SL v Eng...2nd test headingley

First topic message reminder :

Starts tomm and it seems the indisposed Prassanna the WK is a blessing in disguise.
Chandimal will keep wickets and will allow Lanka to play an extra batsman and given that the pitch is expected to assist seamers , it will help Lanka to have some extra batting cushion.

the other thing SL should and will look at is Kulasekhara...too gentle in speeds.......Lakmal was probably their first choice and unlikely  to have recovered from his hamstring strain.
They should play Dhamika prasad who bowls in excess of 140kph.....and captain Angelo should be willing to use himself a bit more as a seamer


Sri Lanka wicketkeeper Prasanna Jayawardene will be unavailable for selection for the second Test, thanks to a finger injury to his right hand, which he sustained while keeping during the first day at Lord's.

He will be replaced in the squad by batsman Kithuruwan Vithanage, with Dinesh Chandimal likely to take over the gloves at Headingley. The injury will not prevent Jayawardene from batting in the second innings of the first Test.

Cook resigns as Captain.

Sorry, one day early!

It won't be possible for the cricket establishment to sack Cook after they put all their eggs in one basket despite taking some significatnt risks. It won't be easy for Cook to back out either. All that Cook and his backers can hope for is that he will have a good series with the bat against India and the team bring about a turn around. I don't think he's going anywhere before the end of the summer.

msp83 wrote:It won't be possible for the cricket establishment to sack Cook after they put all their eggs in one basket despite taking some significatnt risks.

I hope so too...India wants Cook
and Eng management is known to cut their nose to spite their face...so they won't admit...they kept Cook and got rid of KP   

Cook's nightmares tonight  " what will Warne write tomorrow"  

GSC wrote:I think the time has come for Cook to step down.

He seems mentally scarred from the Ashes loss, and his batting suffers as a result. I also fear he cannot regain his form with the bat while simultaneously batting these demons.

Got to agree. Seen a few people say he needs to back to County cricket and regain his form. He did that at the summer and scored 100s in both games he played. He is just mentally shot at international level, maybe the captaincy being removed might help.

Does he stay as ODI skipper as replacing him 6 months or whatever it is out from a World Cup is far from ideal.

I think he will get the first couple of tests again India before a decision is made.

Also need to hope that someone can sort Montys issues out on the next few weeks.

I'm not against cook being in the team even if he is out of form, great player on his day and one of England's best, but the captaincy is affecting him and he has already shown that if plan A doesn't work then he lacks ideas.

I want Cook the batsman back.

Jayawardene saying england aren't up to it under pressure.

Yes he's mocking them and being a bit cocky but he isn't wrong.

Okay seriously Cook has to be dropped. Bloke has lost it.

Gonna take a lot to save the match tomorrow.

You don't turn at the first sight of difficulty, you march bravely on.

What do you mean England are about to have lost six of their last seven tests?

Irrelevant, the only way is up. You learn from your mistakes, you take the experiences, and you become better for it.

And beating India at cricket is Cook's hobby anyway, so he'll be fine.

Duty281 wrote:You don't turn at the first sight of difficulty, you march bravely on.

What do you mean England are about to have lost six of their last seven tests?

Irrelevant, the only way is up. You learn from your mistakes, you take the experiences, and you become better for it.

And beating India at cricket is Cook's hobby anyway, so he'll be fine.

Always find your nonsense posts humorous.

Cook got an lucky series win in India and it's Cook's hobby at beating India.

Do me a favour.

Cook is an average batsman and a pitiful, spineless captain.

Olly wrote:Ian Bell put up to face the media

Not cook, not Moores, not even the vice captain but Ian Bell.

Show some balls for gods sake and front up

.
This was very poor. Any reporter worth his salt would and should have been asking about the quality and effectiveness of Cook's captaincy. The only two people who should have been answering those questions were either Cook or Moores. Totally unfair on the reporters and Bell (regardless of whether he is vice captain or not) for him to have to front up. Placed him in a very difficult, if not impossible, situation.

My major gripe over the Pietersen fiasco was far less the decision but the woeful handling and communication of it. Little seems to have been learned.

guildfordbat wrote:

Olly wrote:Ian Bell put up to face the media

Not cook, not Moores, not even the vice captain but Ian Bell.

Show some balls for gods sake and front up

.
This was very poor. Any reporter worth his salt would and should have been asking about the quality and effectiveness of Cook's captaincy. The only two people who should have been answering those questions were either Cook or Moores. Totally unfair on the reporters and Bell (regardless of whether he is vice captain or not) for him to have to front up. Placed him in a very difficult, if not impossible, situation.

