Barclays Premier League 13/14 Thread Part 'x'

[mystiroakey]

First topic message reminder :

Oh you are SAF? or a Glazier?

[Hammersmith harrier]

There's no point debating with either of you, completely blind to anything negative to do with Arsenal.

[socal1976]

Well the whole point of being world-class is that you're one of the best in the world or, indeed, the best. And it is something that only the best can achieve. It's the elite.

Before this weekend, when exactly did Ozil have a good game for Arsenal? January? December? That's not world-class, that's inconsistency. Something which blights many footballers.

He played great in the both the last cup ties. Against Liverpool he had the key pass in both of Arsenal's goals although he didn't have the assist. He was sensational against Everton. So he basically carried us through those last two difficult ties to put us into a great opportunity to succeed.

[socal1976]

There's no point debating with either of you, completely blind to anything negative to do with Arsenal.

HH, neither one of us is arguing he has played spectacularly the last couple of months. But a couple of months doesn't make a season, even great players can have slumps and drops in form. I loved Cantona, I remember in 96 or 97 he went a couple of months where he didn't score in any competitions. He was still the best player on the team and contributed. Ozil can and I am sure will play better than he has the last couple of months. But he has been integral to our success in the cup this season so if we win it he deserves a lot of credit for that.

[Champagne_Socialist]

All I remember was everyone and their mother telling me how Ozil's success would be measured by ending Arsenal's trophy drought, now HH the famous critic of stats and proponent of it is all about the trophies is moving the goal posts. Ozil leads our team in assists, key passes, and has scored some big goals over the course of the season as well. All in a season that he is adjusting to a new league and a new team; if we win the FA cup he will be a big part of it (certainly bigger part than Carrick and Ronny Johnson were to those trophies). And lets be clear this is a hypothetical with all due respect the teams left in this tournament can still put us out. But that doesn't keep me from pointing out your hypocrisy and the subtle moving of the goal posts.

exactly, we bought ozil to win trophies and challenge for the epl, guess what, we are challenging for the epl and should win the fa cup so Ozil by those standards has been a success. The fact he is also top of the assists and key passes and 3rd top goal scorer for us also highlights just how important he has been for us.

CS back me up on this point, didn't we hear when Ozil was signed how his success and the quality of the buy would be measured in trophies? That was the criteria I heard everyone pointing to now I am hearing something different. He and Giroud have been the constants in our attack with players like Ox, Wilshere, Ramsey, Walcott, Podolski, and Cazorla all missing long stretches of the season those two have been there fighting it out to keep us in contention. Ozil is at or near the top of the chart in key passes, chances created, and assist in the EPL. Has he had a slump in form in the last few matches, I think that is undeniable. But I don't think you will find a single Gunner that would criticize him and this side if we lift the cup. Especially, in light of his performances for us and how he has contributed to that success.

yep agree 100%, when Ozil was bought that is all I heard, he would be judged based on if he won us trophies, now that him winning us a trophy is turning into a reality people are changing the standards. Now people like duty are saying he will only have a world class season if he outperforms suarez or bale   

Any player who gets 20 assists and 10 goals in all comps is having a world class season.

[Duty281]

I'm not saying he has to outperform Suarez or Bale, but that, generally, is the level of a world-class season.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Is there not an arsenal thread you guys can debate arsenal endlessly in?

[Hammersmith harrier]

There's no point debating with either of you, completely blind to anything negative to do with Arsenal.

HH, neither one of us is arguing he has played spectacularly the last couple of months. But a couple of months doesn't make a season, even great players can have slumps and drops in form. I loved Cantona, I remember in 96 or 97 he went a couple of months where he didn't score in any competitions. He was still the best player on the team and contributed. Ozil can and I am sure will play better than he has the last couple of months. But he has been integral to our success in the cup this season so if we win it he deserves a lot of credit for that.

You keep putting words into peoples mouths, could you post some evidence to back up your claims instead of repeating it as if it's anything other than being complete fabrication?

Lets not go comparing Ozil to Cantona, one dragged his teams to 5 division titles the other has done none of that, he may not have been scoring but he was still contributing to the team which Ozil hasn't done in the league for a couple of months now.

[Champagne_Socialist]

I'm not saying he has to outperform Suarez or Bale, but that, generally, is the level of a world-class season.

It really is not the level of a world class season, it is just the level suarez is playing at. Ronaldo and messi are world class but you don't have to play as good as them to have a world class season.

[socal1976]

I'm not saying he has to outperform Suarez or Bale, but that, generally, is the level of a world-class season.

