Best players from your club (AP)

Ok so what I've done here is listed all the clubs currently in the Premiership and given my opinion on the best players they have had, foreign and home grown in the modern era. That means in the premiership era. For the London exiles sides I have allowed home to mean England and the other country...

Home does not mean they came through the academy it merely means they are qualified for that union...

Bath
Foreign: Gavin Henson
Home: Mike catt

Exeter
Foreign: Gareth Steenson
Home: Jack Nowell

Gloucester
Foreign: Phillipe Saint andre
Home: James Simpson-Daniel

Harlequins
Foreign: Andrew Mehrtens
Home: Jason Leonard

Leicester
Foreign: Josh Kronfeld
Home: Will Greenwood

London Irish
Foreign: Jarrod Cunningham
Home: Steffon Armitage

London Welsh
Foreign: Gordon Ross
Home:

Newcastle
Foreign: Alan Tait
Home: Jonny Wilkinson

Northampton
Foreign: Carlos Spencer
Home: Matt Dawson

Sale
Foreign: Jason White
Home: Jason Robinson

Saracens
Foreign: Schalk Britz
Home: Richard Hill

Wasps
Foreign: Serge Betsen
Home: Josh Lewsey

mckay1402 wrote: Bath : Gavin Henson

Brilliant

Is this solely based on performances in the club shirt? Or big names who have played for the club?

Either way a few of the top of my head based more on club form:

Bath: Guscott and Dan Lyle, although Elvis gets a mention for scoring the try which kept Bath in the premiership.

Glaws: JSD/Hazell and Terry Fanaloa

Tigers best foreign player has to be Murphy?

I'd make a case for Paul Volley or Waters as Wasps best English (or Saffa/English) player over the pro period, or at least most important to the clubs success.

Newcastle
Foreign: Alan Tait - Matt Burke mate...Played as brilliant and as passionately for us as he did for Oz. Absolute Legend up here.
Carl Hayman wasn't half bad either.

Home: Jonny Wilkinson

IS this just which names played for us...or which names played brilliant?
Owen Finegan...53 times Australian number 8 played for us....and to be fair he wouldn't have got into the Whitley Bay Rockliff team!

Leicester - Geordan Murphy and Martin Johnson (on the field Kronfeld was rubbish for us)

I was basing it on performance in the shirt

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Bathman_in_London wrote:Is this solely based on performances in the club shirt? Or big names who have played for the club?

Either way a few of the top of my head based more on club form:

Bath: Guscott and Dan Lyle, although Elvis gets a mention for scoring the try which kept Bath in the premiership.

Glaws: JSD/Hazell and Terry Fanaloa

Tigers best foreign player has to be Murphy?

I'd make a case for Paul Volley or Waters as Wasps best English (or Saffa/English) player over the pro period, or at least most important to the clubs success.

I didn't include Guscott as he retired too early. I did consider Dan Lyle though

Leicester
Foreign - Joel Stransky or Pat Howard (To be different from Murphy)
Home - Johnson.

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Yes since the premiership era.

Welly wrote:Leicester
Foreign - Joel Stransky or Pat Howard (To be different from Murphy)
Home - Johnson.

I did initially put Johnson but Greenwood was a better player in my opinion. I also considered Joel Stransky

mckay1402 wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Yes since the premiership era.  

Michael Classens?
Francois Louwe?
Butch James?

Henson has started 6 Premiership games for Bath.

Yes I couldnt help think a certain so so SA back rower might have just been slightly better performing than the tan man

Quins:
Foreign: Nick Evans (or Andre Vos) - either considerably better than Mehrts when he was with us
Home: Jason Leonard is a good shout, but a couple of current players might in time outstrip him. Easter holds the club record for appearances and could make it to 300 club caps (remarkable for a forward). Robshaw has achieved more than any other Quins club captain and is England's 3rd longest serving captain. Marler has the potential to match Leonard's cap count, if he stays fit and keeps developing, and might even match the great man's reputation for touring humour.

Poorfour wrote:Quins:
Foreign: Nick Evans (or Andre Vos) - either considerably better than Mehrts when he was with us
Home: Jason Leonard is a good shout, but a couple of current players might in time outstrip him. Easter holds the club record for appearances and could make it to 300 club caps (remarkable for a forward). Robshaw has achieved more than any other Quins club captain and is England's 3rd longest serving captain. Marler has the potential to match Leonard's cap count, if he stays fit and keeps developing, and might even match the great man's reputation for touring humour.

