Six Nations round 4 Scotland vs Wales

First topic message reminder :

Sat, 9 Mar, 14:15
Murrayfield Stadium

Scotland.

Kinghorn, Seymour, Grigg, Graham, Horne, Russell, Price; Dell, McInally, Nel, Gilchrist, Gray, Bradbury, Strauss, Ritchie.

Reps: Brown, Reid, Berghan, Toolis, Watson, Laidlaw, Hastings, McGuigan



Wales.

Liam Williams; George North, Jonathan Davies, Hadleigh Parkes, Josh Adams; Gareth Anscombe, Gareth Davies; Rob Evans., Ken Owens, Tomas Francis; Adam Beard, Alun Wyn Jones; Josh Navidi, Justin Tipuric, Ross Moriarty.

Reps: Elliot Dee, Nicky Smith, Dillon Lewis, Jake Ball, Aaron Wainwright, Aled Davies, Dan Biggar, Owen Watkin.



Referee Pascal Gauzere (France)
Assistant Luke Pearce (England)
Assistant Federico Anselmi (Argentina)
TMO Marius Jonker (South Africa)

Scotland v Wales is on BBC One

RDW wrote:Grigg has been a real start player for Glasgow but has shown defensive weakness at Champions Cup and Scotland level - he is a hell of an explosive carrier who flies into gaps so if the defence isn't aware he will cause you trouble.

That’s what he will be doing Saturday then...!

There's absolutely no chance that our centres will be better than yours on Saturday.

Both our centres are defensive liabilities. If anyone (eg Parkes) runs at Horne they will trample over him, if anyone (eg Daives) cuts and angle leaving Grigg in no mans land, they'll ghost right passed him.

tigertattie wrote:There's absolutely no chance that our centres will be better than yours on Saturday.

Both our centres are defensive liabilities. If anyone (eg Parkes) runs at Horne they will trample over him, if anyone (eg Daives) cuts and angle leaving Grigg in no mans land, they'll ghost right passed him.

To be fair knowing our track record, Horne and Grigg will have absolute stormers, make themselves toonies first choice, then absolutely balls up when they're selected in the key group stage games of the WC

NeilyBroon wrote:

tigertattie wrote:There's absolutely no chance that our centres will be better than yours on Saturday.

Both our centres are defensive liabilities. If anyone (eg Parkes) runs at Horne they will trample over him, if anyone (eg Daives) cuts and angle leaving Grigg in no mans land, they'll ghost right passed him.

To be fair knowing our track record, Horne and Grigg will have absolute stormers, make themselves toonies first choice, then absolutely balls up when they're selected in the key group stage games of the WC

More than likely.

I'm still hopeful though of Jones getting fit again and playing back to the level he has done before coupled with a fit and on form Matt Scott (12) alongside him. (sadly, I think Taylor is going to suffer the same fate as his namesake Simon).

With Bennett coming back it should hopefully kick Huw on and we'll be able to choose which classy player we want at 13.

Then after the world cup, I really do see he who is anointed by the great celestials along with Hutchison starting to prepare for the 2023 world cup

NeilyBroon wrote:

tigertattie wrote:There's absolutely no chance that our centres will be better than yours on Saturday.

Both our centres are defensive liabilities. If anyone (eg Parkes) runs at Horne they will trample over him, if anyone (eg Daives) cuts and angle leaving Grigg in no mans land, they'll ghost right passed him.

To be fair knowing our track record, Horne and Grigg will have absolute stormers, make themselves toonies first choice, then absolutely balls up when they're selected in the key group stage games of the WC

I’d say you’re pretty spot on...!

Allowing for the slight welsh bias that Wales online can show towards our players I think RDW was pretty close on his comparison

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/scotland-v-wales-head-head-15936439

maestegmafia wrote:Allowing for the slight welsh bias that Wales online can show towards our players I think RDW was pretty close on his comparison

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/scotland-v-wales-head-head-15936439

McInally and Owen only 6s each?

Owens is a Lions test capped player, and McInally has been one of the top NH hookers for the last few seasons!

Owens missed a fair few line outs recently and has been getting stick for it.

Planet Rugby suggest a 7 point wales win.

They were wrong two weeks ago

https://www.planetrugby.com/news/wales-to-keep-grand-slam-dreams-alive/

I'm glad Wales are getting hyped up. We only play well when the media is busy with the other team!

NeilyBroon wrote:I'm glad Wales are getting hyped up. We only play well when the media is busy with the other team!

