ICC Cricket World Cup

by **LondonTiger** Wed 3 Apr - 21:08

First topic message reminder :

Table
England 2pts (+2.08nrr)
Afghanistan
Australia
Bangladesh
India
New Zealand
Pakistan
Sri Lanka
West Indies
South Africa 0pts (-2.08 nrr)

Pool Fixtures

Thu, May 30
10:30 England vs ~~South Africa~~ (The Oval)

Fri, May 31
10:30 West Indies vs Pakistan (Trent Bridge)

Sat, Jun 1
10:30 New Zealand vs Sri Lanka (Cardiff)
13:30 Afghanistan vs Australia (Bristol)

Sun, Jun 2
10:30 South Africa vs Bangladesh (The Oval)

Mon, Jun 3
10:30 England vs Pakistan (Trent Bridge)

Tue, Jun 4
10:30 Afghanistan vs Sri Lanka (Cardiff)

Wed, Jun 5
10:30 South Africa vs India (Southampton)
13:30 Bangladesh vs New Zealand (The Oval)

Thu, Jun 6
10:30 Australia vs West Indies (Trent Bridge)

Fri, Jun 7
10:30 Pakistan vs Sri Lanka (Bristol)

Sat, Jun 8
10:30 England vs Bangladesh (Cardiff)
13:30 Afghanistan vs New Zealand (Taunton)

Sun, Jun 9
10:30 Australia vs India (The Oval)

Mon, Jun 10
10:30 South Africa vs West Indies (Southampton)

Tue, Jun 11
10:30 Bangladesh vs Sri Lanka (Bristol)

Wed, Jun 12
10:30 Australia vs Pakistan (Taunton)

Thu, Jun 13
10:30 India vs New Zealand (Trent Bridge)

Fri, Jun 14
10:30 England vs West Indies (Southampton)

Sat, Jun 15
10:30 Australia vs Sri Lanka (The Oval)
13:30 Afghanistan vs South Africa (Cardiff)

Sun, Jun 16
10:30 India vs Pakistan (Old Trafford)

Mon, Jun 17
10:30 Bangladesh vs West Indies (Taunton)

Tue, Jun 18
10:30 England vs Afghanistan (Old Trafford)

Wed, Jun 19
10:30 New Zealand vs South Africa (Edgbaston)

Thu, Jun 20
10:30 Australia vs Bangladesh (Trent Bridge)

Fri, Jun 21
10:30 England vs Sri Lanka (Headingley)

Sat, Jun 22
10:30 Afghanistan vs India (Southampton)
13:30 New Zealand vs West Indies (Old Trafford)

Sun, Jun 23
10:30 Pakistan vs South Africa (Lord’s)

Mon, Jun 24
10:30 Afghanistan vs Bangladesh (Southampton)

Tue, Jun 25
10:30 England vs Australia (Lord’s)

Wed, Jun 26
10:30 New Zealand vs Pakistan (Edgbaston)

Thu, Jun 27
10:30 India vs West Indies (Old Trafford)

Fri, Jun 28
10:30 South Africa vs Sri Lanka (Edgbaston)

Sat, Jun 29
10:30 Afghanistan vs Pakistan (Headingley)
13:30 Australia vs New Zealand (Lord’s)

Sun, Jun 30
10:30 England vs India (Edgbaston)

Mon, Jul 1
10:30 Sri Lanka vs West Indies (Riverside Ground)

Tue, Jul 2
10:30 Bangladesh vs India (Edgbaston)

Wed, Jul 3
10:30 England vs New Zealand (Riverside Ground)

Thu, Jul 4
10:30 Afghanistan vs West Indies (Headingley)

Fri, Jul 5
10:30 Bangladesh vs Pakistan (Lord’s)

Sat, Jul 6
10:30 India vs Sri Lanka (Headingley)
13:30 Australia vs South Africa (Old Trafford)

Knock Out Fixtures

To Follow

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Wed 29 May - 19:11

https://www.cricket365.com/2019-world-cup/icc-cricket-world-cup-2019-in-form-out-form-pakistan/

Good preview here

by Gooseberry Wed 29 May - 22:01

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:https://www.cricket365.com/2019-world-cup/icc-cricket-world-cup-2019-in-form-out-form-pakistan/

Good preview here

Indeed. refreshingly honest, and does highlight that everyones kinda forgotten about SA!

