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Scotland 2017 6N debrief and Lions/Summer Tour lookahead

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Scotland 2017 6N debrief and Lions/Summer Tour lookahead - Page 7 Empty Scotland 2017 6N debrief and Lions/Summer Tour lookahead

Post by RDW Mon 20 Mar 2017, 10:02 am

First topic message reminder :

Results

Scotland 27 - Ireland 22 Yahoo
France 22 - Scotland 16  Crying or Very sad
Scotland 29 - Wales 13  Yahoo
England 61 - Scotland 21  Shocked
Scotland 29 - Italy 0  Yahoo

Some stats:

- First time with 3 wins since 2006
- First opening round win and win over Wales in over a decade
- 14 tries scored - our best ever
- Our highest points tally (in 2014 we scored 45 points  Shocked )
- Up to 5th in the World Rankings


Verdict

Bar Twickenham this was a fantastic 6N where we won our games playing great rugby.  It was a huge monkey off our back to beat Wales and the Ireland game was a huge result for us.  The Twickenham game was a complete embarrassment but I'd like to think that was a freak result for this team as opposed to a sign that our wins over Wales and Ireland were 'lucky'.  It should keep the players grounded going forward, which is no bad thing.

All in all I'll give our 6N a 8/10

Lions hopefuls?

Pr - can't see any travelling
H Fraser Brown stands an outside chance, and could be injury cover
L - Jonny or Richie Gray stand a chance in the most competitive position
BR - I don't see any of our backrows going
SH - Laidlaw is down the list in terms of ability at 9 but may be picked as a good tourist/leader for the squad
FH - Finn Russell certainly divides opinion but personally I don't think he will travel
C - Dunbar and Jones are outside bets in what isn't actually a great position of depth for the Lions, but again may find themselves as injury cover
FR - Hogg is a near certainty and I can see another winger getting picked, probably Seymour

My prediction:

J Gray, Hogg, Seymour in the squad, Brown, Laidlaw and Jones as first choice injury cover.

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Sun 07 May 2017, 8:52 am

I'm glad Laidlaw is getting a chance to tour, he'll do really well I think.

Absolutely devastating news for the Youngs family. I seriously doubt there is anyone on here who hasn't had a loved one succumb to that dreadful disease. I wanted more Scottish representatives, but this is the worst way imaginable.
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Post by RDW Sun 07 May 2017, 9:11 am

Pyrgos, Price and probably SHC with Russell kicking goals.

Let's hope we score plenty tries then after yesterday's performance!

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Post by BigGee Sun 07 May 2017, 10:05 am

So who else put there hands up yesterday?

Hoyland definitely, showed what he can do with a sniff of a chance, he still had plenty work to do to score that try.

Toolis, the best lock on display yesterday, surely he deserves his chance now.

SHC, had one of his better games recently and with Laidlaw NZ bound, may scrap in for the 3rd SH slot.

The much maligned Chris Dean and Glyn Bryce both showed they have more potential than we have been lead to believe. Dean, again was probably the best centre on the pitch and Bryce was a very decent player at Glasgow before Edinburgh tried to ruin him.

The two bolters for me would be Cummings and Ritchie, both played very well and are definitely prospects for the future. Both will surely get capped, it is only a question of when.

Kinghorn and Fargerson junior both look like a summer in Georgia is what they need.

CDP did not make a compelling case to be coming along either but may well do due to the lack of alternatives with Strauss injured and neither of Ashe nor Denton showing any form either.

Can't wait for Monday, I am sure there will be a few talking points.

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Post by RDW Sun 07 May 2017, 10:22 am

Kinghorn looked like a lost child - he needs to go with the under 20s. I don't think anyone was seriously suggesting that just out of school Fagerson should go on the summer tour and he needs to go dominate with the under 20s.

Could Bryce really get called up?? We really are so short at 15.

My squad:

LH - Dell, Reid
H - Brown, Ford, MaCArthur (McInally had hardly played)
TH - Fagerson, Berghan, Welsh (also loosehead cover)
SR - Gray, Gray, Toolis, Swinson
6/8 - Barclay, Wilson, CDP, Ashe
7 - Watson, Hardie

9 - Price, Pyrgos, SHC
10 Russell, Horne
12/13 - Dunbar, Scott, Taylor, Grigg
Back 3 - Visser, Maitland, Hoyland, Jones

18 forwards 13 backs

Injury concerns - Barclay and Taylor haven't played much recently?

