Glasgow and Edinburgh: Ongoing Banter Thread III

[George Carlin]

First topic message reminder :

Historical Banter:

https://www.606v2.com/t48240-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread
https://www.606v2.com/t51313-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-ii
 
A. Edinburgh
 
1. Pre-season
 
Fri 30 Aug 2013, 19:45
Edinburgh Rugby 15 - 5 Newcastle Falcons
 
Fri 23 Aug 2013, 19:30
Northampton Saints 24 - 6 Edinburgh Rugby
 
2. 2013/2014 Season - Played
 
Sat 7 Sep, 19:15
Munster Rugby 34 - 23 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Fri 13 Sep, 19:45
Edinburgh Rugby 16 - 13 Newport Gwent Dragons
 
Sat 21 Sep, 18:30
Ospreys 44 - 10 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Fri 27 Sep, 19:45
Edinburgh Rugby 9 - 22 Scarlets
 
Sun 6 Oct, 14:05
Cardiff Blues 29 - 12 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Fri 25 Oct, 19:45
Edinburgh Rugby 20 - 13 Benetton Treviso
 
Fri 1 Nov 19:45
Edinburgh Rugby 25 - 23 Zebre
 
Fri 22 Nov 19:05
Ulster Rugby 41 - 17 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Fri 29 Nov 19:45
Edinburgh Rugby 43 - 10 Connacht
 
Fri 20 Dec 19:35
Edinburgh Rugby 11 - 6 Leinster
 
Thu 26 Dec 15:05
Edinburgh Rugby 16 - 20 Glasgow Warriors
 
Wed 1 Jan 18:05
Glasgow Warriors P - P Edinburgh Rugby
 
Sat 15 Feb 17:00
Connacht Rugby 11 - 7 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Sat 22 Feb 14:30
Scarlets 25 - 21 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Fri 28 Feb 19:35
Edinburgh Rugby 31 - 25 Ospreys
 
Fri 21 Mar 19:45
Edinburgh Rugby 3 - 9 Ulster Rugby
 
Sat 29 Mar 19:00
Benetton Treviso 20 - 16 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Thu 3 Apr 18:30
Newport Gwent Dragons 19 - 23 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Fri 11 Apr 19:45
Edinburgh Rugby 22 - 29 Cardiff Blues
 