SA have the oldest squad in the tournament, but not the most experienced by any measure. We talk about Gayles age, but Tahir is the wrong side of 40, Amlas and Steyn both 36. Dumminy and du Plesis also both about ready to be turned into glue. How mobile will they be around the field ? Thats questionable, and will they want their fast bowlers having to hurtle around the outfield chucking themselves into advertising boards to cover for them? Fitness, injuries and squad depth really come into it over an 11 game series. Steyns still touch and go for that first game, and wont have bowled for SA since March when he does play.
Tahirs record in recent years looks good on the surface, but almost all of his recent wickets came against Sri Lanka, Bangladesh and Zimbabwe . Those series (and Pakistan) also make SAs record as a team look healthier than it really is. In the last 2 years hes 68/0 against England, 212/2 against India, 130/2 against Aus (hasnt bowled against new Zealand). Against sides with a solid chance of getting into the knock outs theyve won 3 lost 7 in the past 2 years (and 3 of those were against the rubbish version of Aus)...the win loss percentage noted in that article is hugely misleading.
Amla to me belongs to the old era. I just dont think he can bat in the way required to really challenge the likes of England, although still good enough to make it comfortable for SA when their bowlers are on song. (Its exactly two years since he last scored 50 at a run a ball or better) But not a match winner in his own right. SA obviously have stacks of quality bowlers but dont have the batting and all rounders in their the likes of England do, so tend to be a bit top heavy and reliant on keeping opposition scores down and their star batsmen. The games moved on from that. SA to me look like a side in decline, controversial opinion but they might have been better served had some of these players retired after the CT and allowed more of a new generation of T20 types to come through.
That to me kinda suggest they are mid table fodder, and the sort of side that Windies should fancy scalping, generally too good for the bottom half sides but unlikely to beat many of the good ones. I think I had them down as fifth in the predictions a while back, Ill stick to 5th/6th.

Edit ...just read that Steyn is out of the England game. The attack will likely be Rabada, Ngidi, Tahir then a mixture of all rounders and bits and pieces. There will be a genuine tail whereas England could have the likes of Moeen at 9 and Rashid at 11 and although the main pacemen are very strong it leaves a lot of fill in bowling. Also note comments above regarding Tahir vs decent teams (plus short boundaries).
England really should win. (So put your money on SA Whistle

)

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 3:04

Duty281 wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Some decent value bets knocking about in the top run scorer market imo (Skybet paying each way for top 4 places)

Kohli is 9/1 favourite, Steve Smith at 16/1 both seem very decent shouts to me

Some outside shots - Shai hope at 33/1 and Tamim at 66/1. Both have excellent ODI records and previous success in England too

Eoin Morgan also decently priced at 25/1, currently averaging 70 in ODI cricket this year, I believe. Rashid Khan a nice 16/1 to be the top wicket taker.

In addition to Sky Bet's extreme generosity of 13/8 that England/India/Australia make the semi-finals, they're also offering even money that India win seven games or more at this World Cup. And a tempter at 12/1 that England score 500+ at this World Cup. SkyBet eager to go bankrupt.

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 3:07

England expected to go with the usual tomorrow - Roy/Bairstow/Root/Morgan/Stokes/Buttler/Ali/Woakes/Rashid/Archer/Wood.