I disagree I would rate any player that is top 5 at his position to be World class. I think despite his slump last couple of month there isn't a football expert who wouldn't say that Ozil is still currently one of the 5 best playmaking midfielders.

[Guest]

I'm not saying he has to outperform Suarez or Bale, but that, generally, is the level of a world-class season.

I disagree I would rate any player that is top 5 at his position to be World class. I think despite his slump last couple of month there isn't a football expert who wouldn't say that Ozil is still currently one of the 5 best  playmaking midfielders.

That's a bold statement to say the least Socal.

[Hammersmith harrier]

Some of us just have higher expectations of a world class, Rooney is having a statistically better season as well as playing better but he's still some way from having a world class season.

I'm done putting up with you clowns and your nonsense, lets see how this foe button works.

[Champagne_Socialist]

I'm not saying he has to outperform Suarez or Bale, but that, generally, is the level of a world-class season.

I disagree I would rate any player that is top 5 at his position to be World class. I think despite his slump last couple of month there isn't a football expert who wouldn't say that Ozil is still currently one of the 5 best  playmaking midfielders.

That's a bold statement to say the least Socal.

In terms of creating goals I would say Ozil is quite possible the best, most assists in europe in the last 5 years and top of the list for key passes this season.

[socal1976]

All I remember was everyone and their mother telling me how Ozil's success would be measured by ending Arsenal's trophy drought, now HH the famous critic of stats and proponent of it is all about the trophies is moving the goal posts. Ozil leads our team in assists, key passes, and has scored some big goals over the course of the season as well. All in a season that he is adjusting to a new league and a new team; if we win the FA cup he will be a big part of it (certainly bigger part than Carrick and Ronny Johnson were to those trophies). And lets be clear this is a hypothetical with all due respect the teams left in this tournament can still put us out. But that doesn't keep me from pointing out your hypocrisy and the subtle moving of the goal posts.

exactly, we bought ozil to win trophies and challenge for the epl, guess what, we are challenging for the epl and should win the fa cup so Ozil by those standards has been a success. The fact he is also top of the assists and key passes and 3rd top goal scorer for us also highlights just how important he has been for us.

CS back me up on this point, didn't we hear when Ozil was signed how his success and the quality of the buy would be measured in trophies? That was the criteria I heard everyone pointing to now I am hearing something different. He and Giroud have been the constants in our attack with players like Ox, Wilshere, Ramsey, Walcott, Podolski, and Cazorla all missing long stretches of the season those two have been there fighting it out to keep us in contention. Ozil is at or near the top of the chart in key passes, chances created, and assist in the EPL. Has he had a slump in form in the last few matches, I think that is undeniable. But I don't think you will find a single Gunner that would criticize him and this side if we lift the cup. Especially, in light of his performances for us and how he has contributed to that success.

yep agree 100%, when Ozil was bought that is all I heard, he would be judged based on if he won us trophies, now that him winning us a trophy is turning into a reality people are changing the standards. Now people like duty are saying he will only have a world class season if he outperforms suarez or bale   

Any player who gets 20 assists and 10 goals in all comps is having a world class season.

If Arsenal win the FA cup the criticism will change. Now Arsenal and its players will be deemed failures because they couldn't win the league. If they win the league all of sudden everyone will say that the premier league has degraded to the worst level in years. If Ozil was to leave Arsenal any number of big clubs would jump at the chance to buy him and he would play for any of them. Ancellotti just a month ago said he made a mistake in selling Ozil, a huge admission for a player that he sold.

[Duty281]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

[socal1976]

I'm not saying he has to outperform Suarez or Bale, but that, generally, is the level of a world-class season.

I disagree I would rate any player that is top 5 at his position to be World class. I think despite his slump last couple of month there isn't a football expert who wouldn't say that Ozil is still currently one of the 5 best  playmaking midfielders.

That's a bold statement to say the least Socal.

In terms of creating goals I would say Ozil is quite possible the best, most assists in europe in the last 5 years and top of the list for key passes this season.

Cesc, Rooney (if you consider him a midfielder), and maybe Gotze. Those are the only playmaking midfielders I would rate over Ozil even in his depressed form.

[socal1976]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

[socal1976]

Some of us just have higher expectations of a world class, Rooney is having a statistically better season as well as playing better but he's still some way from having a world class season.

I'm done putting up with you clowns and your nonsense, lets see how this foe button works.

Hallelujah! Arsenal trounce Everton 4-1 in the cup quarterfinals and get a great opportunity in the semis of the FA cup and HH is foe listing me. Christmas comes early this year.