My major gripe over the Pietersen fiasco was far less the decision but the woeful handling and communication of it. Little seems to have been learned.

You make a great point Guildford, lessons are not being learnt PR wise. Heck even Hodgson and co fronted up after the football fiasco! The only time cook spoke was when he slagged off Warne for having an opinion! Whoever is advising them needs to be sacked I'd say.

I think this is also having an effect on attendances. Both the ODI series and the test series have been very very poorly attended, something the ECB need to keep an eye on, sacking your biggest draw was always gonna do this a little, but I think the way its been handled has contributed more.

Now for my other rants...

England's bowling. Why on earth are we bowling bouncers at headingley? Do we not understand that this ground of all in England if you pitch it up you'll get wickets??? The sri Lankans have bowled far better. Anderson has been poor, short and wide too often. Broad is not fit clearly, struggling to hit 80mph!! Jordan has had a poor game, the only one to come out with credit is Plunkett, who has worked his socks off and got reward.

Alastair Cook. Captaincy was atrocious, yes not helped by his bowlers but it was just awful. First up in the morning session, six overs to the new ball, you spread the field first up and allow Jayawardene and Mathews to knock it round at six an over and get themselves in?! That's just criminal. 

Then when Jayawardene fell, why did we just seemingly give up trying to get Mathews out? Do we not realise we can get out both batsmen?!!! He was only about 20/30 odd when we just put the field back and basically gave up getting him out to try and get Herath with one ball an over! Madness!

The use of Moeen Ali was baffling. He didn't bring him on until the Mathews/Herath partnership was nearly two hours old, when none of the seamers were threatening, and Ali the day before had bowled well, especially to the left handers! This just goes along with Cook's use of spinners, he simply doesn't trust ones not named Graeme Swann. Panesar, Kerrigan, Borthwick and now Ali, he doesn't know how to use them. Sky made a great point on how Ali nearly got Mathews when they brought mid on up, but then for some reason after nearly getting him out going over the top, Cook just put mid on back and the potential chance was gone!

George Dobell wrote a great piece on cricinfo, most notable line was Cook is more "mouse than Strauss, and phoney than Dhoni." A damning line. I'd say it wasn't that Cook made bad decisions today, its that he made no decisions. We had plan A (which was poorly devised and executed), and then had nothing else.

It was just an embarrassment today. 

But credit to Sri Lanka, they've come over here in early season and will defeat England and its fully deserved. Anglo Mathews is a heck of cricketer

Another gripe

The 9/10 over spells that Anderson/Broad are bowling. What on earth are you doing Alastair?!?! These guys already look run into the ground and we ain't even in July yet!!!

Still we can all take solace in the fact Alastair cooks wife and kids are exactly the right ones for an England captain to have!

Deary me ECB, I've gone full Keegan

guildfordbat wrote:

Olly wrote:Ian Bell put up to face the media

Not cook, not Moores, not even the vice captain but Ian Bell.

Show some balls for gods sake and front up

.
This was very poor. Any reporter worth his salt would and should have been asking about the quality and effectiveness of Cook's captaincy. The only two people who should have been answering those questions were either Cook or Moores. Totally unfair on the reporters and Bell (regardless of whether he is vice captain or not) for him to have to front up. Placed him in a very difficult, if not impossible, situation.

Yeah, sending out Bell was the cowards way out. If not the Captain or Coach, should have been one of the bowlers. Would love to have seen them try to explain the dross they served up yesterday.

according to the Karmik theory bad karma pays back badly....

the evil Nexus of Dhoni-Srini-CSK has destroyed India's test cricket.

and the bad Karma accrued by collectively targetting KP has had severe consequences on English cricket

Can we just have a specialist KP topic.

The endless references to him everytime England do poorly is really boring now.

GSC wrote:Can we just have a specialist KP topic.

The endless references to him everytime England do poorly is really boring now.

+1

GSC wrote:Can we just have a specialist KP topic.

The endless references to him everytime England do poorly is really boring now.

Great idea. Open a thread for KPF and keep him in there.

I see...KP is a sore wound and hurts when touched.
  

But I and many of us do not have a KP embargo unfortunately

Not so much a sore wound as we had the debate months ago and everyones laid out their arguments and opinions many times already.

KP_fan wrote:I see...KP is a sore wound

No, not really. It just gets a bit boring when, every time something goes wrong for England, some people say 'Well it's because they dropped KP'.

Hoggy_Bear wrote:

KP_fan wrote:I see...KP is a sore wound

No, not really. It just gets a bit boring when, every time something goes wrong for England, some people say 'Well it's because they dropped KP'.

i answer you and GSC both......