But they may go with Plunkett if Wood is unfit. It seems that everything is set up too perfectly for England tomorrow, especially with Steyn out, and I half expect England to be brought to earth with a bump by a dismal batting performance. Business as usual, in other words.

by Gooseberry Thu 30 May - 3:40

Khan isnt likely to feature past the knock outs so not that smart a bet.
12/1 on 500 sent that good a bet ....in all the games they ever played they've not come very close to doing it. They play a max of 11 here, and will only get the chance when batting first (unless someone else gets 500 first..not happening). They will almost always bat second given the chance. The weather for the next couple of weeks it's pretty patchy too some are likely to see some games cut short. Maybe 4 opportunities to do it. It ain't gonna happen.

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 4:10

I think they're very generous prices, truth be told. Rashid Khan will only feature in two games fewer, which isn't that big a drop.

England probably won't get 500, but they've got better than the 8% chance that SkyBet reckon. The games against Pakistan and Bangladesh offer the best hope of getting it. Agree that England will bat second whenever they win the toss, but I think the opposition will almost always insert England first if they do likewise.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 5:58

Duty281 wrote:I think they're very generous prices, truth be told. Rashid Khan will only feature in two games fewer, which isn't that big a drop.

England probably won't get 500, but they've got better than the 8% chance that SkyBet reckon. The games against Pakistan and Bangladesh offer the best hope of getting it. Agree that England will bat second whenever they win the toss, but I think the opposition will almost always insert England first if they do likewise.

Yeah that's the thing about the top wicket taker/scorer markets this tournament - not like previous years when you'd have to pick a player from a side likely to make it to the knockouts, the difference between 9 and 11 games isn't too much.

Also for the 500 shout...Trent Bridge fixtures of interest would be England vs Pakistan and Australia vs Bangladesh imo. The most likely ground for it

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 6:43

For UK folk, Channel 4 have got highlights of every game at this World Cup, tucked away at some midnight hour.

https://www.channel4.com/press/news/channel-4-show-highlights-2019-cricket-world-cup

by Gooseberry Thu 30 May - 7:06

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Duty281 wrote:I think they're very generous prices, truth be told. Rashid Khan will only feature in two games fewer, which isn't that big a drop.

England probably won't get 500, but they've got better than the 8% chance that SkyBet reckon. The games against Pakistan and Bangladesh offer the best hope of getting it. Agree that England will bat second whenever they win the toss, but I think the opposition will almost always insert England first if they do likewise.

Yeah that's the thing about the top wicket taker/scorer markets this tournament - not like previous years when you'd have to pick a player from a side likely to make it to the knockouts, the difference between 9 and 11 games isn't too much.

Also for the 500 shout...Trent Bridge fixtures of interest would be England vs Pakistan and Australia vs Bangladesh imo. The most likely ground for it

The odds were for England to make 500, not any team. They've passed 450 once ever. Its only a 50% chance they'll get to bat first in that game, and they didnt get to 400 in any of the games ( including the one at trent bridge) in the recent Pakistan series. Its literally never happened, honestly dont see it as great odds especially with rain around (including Trent Bridge on Tuesday, could be a seamers paradise and/or a shortened game). The match against Australia was on a dead hard baked pitch at the height of an extreme hot and dry spell against an awful bowling attack. The wickets currently are much greener.
Max 11 games, lets say 1 gets rain affected. Lets say they bat first half the time. Thats 5 chances. They've past 400 once in 28 games since that 482. they will be playing against teams best XIs not the B team attack Australia fielded. Dont believe the hype on 500.

As for Rashid Khan ... to be fair on reflection 16/1 appears is pretty good considering hes the best wicket taker in the world, but that two games is still a thing. Id be interested to know the odds on Bumrah and Woakes given it looks like a very " English summer". Khans record is also padded massively, almost all his wickets have come against Ireland and Zimbabwe, hes only played once against one of the top sides and they fielded a second string. Its hard to know how good he really is, no question from IPL etc that he can be a force but hes totally untested against the best batting line ups and had barely played any cricket on green wickets. At the Champions trophy the top 4 wicket takers were all seamers (Hasan Ali (13), Hazelwood, Junaid Khan, Plunkett), the top spinner as Adil Rashid (7) and only one other spinner took more than 5. Now Rashid Khan of course didnt play that but the suggestion is that whilst leggies are still valuable they arent quite as important in classic English conditions even with the kookabura as they are elsewhere.
I guess with Adil Rashid being a bit off and most of the top seamers likely to be rotated a bit his stock rises , just maybe not quite as obvious as it would look from his ranking. But you can get Hasan Ali at better than 50/1 .... he took 4 more wickets than anyone else at the Champions Trophy (but yeah still a long shot!)
Also if you think Skys a gimme on that hes 18/1 elsewhere. So is Chris Woakes.

