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US Open Day 5 - Shall I Neel and ask her to Marray me? Or shall I just Peyer and give her the Haas Keys?

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Post by HM Murdock Fri 04 Sep 2015, 7:02 am

First topic message reminder :

Order of play
http://www.usopen.org/en_US/scores/schedule/index.html?promo=topnav

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:09 am

Poor Rafa. Comms have started comparing him to Wozniaki. Maybe he'll be dating Rory before too long.....

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:18 am

Yes, undoubtedly pleasing on the eye, but very unlikely to string it together for long enough against the big guns. I actually think Mannarino's level against Murray was much higher (until his legs went).

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:26 am

I also think that Foggy's shotmaking is being flattered by Rafa's lack of depth at times. But, yes, he is a player that seems to have it all, apart from the mental side, which, let's face it, is probably the most important of the lot.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:29 am

Foggy smelling blood here.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:31 am

Not much point running round your backhand if you're just going to dump your forehand in the net.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:32 am

Foggy is getting good depth on his flat shots too, and his angles are pretty sharp, especially the CC BH. Fognini has 45 winners to Nadal's 23.

I have noticed this since last year, Bolleli, Seppi, Fognini, Lorenzi, and some of the women players Pennetta and Errani are hitting flatter balls on non-clay surfaces. Seppi v Djokovic was also similar.

Nadal's loss of power and depth is astonishing in this match. Even the Schwartzman match was very similar. Fifth set on the cards now, unless Fognini falls apart.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:33 am

This is definitely a purple patch for Foggy now. Can he keep it up?

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:35 am

Fifth set, it is.

The better question is whether Nadal can scrape through. Fognini has shown very good resilience to take two sets back, and make this a one-set shootout.


Last edited by laverfan on Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:36 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:36 am

You're right LF. He is hitting nice and flat, although Rafa is inviting it with those loopy short ones.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:39 am

When Nadal plays such shots, the obvious match that comes to mind is Soderling v Nadal.

Nadal serves first, and unless he is broken, the pressure to stay in the match is on Fognini.

PS: If Nadal gets out of this one, Lopez (with a recent win over Nadal) is waiting for him. chin


Last edited by laverfan on Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:41 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:41 am

Who's your money on LF? Couple of years ago, you'd have bet your house on Rafa pulling it out the bag, but I'm not so sure now. The sad thing for Rafa is that it's barely a story if he does crash out. Pretty much par for the course these days, although losing from 2 sets up would be a bit of a shocker.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:43 am

I guess the big unknown is how Foggy will handle the situation. He could do pretty much anything, from dazzle to despair.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:46 am

Only loss from 2 sets up is Miami 2005 v Federer

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/atp-5-set-records-five-set.335267/page-4#post-4894978

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:46 am

Winners really flowing now for Foggy. Rafa's forehand lacking bite and either looping short or drifting long. His confidence seems so fragile, but this onslaught from Foggy can't be helping.

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Post by Belovedluckyboy Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:47 am

It seems that Nadal is wilting in the humidity. He was hitting alright at the first two sets but he's getting worse as the match progresses. It's always the third set that he starts to have problems.

It will be sad for Rafa if he loses here, when he was leading with a break in set three and about to finish the job in straight sets. Rafa really needs someone who can help him to stay calm and focused. It looks like a total collapse now by Rafa!

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:49 am

Fognini breaks. Sad. If he wins this one he deserves it, with the gumption he has shown.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:49 am

Wow! Stepping in and unleashing on almost every point now. I retract my earlier comment about Mannarino. This is mighty impressive. Rafa like a deer in the headlights.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:52 am

Belovedluckyboy wrote:It seems that Nadal is wilting in the humidity. He was hitting alright at the first two sets but he's getting worse as the match progresses.  It's always the third set that he starts to have problems.

Earlier in the Day, T2 (Temp21) has mentioned about day heat and heatstrokes, and I had countered with humidity at night.

