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Silly Season Transfer Rumours 19/20

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Tue 05 May 2020, 6:07 pm

First topic message reminder :

mikey_dragon wrote:It’s an unfortunate coincidence I think, but his injury record was exemplary before he linked up with Bath.

His last lengthy injury was a collarbone issue suffered in a Wales training camp. Probably a bit of a mixed bag. It's hard once you start getting injuries to get out of the cycle as often one leads to another, Falatau managed to break the same arm some four or five months apart. Something Billy Vunipola managed as well.

I think Carlos is right. With the financial squeeze clubs are going to look for more value for money and less marquee names. Johnny May certainly found that when he went to discuss his new contract as did Ben Youngs.

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Post by king_carlos on Fri 26 Jun 2020, 12:09 pm

James Hanson, Lewis Ludlow and Alex Craig re-sign with Gloucester. Hanson is significant for them given that Franco Marais has left.

Marais and Mostert are big loses for Gloucester. Tom Marshall is also a good player they are losing but they have good depth in the back three.

Jonny May has also extended terms with them. Presumably that's part of a longer term deal to secure his financial position, hence mitigate any frustrations with possible pay-cuts.

Byran Byre also extends with Bristol after being on loan from Leinster. Makes sense for Bristol as their only confirmed hookers were Harry Thacker and Will Capon. Both are massively talented but depth was clearly needed.

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Post by Bathite on Fri 26 Jun 2020, 12:25 pm

Didn't realise Glos had lost that many! What's the official in/out status?

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Post by king_carlos on Fri 26 Jun 2020, 1:04 pm

Out:

Callum Braley
Aaron Hinckley
Franco Marais
Tom Marshall
Owen Williams
Ruan Dreyer
Franco Mostert

In:

Jordy Reid
Singlteon (one season loan)
Jonny May
(Louis Rees-Zammit technically as well as he's signed his first senior contract)

There were rumours that Jason Woodward was considering other offers due to pay-cuts as well but no idea if there any truth in the those rumours.

Also rumours that Ruan Ackermann might follow his dad to Japan and Gerbrandt Grobler is on Jake White's radar for returning to South Africa. Nothing more than rumours currently on both those fronts as well.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Fri 26 Jun 2020, 1:26 pm

Where is Mostert going?

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Fri 26 Jun 2020, 1:34 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Where is Mostert going?

Japan.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Fri 26 Jun 2020, 7:16 pm

Brock James will join Ospreys as attack coach.

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Post by king_carlos on Sat 27 Jun 2020, 10:31 am

Matas Jurevicius signs for Quins from London Scottish. Played lock in the Championship this season but Gustard mentions he could be a good fit at blindside. He was getting good reviews in the Championship and keeping big Georgian Nodar Tcheisvili out the side this season so seems to have a bit about him.

Quins have a lot of talent in the back row so losing the likes of Robshaw, Kunatani and Bothma will allow them to invest elsewhere I guess.

I quite like Gustard's recruitment for next season but I can't help feeling that Quins are needing a few players with patchy injury records to string games together. There's a lot of talent in the squad but guys like Clifford and Scott Baldwin getting fit is important for them.

The Quins backline will be exciting though with Marchant returning from the Blues, Earle hopefully coming back from injury and Ashton settling there.

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Post by king_carlos on Sat 27 Jun 2020, 1:47 pm

Sounds like Brad Barritt will hang his boots up at the end of this season. Accumulation of injuries taking their toll it seems. He's been an absolute rock for Sarries since 2008 and a very good captain for them whilst winning everything going.

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Post by Mr Bounce on Sat 27 Jun 2020, 2:11 pm

king_carlos wrote:Sounds like Brad Barritt will hang his boots up at the end of this season. Accumulation of injuries taking their toll it seems. He's been an absolute rock for Sarries since 2008 and a very good captain for them whilst winning everything going.

Always remember Barritt having has face absolutely mashed in a game against Australia. We won, and he'd been an absolute defensive rock all game, generally stopping everything head first. Hard as nails. I feel Sarries will miss him.


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Post by formerly known as Sam on Sat 27 Jun 2020, 2:37 pm

Barritt retiring will be a blow from the interview I think it was Sanderson gave he didn't want to play his final season in the Championship. Sounds like he felt he had one year left in the tank but wanted to finish on a high. I wonder if some SA franchises might give him a call if he's heading back down there, a leader of that calibre might be useful to one or two of them. If he fancies coaching their could be an option to do some mentoring though he has business interests outside of the game.

On Quins and Gustard it seems like he's trying to give them more of an edge. Quins have spent money and quite a lot of it on flair players and players from that golden patch. One thing Quins haven't really spent money on or spent money well enough on is the tight five or on backs that give a solid rock to work around. They won the title with Jordan Turner-Hall at 12 who was a defensive rock for them and never really brought in someone else who quite did the unglamorous stuff he did. Might take a bit longer for Gustard to complete his overhaul but by the time he's got the squad how he likes it Quins will be a lot meaner in defence and up front.