Sat 19 Apr 15:30
Zebre 26 - 13 Edinburgh Rugby
 
Sat 26 Apr 19:05
Glasgow Warriors 37 - 34 Edinburgh Rugby
 
3. 2013/2014 Season - Final Games
 
Sat 3 May 17:00
Edinburgh Rugby v Munster Rugby
Meggetland
BBCALBA/TG4
 
Sat 10 May 18:30
Leinster Rugby v Edinburgh Rugby
Royal Dublin Society
 
B. Glasgow
 
1. Pre-season
 
Sat 31 Aug 2013, 15:00
Exeter Chiefs 26 - 29 Glasgow Warriors
 
2. 2013/2014 Season
 
Fri 6 Sep, 19:35
Glasgow Warriors 22 - 15 Cardiff Blues
 
Fri 13 Sep, 19:05
Ulster Rugby 12 - 13 Glasgow Warriors
 
Fri 20 Sep, 19:35
Glasgow Warriors 12 - 6 Leinster Rugby
 
Fri 27 Sep, 19:30
Zebre 17 - 24 Glasgow Warriors
 
Sat 5 Oct, 18:30
Scarlets 12 - 17 Glasgow Warriors
 
Fri 25 Oct, 19:35
Glasgow Warriors 6 - 13 Munster Rugby
 
Sat 2 Nov, 17:00
Connacht Rugby 12 - 19 Glasgow Warriors
 
Fri 22 Nov, 19:35
Glasgow Warriors 8 - 23 Newport Gwent Dragons
 
Fri 29 Nov, 19:05
Ospreys 16 - 28 Glasgow Warriors
 
Fri 20 Dec, 19:35
Glasgow Warriors P - P Benetton Treviso
 
Thu 26 Dec 15:05
Edinburgh Rugby 16 - 20 Glasgow Warriors
 
Wed 1 Jan 18:05
Glasgow Warriors P - P Edinburgh Rugby
 
Sun 9 Feb 14:00
Glasgow Warriors 8 - 6 Connacht Rugby
 
Sat 15 Feb 18:30
Cardiff Blues 20 - 27 Glasgow Warriors
 
Sun 23 Feb 14:30
Newport Gwent Dragons 24 - 23 Glasgow Warriors
 
Sat 1 Mar 20:30
Leinster Rugby 28 - 25 Glasgow Warriors
 
Sat 22 Mar 18:30
Glasgow Warriors 14 - 6 Scarlets
 
Fri 28 Mar 19:35
Glasgow Warriors 11 - 9 Ospreys
 
Fri 4 Apr 19:35
Glasgow Warriors 29 - 10 Benetton Treviso
 
Sat 12 Apr 18:30
Munster Rugby 5 - 22 Glasgow Warriors
 
Fri 18 Apr 19:35
Glasgow Warriors 27 - 9 Ulster Rugby
 
Sat 26 Apr 19:05
Glasgow Warriors 37 - 34 Edinburgh Rugby
 
3. 2013/2014 Season - Final Games
 
Fri 2 May 20:00
Benetton Treviso v Glasgow Warriors
Stadio Monigo
Mediast/ALBA
 
Sat 10 May 18:30
Glasgow Warriors v Zebre
Scotstoun Stadium
 
[16/17/18 May
PO Semi Final
[tbc] v [tbc]
Venue TBA]
 
[Sat 31 May
PO Final
[tbc] v [tbc]
Venue TBA]
 
***
 
Any and all patter about these teams is welcome.
 
Any jingoism, sledging or graceless kicking of anyone whilst they are up or down will see posts deleted.
 
Be gracious and be constructive.

[EWT Spoons]

Sadly I did click on the link and may have helped give them a false sense of worth.

Anyway, it sounds like this guy has plenty of experience and I hope that someone in the SRU takes on board his report as things need to change.

[123456789]

I researched his assertion that "Now is the time, Now is the hour" were the words of Robert the Bruce and it turns out most results feature him making the claim in all sorts of reports, he may be a bit of a nutjob. Having said that his ideas seem to be pretty good and his Regional plan would be incredibly successful. Not sure about the selling and lease back of Murrayfield though, I think it could cause problems in the long term.

[EWT Spoons]

Also does also rely on Edinburgh Council A) wanting to buy the stadium and B) Having the funds to allow them to do so

[123456789]

It would also provide a one off economic boost and then become a permanent drain, surely it would be far better to lease it out for concerts and athletics events over the off season, or (if Edinburgh can find a different ground) when Scotland aren't playing

[EWT Spoons]

I believe that's part of the plan with getting this new synthetic pitch. It should allow them to use it more for other events.

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

His report also makes absolutely no mention of where the blazers and bufties can expect to park their cars on Scotland match days - expect this report to be filed straight in the round, wicker paper holder

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

It also references (not quite linking in the browser I'm using) the most recently available NZRU report (2012):  http://files.allblacks.com/comms/2012_Annual_Report/New-Zealand-Rugby-Annual-Report-2012.pdf - worth a read

And the Strategic Framework is worth a skim too: http://www.nzru.co.nz/about_us/strategic_framework

[123456789]

If they're paying for three teams, who's paying for the champagne and sandwiches?

[BigGee]

It would also provide a one off economic boost and then become a permanent drain, surely it would be far better to lease it out for concerts and athletics events over the off season, or (if Edinburgh can find a different ground) when Scotland aren't playing

They kind of do that already, Celtic will be using it for European games while the CG is on. There are concerts there most summers. This is a very good revenue stream for the SRU and it would not be a good idea to give it up. The debt for Murrayfield is coming down nicely and will soon be pretty manageable, freeing up funds for other projects such as grass roats development, academies, semi pro leagures or even a third pro team!

[123456789]

So basically what Alistair Gray has done is what we've all done and that's work out what Scottish rugby needs to do to lift itself from the mire without working out a realistic financial backer

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

So basically what Alistair Gray has done is what we've all done and that's work out what Scottish rugby needs to do to lift itself from the mire without working out a realistic financial backer

Aye

[RDW]

Well what's the Euromillions jackpot for tonight?? If I won 100 million I'd happily ploy 30 million into Scottish rugby!

If I got the very best seats at Murrayfield and an open bar for all my pals on V2 forum of course...   

[Weegie Wizard]

Ok, far be it for me to suggest a previously low profile management consultant is simply trying to get a bit of publicity, but the chap seems to be repeating what anyone with even the most passing regard for Scottish rugby could have slurringly delivered in Byres Road on any given Friday.

As a point of interest, he suggests Edinburgh City Council but Murrayfield to give then a stadium to host unspecified future events! Can anyone think of any event which Edinburgh City Council may need a 67,000 seater stadium often enought to shell out hard cash to buy the place?

On another issue, Scotland needs more youngsters playing the game until they are in their late teens and we also need a third pro team to give more opportunities to make the step up to pro rugby.

