Super Saturday, Game 3: England v France

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ENGLAND v FRANCE
Saturday 21 March 2015
KO: 17:00
Twickenham Stadium

Referee: Steve Walsh (ARU)
AR1: John Lacey (IRFU)
AR2: Leighton Hodges (WRU)
TMO: Ben Skeen (NZR)

***********************

A. Teams

ENGLAND
 
15. Mike Brown (Harlequins, 36 caps)
14. Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby, 8 caps)
13. Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby, 10 caps)
12. Luther Burrell (Northampton Saints, 11 caps)
11. Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs, 7 caps)
10. George Ford (Bath Rugby, 10 caps)
09. Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 46 caps)

01. Joe Marler (Harlequins, 30 caps)
02. Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints, 65 caps)
03. Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers, 49 caps)
04. Geoff Parling (Leicester Tigers, 22 caps)
05. Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints, 37 caps)
06. James Haskell (Wasps, 57 caps)
07. Chris Robshaw (captain, Harlequins, 36 caps)
08. Billy Vunipola (Saracens, 16 caps)

16. Tom Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 21 caps)
17. Mako Vunipola (Saracens, 19 caps)
18. Kieran Brookes (Newcastle Falcons, 9 caps)
19. Nick Easter (Harlequins, 50 caps)
20. Tom Wood (Northampton Saints, 35 caps)
21. Richard Wigglesworth (Saracens, 20 caps)
22. Danny Cipriani (Sale Sharks, 11 caps)
23. Billy Twelvetrees (Gloucester Rugby, 19 caps)

FRANCE

15 Scott Spedding, 14 Yoann Huget, 13 Gaël Fickou, 12 Maxime Mermoz, 11 Noa Nakaitaci, 10 Jules Plisson, 9 Sébastian Tillous-Borde, 8 Loann Goujon, 7 Bernard le Roux, 6 Thierry Dusautoir (c), 5 Yoann Maestri, 4 Alexandre Flanquart, 3 Nicolas Mas, 2 Guilhem Guirado, 1 Vincent Debaty.

Replacements: 16 Benjamin Kayser, 17 Rabah Slimani, 18 Uini Atonio, 19 Romain Taofifenua, 20 Damien Chouly, 21 Rory Kockott, 22 Rémi Talès, 23 Mathieu Bastareaud.

B. Head to Head

85 Played 85

45 Wins 33

33 Losses 45

7 Draws 7

147 Tries 135

78 Conversions 77

151 Penalties 90

22 Drop Goals 33

1,218 Points 1,036

LondonTiger wrote:

bluestonevedder wrote:
Parling's the lineout man, but it still faltered against Scotland when he came on!

In what way?

We missed one LT, I'm sure. Youngs at hooker, Parling jumping (which is usually a sure combination).

I think I would have had Youngs starting with Hartley on the bench.

Hartley has been a pale shadow of his normal self. Has he been told watch his discipline? Is this affecting his game.

Regardless when Youngs has come on he has looked far more aggressive, dynamic etc.

I do think Lancasters bench management is appalling. From day one it has never been good from a selection point...nor from a tactical side...ie subbing players who are bossing the game...and leaving on players who are having a mare.

There's something to be said for Youngs coming on with a more tired defence though. Suppose the same could be said of Easter instead of Attwood though I would have a proper lock as a safety first option.

bluestonevedder wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:

bluestonevedder wrote:
Parling's the lineout man, but it still faltered against Scotland when he came on!

In what way?

We missed one LT, I'm sure. Youngs at hooker, Parling jumping (which is usually a sure combination).

The only lineout we lost was the first of the game, when Hartley underthrew in the Scottish 22. Underthrowing has been a real problem for Hartley and he has misssed a handful of attacking throws - though if you look at the Saints lineout they tend to catch the ball lower than tigers and rely on movement and timing.

Tigers tend to catch the ball higher - and this means at times Youngs overthrows. He did this when he came on, but Nowell came in and took thae ball so technically it was not a lost lineout.

There was a rubbish overthrow that Youngs did. Fortunately the only guy who was awake to what was going on was Nowell who went on to cause mayhem. It would be nice to believe it was pre-planned but it didnt look it.

EDIT and maybe I should just read what everyone else has written

Has this England team been good at scoring tries in this 6N or is it a lot of media hype?