Actually I didn't think of Easter. Great Shout.

Poorfour wrote:Quins:
Foreign: Nick Evans (or Andre Vos) - either considerably better than Mehrts when he was with us
Home: Jason Leonard is a good shout, but a couple of current players might in time outstrip him. Easter holds the club record for appearances and could make it to 300 club caps (remarkable for a forward). Robshaw has achieved more than any other Quins club captain and is England's 3rd longest serving captain. Marler has the potential to match Leonard's cap count, if he stays fit and keeps developing, and might even match the great man's reputation for touring humour.

The England team interview videos with Marler really crack me up. He is developing into a terrific player as well.

mckay1402 wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Yes since the premiership era.  

What? Eh?

Ah, I guess you're joking

You are joking aren't you?

Wasps...

NEQ - Craig Dowd, Trevor Leota, Rob Howley.

EQ - Lawrence Dallaglio, Fraser Waters, Christian Wade. Lewsey was a cracking player though.

mckay1402 wrote:

Welly wrote:Leicester
Foreign - Joel Stransky or Pat Howard (To be different from Murphy)
Home - Johnson.

I did initially put Johnson but Greenwood was a better player in my opinion.  I also considered Joel Stransky

I disagree about ~Greenwood being the better player - even so his performances for England were always better than those for Tigers. Maybe you could include him as a Quin?

Stransky was much better for us than Kronfeld - but still behind Murphy, Ayerza, Castro, Alessana

Bath
Foreign: Gavin Henson
Home: Mike catt


Really?

Is he for real, Henson?

Hound of Harrow wrote:Wasps...

NEQ - Craig Dowd, Trevor Leota, Rob Howley.

EQ - Lawrence Dallaglio, Fraser Waters, Christian Wade. Lewsey was a cracking player though.

I did consider Howley but I just remember Betsen being absolutely indestructable for Wasps. I also think Lewsey was above certainly Waters and Wade. Not sure about Dallaglio though

Cyril wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Yes since the premiership era.  

What? Eh?

Ah, I guess you're joking

You are joking aren't you?

I can only assume the whole thread is an elaborate way to make the joke...

LondonTiger wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:

Welly wrote:Leicester
Foreign - Joel Stransky or Pat Howard (To be different from Murphy)
Home - Johnson.

I did initially put Johnson but Greenwood was a better player in my opinion.  I also considered Joel Stransky

I disagree about ~Greenwood being the better player - even so his performances for England were always better than those for Tigers. Maybe you could include him as a Quin?

Stransky was much better for us than Kronfeld - but still behind Murphy, Ayerza, Castro, Alessana

I wanted to put Castro but wasn't sure whether his recent tirade might have tarnished his standing but based on performance I would probably have chosen him.

Bathman_in_London wrote:

Cyril wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Yes since the premiership era.  

What? Eh?

Ah, I guess you're joking

You are joking aren't you?

I can only assume the whole thread is an elaborate way to make the joke...

Not really. I did think it would be amusing but I also think he has played well. Not a serious suggestion for best foreign so don't all get too excited.

Bathman_in_London wrote:

Cyril wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Yes since the premiership era.  

What? Eh?

Ah, I guess you're joking

You are joking aren't you?

I can only assume the whole thread is an elaborate way to make the joke...

That's a lot of effort to go into for a 'joke'.

When he said 'performance in the shirt' I can only assume that the reason Henson always looked bulked-up is that he was wearing a Bath replica top under his Welsh jersey all those years...

What Bath game did Henson play well in that you have watched?

Good idea McKay. If anyone's interested in the other, minor league:
https://www.606v2.com/t57248-best-players-from-your-club-celtic-pro-12

George Carlin wrote:Good idea McKay. If anyone's interested in the other, minor league:
https://www.606v2.com/t57248-best-players-from-your-club-celtic-pro-12

Now now George let's not be like that

mckay1402 wrote:

George Carlin wrote:Good idea McKay. If anyone's interested in the other, minor league:
https://www.606v2.com/t57248-best-players-from-your-club-celtic-pro-12

Now now George let's not be like that

Just noticed your new one squire:
https://www.606v2.com/t57247-best-players-from-your-club-pro-12

Perhaps the Forum Gods could do a clever thread merger thingy?