by msp83 Thu 30 May - 7:47

They should do away with TB as a ODI ground. Produces exciting test matches particularly when overhead conditions help, and T-20 is anyways about slogging around. But the ground itself makes the interest levels go down as 400+ is pretty much par there. Since ICC is preparing the pitches for the global event, hopefully there will be something to look forward to. I am beginning to work myself into some interest for the tournament, hope the pitches won't ruin it...

by msp83 Thu 30 May - 7:57

As for South Africa-England, the only thing that gives SA hope is their bowling and the fact that England is never too far away from a complete batting meltdown as all 11 of them who can bat, who can smash it, would keep doing it till they gets done and sometimes that can see terrible outcomes.
But the home side would go in as massive favorites. SA's got Rabada, and they do have Ngidi and Tahir too. But without Steyn, the rest of the attack might just get found out... And if England gets a big score on the board, only Quinton de Kock can really smash it around, and David Miller comes off once in 10 games.
How would the SA lineup even look? Can't really speculate.
QDK, Amla, Faf, Miller, Rabada, Ngidi, Tahir and Phehlukwayo would play,, Who would be the extra batsmen, who would be the all-rounder?

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 9:38

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/may/29/world-cup-opening-ceremony-cricket

Sounds like the opening ceremony was just as bad as the infamous one in '99!

by **Pal Joey** Thu 30 May - 10:03

So are we going to do the tipping competition?
Maybe just go with Tiger's one?

Pick the winner and either Narrow, Comfortable, Easy or Thrashing.

Not sure how the points will work... Tiger? How does it work with Superbru?

Anyway... I'll set up a page so we can put down our picks for the first block of 10 matches.

https://www.606v2.com/t68801-2019-icc-world-cup-tipping-competition

by Gooseberry Thu 30 May - 17:35

Saw ladbrokes had Rashid Khan at 20/1 for leading wicket taker today....actually worth a penny at that rate despite the hatchet job I on him above

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 20:04

South Africa win the toss and field first. Bit of green on the pitch and the Oval appears to favour those fielding first. Plunkett playing at the expense of Wood, even though the latter is 'fully fit', according to Morgan.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 20:12

Duty281 wrote:South Africa win the toss and field first. Bit of green on the pitch and the Oval appears to favour those fielding first. Plunkett playing at the expense of Wood, even though the latter is 'fully fit', according to Morgan.

Personally agree with the selection - Plunkett has a far superior record, and certainly bowled better as the Pakistan series went on.

Big test first up for England - Rabada and Ngidi on a green top at 10:30am, won't be easy!

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 20:16

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Big test first up for England - Rabada and Ngidi on a green top at 10:30am, won't be easy!

I have what is known in the medical profession as 'a very, very bad feeling'.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 20:16

Duty281 wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Big test first up for England - Rabada and Ngidi on a green top at 10:30am, won't be easy!

I have what is known in the medical profession as 'a very, very bad feeling'.

Already convinced myself in my mind losing this one doesn't matter because we have 8 more games left Laugh

by alfie Thu 30 May - 20:20

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Duty281 wrote:South Africa win the toss and field first. Bit of green on the pitch and the Oval appears to favour those fielding first. Plunkett playing at the expense of Wood, even though the latter is 'fully fit', according to Morgan.

Personally agree with the selection - Plunkett has a far superior record, and certainly bowled better as the Pakistan series went on.

Big test first up for England - Rabada and Ngidi on a green top at 10:30am, won't be easy!