No-one has been especially good at scoring tries this year, PH. England have 11, yes, but more than half of them came against a tissue-thin Italian defence at Twickers and another 3 against a side that managed to miss closer to 30 tackles than 20.

It is notable what a thin year this has been for crossing the whitewash. I saw a stat the other day that said that the current record for the fewest tries scored by a winning team in the 6 Nations is 9 (one of the Welsh triumphs, I think). Every chance that this feat will be eclipsed this year, I would guess. France may be clueless in a lot of departments but they know how to defend and I wouldn't be backing England to score many tries against them. They've been better than the rest at scoring tries this year but that doesn't, per se, say a lot.

Pot Hale wrote:Has this England team been good at scoring tries in this 6N or is it a lot of media hype?

They have looked better than anyone else so far and they have looked consistently dangerous running the ball, (when they are not knocking on, passing forward or using blockers...). Maybe its just one of those years when defenses are generally on top

captain carrantuohil wrote:No-one has been especially good at scoring tries this year, PH. England have 11, yes, but more than half of them came against a tissue-thin Italian defence at Twickers and another 3 against a side that managed to miss closer to 30 tackles than 20.

It is notable what a thin year this has been for crossing the whitewash. I saw a stat the other day that said that the current record for the fewest tries scored by a winning team in the 6 Nations is 9 (one of the Welsh triumphs, I think). Every chance that this feat will be eclipsed this year, I would guess. France may be clueless in a lot of departments but they know how to defend and I wouldn't be backing England to score many tries against them. They've been better than the rest at scoring tries this year but that doesn't, per se, say a lot.

Isn't that generally what Hansen and O'Shea have been saying - that the refs' interpretation is now tilted so far in favour of defence that it's strangling the game?

That said, how many tries have England left on the pitch through lack of precision - at least 3 versus Scotland and 2 each versus Ireland and Wales. If wishes were horses and all that, but this side is creating more chances than any England side for a long while, and I suspect it's mainly lack of familiarity that's stopping them from taking them. A long pre-RWC camp may be enough to sort that out.

Seeing that France have now got a goal kicker that kick goals. England need to be care full about giving away penalties.

The Last game France played when Plisson came on They started to show sign's of improvement.

I am hoping that England do not get it in to their heads that because they are playing last that the tournament is in the bag......I really hope that they go out and play good rugby like we all know they can.

I was, at first, pretty incandescent that Attwood had been dropped completely from the squad. Whatever your opinion on Parling, Attwood made 19 tackles against Ireland and has put in some hard shifts. He's done nothing wrong and to drop from the 23 is pretty harsh.

I do now however, see why Lancs has brought Easter on to the bench. If you've played your socks off with an international point to prove for the past four years then what better team to be told your'e facing with a chance for silverware at the end than the team which nearly ended your international career. A master stroke of psychological handling, if it comes off!

I actually think France will turn up for this one and pull off the win. There's something so random and hopeless about France under Saint-Andre that you just know they'll pull something out the hat.

funnyExiledScot wrote:I actually think France will turn up for this one and pull off the win. There's something so random and hopeless about France under Saint-Andre that you just know they'll pull something out the hat.

We don't need that sort of karma at the moment!

Chjw131 wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:I actually think France will turn up for this one and pull off the win. There's something so random and hopeless about France under Saint-Andre that you just know they'll pull something out the hat.

We don't need that sort of karma at the moment!

Not 100% sure, but methinks it actually comes from Lancaster.

I'm sorry, just have a strong feeling about this weekend. I think Wales will win big enough to require winning margins from Ireland and Scotland. I think Ireland will win big enough to narrowly increase that margin for England, but that France will shade England, leaving Ireland victorious.

You heard it here first!

Chjw131 wrote:I was, at first, pretty incandescent that Attwood had been dropped completely from the squad. Whatever your opinion on Parling, Attwood made 19 tackles against Ireland and has put in some hard shifts. He's done nothing wrong and to drop from the 23 is pretty harsh.

I do now however, see why Lancs has brought Easter on to the bench. If you've played your socks off with an international point to prove for the past four years then what better team to be told your'e facing with a chance for silverware at the end than the team which nearly ended your international career. A master stroke of psychological handling, if it comes off!

I agree. Attwood is frustrating as he punches so far below his weight. But his work rate has been very good. Parling is a step back, a conservative pick.