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Post by BigGee Sun 07 May 2017, 11:01 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:Kinghorn looked like a lost child - he needs to go with the under 20s. I don't think anyone was seriously suggesting that just out of school Fagerson should go on the summer tour and he needs to go dominate with the under 20s.

Could Bryce really get called up?? We really are so short at 15.

My squad:

LH - Dell, Reid
H - Brown, Ford, MaCArthur (McInally had hardly played)
TH - Fagerson, Berghan, Welsh (also loosehead cover)
SR - Gray, Gray, Toolis, Swinson
6/8 - Barclay, Wilson, CDP, Ashe
7 - Watson, Hardie

9 - Price, Pyrgos, SHC
10 Russell, Horne
12/13 - Dunbar, Scott, Taylor, Grigg
Back 3 - Visser, Maitland, Hoyland, Jones

18 forwards 13 backs

Injury concerns - Barclay and Taylor haven't played much recently?

That is probably the squad that BVC would have picked. You just feel though that Toonie will put his own stamp on it somewhere. One thing that he has shown throughout his time at Glasgow is that he is not afraid to pick young promising players and to give them their chance. He is probably a lot less conservative than Cotter in that respect.

There will be a curve ball in there somewhere, you just know it!

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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 11:59 am

Taylor has played once or twice at 15 for Sarries. Given the options at centre I could see Toonie going with that. Bryce really isn't up to it in my opinion.

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Post by RDW Mon 08 May 2017, 12:02 pm

Problem is Taylor hasn't played the last few weeks for Sarries, and has only had a handful of games when he came back from injury a month or two ago.

Is he even fit?

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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 12:09 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Problem is Taylor hasn't played the last few weeks for Sarries, and has only had a handful of games when he came back from injury a month or two ago.

Is he even fit?

I'd take him on one leg over Bryce.

Is Jackson fit? He's another who can play 15 if required.

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Post by RDW Mon 08 May 2017, 12:10 pm

Jackson is fit but also has hardly played for 'quins of late.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 12:14 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Jackson is fit but also has hardly played for 'quins of late.

Good, he'll be fresh! Bryce has played loads this season and has looked out of his depth in the Pro12.

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Post by BigGee Mon 08 May 2017, 12:14 pm

I think the good ship Jackson has sailed and Toonie will look forward not backwards. He would take Kinghorn/Bryce over Jackson.

FES - Bryce has actually played pretty well the past few games. Now that Glasgow are letting Murchie go, you would wonder if they wish they had kept him (and I know what your answer to that is going to be!)

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Post by RDW Mon 08 May 2017, 12:29 pm

Tonks maybe? he'll be playing Prem rugby next season and is only 27 or so - got his best years ahead of him.

Byron McGuigan has been getting a lot of gametime for sale too.

Neither are ideal options but it might be a good idea to get at least one involved as they are only a few injuries away from starting!

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama Mon 08 May 2017, 12:32 pm

It's not going to be a great reflection on Scotland if the minimum requirement for getting picked for a summer tour is to play pretty well in 2 consecutive games, coming off the back of the rest of the season where you've offered next to nothing! For form over the season as a whole it would be a very big call to select Bryce over Kinghorn, even if Kinghorn is looking tired and is still about 12 years old.

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Post by RDW Mon 08 May 2017, 12:35 pm

TheMildlyFranticLlama wrote:It's not going to be a great reflection on Scotland if the minimum requirement for getting picked for a summer tour is to play pretty well in 2 consecutive games, coming off the back of the rest of the season where you've offered next to nothing! For form over the season as a whole it would be a very big call to select Bryce over Kinghorn, even if Kinghorn is looking tired and is still about 12 years old.

Up until late October Kinghorn was the dogs Love sacks and looked like the 2nd messiah - from then on (and particularly after Christmas) he has been average at best, completely unprepared for professional rugby at worst.