Makes sense to me too . I don't think England really need to play Archer and Wood together. One opens with Woakes , and then use Plunkett (or Curran) as the third pace man.
In any case even if Wood is fully fit it won't hurt to let him rest a bit longer to make sure : he is rather prone to recurring injury !

SA will be glad to have won this toss. Just hope England don't pick today to have one of their batting meltdowns...

by **LondonTiger** Thu 30 May - 20:21

Duty281 wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Big test first up for England - Rabada and Ngidi on a green top at 10:30am, won't be easy!

I have what is known in the medical profession as 'a very, very bad feeling'.

"I gotta feeling,
That tonight's gonna be a bad, bad night"

by alfie Thu 30 May - 20:21

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Duty281 wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Big test first up for England - Rabada and Ngidi on a green top at 10:30am, won't be easy!

I have what is known in the medical profession as 'a very, very bad feeling'.

Already convinced myself in my mind losing this one doesn't matter because we have 8 more games left

Ha ! Don't think that way...the effect of a disaster first up might be Very Bad for morale... But we should have faith , no ?

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 20:28

alfie wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
Duty281 wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Big test first up for England - Rabada and Ngidi on a green top at 10:30am, won't be easy!

I have what is known in the medical profession as 'a very, very bad feeling'.

Already convinced myself in my mind losing this one doesn't matter because we have 8 more games left

Ha ! Don't think that way...the effect of a disaster first up might be Very Bad for morale... But we should have faith , no ?

I'm an England fan at heart still Alfie - I'm convinced 120 all out is coming!

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 20:32

South Africa opening with Tahir...that's unexpected.

Bairstow out first ball. 1/1. Sad

by **LondonTiger** Thu 30 May - 20:33

Oops.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 20:34

There's no worse sight in cricket than Imran Tahir doing a lap after getting a wicket - especially when that's 2nd ball of the tournament against your team!

by **Pal Joey** Thu 30 May - 20:46

And there's nothing worse on the ears when the commentators say "... and there's no better sight than Tahir in full celebration mode...!"

Oh yes there is!

Nasser shouldn't have mentioned the word "loss" either... just before the wicket fell.
I suddenly felt a shadow of doubt when he said that. Talk about jinxing them!

by alfie Thu 30 May - 20:47

Inspired SA move to open with Tahir !

That has already done for one of the features of England's game plan : the rocket start from their opening pair. Good to have Root at three ; but you wonder if Roy might be a bit more restrained than usual after the early loss of his partner... Might find the late onslaught will be mounted off a lower base than they've been accustomed to lately.

Reckon you can forget about 500 today anyway Smile

by alfie Thu 30 May - 20:50

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:There's no worse sight in cricket than Imran Tahir doing a lap after getting a wicket - especially when that's 2nd ball of the tournament against your team!

A large West Indian fast bowler's repetitive "salute" performance comes to mind...

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 20:51

Some runs coming for Roy/Root, but they're living dangerously. Couple of narrow escapes.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 20:56

alfie wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:There's no worse sight in cricket than Imran Tahir doing a lap after getting a wicket - especially when that's 2nd ball of the tournament against your team!

A large West Indian fast bowler's repetitive "salute" performance comes to mind...

ICC Cricket World Cup - Page 4 Oavdp56_jos-buttler-_625x300_28_February_19

by **Dolphin Ziggler** Thu 30 May - 21:01

What should be par here then, gentlemen?

by Gooseberry Thu 30 May - 21:02

Going pretty well for england now after that shocker start
SA only really have 3 real front line bowlers and 3 part timers, thats go to be a plus for England as the innings progresses. On course for a score in the high 300's if they do have a collapse.

I cant see SA getting near 400 with their batting line up. If England pass 350 they should be favourites.

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 21:04

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:What should be par here then, gentlemen?

Need at least 350. Pleasant conditions, lightning-quick outfield.

by alfie Thu 30 May - 21:15

Root and Roy scoring briskly enough...couple of loose shots but so far OK...