Anyone else think France are going to turn up for this one, just to pee us off.

Say it ain't so Steve, you exfoliated love monkey, you:

http://www.sanzarrugby.com/superrugby/news/steve-walsh-to-retire-from-rugby/

So if he as retired with immediate effect. Who will be reffing the game?

majesticimperialman wrote:So if he as retired with immediate effect. Who will be reffing the game?

Nigel Owens is reffing the game now - at least we knew where were with Walsh, with Owens its a case of seeing how many laws he'll simply ignore in favour of the opposition. This England could take upwards of 40 minutes to work that out, by which time, France will be home and dry.

George Carlin wrote:Say it ain't so Steve, you exfoliated love monkey, you:

http://www.sanzarrugby.com/superrugby/news/steve-walsh-to-retire-from-rugby/

Ding, dong the witch is dead... England's RWC chances just took an uptick, since there is now zero chance that he can ref them.

I see ARU are setting high ambitions for his replacement:

Bill Pulver, ARU CEO wrote:"We now look forward to continuing to support the development of our next tier of match officials to reach and hopefully exceed the levels attained by Steve through his career.”

An event which has a chance of occurring for the first time in over 10 years, thousands all over the capital awaiting the chance to watch and celebrate, pictures coming in of the Welsh and Irish enjoying their moments in the sun, then as Londoners think its their turn, a great heap of continental smog envelopes and we see diddly squat

I'm just hoping that the "eclipse" as seen from my office in London isn't a metaphor for what happens over the weekend

BamBam wrote:An event which has a chance of occurring for the first time in over 10 years, thousands all over the capital awaiting the chance to watch and celebrate, pictures coming in of the Welsh and Irish enjoying their moments in the sun, then as Londoners think its their turn, a great heap of continental smog envelopes and we see diddly squat

I'm just hoping that the "eclipse" as seen from my office in London isn't a metaphor for what happens over the weekend

dont worry bamBam, our own smog is probably darker than yours!

on another note, I regained some optimism after reading Austin Healy article (reminiscent of some articles I read in the build up of the 1999 worldcup semi final):
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/sixnations/11483096/Six-Nations-This-France-side-are-the-worst-I-have-ever-seen.html

thanks for giving us a reason to perform

whocares wrote:

BamBam wrote:An event which has a chance of occurring for the first time in over 10 years, thousands all over the capital awaiting the chance to watch and celebrate, pictures coming in of the Welsh and Irish enjoying their moments in the sun, then as Londoners think its their turn, a great heap of continental smog envelopes and we see diddly squat

I'm just hoping that the "eclipse" as seen from my office in London isn't a metaphor for what happens over the weekend

dont worry bamBam, our own smog is probably darker than yours!

on another note, I regained some optimism after reading Austin Healy article (reminiscent of some articles I read in the build up of the 1999 worldcup semi final):
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/sixnations/11483096/Six-Nations-This-France-side-are-the-worst-I-have-ever-seen.html

thanks for giving us a reason to perform

Saw that Healy piece.  Wot a lad that Healy is.  Goad the opposition at your peril is the moral from Neil Francis after last week's hoedown.

I guess he's lucky though that most French people refuse to speak or read English (even though I'd say a whole host of them secretly can ).  So perhaps none of the French team read Healy.

From ESPN: England are favourites at 11/50 with UniBet with France priced at 7/2.

Nothing like totally writing off the French to goad them into action! I can't help getting the feeling this match isn't going to be as straightforward as most seem to think.

I think England should just concentrate on beating France (if they can and not worry about the table position too much).  Other than losing to Ireland, the chief reason things are so close is because England failed to score enough points against Scotland.  Despite being ahead at the moment on points, Ireland should still be favourites.

It would be better for England to beat France than do something stupid and embarrass themselves.

In terms of the team, Attwood has not stood out recently, which is a pity since his early season form for Bath was very good, but I wonder if England will miss his bulk against a very big French team.  Equally not having a proper lock on the bench, even though Easter played well when he came on in Dublin.  Not sure I follow the bench strategy very well, it does not seem to have a lot of impact.

The chief reason things are so close is that Ireland went for the marathon phase record in Wales when less sweaty options out wide were always on had they attempted to pass longer than ten feet to the right or left of them.