Without getting too weegie, I have to say nae bother pal

[demosthenes]

It would also provide a one off economic boost and then become a permanent drain, surely it would be far better to lease it out for concerts and athletics events over the off season, or (if Edinburgh can find a different ground) when Scotland aren't playing

They kind of do that already, Celtic will be using it for European games while the CG is on. There are concerts there most summers. This is a very good revenue stream for the SRU and it would not be a good idea to give it up. The debt for Murrayfield is coming down nicely and will soon be pretty manageable, freeing up funds for other projects such as grass roats development, academies, semi pro leagures or even a third pro team!

Agreed. The asset should be developed, not sold off. And I am sure that this has been looked at before, from both inside and outside the SRU. Its not as if the rugby community in Scotland is short of people with property expertise, including at least one former President.

[GLove39]

Well what's the Euromillions jackpot for tonight?? If I won 100 million I'd happily ploy 30 million into Scottish rugby!

If I got the very best seats at Murrayfield and an open bar for all my pals on V2 forum of course...   

     

[jimbopip]

Well what's the Euromillions jackpot for tonight?? If I won 100 million I'd happily ploy 30 million into Scottish rugby!

If I got the very best seats at Murrayfield and an open bar for all my pals on V2 forum of course...   

     

You do realise that Schiz and Asbo would suddenly find your company indispensable?  

[Guest]

I don't trust him simply because he was seems to think Scotland escaped the wooden spoon on points difference (false) or that the sru are directly responsible for nematodes (false). Also he complains that a semi pro league isn't exactly ground up useful yet that's immediately after suggesting as his first recommendation a third professional team. Finally although I could go on he proudly cites work with the fa around sa world cup? Great work mate..

While much of this might be the daily mail factor My intuition is good and i say ignore him.

[123456789]

Although on a positive note we have no decent professional structure to speak of, we just let people play and hope for the best. We have a genuine chance to look at other nations at take the best bits of each ones's system to fit our own in the most productive and cost-effective way possible.

[21st Century Schizoid Man]

His report also makes absolutely no mention of where the blazers and bufties can expect to park their cars on Scotland match days - expect this report to be filed straight in the round, wicker paper holder

They (bufties) could park their Bentleys on fES' estate and get have his chauffeur run them round the corner i the old motorised charabanc !!!!  

[tigertattie]

I've found the solution to getting a SRU funded pro team in Aberdeen.

Sell Glasgow Warriors

[IanBru]

One flaw in that plan - you can't place a price on:
i) the value of awesome; and
ii) the chiseled good looks of the Glasgow Warriors' supporters.

[justified sinner]

I just noted yet another flaw with Edinburgh, the number of hoops to join the supporters site is ridiculous and the security code is indecipherable to me . So then it says contact administrator, when I try to do that it says I must be a member. Bye bye ERSC.

[RDW]

You on Twitter JS? Worth contacting them there.

Hopefully Edinburgh's players get a good kick up the arse after Friday's limp performance. Given that the Blues haven't won away in a year (last time away to Edinburgh), to give them a try BP win is just indefensible.

I hope Solomons shakes up the team - players need to know that if they play like that they will get dropped.

I would give Strauss the boot and sounds like we were punished for not playing a proper 7. Bring back the ginger midget.

On the plus side, good to see Visser back again.

[VinceWLB]

I think where Toonie's rotation policy is starting to pay dividends as all players in the squad hit their peak form, Solomon's makes him looks like a fool i mean how many games in a row is it now for the likes of Gilchrist, Nel, and du Preez? surely the likes of Cox, Basilaia and Niven could have done with some gametime, also what's up with Lutui? i think he is a much much better player than Hilterbrand...
Nel would be a much better player and more effective if he knew he had to play for 55-60 minutes only, not 78 minutes every game..

We will see if Solomons uses common sense and rotate a bit this weekend ahead of the 1872 return fixture.

[RDW]

TBH the season is lost for us now, and has been for a while really, with the only thing left playing for is the 1872 cup (however remote our chances of winning are).

All our efforts should be focussed on beating Glasgow, so if that means rotating the team and having a humiliating loss to Zebre then so be it.

[VinceWLB]

I don't think the back up options are that bad to be honest, Cox is arguably not much worse than VdW and i liked Basil's play early this season. The problem is these guys are likely to be rusty as they haven't been given gametime. But they would have a point to prove.

I certainly wouldn't bet my house that Solomons will rotate for the Zebre game..