Going to need a few today I think : outfield like lightning ; that lovely push down the ground from Roy seemed to accelerate away from the fielder. Reckon wickets will be key today - for both teams.

by Gooseberry Thu 30 May - 21:15

Duty281 wrote:
Dolphin Ziggler wrote:What should be par here then, gentlemen?

Need at least 350. Pleasant conditions, lightning-quick outfield.

SA havent passed 350 since August last year, and the time before that was 2017. They have struggled to make big totals recently, despite playing against some rubbish sides. Part of that is de villiers retirement and part of it is Amlas decline, also their collective inability to bat against spinners in any format. 350 should be enough for a side with 4 good bowlers, 3 fill ins and the option of a lot of spin.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 21:18

alfie wrote:Root and Roy scoring briskly enough...couple of loose shots but so far OK...

Going to need a few today I think : outfield like lightning ; that lovely push down the ground from Roy seemed to accelerate away from the fielder. Reckon wickets will be key today - for both teams.

Would agree with that - definitely key for England. SA's top 4 is very good, beyond that, well I wouldn't be trusting them to break the back of a big chase of 350.

Doesn't seem to be many demons in the pitch - think SA might've bowled Tahir one too many with the new ball and blunted Rabada a bit. Roy hasn't really got going yet, Root doing what Root does nicely.

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 21:21

England in control now. Currently heading for 360-380. All is well.

by alfie Thu 30 May - 21:35

Like the way these two have played this : not too bothered by the early wicket and some tricky deliveries at the start ; got into gear steadily (with just a couple of lucky false shots) and have scored quite rapidly without doing anything dramatic or taking much in the way of risks.
Going to be hard for SA to contain the likes of Buttler and Stokes later on this ; so the priority ought to be setting a good solid platform for later fireworks : they're doing better than that at present...

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 21:53

Roy gone just as he was looking to kick on. Time for the in-form skipper.

by Nathaniel Jacobs Thu 30 May - 21:54

That was a pretty tame end by Roy essentially slogging a long hop straight up in the air. Good innings nonetheless

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 21:56

Root follows shortly after. Pretty poor shot. South Africa right back in contention.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 21:56

Well they’ve just undone the good work they did to restore England’s position of power, with pretty nothing shots.

by **Dolphin Ziggler** Thu 30 May - 21:57

Well, that's turned on its head

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 21:57

Don’t like stokes ahead of Buttler here tbh

by Nathaniel Jacobs Thu 30 May - 21:59

Stokes has had in on Rabada in the past. And young South African is never far away from a verbal meltdown either.

by alfie Thu 30 May - 22:00

Hmm. Indeed they've rather thrown that away...

I'll accept some blame for praising their measured approach Smile

Up to the two lefties now to restore the position...

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 22:00

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Don’t like stokes ahead of Buttler here tbh

Agreed. Bar one good innings against Pakistan, Stokes has had a pretty rough time with the bat in recent months.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Thu 30 May - 22:07

Duty281 wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Don’t like stokes ahead of Buttler here tbh

Agreed. Bar one good innings against Pakistan, Stokes has had a pretty rough time with the bat in recent months.

If Buttler bats 100 balls, England win the game, and as he has proven many times in the past he's arguably a better player when he can come in earlier and get his eye in and then accelerate over time.

by Gooseberry Thu 30 May - 22:09

Fortunately for England they have the most ridiculously strong tail in international cricket history. Moeen, woakes, Rashid, Plunkett are all players who could bat 7 in many teams and who are capable of hitting rapid 30s. Archers hardly a bunny either. Wickets are still key though and three of top names down has slowed things a lot.
All in it's not the stat to the tournament England wanted, but maybe it will shut msp up a bit

by Duty281 Thu 30 May - 22:37

Morgan trying very hard to score quickly, with Stokes doing little at the other end. It's the sort of thing that will either see Morgan blast England past 200 in double quick time, or get out and leave his side in trouble.

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