Ireland did indeed 'choke' in the brain department - thus the nailbiting end we all gotta endure tomorrow.

George Carlin wrote:Say it ain't so Steve, you exfoliated love monkey, you:

http://www.sanzarrugby.com/superrugby/news/steve-walsh-to-retire-from-rugby/

You have an excellent way with words George!

There seems to be a lot of pundits tipping Wales to win the 6 Nations, just can't see anything other than Ireland winning to be honest, England will make hard work of France but I think we are a try or two better to be honest but you never know we could easily have a stinker and let them into the game all too often.

I remember a few years ago, (2011?) when Wales played France last match on the final Saturday and needed a win by a certain points advantage to take the championship in Paris.

France turned up massively and blew us off the park.

If the scots beat Ireland, France could either be in the running to win their year, (should Wales lose to Italy), or they could be fighting for second place in the tournament if they play well...

Very similar to the 2011 championship. They could we'll have a lot to play for.

Right lads. Let's see what we've got

Right, Firstly i think we won't get the points difference we need to win. France have been pretty good at the breakdown and turning the ball over so we will end up without enough ball to score points.

Beat France by 26+ points, nope

At least Wales won't win it

GeordieFalcon wrote:At least Wales won't win it

lol, don't say that you'll upset a few people!

GeordieFalcon wrote:At least Wales won't win it

Definitely the lesser of two evils

Rather lose to the team who beat us fairly easily, at least we know they were better than us when we faced off

GeordieFalcon wrote:At least Wales won't win it

With that second half performance wales certainly would not have been undeserved winners. Even with biggar doing his best(worst?) Petulent Farrell impression.


Cannot see us getting anywhere near the points neeeded, just hope they go out and play sensible rugby.

England really need to step up now. they cannot afford to give France any penalties.

They cannot afford to start slow either. they have to hit the ground running.

We have to beat France first let alone worry about points difference. And our luck the real France will turn up and smash us all over the park....

How many points do England need to win?

I were a bit baffled through the week at everyone making England favourites.

Lest we forget, France have not yet had their traditional superb game in this Six Nations, so England must be wary.

26 points or so? Never. Although this first half, in 2009, is probably what England will be aiming for:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/7941972.stm

Nah the real France is not the one that "turns up".... Anyway good luck England. If you do it you would be clear worthy 6N champs

majesticimperialman wrote:How many points do England need to win?

26

Right - come on then England.

The world is watching you.

The Northern Hemisphere rugby world expects.

This is not about winning the 6N, this is about making the SH tremble...

We know you can do it.

Don't let us down whatever you do.

GeordieFalcon wrote:We have to beat France first let alone worry about points difference.  And our luck the real France will turn up and smash us all over the park....

thats my worry, everyone seems to be writing france off.

majesticimperialman wrote:England really need to step up now. they cannot afford to give France any penalties.

They cannot afford to start slow either. they have to hit the ground running.

Unless they can pull a Wales in the second half!

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:England really need to step up now. they cannot afford to give France any penalties.

They cannot afford to start slow either. they have to hit the ground running.

Unless they can pull a Wales in the second half!

i dont think France will buckle like Italy and Scotland did

nathan wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:England really need to step up now. they cannot afford to give France any penalties.

They cannot afford to start slow either. they have to hit the ground running.

Unless they can pull a Wales in the second half!

i dont think France will buckle like Italy and Scotland did

In all honesty, if England start to pull away I can definitely see the French giving up.

Gawd in heaven France, please turn up and throw your Irish buddies a bone! I still have nightmares of 2007....

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

nathan wrote:

Rory_Gallagher wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:England really need to step up now. they cannot afford to give France any penalties.

They cannot afford to start slow either. they have to hit the ground running.

Unless they can pull a Wales in the second half!

i dont think France will buckle like Italy and Scotland did

In all honesty, if England start to pull away I can definitely see the French giving up.

Yup I agree - I don't think this one is over by any stretch so I'm keeping the on ice - England are well capable of racking up the points, so the question is how many France can score.....

If the last 2 games are any thing to go by, this should be a cracker.

England need 26 or points to win. It is not impossible at all. But they will need to be at their best.

I am so nervous right now. I do hope England win. It will be edge of the seat stuff i am sure.

Amazing day of rugby - the 6N format might be flawed and not the fairest but its hard to beat super saturday!