[Guest]

I'd put Xavi and Iniesta above him straight away.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

https://www.606v2.com/t52449-arsenal-fc-thread#2566265

[socal1976]

I'd put Xavi and Iniesta above him straight away.

Iniesta I agree with Xavi, I don't. Xavi has been highly mediocre this year. Cesc has basically taken his spot and to me he is not nearly as influential there is even talk of him leaving Barca and take an MLS payday.

[Duty281]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

[Champagne_Socialist]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

Well based on your views Suarez is not world class because he is below the level of ibrahimovic and to be world class you have to be the best.

To be world class you just have to be playing world class, you don't have to be the best in your position, that is just nonsense.

[socal1976]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

[Hammersmith harrier]

Duty, i'd give it up before you get dragged down to their level, such blatant trolls should be banned from this site.

[Champagne_Socialist]

I'm not saying he has to outperform Suarez or Bale, but that, generally, is the level of a world-class season.

I would also add that bale and suarez play in different positions to Ozil so that argument that Ozil has to outperform suarez is redundant. It is like saying Pique is not world class unless he outperforms Messi....

[Duty281]

Suarez is below Ibrahimovic?

No...I'll be here all night otherwise.

[Champagne_Socialist]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

[Duty281]

Duty, i'd give it up before you get dragged down to their level, such blatant trolls should be banned from this site.

Haha, yeah.

They've got such a similar writing style and view on football that, if they weren't logged on at the same time, I'd almost believe they were the same person.

[socal1976]

I would rather have Suarez than Ibra myself duty.

[Champagne_Socialist]

Suarez is below Ibrahimovic?

No...I'll be here all night otherwise.

Well if Suarez is above Ibrahimovic that means ibrahimovic is not world class because he is below the level of suarez..... cording to your opinion which is obviously wrong

[Hammersmith harrier]

Duty, i'd give it up before you get dragged down to their level, such blatant trolls should be banned from this site.

Haha, yeah.

They've got such a similar writing style and view on football that, if they weren't logged on at the same time, I'd almost believe they were the same person.

I believe they are the same person Duty, very easy to circumvent the IP tracker and they come across as being sad enough to do it.

[socal1976]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

[CFCNick]

Is there not an arsenal thread you guys can debate arsenal endlessly in?

Do you remember back when this place was split into individual clubs?

[Duty281]

Suarez is below Ibrahimovic?

No...I'll be here all night otherwise.

Well if Suarez is above Ibrahimovic that means ibrahimovic is not world class because he is below the level of suarez..... cording to your opinion which is obviously wrong

Stop putting words in my mouth. They can both be world-class.

[Champagne_Socialist]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

The only player I can think of is Oscar but I think Ozil has had a slightly better season. David Silva has not been as good as Ozil this season and neither has Juan Mata.

I am actually struggling to find an attacking central midfield playmaker who has had a better season than Ozil in the EPL.

[Champagne_Socialist]

Suarez is below Ibrahimovic?

No...I'll be here all night otherwise.

Well if Suarez is above Ibrahimovic that means ibrahimovic is not world class because he is below the level of suarez..... cording to your opinion which is obviously wrong

Stop putting words in my mouth. They can both be world-class.

so you are now saying you don't have to be at the level of suarez to be world class.... make your mind up

[socal1976]

Suarez is below Ibrahimovic?

No...I'll be here all night otherwise.

Well if Suarez is above Ibrahimovic that means ibrahimovic is not world class because he is below the level of suarez..... cording to your opinion which is obviously wrong

Stop putting words in my mouth. They can both be world-class.

Ok so where do you draw the line? Can 3, 4 or 5 players at a single position be world class. You said world class meant the best it is a logical connotation from the statement that you made. The best means one, the single best.

[socal1976]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

The only player I can think of is Oscar but I think Ozil has had a slightly better season. David Silva has not been as good as Ozil this season and neither has Juan Mata.

I am actually struggling to find an attacking central midfield playmaker who has had a better season than Ozil in the EPL.

You missed our lengthy debate last night about how Rooney is now a playmaking midfielder despite the fact that United's webpage has him listed as a striker and that he starts a great many matches as a striker and has played almost his whole career as a forward. Apparently, Rooney is the best playmaking midfielder in EPL now. Oscar has been just as up and down as Ozil. He has been benched a number of recent matches and has tailed off a great deal since a great start to the season. But again that is another player who has recently had a dip in form who the media aren't criticizing and crucifying. If he played for the gunners they would be calling him soft and inconsistent.