The focus all week has been on the regional mess, national team has gone pretty much under the radar - I've not seen any 'hype'

Walesonline is getting carried away, there is not as much difference between the two sets of players as that. I'm expecting a rough ride for Wales on Saturday.

BlueNote wrote:Walesonline is getting carried away, there is not as much difference between the two sets of players as that. I'm expecting a rough ride for Wales on Saturday.

The only rating that is maybe slightly off is Moriarty - what others don't seem right based on current form ?

Munkian,
It's more a question of underestimating the Scottish players (Seymour, Price, Dell...)

BlueNote wrote:Munkian,
It's more a question of underestimating the Scottish players (Seymour, Price, Dell...)

Returning from injury mind.

munkian wrote:

BlueNote wrote:Munkian,
It's more a question of underestimating the Scottish players (Seymour, Price, Dell...)

Returning from injury mind.

None of the players above have been injured recently!

tigertattie wrote:

munkian wrote:

BlueNote wrote:Munkian,
It's more a question of underestimating the Scottish players (Seymour, Price, Dell...)

Returning from injury mind.

None of the players above have been injured recently!

I hadn't noticed them playing then

munkian wrote:

tigertattie wrote:

munkian wrote:

BlueNote wrote:Munkian,
It's more a question of underestimating the Scottish players (Seymour, Price, Dell...)

Returning from injury mind.

None of the players above have been injured recently!

I hadn't noticed them playing then  

Price hasnt been getting much game time as Laidlaw (our captain) plays mostof the matches

Seymour and Dell have played in all three games with Dell usually getting subbed at 60 mins with the rest of the front row. Seymour has played every minute I beleive, he's just been knickers!

BBC 2 Wales & BBC Alba are both showing the WOMEN's Sco v Wal game tonight. Why cant one show the Women's game and the other show the U20... its not rocket science...

International World Women's day today and Scotland v Wales tomorrow, I knew that skirt was worth the investment, 2 wears in 2 days.

Can't imagine the stuff over the regions will affect Wales too much. Gatland is a world class coach and the squad aren't lacking for leaders to make sure their heads are in the right place.

Evil Professor Gatland probably concocted all the region mess as a distraction as part of his masterplan to take over the world win the Six Nations.

RDW wrote:Well at the risk of kicking off WW3, here's my take on the head to heads:

Dell v Francis - Francis
McInally v Owens - Evens
Nel v Evans - Nel
Gilchrist v Beard- Gilchrist
Gray v AWJ - AWJ
Bradbury v Navidi - Evens
Ritchie v Tupiric - Tupiric (only just)
Strauss v Moriarty - Evens

Price v Davies - Davies
Russell v Anscome - Russell
Graham v North - North
Horne v Parkes - Evens (mainly because Parkes has been quiet this tournament
Grigg v Davies - Davies
Seymour V Adams - Evens (although Seymour's form hasn't been great
Kinghorn v Williams - Williams


So pretty much as we have all been saying - packs are fairly even with Wales just shading it, in the backs there is a huge difference in class.

Think this is being a bit harsh on Wales. For starters, the props are the wrong way round - Francis a TH. I also think Francis is massively underrated and would be in the England set-up, maybe ahead of Harry Williams, had he not opted for Wales. Surprisingly good in the loose despite his frame and took Ben Moon apart last week in the tight.

The key thing to this comparison - is it about form or ability? Because I think Ritchie is gunning for player of the tournmanet at the moment, but in terms of pedigree, you go for Tipuric every time. Nel, on the other had, hasn't played a minute in the 6Ns so far...so hard to pick him ahead of Francis.

I'd take Rob Evans over Dell, Ken over McInally, Moriarty over Strauss, Navidi shading Bradbury, Adams over Seymour on form, becomes practically enes in terms of ability...and I don't think that's being unfair to the Scots, in all honesty. Beard also very green at test level and might turn into a really good player; I'd also say Parkes is a 'better' 12 at international level than Horne, who flatters to deceive for me despite his playmaking. Almost to a man I'd pick Wales, and as biased as it sounds I don't think it's unfair. It simply reflects the injury issues Scotland have. With both fully fit XVs it becomes a lot closer but, as it is, there's some gulf between the two teams.

Well that is a good start to the weekend

Scotland U20s beat Wales 27-20, with a very good first half by the sounds of things.

We usually struggle against Wales at this level (or at any level!), so a good result for our boys. They have played in fits and starts in this comp, but looks like they finally strung it together

BigGee wrote:Well that is a good start to the weekend

Scotland U20s beat Wales 27-20, with a very good first half by the sounds of things.