"boring" is a term that trivializes the issue......
that can be used in context of a drama played on TV where real lives are not involved.

But when a real human being's life / career / respect / Credibility is involved...it is much beyond boring.
and since that human being was symbolized as one of the central reason for the dissent / debacle and most evils......
and that after him the team continues to spiral downwards......it is natural that questions will be raised and Moores, Downton, Cook, Giles Clark etal would be asked to explain....

They made him central to the situation and unfortunately cannot escape from the aftermath

I fear that will continue for a while yet...the fan club just don't know when to let go.
Pointless : either the man was a corrosive influence whose diminishing returns no longer justified keeping him on ; in which case they're well shot of him ; or a Grave Mistake was made (for whatever reason) and it has cost the team perhaps another eighteen months of his service - perhaps less given an increasing tendency to injury.   Either way , he's gone and isn't coming back so repeated references are just a waste of time.
The past is often a comforting sort of place in which to dwell : but it doesn't lend itself to exerting any useful influence on the present - or at least , none that can be changed.
So I always prefer to look forward .

Whatever else has happened since the team came unstuck last year , at least a couple of new players have enjoyed some success , demonstrating that they do have the basic game to perform at Test level.  If Ballance , Robson and Jordan have been a little inconsistent so far , is that unreasonable in their first two or three Tests ?  Very few players launch their careers with uninterrupted success in their first series so I am happy enough to see these fellows given their chance - along with the recycled Plunkett and quickly returned Root...
All of which is to suggest that regardless of the very disappointing performance in the current match , now is not a time to despair of the ruin of English Cricket  ; but to accept that a new team is being built from the ground up and there are going to be downs like this as much as ups like Lord's while the re-construction is going on.
So perhaps we (well most of us) can stop pining for Swann and "others" and take an interest in what may be a rather difficult journey , but is sure to include a fair amount of thrills along with the spills.

I will address this actual match separately...

This feels like a real nadir in the same way as the 1999 home series vs. New Zealand.

For you youngsters who missed the 90's, you are probably learning now why people still go on about how bad it was!

As to the game in progress : well , disappointing is the word (except for my Sri Lankan friends of course ). And I think we should not overlook the fact that Sri Lanka have played very well here. I do think that they were somewhat underrated by a lot of people , even a few on here , perhaps largely because of a perceived weakness in early season English conditions . Perhaps not enough weight was given to the fact that English pitches seem to have changed quite a lot in recent years , and these two in particular were not of a type to cause too much distress to the visitors.
Remember Lord's ? Only a week or so back : rather dominated by England , the only real criticism of the home team being over the steps they took , or didn't take , in trying to force the win. And why were they in a strong position ? Because they batted first , scored big , and were able to control the game in the third innings : though a spirited Sri Lankan fight back was able to slow them down just enough to save the game.
English confidence was high : perhaps a few warning signs were disregarded ? Apart from the Sri Lankan bowlers taking early wickets in both innings , before being ground down by their opponent's batting depth , their openers were not cowed by England's seam attack , and their senior batsmen were clearly capable of big scores. So this second match should never have been viewed as a given.

In fact , although the supporters may have been unrealistically confident going into this match (and even during : read back some of the predictions as late as last night on this thread !) , I do not think England took Sri Lanka at all lightly. Rather the reverse actually : in spite of being ahead of the game for most of the first three days , Sri Lankan fight back notwithstanding , England made their fatal mistake in going on the defensive at 277/7 , revealing their collective lack of confidence in finishing what still at that point should have been their game. Consider : in normal circumstances , the last three wickets , even on a good pitch and with one strong batsman left , would be unlikely to add more than , say 70 runs ? So the likely worst case for England was a chase of about 240 ...if their confidence had not been as fragile as their batting (sorry guildford   ) I think they'd have accepted those odds and pushed to finish things in a normal manner.
As it was of course they adopted that awful - though much used , alas - tactic of giving the proper batsman immunity and targeting only his partner. And in doing so cut their own throats .
The trouble with that tactic , as Agnew pointed out , is it leaves you with nowhere to go when it fails. And of course employing it with three wickets left was doubly foolish. It gives heart to the batsmen , it eats at the soul of the bowlers , who find themselves just putting the ball in play for at least two thirds if the time , and eventually find it harder than ever to produce the killer ball in their brief chances at the "rabbit" ...plus it tires them out ! I could go on , but I think I've made my point ... Amusingly they might have got away with it if Plunkett had clung on to that caught and bowled ; but it would still have been a bad tactic.