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama Mon 08 May 2017, 12:38 pm

But again, the frame of reference here is Bryce's form which has been worse. I'd certainly consider Tonks over either of them

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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 12:43 pm

BigGee wrote:I think the good ship Jackson has sailed and Toonie will look forward not backwards. He would take Kinghorn/Bryce over Jackson.

FES - Bryce has actually played pretty well the past few games. Now that Glasgow are letting Murchie go, you would wonder if they wish they had kept him (and I know what your answer to that is going to be!)

He's been ok, but that doesn't erase some of the complete dross we've seen from him this season. When he's off his game the basics are all over the place, and he really can shirk a tackle from time to time.

If Glasgow want him back then that would be fine with me.

Kinghorn on the other hand I'm far more forgiving with. Yes, he's made similar mistakes to Bryce on the defensive side, but I think he offers much more going forward and has a vast amount more potential.

Maitland and Kinghorn, in that order, would be my two 15s for this summer were it up to me. I'd also personally take Jackson as back-up to Russell, although I do agree that Toonie may simply see Horne as back-up to Russell and stick with him. Not sure what Toonie will do about Weir. My hunch is that he'll take him.

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Post by BigGee Mon 08 May 2017, 12:45 pm

I really can't see us going back to McGuigan and Tonks, neither of whom are holding down starting places in their own club teams (even in the championship) and unfortunately I would put Lee Jones into that category as well, his international chances have come and gone.

Toonie will be looking to build a team for the future with the next world cup in mind and I don't think any of those guys are going to be a part of it. I would probably blood Kinghorn and Hastings (even though they are not ready) before going back there.

Ther one positive thing is that we have Italy up first, who are not going to be strong and also look like they are doing a spot of re-building. With that and the Fiji game, there is potential for a spot of experimentation.

Biggar looks like he may well be crocked already and the chances of Sexton making it right through the whole tour must be remote. We would do well to plan for Finn not being there for some, or all of the tour. That means that Weir and Horne will surely both be going. It gets a lot more complicated though if either of them gets injured.

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Post by IanBru Mon 08 May 2017, 1:00 pm

The question that's really wracking my conscience is whether the SRU twitter feed will announce the squad with a glacial string of one-by-one player photos.
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Post by Gooseberry Mon 08 May 2017, 1:04 pm

IanBru wrote:The question that's really wracking my conscience is whether the SRU twitter feed will announce the squad with a glacial string of one-by-one player photos.

Itll be more exciting than the Scottish Lions announcement

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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 1:40 pm

I'd like to see the SRU announce the squad in order of how good the players are, starting with the best and ending with the worst.

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Mon 08 May 2017, 1:43 pm

When is the toonie tombola getting it's first national outing?
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Post by RDW Mon 08 May 2017, 1:55 pm

Head Coach Gregor Townsend today named three uncapped players in a 34-man Scotland squad for next month’s three-test summer tour, the first under his stewardship.

The national team will face their opponents on consecutive Saturdays, starting with an historic test match against Italy in Singapore (10 June), followed by Australia in Sydney (17 June) and Fiji in Suva (24 June).

Glasgow Warriors’ centre Nick Grigg, prop D’Arcy Rae and Edinburgh Rugby hooker George Turner are the uncapped men to tour and will look to add international honours to their senior club careers.

A qualified community coach, 22-year-old Rae represented Scotland throughout the age-grades and is a former pupil at Marr College. He won the Bill McLaren Shield, BT Premiership and BT Cup with Ayr, while coming through the ranks with the Scotstoun club.

Macphail scholarship recipient George Turner (24) joined Edinburgh Rugby in 2011 as an Elite Development Player, having represented Scotland throughout the age-grades. He made his first start in 14 appearances for the capital club against Dragons last month.

Grigg (24) signed for Glasgow Warriors at the start of the season having impressed for Stirling County as a BT Sport Scottish Rugby Academy player.

The powerful Kiwi-born centre has made 21 appearances for the club since his March debut last year and has enjoyed a fine season with the Warriors.