We usually struggle against Wales at this level (or at any level!), so a good result for our boys. They have played in fits and starts in this comp, but looks like they finally strung it together

Haven’t seen the match but by the live stream accounts it sounds like a superb win for Scotland. Ireland beat the french to take the Championship.

We are meant to have a very good crop of youngsters coming through at the moment. They were very impressive at U18 level. Not seen much sign of them stepping up so far, but looks like they nailed it tonight.

I thought the last few u20s Scots teams have looked good. It’s an interesting championship this year.

miaow wrote:

RDW wrote:Well at the risk of kicking off WW3, here's my take on the head to heads:

Dell v Francis - Francis
McInally v Owens - Evens
Nel v Evans - Nel
Gilchrist v Beard- Gilchrist
Gray v AWJ - AWJ
Bradbury v Navidi - Evens
Ritchie v Tupiric - Tupiric (only just)
Strauss v Moriarty - Evens

Price v Davies - Davies
Russell v Anscome - Russell
Graham v North - North
Horne v Parkes - Evens (mainly because Parkes has been quiet this tournament
Grigg v Davies - Davies
Seymour V Adams - Evens (although Seymour's form hasn't been great
Kinghorn v Williams - Williams


So pretty much as we have all been saying - packs are fairly even with Wales just shading it, in the backs there is a huge difference in class.

Think this is being a bit harsh on Wales. For starters, the props are the wrong way round - Francis a TH. I also think Francis is massively underrated and would be in the England set-up, maybe ahead of Harry Williams, had he not opted for Wales. Surprisingly good in the loose despite his frame and took Ben Moon apart last week in the tight.

The key thing to this comparison - is it about form or ability? Because I think Ritchie is gunning for player of the tournmanet at the moment, but in terms of pedigree, you go for Tipuric every time. Nel, on the other had, hasn't played a minute in the 6Ns so far...so hard to pick him ahead of Francis.

I'd take Rob Evans over Dell, Ken over McInally, Moriarty over Strauss, Navidi shading Bradbury, Adams over Seymour on form, becomes practically enes in terms of ability...and I don't think that's being unfair to the Scots, in all honesty. Beard also very green at test level and might turn into a really good player; I'd also say Parkes is a 'better' 12 at international level than Horne, who flatters to deceive for me despite his playmaking. Almost to a man I'd pick Wales, and as biased as it sounds I don't think it's unfair. It simply reflects the injury issues Scotland have. With both fully fit XVs it becomes a lot closer but, as it is, there's some gulf between the two teams.

miaow - they're that way round because they're pushing against each other....

Just like the left wingers are against the right wingers....

Close game to celebrate International Ladies day with a ladies international. Well done to the welsh ladies team in a hard fought 17 points to 15 victory

Interesting way of going about things RDW. Rather than head to head by position, doing head to heads in terms of on field situations. Might be a bit messy if it caught on though - do you compare the 7 to the way they close the 10 down? The 8 the blindside with the ball? The 15 v the 10 fielding the high ball?

I get why you did it but think it's easier/better to compare position by position, personally.

Rugby World’s Any interesting statistics?

* Wales are looking to extend their record winning sequence to 13 matches. Their last defeat was away to Ireland, next week’s opponents, in February last year.

* Wales have never lost to Scotland under Warren Gatland, who has won ten out of ten meetings with them in his current job. Wales’ only defeat since Gatland took charge after RWC 2007 occurred two years ago when he was on a sabbatical because of the Lions job.

* Greig Laidlaw, named as a replacement, could become only the third Scot to score 300 Test points at Murrayfield. The goal-kicking scrum-half is on 291, behind Chris Paterson (366) and Gavin Hastings (334).

* Stuart McInally captains Scotland for just the third time. He wore the armband in matches against Argentina last June and Wales in November – he scored a try on both occasions!

* Welsh discipline has improved in leaps and bounds during the championship. They conceded ten penalties in Paris, six in Rome and just four in Cardiff against England – one of which was a wrong call against Justin Tipuric for a supposed no-arms tackle.

* Wales achieved 60% possession in their wins against Italy and England. The Scots average 49% in this championship so have a mountain to climb to turn that figure to their advantage.

* Scotland missed 27 tackles against France in round three and have conceded a try every 24 minutes during the tournament.

* Wales are the only team yet to score a first-half try in this Six Nations – but their seven second-half tries trumps the rest. Fifty-six of Wales’ 71 points have come after the break.