So do I want Cook's head ? If so , should probably want Moores also , for he was obviously a party to it. That I'll leave for another post.

Apart from the above , which was the heart of the matter , we can regret careless batting that threw away a great position on Saturday evening , poor catching , and some below par bowling yesterday , even before the Big Mistake. The second innings collapse I almost disregard , as I rather expected it. They were almost broken before that Sri Lankan innings ended , and one break was always likely to bring a clatter.

Anyway enough for now as the slaughter is about to recommence . Bon appetit , Lions   

I hope that SL do go on and win this game they deserve it.

Lot of deserted stands ...

When Root and Ali walk off with 150 each I'll bet there will be thousands telling their grandchildren "I was there !"   

Lol

First hour done.

Those Sri Lankans look tired to me

there is some rain...so luck smiling on Eng for now

KP_fan wrote:there is some rain...so luck smiling on Eng for now

Going to need rather a lot of rain , I reckon. But it doesn't really matter : even if weather and some resistance from the remaining bats were to save the game England will still know they threw away a strong position with a combination of some loose shots in their first innings and some strangely uninspired bowling second time around (even before the tactical blunder in the afternoon) So it will still be a bad Test for them.

Unlike many I am not in despair , though seriously disappointed at one step forward being followed by two steps back. A lot of - quite promising - youth in this team and they can learn on the job.
The big short term issue remains the lack of a penetrative spinner , or even a Giles type reliable container. Am afraid there is no magic wand : they will have to do what Australia did post-Warne : just keep trying until they find one that works...

Alfie - I agree with a lot of your last post but do consider the captaincy position is also a major immediate issue. If the captaincy isn't right (and without the emotive claptrap of a certain other poster, I don't think it is), hard to see meaningful progress being made and maintained.

I appreciate there is a separate thread on the lines of "Burn Cook the Witch" - whilst I don't go as far as that sentiment, I understand where posters are coming from and believe the issue can't be avoided here if we're assessing what went wrong in this Test and what happens next.

Oh I don't mean to , guildford. You'll have noted I was very critical of Cook's tactics yesterday in a post a little above. Indeed I was particularly disappointed because it seemed to me that Cook had actually improved his handling of the attack over the last two innings ; coaxing wickets out of what appeared to be dead final day at Lord's and attacking well on day one here ...to see him revert to such negativity yesterday was surprising and dispiriting.
I mean to address the captaincy issue after the match - when the dust has settled ? Who knows , Cook may call time himself by then - he is clearly feeling ghe pressure.
But for now my position is that there are several problems with changing the leader . One , no clear alternative. Two , yet another upheaval for a team which has been battered around lately , and is trying to find its feet again. Three , that if Moores is himself in agreement with a defensive approach will a captaincy change even make much difference ? And four ; I would hate to see , say , Ian Bell's batting brought down by the added responsibility - though that might be balanced by a carefree Cook getting back in the runs...

I agree the issue needs consideration. Broadly , Cook needs to improve with bat and baton , as it were , or return to the ranks. But the timing is an issue ; and I wonder if too much attention to this one factor might be doing England a disservice in terms of focus ?

Lot of food for thought.

At least Root and Ali haven't looked quite as fragile this morning so far. Though I suppose that comment will do for them   

Cheers, Alfie. An extremely good post.

Timing and lack of alternatives are certainly significant considerations but only if Cook wants to continue in the role. I'm not sure he does.

Btw, as regards a "Giles type reliable container" I'm typing this at the Oval whist watching Gareth Batty bowl the first over after lunch - a maiden. Just saying ....

Yes I see he has two wickets...might be just a little long in the tooth by now though ? Even though spinners can go on forever...

And I agree Cook's own feelings are central. But desire to lead can ebb and flow due to a lot of different factors. We shall see.

Think I will have to get a bit if shut eye soon ...might check back later and see if Bailey and Watson are still in   

England could do with a stopgap option really, I tend to agree there really aren't any alternatives for England at this stage.

I just don't see Cook turning his form around while simultaneously battling on the captain front.

Root too slow, too defensive and in the end flawed technique getting exposed again...closing the face of bat on one that he should have offered a full bat to

MOEEN!!!!!!!!

Root showing that he's learning well from the guys above him. No longer doing silly things like big tons when he's needed but failing and exposing the lower order to a trashing.

They've really moved on since the Aussie drubbing.

Actually naive from Moeen

By scoring runs he's made himself more likely to be dropped, judging by recent selections

Indeed.  Or he'll be moved to ensure he fails sooner rather than later.  Opener next time.