The Scotland squad also welcomes the return of Pete Horne and Willem Nel from injury, while there are notable recalls for Glasgow Warriors wing Lee Jones, Harlequins back Ruaridh Jackson and Edinburgh Rugby scrum-half Sam Hidalgo-Clyne – who steps into the squad for Greig Laidlaw, recently called up for the British & Irish Lions tour of New Zealand.

Scotland Head Coach, Gregor Townsend, said: “We’re looking forward to what will be a challenging tour of three different countries, playing three quality sides.

“This tour is all about learning and competing. As a coaching group we will be learning more about our players and how they perform in a different environment against three sides with contrasting styles of play.

“We have assembled a strong squad, and this is an opportunity for them work with us for the first time. We’re going to have three week’s preparation in Scotland before we head overseas, which will enable us to implement the key components of how we will play.

“Ultimately, though, this is a tour that will be about competition – for each individual to compete for a starting place and for them to work hard and find a way to win every time they play.”

Scotland’s match against Italy will be the first tier one international to be played in the Lion City and looks to build on the success of their recent hosting of the HSBC Sevens World Series.

The second test will see the Scots return to Australia for the first time since 2012, when captain Laidlaw kicked a match-winning penalty to secure the team’s first win down under since 1982 (9-6).

The Wallabies edged out Scotland by a single point in the past two meetings; in Rugby World Cup 2015 (35-34) and the autumn test at BT Murrayfield in November (23-22).

Scotland will then travel to Fiji for the third and final test match.

It will be the third time the Scots have faced the Pacific Islanders on their home patch, with the nations honours-even from the 1998 test in Suva won by the hosts (51-26) and the Scottish victory in Lautoka in 2012, in which Tim Visser made a try-scoring debut (35-27).

Townsend added: “Playing Italy in Singapore will be a very different prospect than taking them on in Edinburgh or Rome. It will be a challenge for both teams to adapt to the new surroundings.

“Australia in Sydney in the afternoon is just an excellent fixture against a team that plays some great attacking rugby, while Fiji in Suva will be a huge test for our defence in an environment that we will very rarely play in.”

The draw for the Rugby World Cup 2019 will take place in Kyoto this Wednesday (10 May) and Townsend explained the game’s global showpiece is already a part of the selection process.

“The Rugby World Cup certainly features in our thinking as we prepare for this tour,” he added.

“We’ve looked at a number of players for selection for this squad and there are a few that have missed out on selection, some of whom were very close and will be in our thoughts as we move into next season and as we build towards the World Cup.

“The 34 players named today are selected not just for their form and what they’ve done in a Scotland jersey up to now but for what they can do over the next couple of years.”

Townsend also confirmed the appointment of Stuart Yule and Gavin Vaughan as national team S&C Coach and Analyst, respectively.

The pair join the Scotland backroom from Glasgow Warriors, completing the set-up under the new Head Coach.

SCOTLAND SQUAD – 2017 SUMMER TOUR

FORWARDS (20)

PROP (6)
Alex Allan (Glasgow Warriors) – 3 caps
Allan Dell (Edinburgh Rugby) – 8 caps
Zander Fagerson (Glasgow Warriors) – 9 caps
Willem Nel (Edinburgh Rugby) – 15 caps
D’Arcy Rae (Glasgow Warriors) – uncapped
Gordon Reid (Glasgow Warriors) – 24 caps

HOOKER (3)
Fraser Brown (Glasgow Warriors) – 25 caps
Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby) – 107 caps
George Turner (Edinburgh Rugby) – uncapped

SECOND-ROW (4)
Richie Gray (Toulouse) – 64 caps
Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors) – 33 caps
Tim Swinson (Glasgow Warriors) – 29 caps
Ben Toolis (Edinburgh Rugby) – 1 cap

BACK–ROW (7)
CAPTAIN John Barclay (Scarlets) – 60 caps
Magnus Bradbury (Edinburgh Rugby) – 1 cap
John Hardie (Edinburgh Rugby) – 15 caps
Rob Harley (Glasgow Warriors) – 19 caps
Josh Strauss (Glasgow Warriors) – 11 caps
Hamish Watson (Edinburgh Rugby) – 10 caps
Ryan Wilson (Glasgow Warriors) – 27 caps

BACKS (14)