TightHEAD wrote:What Bath game did Henson play well in that you have watched?

Do I have to have watched them to know he played well?

For what my miniscule knowledge is worth, I would have Jonathan Humphreys, Michael Claassens, Francois Louw or maybe even Peter Stringer before Henson.

In terms of the English gold, it would have to be Phil de Glanville, Jerry Guscott, Matt Stevens or club ligind Danny "are you lookin' at my bird?" Grewcock.

Should do best Home 23 V best forign 23

 Leicester's would be for me
 Home
  1) Rowntree, 2) Wheeler, 3) Garforth
  4) Johnson, 5) Kay
  6) Corry, 7) Back, 8) Richards
  9) Healey, 10) Cusworth
12) Dodge, 13) Greenwood
11) R. Underwood, 12) Stimpson, 15) Hare


16) West, 17) 18) Refern, 19) Parling, 20) Moody, 21) Elis, 22) Flood, 23) Lloyd

 Foreign:
 1) Ayerza, 2) Kayser, 3) Castrogiovanni
 4) van Heerden, 5) Cullen
 6)  Kronfeld 7) Salvi, 8) Miller
 9) Kardooni/Serevi(due to entertainment value) , 10) Stansky
12) Howard, 13) Gibson
11) Lougheed, 14) A.Tuilagi, 15) Murphy

16) Davies, 17) stankovich, 18) Morris, 19) Thorn/Wentzel, 20) H.Tuilagi 21) Dupuy, 22) Mauger, 23) Van der westheusen  

 Some hard ones there,

mckay1402 wrote:

TightHEAD wrote:What Bath game did Henson play well in that you have watched?

Do I have to have watched them to know he played well?

Seeing as he has only played a handful of games for them (mainly from the bench) I was just trying to understand how you have come to the conclusion that Henson is the best Foreign player Bath have fielded in the Pro era.

Louw would be my choice. World class backrower.

mckay1402 wrote:

TightHEAD wrote:What Bath game did Henson play well in that you have watched?

Do I have to have watched them to know he played well?

erm for bath what about Ieuan Evans? or Andy Nicol.

People are going too far in the past. I did think about Ieuan but in my opinion he retired too long ago to be included in this thread.

McCoy - Waters was the lynch pin of Wasps blitz defence that won us so many trophies. When he left for Treviso and Lol retired in 2008 most Wasps fans felt we would miss Waters more; mainly because Lol was not the player he was (but what a captain!).

Phillipe Saint andre retired the same year as him.

 also wasn't andy Nichol the bath captain in their Heineken cup win? surley that would put him ahead of Henson.

Welly wrote:Phillipe Saint andre retired the same year as him.

 also wasn't andy Nichol the bath captain in their Heineken cup win? surley that would put him ahead of Henson.

You are totally right. I was looking at the coaching years. How on earth could I not have noticed that???

There's a balance between who is the best and who is your favourite player. For Glaws the best foreign player had to be Ian Jones, as he's truly one of the world's greatest locks, but as has been mentioned earlier our favourite foreign player is unquestionably Terry Fanolua. Our best best and favourite English player would be Sinbad.

Welly wrote:Should do best Home 23 V best forign 23

 Leicester's would be for me
 Home
  1) Rowntree, 2) Wheeler, 3) Garforth
  4) Johnson, 5) Kay
  6) Corry, 7) Back, 8) Richards
  9) Healey, 10) Cusworth
12) Dodge, 13) Greenwood
11) R. Underwood, 12) Stimpson, 15) Hare


16) West, 17) 18) Refern, 19) Parling, 20) Moody, 21) Elis, 22) Flood, 23) Lloyd

 Foreign:
 1) Ayerza, 2) Kayser, 3) Castrogiovanni
 4) van Heerden, 5) Cullen
 6)  Kronfeld 7) Salvi, 8) Miller
 9) Kardooni/Serevi(due to entertainment value) , 10) Stansky
12) Howard, 13) Gibson
11) Lougheed, 14) A.Tuilagi, 15) Murphy