KP_fan wrote:

Hoggy_Bear wrote:

KP_fan wrote:I see...KP is a sore wound

No, not really. It just gets a bit boring when, every time something goes wrong for England, some people say 'Well it's because they dropped KP'.

i answer you and GSC both......

"boring" is a term that trivializes the issue......
that can be used in context of a drama played on TV where real lives are not involved.

But when a real human being's life / career / respect / Credibility is involved...it is much beyond boring.
and since that human being was symbolized as one of the central reason for the dissent / debacle and most evils......
and that after him the team continues to spiral downwards......it is natural that questions will be raised and Moores, Downton, Cook, Giles Clark etal would be asked to explain....

They made him central to the situation and unfortunately cannot escape from the aftermath

KPF, I know you prefer the dramatic style at times, but this is an absolutely spot on, perfectly nailed on, and to the core response. The KP sacking decision was a risky one in cricketing terms to start with, the way it was handled by the powers that be was downright disgusting, and I didn't see such trivialization when the pathetic clown who is the manager or whatever opened his stupid little mouth to sprout a truckload of self-congratulatory nonsense last months. Even in the immediate aftermath of Pietersen's sacking, I and many others said that there will be continuous questions on Cook and the ECB lot so long as the team is not doing well. The only way to stop the questions is to start performing. Thankfully for Cook and ECB, Pietersen has not been on top form in the IPL or the T-20 cricket in England, otherwise the situation could have been a lot worse.
PS
Noted Alfie's non-trivializing post on the subject, that does make a lot of sense, but cricket is a matter of passion and emotion, and Pietersen the player had an emotional connect with many followers of the game. The way it all came to an end will rankle with people for long, and as I said, all that England can do is to start performing, channelize that passion and emotion back to cricket that is been played.

Less than 200 left to get now, the platform is there for Broad's 50 ball hundred to win the match!

A session and a bit to survive. Can England save this one?
Ali has battled away, Prior has faced over 30 balls already. England do bat deep with Stuart Broad coming in at 10. If they really really apply themselves, if a bit of luck go their way, I think they can at least save Cook from a home series loss against a lower ranked side here, something that a greatful skipper will take at this point.

That was a no ball, 3rd umpire makes a big call and gets it wrong!

msp83 wrote:A session and a bit to survive. Can England save this one?
Ali has battled away, Prior has faced over 30 balls already. England do bat deep with Stuart Broad coming in at 10. If they really really apply themselves, if a bit of luck go their way, I think they can at least save Cook from a home series loss against a lower ranked side here, something that a greatful skipper will take at this point.

They won't be below this shambles for long.

Just like the last slump Eng will probably fall a long way before they recover again.

I'd bring back KP for India.

msp83 wrote:

KP_fan wrote:

Hoggy_Bear wrote:

KP_fan wrote:I see...KP is a sore wound

No, not really. It just gets a bit boring when, every time something goes wrong for England, some people say 'Well it's because they dropped KP'.

i answer you and GSC both......

"boring" is a term that trivializes the issue......
that can be used in context of a drama played on TV where real lives are not involved.

But when a real human being's life / career / respect / Credibility is involved...it is much beyond boring.
and since that human being was symbolized as one of the central reason for the dissent / debacle and most evils......
and that after him the team continues to spiral downwards......it is natural that questions will be raised and Moores, Downton, Cook, Giles Clark etal would be asked to explain....

They made him central to the situation and unfortunately cannot escape from the aftermath

KPF, I know you prefer the dramatic style at times, but this is an absolutely spot on, perfectly nailed on, and to the core response. The KP sacking decision was a risky one in cricketing terms to start with, the way it was handled by the powers that be was downright disgusting, and I didn't see such trivialization when the pathetic clown who is the manager or whatever opened his stupid little mouth to sprout a truckload of self-congratulatory nonsense last months. Even in the immediate aftermath of Pietersen's sacking, I and many others said that there will be continuous questions on Cook and the ECB lot so long as the team is not doing well. The only way to stop the questions is to start performing. Thankfully for Cook and ECB, Pietersen has not been on top form in the IPL or the T-20 cricket in England, otherwise the situation could have been a lot worse.
PS
Noted Alfie's non-trivializing post on the subject, that does make a lot of sense, but cricket is a matter of passion and emotion, and Pietersen the player had an emotional connect with many followers of the game. The way it all came to an end will rankle with people for long, and as I said, all that England can do is to start performing, channelize that passion and emotion back to cricket that is been played.

yes...a GLARING MISTAKE
they should have fired Cook and retained KP

Or be rid of both and start again, though it may take years to rebuild.

And agreed the new man in charge spouting was a sign of being small minded from the start.  Signs of another bad era.