SCRUM-HALF (3)
Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (Edinburgh Rugby) – 9 caps
Ali Price (Glasgow Warriors) – 5 caps
Henry Pyrgos (Glasgow Warriors) – 21 caps

STAND–OFF (2)
Pete Horne (Glasgow Warriors) – 23 caps
Finn Russell (Glasgow Warriors) – 27 caps

CENTRE (4)
Alex Dunbar (Glasgow Warriors) – 24 caps
Nick Grigg (Glasgow Warriors) – uncapped
Matt Scott (Gloucester) – 37 caps
Duncan Taylor (Saracens) – 18 caps

BACK-THREE (5)
Damien Hoyland (Edinburgh Rugby) – 2 caps
Ruaridh Jackson (Harlequins) – 30 caps
Lee Jones (Glasgow Warriors) – 4 caps
Sean Maitland (Saracens) – 28 caps
Tim Visser (Harlequins) – 31 caps
Unavailable following British & Irish Lions selection: Stuart Hogg, Greig Laidlaw, Tommy Seymour

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Post by RDW Mon 08 May 2017, 1:58 pm

Is George feckin Turner really our 3rd best hooker?? He's 4th choice at Edinburgh!

Delighted to see Toolis in there - if Gilchrist had been picked over him I would have had a meltdown I think.

There's a lot of players lacking fitness - Nel (I'd rather he had the summer off), Bradbury, Strauss, Taylor

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Mon 08 May 2017, 2:02 pm

Strong side an apparant 23 emerges (for me anyway)

1. Reid
2. Brown
3. Nel
4. Gray
5. Gray
6. Barclay
7.Watson
8. Strauss

9. Price
10. Russell
11. Visser
12. Dunbar
13. Taylor
14. Hoyland
15. Maitland

16. Dell
17. Ford
18. Fagerson
19. Toolis
20. Bradbury
21. Pyrgos
22. Scott
23. (pick one)

Looks quite strong to me. Nel being back is a huge boost.
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Post by demosthenes Mon 08 May 2017, 2:04 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:Is George feckin Turner really our 3rd best hooker?? He's 4th choice at Edinburgh!

Delighted to see Toolis in there - if Gilchrist had been picked over him I would have had a meltdown I think.

There's a lot of players lacking fitness - Nel (I'd rather he had the summer off), Bradbury, Strauss, Taylor

Agreed re fitness.

Also interested to see Jackson listed as a back-three player.

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Post by IanBru Mon 08 May 2017, 2:07 pm

Really delighted for Kiwi-for-Gregg too - he could be fantastic in an international setup.
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Post by tigertattie Mon 08 May 2017, 2:24 pm

Surprised at Jacko being back in the fold. He was deemed surplus to requirements at Glasgow by Toonie so I'd have thought he was surplus for Scotland too!
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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 2:33 pm

No Gilchrist and no Du Preez - that surprises me.

Pleased to see Jackson back in the fold.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 2:35 pm

Pretty green group of props as well, but not really much choice there for Toonie with both Dickinson and Sutherland missing.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 2:37 pm

I wonder if Gatland and Toonie have spoken re: possible Lions call-up players, which might explain Jackson's surprise inclusion. If would make sense for Gatland to tell the international coaches who is on his radar, so that contingencies can be made.

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Mon 08 May 2017, 2:39 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:I wonder if Gatland and Toonie have spoken re: possible Lions call-up players, which might explain Jackson's surprise inclusion. If would make sense for Gatland to tell the international coaches who is on his radar, so that contingencies can be made.

In that case I'd be surprised Gilchrist isn't touring, by that logic anyway.
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Post by nickj Mon 08 May 2017, 3:16 pm

Broadly pleased.

Main absentees seem to be Dickinson, Sutherland, McInally, Gilchrist, Ashe, Du Preez, Weir and Hughes.

Assume, Dicko and Sutherland need to have the summer to work on their fitness. I hope Nel's inclusion is an indication he's now ok.

Weir just hasn't done enough this season, although he played well at the weekend. That said, its quite a fall from grace for him, Grant Gilchrist and Stewart McInally.

Neil Cochrane and Pat MacArthur must be wondering what they've done wrong to miss out for George Turner (the forgotten man for so long)

Would imagine Rory Hughes and Adam Ashe would be the next cabs off the block...