Belovedluckyboy wrote:It will be sad for Rafa if he loses here, when he was leading with a break in set three and about to finish the job in straight sets.  Rafa really needs someone who can help him to stay calm and focused.  It looks like a total collapse now by Rafa!

He will fight till the bitter end though. The sort of familial trust that Nadal has in UT is unlikely to be bestowed on anyone else at this stage in his career.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:53 am

Break back, but not done yet. Fognini, right now, reminds me of Davydenko.


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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:54 am

This has really come alive now. Rafa steps it up, but did Foggy blink there and go a bit safe?

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:55 am

3 BPs for Fognini now.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:57 am

One saved (whoever wants to win the match must break and consolidate), two saved. Not the third one though.

It will be a see-saw till the very end.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 5:59 am

And Rafa hands the break straight back. To think I almost gave up on this one in the 3rd. Hurrah for insomnia!

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:02 am

As does Fognini, DF on BP, this is crazy.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:03 am

Next to hold wins it!?

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:05 am

Nadal and Fognini, are too tense and become a bit defensive.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:07 am

Nadal gives it back. I have a feeling that Fognini will hold and go through.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:09 am

So that's 5 breaks in a row. Can Foggy halt the trend?

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:12 am

From 40-0 to 40-40. Laugh Come on!

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:18 am

What a game! I'm speechless. Luckily, I can still type inane messages on my phone. We're now at 67th deuce. Both players playing lights out stuff.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:20 am

Classic Rafa to dig himself out of that game. He's in full survival mode now. Could be the turning point.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:21 am

3 BPs for Fognini to serve for the match. Wow! And takes the first one to serve for it.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:23 am

Cahill sitting behind Fognini, ready for the interview.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:24 am

Err, no. Make that 7 breaks in a row. Foggy will serve for it. It's a nailed on certainty, surely.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:27 am

MP for Fognini. Is there more drama?

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Post by TRuffin Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:27 am

Is this rock bottom for nadal? 1st loss in 152 major matches when up two sets to love, broken 4 time in a row of a fifth set, lose to a guy who has never beaten a top 10 player on hard courts..

At least this should end the nonsense from some fans that nadal is afraid to play freely because of his back. He threw everything out there but the kitchen sink tonight.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:28 am

Nadal gone from two sets up. Excellent match and a fifth set!

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:30 am

Fognini played an excellent match and was coming after Nadal full tilt. Watching Cahill with Fognini.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:30 am

Hats off to Foggy. That was an epic 5th set or maybe I just hallucinated it all due to lack of sleep. Rafa's form was not there, but all the competitive juices were flowing in the decider and Foggy did incredibly well to close that out.

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Post by Belovedluckyboy Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:31 am

Total collapse by Nadal! Fog is the better player for the last three sets though. Congrats to Fog.

Well Rafa at least escape a beatdown by Novak this time. Lots of work to be done by Rafa, cant believe he collapses like that with that serve gone as the match progresses.

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Post by TRuffin Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:33 am

What an open draw for djokovic on this half of the draw.

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Post by Belovedluckyboy Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:34 am

Come on Truffin, even if hes playing freely out there, hes wilting in the humidity. Hes throwing Fog a lifeline and Fog gladly took it.

Fog hit hard and flat and played well from third set onwards; going for his shots and Rafa became more defensive. Fog was the better player the second half of the match.

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Post by TRuffin Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:39 am

Belovedluckyboy wrote:Come on Truffin, even if hes playing freely out there, hes wilting in the humidity.  Hes throwing Fog a lifeline and Fog gladly took it.  

Fog hit hard and flat and played well from third set onwards; going for his shots and Rafa became more defensive.  Fog was the better player the second half of the match.

The great and fit bull wilted in the humidity but mental miget fognini didn't?  Then it really is rock bottom for Nadal if he Is losing a physical match to a guy whose never beaten a top player on hard courts.   So not the back now but the humidity. Ok, whatever you say.