[RDW]

If he was to do mass rotation the team would be something like

Blaauw
Hilterbrand
Berghan
Atkins
Cox
Leonardi
Grant
Basalaia

Kennedy
Bezy
Visser
Atiga
Beard
?
Brown

The forwards are still competitive enough but that highlights the glaring lack of depth in our backs.

Given the performance of some of the young backs at Melrose 7s we could do a lot worse than playing them!

[VinceWLB]

I don't think it's that bad, it would maybe not get the win away to Zebre but it would be competitive, Berghan is a big question mark though.
Yeah some of these Accies players should definitely be given a chance to shine.

[RDW]

As you say there are certain players that have had a lot of gametime this year, playing 80 minutes of most games from the start of the season. As a minimum I think they need a rest for the final run in, especially the Scottish guys going on tour in the summer.

Nel
Gilchrist
Du Preez
Denton
Cuthbert

Completely forgot that De Luca was still available! He'd do a decent job, and will no doubt be keen for a last game for Edinburgh.

[tigertattie]

with nothing to play for and Glasgow looking for a solid playoff position, should we give the unwashed four tries and a win in the cup game?

Just to be neighbourly!

[George Carlin]

with nothing to play for and Glasgow looking for a solid playoff position, should we give the unwashed four tries and a win in the cup game?

Just to be neighbourly!

  

[RDW]

I suspect it is irrelevant whether we give them it or not - they will take it either way!

[tigertattie]

You are mistaken RDW. Glasgow cannot beat us. If Glasgow win then it will only be because we let them win! With us letting Glasgow win, then it means we get the moral victory.

See.  Not just the unwashed that can be Welsh-like with their logic!

[IanBru]

Anyone reading the Irish Times yesterday? I swear, teams might as well not player Munster, because if they win it can only be because Munster were terrible.

Glasgow score a try? Weak defence.
Glasgow dominate at the breakdown? Poor skills from Munster.
Glasgow frustrate, forcing Munster into mistakes? Munster are suffering from a 'European Hangover'.
Glasgow kick a penalty goal? The posts once belonged to Leinster.

I know we harp on at the Welsh form being one-eyed and self-obsessed, but at least they can sing.

U2 and the Corrs are a load of poopie.

[RuggerRadge2611]

Anyone reading the Irish Times yesterday? I swear, teams might as well not player Munster, because if they win it can only be because Munster were terrible.

Glasgow score a try? Weak defence.
Glasgow dominate at the breakdown? Poor skills from Munster.
Glasgow frustrate, forcing Munster into mistakes? Munster are suffering from a 'European Hangover'.
Glasgow kick a penalty goal? The posts once belonged to Leinster.

I know we harp on at the Welsh form being one-eyed and self-obsessed, but at least they can sing.

U2 and the Corrs are a load of poopie.

Said this numerous times. Since their European dominance some sectors in Irish rugby have become insufferably arrogant.

[tigertattie]

One thing worth noting is that these articles are written for their audiences! No one in the Munster provence really wants to read about how well Glasgow are doing at the moment.  So the focus of the article is about how Munster peformed in the match.

Even taking that out of the picture, there is always a he said/she said arguement when it comes to opinions.  Unfortualty a sense of "arrogance" is normally picked up from these things when looking at it for the opposing side. It's like a 50/50 call going either way. The perceived stronger side would say that a 50/50 call that went for them was because it was fully justified and that the other team were moaning and whinging just because they dont win. The perceived weaker team would say they were hard done by and that the powers that be are consipring against them to keep the top teams at the top.

Besides, Glasgow can't moan because you guys are starting to develope the "bigger" team swagger!

[nickj]

Ihaia West has been called up by the Blues

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_9265098,00.html

[tigertattie]

Ihaia West has been called up by the Blues

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,16024_9265098,00.html

Ah, the fella that many said was going to be coming to Scotland to play as he aspired to play international rugby for Scotland but then everyone discovered he wasnt Scottish Qualified and had never actually even mentioned anything about moving to Scotland!!!

[nickj]

Just the chap

[George Carlin]

One thing worth noting is that these articles are written for their audiences! No one in the Munster provence really wants to read about how well Glasgow are doing at the moment.  So the focus of the article is about how Munster peformed in the match.

Even taking that out of the picture, there is always a he said/she said arguement when it comes to opinions.  Unfortualty a sense of "arrogance" is normally picked up from these things when looking at it for the opposing side. It's like a 50/50 call going either way. The perceived stronger side would say that a 50/50 call that went for them was because it was fully justified and that the other team were moaning and whinging just because they dont win. The perceived weaker team would say they were hard done by and that the powers that be are consipring against them to keep the top teams at the top.