[Champagne_Socialist]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

The only player I can think of is Oscar but I think Ozil has had a slightly better season. David Silva has not been as good as Ozil this season and neither has Juan Mata.

I am actually struggling to find an attacking central midfield playmaker who has had a better season than Ozil in the EPL.

You missed our lengthy debate last night about how Rooney is now a playmaking midfielder despite the fact that United's webpage has him listed as a striker and that he starts a great many matches as a striker and has played almost his whole career as a forward. Apparently, Rooney is the best playmaking midfielder in EPL now. Oscar has been just as up and down as Ozil. He has been benched a number of recent matches and has tailed off a great deal since a great start to the season. But again that is another player who has recently had a dip in form who the media aren't criticizing and crucifying. If he played for the gunners they would be calling him soft and inconsistent.

I would say Rooney is a striker, it is only because of Utd's weakness in midfield that he is forced to play in midfield.

[Duty281]

Rooney is a ten - I thought we went over this.

Ibrahimovic isn't world-class, I've never said he was/is.

And the best? I mean a vague grouping. I don't think there's a fixed number on how many can be world-class or not.

[CFCNick]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

You ever heard of a chap that goes by the name of Eden Hazard? More assists in all comps than Bale, Iniesta and Xavi in the last 18 months. 15 goals and 10 assists this season. 16 goals and 26 assists last season. Lit up Kyle Walker yesterday.

Or how about Oscar? 17 goals and 19 assists last season. 12 goals and 8 assists this season.

Then add David Silva, Fabregas, Isco, Iniesta, Mata, Lallana, Gotze, hell I'd even put Coutinho ahead of Ozil.

If you can't count that's 6 players in the Premier League I'd have instead of Ozil.

[CFCNick]

Rooney is a ten - I thought we went over this.

Ibrahimovic isn't world-class, I've never said he was/is.

And the best? I mean a vague grouping. I don't think there's a fixed number on how many can be world-class or not.

Think we can count on one hand the number of people who think Ibra is world class.

[Duty281]

Eden Hazard and Oscar would easily slot into a best XI this season ahead of Ozil. David Silva too, in all probability.

[Champagne_Socialist]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

You ever heard of a chap that goes by the name of Eden Hazard? More assists in all comps than Bale, Iniesta and Xavi in the last 18 months. 15 goals and 10 assists this season. 16 goals and 26 assists last season. Lit up Kyle Walker yesterday.

Or how about Oscar? 17 goals and 19 assists last season. 12 goals and 8 assists this season.

Then add David Silva, Fabregas, Isco, Iniesta, Mata, Lallana, Gotze, hell I'd even put Coutinho ahead of Ozil.

If you can't count that's 6 players in the Premier League I'd have instead of Ozil.

Didn't know isco, fabregas, iniesta and gotze play in the epl.

Are you seriously saying mata has played better than Ozil this season? Mata has had a very very poor year, mainly due to being benched for 6 months because of mourinho.

I disagree that lallana, coutinho or david silva hve had as much of an impact as Ozil.

I would also add that Hazard plays on the wing whilst Ozil plays ion the centre, very different positions so impossible to compare.

[socal1976]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

You ever heard of a chap that goes by the name of Eden Hazard? More assists in all comps than Bale, Iniesta and Xavi in the last 18 months. 15 goals and 10 assists this season. 16 goals and 26 assists last season. Lit up Kyle Walker yesterday.

Or how about Oscar? 17 goals and 19 assists last season. 12 goals and 8 assists this season.

Then add David Silva, Fabregas, Isco, Iniesta, Mata, Lallana, Gotze, hell I'd even put Coutinho ahead of Ozil.

If you can't count that's 6 players in the Premier League I'd have instead of Ozil.

Hazard is a winger. Oscar has slumped in recent weeks and is way off the form he showed early in the year. Isco is on the bench at Madrid behind Ozil's understudy Modric. Lallana a good player but pretty funny him being better than Ozil. Coutinho are you serious? Mata was on the bench at Chelsea and has been pretty mediocre for United since his switch. Of the list you presented maybe Oscar. Cesc and Iniesta I can agree with.

[Champagne_Socialist]

Rooney is a ten - I thought we went over this.

Ibrahimovic isn't world-class, I've never said he was/is.

And the best? I mean a vague grouping. I don't think there's a fixed number on how many can be world-class or not.

Think we can count on one hand the number of people who think Ibra is world class.

He made the fifa team of the year

He is easily world class but that is a different debate.