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Post by laverfan Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:46 am

TRuffin wrote:What an open draw for djokovic on this half of the draw.  

Nadal the way he has played so far, was not a threat anyway. If Fognini and others keep their heads, they are better opposition for Djokovic.

Murray played a 5-setter with Mannarino, Wawrinka scrapped past Chung in 3 TBs. Federer has very good H2H v Kohl and Isner.

Biggest threat to Federer @USO is Berdych at QF, depending on which one shows up. Gasquet may take out Berdych.

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Post by TRuffin Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:50 am

laverfan wrote:
TRuffin wrote:What an open draw for djokovic on this half of the draw.  

Nadal the way he has played so far, was not a threat anyway. If Fognini and others keep their heads, they are better opposition for Djokovic.

Murray played a 5-setter with Mannarino, Wawrinka scrapped past Chung in 3 TBs. Federer has very good H2H v Kohl and Isner.

Biggest threat to Federer @USO is Berdych at QF, depending on which one shows up. Gasquet may take out Berdych.

True- but there is still bigger talent, ranking and form on the Murray/fed side. Who are we kidding here? Djoko should make it to the final without a slug fest while fed/Murray are going to face some battles. Advantage Novak. That's the way draws work though.

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Post by Belovedluckyboy Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:51 am

Truffin, please update yourself about Rafa. Rafa has been affected by the humidity here. Also, arent you the one saying age is catching up with Rafa but how come youre still thinking hes the fit bull like before? Arent you contradicting yourself?

Fog has never suffered with humidity, he can deal well with it, he doesnt lose because of humidity but mental collapses.

If youve watched Rafa enough you would have known that he couldnt deal well in humidity. This loss is more than the humidity but a collapse of his game esp his serve. Dont just pick on one point and try to argue with me

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:52 am

TRuffin wrote:
Belovedluckyboy wrote:Come on Truffin, even if hes playing freely out there, hes wilting in the humidity.  Hes throwing Fog a lifeline and Fog gladly took it.  

Fog hit hard and flat and played well from third set onwards; going for his shots and Rafa became more defensive.  Fog was the better player the second half of the match.

The great and fit bull wilted in the humidity but mental miget fognini didn't?  Then it really is rock bottom for Nadal if he Is losing a physical match to a guy whose never beaten a top player on hard courts.   So not the back now but the humidity. Ok, whatever you say.
Gloating about Nadal at rock bottom is almost as futile as would be gloating about Federer in a similar position. When you've accumulated 14 slams, this kind of disappointment will soon be forgotten. The fact that the defeat seems so shocking merely serves as a reminder of quite what a glittering career Nadal has had.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:54 am

Belovedluckyboy wrote:Truffin, please update yourself about Rafa.  Rafa has been affected by the humidity here. Also, arent you the one saying age is catching up with Rafa but how come youre still thinking hes the fit bull like before? Arent you contradicting yourself?

Fog has never suffered with humidity, he can deal well with it, he doesnt lose  because of humidity but mental collapses.

If youve watched Rafa enough you would have known that he couldnt deal well in humidity.  This loss is more than the humidity but a collapse of his game esp his serve.  Dont just pick on one point and try to argue with me
Don't make excuses BLB. You really don't need to make excuses.

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Post by Aut0Gr4ph Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:59 am

You're also doing a major disservice to Foggy TR. The way he played to close out the 5th was easily top ten quality. The fact that he doesn't have much of a HC pedigree is irrelevant. It doesn't detract one iota from the challenge he posed Rafa in that match.

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Post by Belovedluckyboy Sat 05 Sep 2015, 6:59 am

Thats not excuses, Rafa's game did collapse, esp his serves. He always suffers a dip in the third set here and Fog is a better player than Coric or Diego and so hes able to capitalize. Fog played better than Rafa from then onwards, hitting winners after winners whilst Rafa was busy defending.

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