* Jonny Gray and Tommy Seymour will both win their 50th caps. Gray, 24, will become the 14th Tier One player to win 50 caps before turning 25. Among the existing 13 players, Gray’s injured team-mate Stuart Hogg won 53 caps by 25 while Wales wing George North won 72 of his current 84 caps by that age.

* Scotland have won 12 of their previous 15 home games, with New Zealand, South Africa and Ireland the only sides to prevail at Murrayfield in that time.

* Wales have the worst-performing lineout in this championship, at 69.7%. But they have won eight scrum penalties – more than any of their rivals.

* Wales have conceded the joint fewest penalties (with Ireland) in the tournament, at 19. In contrast, Scotland have conceded the joint most (with Italy) at 29, with the major problems being the ruck and tackle areas.

* Blair Kinghorn, deputising for the absent Stuart Hogg, has carried for the most metres – 464. And team-mate Jamie Ritchie tops the chart for most breakdown steals (four, with France’s Wenceslas Lauret) and most defensive ruck arrivals (44


Read more at https://www.rugbyworld.com/tournaments/six-nations/six-nations-wales-v-scotland-preview-88436#lDhvgQeUX9YzMAJT.99

I'm going Scotland 16 Wales 25

The things that may prove crucial, for me, are; Wales score most of their tries in the second half, Scotland don't score many tries in the second half and Scotland give away more penalties than Wales. I think if Scotland are even three points down at half-time we can all turn over to CBBC and watch something more entertaining.


Wales tend do have Davies and Moriarty doing most of the carrying so if Ritchie and Hamish can smother Davies and Bluto batters Moriarty then Scotland are in with a shout. But as we all know, "IF your auntie had balls, she'd be your uncle."

Incredibly nervous today. Happy it’s the early kick off

Very difficult to make a case for Scotland winning this one, but this has been the tournament of many upsets with England beating Ireland, Wales beating England, and Wales overturning a big deficit to beat the French.

The bones are telling me this morning that Scotland will pull this off... and maybe more comfortably than expected by the few who think they will win. But the bones are creaking badly from overwork so who knows? - the basterdes may be lying! Still, these feelings pop up now and again all of a sudden like this morning and I've learned to listen to most of them.
Good luck to both sides and may the team that plays best win

Mon the Scots, lets make this interesting going into the final weekend!

This has got upset (if Wales are indeed considered favourites?) written all over it. Not feeling the confidence today. Scotland at home, big attacking threat, Wales not been at their best apart from the usual extra effort showing against England........ hmmmm.

Wales have got to get over this reliance on coming back at teams in the 2nd half. Finishing strongly is great. But why not focus on starting strongly too? That way we might actually be in front come the 2nd half and the strong finish will be a bonus and will see us pull even further away!

EnglishReign wrote:Mon the Scots, lets make this interesting going into the final weekend!

It’ll be interesting regardless, because of the BP situation.

The Oracle wrote:This has got upset (if Wales are indeed considered favourites?) written all over it. Not feeling the confidence today. Scotland at home, big attacking threat, Wales not been at their best apart from the usual extra effort showing against England........ hmmmm.

Wales have got to get over this reliance on coming back at teams in the 2nd half. Finishing strongly is great. But why not focus on starting strongly too? That way we might actually be in front come the 2nd half and the strong finish will be a bonus and will see us pull even further away!

I feel like everything is set up for a Scottish win today.

It will be hard to have a good start today, in my opinion. I think the Scots will start bigger with the home crowd factor etc. If we weather the storm and are in the lead at halftime, I’d be pretty confident, but I’m not at all at the minute. That said, didn’t we start pretty well two years ago?

Leading at half time I think, Risca! And then fell apart 2nd half

Pffttt, not buying all this mock Welsh nervousness! Wales by 14

Form says a Wales victory. My head says Wales are on a role and will win.
Scotland have yet to really perform and they are missing quite a few players.
I can see it being close but Wales by at least a score,

Good luck Welsh fans!

Pillow fort assembled...

RDW wrote:Pillow fort assembled...

It’s normal to have a heart rate of 200bpm right?

bsando wrote:

RDW wrote:Pillow fort assembled...

It’s normal to have a heart rate of 200bpm right?

200? How are you so relaxed?!

bsando wrote:Good luck Welsh fans!

You too

Guarantees in life - death, taxes and Scotland not gathering kick offs

Bloody kick offs

Excellent aggressive Scotland defence