[Guest]

Never understood all the Ibra hate myself. Had he plied his trade in this country he'd be held in higher regard probably. One of the best frontmen of the past decade.

[CFCNick]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

You ever heard of a chap that goes by the name of Eden Hazard? More assists in all comps than Bale, Iniesta and Xavi in the last 18 months. 15 goals and 10 assists this season. 16 goals and 26 assists last season. Lit up Kyle Walker yesterday.

Or how about Oscar? 17 goals and 19 assists last season. 12 goals and 8 assists this season.

Then add David Silva, Fabregas, Isco, Iniesta, Mata, Lallana, Gotze, hell I'd even put Coutinho ahead of Ozil.

If you can't count that's 6 players in the Premier League I'd have instead of Ozil.

Hazard is a winger. Oscar has slumped in recent weeks and is way off the form he showed early in the year. Isco is on the bench at Madrid behind Ozil's understudy Modric. Lallana a good player but pretty funny him being better than Ozil. Coutinho are you serious? Mata was on the bench at Chelsea and has been pretty mediocre for United since his switch. Of the list you presented maybe Oscar. Cesc and Iniesta I can agree with.

Like Ozil then? Eh?

[CFCNick]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

You ever heard of a chap that goes by the name of Eden Hazard? More assists in all comps than Bale, Iniesta and Xavi in the last 18 months. 15 goals and 10 assists this season. 16 goals and 26 assists last season. Lit up Kyle Walker yesterday.

Or how about Oscar? 17 goals and 19 assists last season. 12 goals and 8 assists this season.

Then add David Silva, Fabregas, Isco, Iniesta, Mata, Lallana, Gotze, hell I'd even put Coutinho ahead of Ozil.

If you can't count that's 6 players in the Premier League I'd have instead of Ozil.

Didn't know isco, fabregas, iniesta and gotze play in the epl.

Are you seriously saying mata has played better than Ozil this season? Mata has had a very very poor year, mainly due to being benched for 6 months because of mourinho.

I disagree that lallana, coutinho or david silva hve had as much of an impact as Ozil.

I would also add that Hazard plays on the wing whilst Ozil plays ion the centre, very different positions so impossible to compare.

Well, you can't count then can you. The list at the bottom of my post has eight players plus Ozil. Four from the Premier League plus Hazard and Oscar.

  for you   

[Champagne_Socialist]

World-class is the elite level. The highest. The best.

Which is not where Ozil is this season, which was the original point.

So only one player at each position can be world class? Under that criteria either Zlatan or Suarez aren't world class, because only one of them can be world class. Either Vidal or Ya Ya are world class and not both of them because there can be only one that is the best. The world of football is not a highlander movie. "there can only be one."

No the best is a vague grouping. You know...there can be more than one.

I agree this hasn't been Ozil's best season but even still I struggle to find five playmaking midfielders that I rate higher than him. Iniesta is a fair shout. Gotze maybe. Cesc for sure he has been great. Rooney if you are now categorizing him as a midfield playmaker (despite him playing a lot of times as a striker and most of his career).

Are there 3 other playmakers in the EPL who have been better than Ozil this season? 12 assists, 6 goals and top of the key passes stat is hard to beat.

Can't think of more than one or two that have had better seasons. The once vaunted Mata who was purchased for almost the same amount of money hasn't exactly been burning it up this season at either United or Chelsea but somehow the media isn't crucifying him like they are doing to Ozil.

You ever heard of a chap that goes by the name of Eden Hazard? More assists in all comps than Bale, Iniesta and Xavi in the last 18 months. 15 goals and 10 assists this season. 16 goals and 26 assists last season. Lit up Kyle Walker yesterday.

Or how about Oscar? 17 goals and 19 assists last season. 12 goals and 8 assists this season.

Then add David Silva, Fabregas, Isco, Iniesta, Mata, Lallana, Gotze, hell I'd even put Coutinho ahead of Ozil.

If you can't count that's 6 players in the Premier League I'd have instead of Ozil.

Hazard is a winger. Oscar has slumped in recent weeks and is way off the form he showed early in the year. Isco is on the bench at Madrid behind Ozil's understudy Modric. Lallana a good player but pretty funny him being better than Ozil. Coutinho are you serious? Mata was on the bench at Chelsea and has been pretty mediocre for United since his switch. Of the list you presented maybe Oscar. Cesc and Iniesta I can agree with.

But if we just look at epl players then that would just leave oscar who is performing roughly the same as Ozil. Would also add oscar's form has slumped massively over the last 6 weeks but no one here is using that to bash him.

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