16) Davies, 17) stankovich, 18) Morris, 19) Thorn/Wentzel, 20) H.Tuilagi 21) Dupuy, 22) Mauger, 23) Van der westheusen  

 Some hard ones there,

Looking only at those who played a significant amount of time in the pro era I would have:

English:

Rowntree, Cockerill, White, Johnson, Kay, Moody, Back, Corry (Deano for me was amateur era)
Ellis, Flood, Healy, Greenwood, Manu, Varndell, Stimpson

vs

Ayerza, Kayser, Castro, vn Heerden, Cullen, Newby, Salvi, HenryT
Dupuy, Stransky, Lougheed, Howard, Gibson, Alessana, Murphy



PS - didn't Apple play for England A, thus ruling himself out of the Foreign XV?

Quins:

Foreign- For the quality they had here and not elsewhere, Nick Evans or Vos

Homegrown- Robshaw

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Yes since the premiership era.  

Michael Classens?
Francois Louwe?
Butch James?

I assumed Henson was a wum, but it has been said a few times now. Fool me once....

Wouldn't have Henson in the top 5 best Welsh players to play for bath in the prem era! Never mind top foreignee

Luke Watson, Joe Maddock and Dan Lyle had massive impacts. But I'd say the signing of Butch as a WC winning fly half at the time was a massive coup. Along with Maddock and under Steve Meehan we played some incredible rugby. Ok we didn't win anything at the time, but it was beautiful offloading rugby to watch. A young Julian Salvi and Luke Watson also contributed to this a lot during that time.

Bathite wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:

Chunky Norwich wrote:

mckay1402 wrote:I was basing it on performance in the shirt

You genuinely think Gavin Henson is the best performing player for Bath from outside England?

Yes since the premiership era.  

Michael Classens?
Francois Louwe?
Butch James?

I assumed Henson was a wum, but it has been said a few times now. Fool me once....

Wouldn't have Henson in the top 5 best Welsh players to play for bath in the  prem era! Never mind top foreignee

Luke Watson, Joe Maddock and Dan Lyle had massive impacts. But I'd say the signing of Butch as a WC winning fly half at the time was a massive coup. Along with Maddock and under Steve Meehan we played some incredible rugby. Ok we didn't win anything at the time, but it was beautiful offloading rugby to watch. A young Julian Salvi and Luke Watson also contributed to this a lot during that time.

I remember the 98 HC final. There was a restart and a Brive prop caught the ball. Out of nowhere came a blue blur and flattened him with one of the best tackles I've ever seen.

The 'blue blur' was Dan Lyle.

Foreign 15 v English 15??
HHmmmm tricky one.
Not many recent players...Sinoti and Hogg. Hopefully with the kids coming through that will change though. Certain positions are very strong....certain ones are weak.

1 Nick Popplewell
2 Ross Nesdale
3 George Graham / Carl Hayman - Crazy im debating Hayman but Graham was top class.
4 Doddie Weir
5 Mark Andrews
6 Colin Charvis / Peter Walton
7 Andrew Mower
8 Pat Lam

9 Gary Armstrong
10 Jimmy Gopperth
11 Va'aiga Tuigamala
12 Alan Tait / Mark Mayerhofler - Both class
13 John Leslie
14 Sinoti Sinoti
15 Matthew Burke

Bench: Peter Stringer, Stuart Grimes, Craig Hamilton, Richard Metcalfe, Euan Murray, Epi Taione, Marius Hurter , Aly Hogg, Richard Arnold

 1 Jon Golding
2 Matt Thompson
3 Dave Wilson
4 Geoff Parling
5 Garath Archer
6 Phil Dowson
7 Steve O’Neill
8 Dean Ryan

9 Lee Dickson
10 Jonny Wilkinson (Rob Andrew on the bench)
11 John Bentley
12 Tom May
13 Jamie Noon
14 Tony Underwood
15 Mathew Tait / Tim Stimpson

Bench: Toby Flood, Rupert Harden, Andy Perry, Michael Stephenson, Tim Stimpson, Hugh Vyvyan, Dave Walder, Colin White, Mark Wilkinson, Malcolm Young, Mike McCarthy