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Post by RDW Mon 08 May 2017, 3:20 pm

I wonder if this is Nel's attempt to be first reserve for the Lions tour...

I really hope he is actually fit.

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Post by EWT Spoons Mon 08 May 2017, 3:23 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:I wonder if this is Nel's attempt to be first reserve for the Lions tour...

I really hope he is actually fit.

I was thinking the same. But more that Gatland told Toonie to bring him over as he's likely to be called up if he's fit.

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Post by nickj Mon 08 May 2017, 3:23 pm

Me too. His come back didn't go too well, so I'd have been inclined to let him spend the summer building up to be honest. That said, our boys arent far away

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Post by RDW Mon 08 May 2017, 3:30 pm

The squad will be training together for 3 weeks before heading out so if Nel is basically fit now then he should be in reasonable shape for the games, and may well get a late call up during the tour.

I would personally take the Munster tighthead as first reserve and probably Nel after that if he is fit.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Mon 08 May 2017, 5:28 pm

nickj wrote:Broadly pleased.

Main absentees seem to be Dickinson, Sutherland, McInally, Gilchrist, Ashe, Du Preez, Weir and Hughes.

Assume, Dicko and Sutherland need to have the summer to work on their fitness. I hope Nel's inclusion is an indication he's now ok.

Weir just hasn't done enough this season, although he played well at the weekend. That said, its quite a fall from grace for him, Grant Gilchrist and Stewart McInally.

Neil Cochrane and Pat MacArthur must be wondering what they've done wrong to miss out for George Turner (the forgotten man for so long)

Would imagine Rory Hughes and Adam Ashe would be the next cabs off the block...

Hughes yes, but I would expect Du Preez to come in ahead of Ashe.

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Post by nickj Mon 08 May 2017, 5:34 pm

You're probably right. He's got to be in the mix, otherwise its quite a fall from grace for him too

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Post by MacKnocked-on Mon 08 May 2017, 6:07 pm

I thought we might have seen one or two new caps from English clubs, particularly Mitch Eadie.

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Post by BigGee Mon 08 May 2017, 6:18 pm

This does look like a squad picked with the likliehood of a few Lions call ups in mind. There are certainly more players than would normally get taken on a summer tour.

Jackson can cover for either Maitland or Russell if they get the call.

Harley can move into the second row if one of them gets called and there are plenty of back rows if any of them do.

Nel is the interesting one that we were not really expecting. Could he yet be a Lions bolter, the chances of all the props getting through unscathed is almost non-existent. We still have two THs even if he was to get called up.

I am actually pretty pleased with the squad. It seems to have rewarded form players like Toolis and shown the ones that have not been, Weir, CDP and Gilchrist that they have to do better to stay in the squad.

I would hope that we can put out a competitive team from this group.

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Post by BigGee Mon 08 May 2017, 6:21 pm

MacKnocked-on wrote:I thought we might have seen one or two new caps from English clubs, particularly Mitch Eadie.

Mitch Eadie is one to keep an eye on. It will be interesting to see if he can break through and get some game time playing in a stronger team like Northampton. A lot may depend on whether King Louis goes back to France or not. I expect we will get a better feel as to whether he is international class now he will be playing in a better team. There is plenty competition in that Northampton back row though.

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Post by RDW Tue 09 May 2017, 11:34 am

I'm bored at work so here are my teams for each test. I see the Italy game as a chance to get the team up to speed for the Australia game then more experimenting for Fiji:

Italy/Aus

Reid
Brown
Nel (get him up to speed quickly)
Gray
Gray
Barclay
Watson
Strauss (see Nel)

Price
Russell
Visser
Dunbar
Scott
Hoyland
Maitland

Subs - Dell, Ford, Fagerson, Toolis, Harley (Italy) / Hardie (Aus), Pyrgos, Horne, Taylor

Fiji

Dell
Brown
Fagerson
Toolis
Swinson
Barclay
Hardie
Wilson

Pyrgos
Horne
Visser
Dunbar
Taylor
Jones
Maitland

Subs - Allan, Ford, Rae, Gray, Bradbury, SHC, Jackson, Grigg

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Post by tigertattie Tue 09 May 2017, 11:44 am

Obviously the coaches will know better than us, but I really really hope that Nel is fully fit. I'm worried that his lack of match fitness could see him getting injured further as international rugby, even though its a friendly, if far more intense than club rugby.

