have a certain opinion about The Lions before you could understand that one.  I neither have that opinion about The Lions nor would I condone the attitude.

But I wouldn't ban him from the team either as punishment.. I'd readily take him onboard for the England game... and tell him, "the way you'll aim to play for us today is the way you'll aim to play for us at all times in the future, or else"

Well if it's true, which apparently it is though I still raise a somewhat sceptical eyebrow to it, then I'm sure the sentence and time has been served. Missing a whole championship as punishment? Would be rather harsh. A couple of games out would seem about right. We want lads that bleed green then Schmidt will want to see 100% commitment. Zebo gave much less than that. But we will know if Bowe comes in and Zebo doesn't that all is not as it seems. I think we need Zebo's spark on the pitch, though he wouldn't have made a lick of difference so far.

On the Lions, indeed, you are right of course. It may well be the case that Schmidt agrees with you on that one.

Hookie I actually think you are right about it but that would concern me a little. This isnt highschool in New Zealand and he is dealing with Pro rugby players (although I say that advisedly). I also think given how Trimble and DK havent done anything wrong in the two games the kind of message he would be giving them if he now dropped them (or anyone from the bench). To a certain extent he could be backing himself into a corner...EOS anyone...

Zebo made Ireland training squads last September (unlike Trimble, Cave & Gilroy for example). Then he got injured for the AIs.

If he was being punished for not performing well on the US tour, why was he not dropped for that squad?

I think he will only rotate the bench a bit - i.e., start McFadden for Kearney. Possibly start Tommy O'Donnell for Henry (with Henry on the bench). Maybe Felix Jones on the bench (he has been the travelling back so far I know).

I think they will be the only two he might think of.

By the way, Schmidt doesn't like the word 'rotation'! I'm surprised all you Leinster fans don't know that  

Sin é wrote:Zebo made Ireland training squads last September (unlike Trimble, Cave & Gilroy for example). Then he got injured for the AIs.

If he was being punished for not performing well on the US tour, why was he not dropped for that squad?

He's being punished piecemeal?

If he is/was being punished.... and that's up in the air until a leak might float out - then it really must have stung someone in Ireland camp - not necessarily Schmidt though, who was just an observer.  Kiss was the boss then...and maybe it's a latent distaste from him that goaded Schmidt to act.

Anyway, it's all speculation to us (even though Hook has a factual lowdown)  I'm shocked that you don't have the true details Sin available for us.  That's your homework.  Find out for us.  Use your sources and find out for us!!!

Sin é wrote:

By the way, Schmidt doesn't like the word 'rotation'! I'm surprised all you Leinster fans don't know that  

He may use a different word then...but he's done enough of it for us to know he does it.

SecretFly wrote:

Sin é wrote:

By the way, Schmidt doesn't like the word 'rotation'! I'm surprised all you Leinster fans don't know that  

He may use a different word then...but he's done enough of it for us to know he does it.

Look at Schmidts HC teams with Leinster....he never rotated/changed the team unless there was an injury. His selections were as obvious as a belfastman with a grudge.