Besides, Glasgow can't moan because you guys are starting to develope the "bigger" team swagger!

Is there a link to the article? The piece I read in the IT was quite magnanimous. Or was this a George Hook column, by any chance.

All this talk of Glasgow being a cocky side is interesting, because I wouldn't say that I agree. I honestly think that Ulster and Glasgow are very low key for sides that have played fairly well all season (not brilliantly though, on the Glasgow side) and I have never heard either Anscombe or Toonie produce a back-slapping or ridiculous interviews. Both of these sides win matches on the back of their defence. Glasgow has a very modest ground by Rabo standards - Scotstoun is a third of the size of Munster's second ground, Musgrave - and their website is simple and non-bombastic.

Other than the inevitable sledging from Glasgow fans on these boards, are they really a team to dislike? I think that Glasgow are a lot of neutral's 'second team'.

[tigertattie]

Don't get me wrong, I don't dislike Glasgow (the rugby team, not nessesarily the city)   

I'd even go as far as saying I want Glasgow to win all their games unless they are playing Edinburgh

I was just pointing out that folks perspectives come across as being different depending on the side of the fence they are on.

Please note however that my "neutrality" towards Glasgow warriors does not mean I think that ASBO and Schiz should continue to avoid soap while bathing!

[funnyExiledScot]

All this talk of Glasgow being a cocky side is interesting, because I wouldn't say that I agree. I honestly think that Ulster and Glasgow are very low key for sides that have played fairly well all season (not brilliantly though, on the Glasgow side) and I have never heard either Anscombe or Toonie produce a back-slapping or ridiculous interviews. Both of these sides win matches on the back of their defence. Glasgow has a very modest ground by Rabo standards - Scotstoun is a third of the size of Munster's second ground, Musgrave - and their website is simple and non-bombastic.

Other than the inevitable sledging from Glasgow fans on these boards, are they really a team to dislike? I think that Glasgow are a lot of neutral's 'second team'.

Such a lawyer!!

My take on it is that the Glasgow fans are fast adopting a "Welshness" to their own team, with every player starting at "world class" and then moving up a few gears thereafter. Some of the abuse us Edinburgh fans have been subjected to for merely pointing out that Al Kellock is probably less good than Victor Matfield very much mirrors the "there's only one "Dan" in world rugby, and that's Dan Biggar" brigade on the Welsh boards. How long before Tom Jones appears at Scotstoun I wonder, dressed as a stem of hogweed or giant bottle of Hooch (not sure what the Glasgow equivalent of a daffodil would be....can flowers survive in Glasgow?).

Still, Glasgow are my second team....and I'm very grateful that there's a club in Scotland able to win the odd game   

[Weegie Wizard]

I think when it comes down to it all Glasgow/Edinburgh supporters have the other as their second team. That must be right?

Surely then it goes all the irish teams, then the italians, then no-one.  

[TJ]

Edinburgh are the team I support. I do enjoy Glasgow winning so long as its not against Edinburgh. I want to see the Italian teams do well. I don't really care about the other teams - apart from I like to see good rugby played so I enjoy watching teams that play positive rugby

[funnyExiledScot]

I think when it comes down to it all Glasgow/Edinburgh supporters have the other as their second team. That must be right?

Surely then it goes all the irish teams, then the italians, then no-one.  

Hmmm, I'm pretty sure 21st Schizoid and Jimbopip would sooner support the David Cameron Invitational Select XV, compiled in order to raise money for landowners in the home counties, than confess to having any inkling towards supporting Edinburgh!

[TJ]

BTW - I have never seen the arrogance ascribed here to Glasgow supporters - all I have seen is pride in a team doing well and lots of amusing banter.

[RDW]

I absolutely want Glasgow to win every game other than against Edinburgh, and I'll be at Scotstoun if they get a home Semi final!

Will always be grateful to Glasgow fans for their support at the HK Quarter Final against Tolouse - the best atmosphere I have ever been at for a rugby game!

[justified sinner]

Was a fair few across in Dublin for the semi-final as well, great weekend despite being outnumbered 10 to 1 by Ulster fans who were also great fun.

[tigertattie]

If I could make one change to Glasgow rugby fans, it would be to stop the constant chant of "Glazzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzgoooooooooooooooo"
"Glazzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzgoooooooooooooooo"

Other than that, they are an alright bunch!

[cakeordeath]

Glasgow are my main team, with Edinburgh a very very close 2nd. In fact I would rather Edinburgh make 6th spot in the Rabo than Glasgow made the play-offs

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