The last thing we want to do is knacker Nel further. I'd have given him the summer off and let him get eased back into playing.

I'm also worried about Finn. With Biggar still cabbaged, it is quite possible that Finn will be calld into the Lions squad and even if this is just to hold tackle bags, it means we'll face Oz with Horne or Jackson at 10 which is not good.
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Post by RDW Tue 09 May 2017, 11:46 am

Nel has is back doing full contact training apparently.

i do agree that he should have had the summer off though - I think the Lions chance must be behind it.

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Post by RuggerRadge2611 Tue 09 May 2017, 11:51 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:Nel has is back doing full contact training apparently.

i do agree that he should have had the summer off though - I think the Lions chance must be behind it.

To be fair, he has had a long time off, he must be champing at the bit to get back.
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Post by funnyExiledScot Tue 09 May 2017, 1:34 pm

The prospect of quite a cool trip might appeal as well. As tours go this one takes in some awesome places, but the chance to bully some powder puff Aussie looseheads!

If he isn't 100% then we always have young Fagerson to rely on. He's amassed some pretty great experience given his age.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Tue 09 May 2017, 1:35 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm bored at work so here are my teams for each test. I see the Italy game as a chance to get the team up to speed for the Australia game then more experimenting for Fiji:

Italy/Aus

Reid
Brown
Nel (get him up to speed quickly)
Gray
Gray
Barclay
Watson
Strauss (see Nel)

Price
Russell
Visser
Dunbar
Scott
Hoyland
Maitland

Subs - Dell, Ford, Fagerson, Toolis, Harley (Italy) / Hardie (Aus), Pyrgos, Horne, Taylor

I would switch Scott and Taylor around, and I'd put Swinson on the bench ahead of Toolis. Otherwise that's exactly what I'd go with.

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Post by funnyExiledScot Tue 09 May 2017, 1:38 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:I'm bored at work so here are my teams for each test. I see the Italy game as a chance to get the team up to speed for the Australia game then more experimenting for Fiji:

Fiji

Dell
Brown
Fagerson
Toolis
Swinson
Barclay
Hardie
Wilson

Pyrgos
Horne
Visser
Dunbar
Taylor
Jones
Maitland

Subs - Allan, Ford, Rae, Gray, Bradbury, SHC, Jackson, Grigg

I'd include Scott at centre for Dunbar, switch Brown for Ford and I'd specify Ritchie rather than Jonny for the bench (not sure which you were picking) but otherwise I think that's about right for the rotation team.

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Post by RDW Tue 09 May 2017, 1:49 pm

The thing is, we know exactly what Swinson can do at International level so I really want Toolis to get more gametime than him.  Toolis has the potential to be even better than Swinson - he certainly has the physical attributes and the skills - and could be a really good lock option to compete with the Grays.

We won't find that out if he doesn't play much this tour.

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Post by tigertattie Tue 09 May 2017, 2:40 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:The thing is, we know exactly what Swinson can do at International level so I really want Toolis to get more gametime than him.  Toolis has the potential to be even better than Swinson - he certainly has the physical attributes and the skills - and could be a really good lock option to compete with the Grays.

We won't find that out if he doesn't play much this tour.

What Admin boy said!

I see summer tours as development tours!

Now lets get something cleared up right away. A development tour doesn't mean send a squad of new caps down to be torn apart! To develop someone you need to have them learning in a constructive way. So you get to try out new combos or try out some new players sprinkled in with the more experienced guys.

Say you play Jonny and Swinson in the 2nd row. What does this achieve? Hee haw! Especially when toonie has seen those two pairing up time and time again at Glasgow. So it makes sense to try Toolis and Jonny working together in the first game.

I also can;t see what having Horne at 10 and Jacko anywhere in the squad is going to teach us!

This being said, it does again show that our lack of depth beyond the first XV is quite worrying. But to get that depth, we need to develop players.
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