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Sun 28 Jun 2020, 9:09 am

George Skivington appointed head coach by Glaws having spent the last couple of years as LI forwards coach. LI immediately kick off because Glaws have made no contact with them and Skivington is under contract for another year.

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Post by chris_501 on Sun 28 Jun 2020, 6:24 pm

king_carlos wrote:With Johnny Williams and Tompkins both in Pivac's plans Owen probably decided to take a big contract and chance to travel. Fair play to him.

The move to Gloucester never really panned out but he got a huge payday by going there.

I can understand why some players don't view chasing international honours as the holy grail that it used to be. Playing that much rugby and the ensuing injury rates frankly doesn't seem like the honour it's often spoken of!

Interesting that he's a third Gloucester player following Johann Ackermann to his new club.


I always thought Ackerman resented having Williams there, he was signed by an earlier regime on such a load of cash for a bench player that he must have taken up a big chunk of the salary cap that could have been used elsewhere by JA. He also never really appeared, although I understand he was carrying a long term injury.

With regards to not blaming him for taking the contract in Japan for money, short career etc. It seems he already did that in the move from Tigers to Glos. The trade off is he writes off the ability to be involved in one of those Friday night 6N matches in front of a packed out crowd that make the hairs on your neck stand up. He may look upon the fact he with be financially sound, but also that he never really gave being a top class international and all the experiences that go with it, a real chance.

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Sun 28 Jun 2020, 8:37 pm

Not only have three followed him from Glaws there's two former Lions already in the Red Hurricanes squad in prop Van Rooyen and Erasmus.

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Post by BigGee on Sun 28 Jun 2020, 9:39 pm

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/report-french-media-claim-courtney-lawes-in-advanced-talks-with-prod2-big-spenders/

CL the latest player to be linked to big spending Beziers for next season!

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Sun 28 Jun 2020, 10:25 pm

There's been a lot of names thrown around in regards to joining them post takeover. Sounds like there was competing bids and there's been a lot of flexing of financial muscles with high profile players wanted. Existing contracts don't seem to matter.

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Post by king_carlos on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 12:30 am

It'd be a big blow for England to lose both Lawes and Kruis in quick succession.

Wasn't Biggar linked to Beziers recently as well?

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Post by BigGee on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 6:58 am

It will be a big temptation for any 30 something rugby international if they really do have that amount of money put in front of them. It would be hard to judge any of them for taking it.

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 8:27 am

Got to be an attractive option at the minute. Either stay in the Prem with an English winter coming and a pay cut or go to the lovely city of Beziers on France's south coast for a big pay day in what should be an easier league. Get the club promoted and you'll be a local hero as well.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 10:09 am

Barrett would need to be granted a sabbatical. Nonu is probably too old now. Biggar and Lawes leaving Saints would be quite a blow.

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Post by BigGee on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 10:20 am

Barrett just announced this will be his last season at Sarries, he has extended to the end of this season to see out the league and the Champs Cup.

He did not mention retirement in his tweet!

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 10:29 am

Barrett was the one offered as far as I know, not Barritt.

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Post by king_carlos on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 10:30 am

By my understanding the NZRU eventually broke their previously strict wage structure when re-signing Ardie Savea and Beaudan Barrett so I'd guess the later will be on a lot at the Blues. Obviously not matching the sort of money Beziers are throwing about though.

They'd been really strict with having a sort of top tier wage that they didn't break with NZRU contracts, hence guys like Carter getting sabbaticals to top up their pension pot. It sounded like Savea was almost signed on to move away prior to them breaking that structure though so given how important he is to their side it seemed an inevitable decision.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 11:11 am

Biggar remains unaffected anyway, he can still play for Wales. If he's on the rumoured 600K at Saints and Beziers are offering more, then he must be laughing right now.

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 11:27 am

mikey_dragon wrote:Biggar remains unaffected anyway, he can still play for Wales. If he's on the rumoured 600K at Saints and Beziers are offering more, then he must be laughing right now.

Beziers are a second division side. That would effect his selection.

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Post by king_carlos on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 12:05 pm

Biggar and Lawes are presumably Saints two marquee players so the change in cap won't effect them. If Saints wanted a big transfer fee and either wanted the huge salary it could work out for both parties.

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Post by Hazel Sapling on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 12:29 pm

Can't imagine Lawes will be interested with Kruis likely out the reckoning for England honours. Makes it more likely he will keep picking up England caps (and payments secondarily, of course) for a year. He is also in amongst it for Lions honours.

Biggar is an interesting one. Ultimately, he will probably want to see out his high value contract and get one last big contract in time for his age 32 season (31 this October). He probably has Lions hopes as well.

Beziers are probably not going to get the early 30's crowd of established internationals until they are in Top 14. If they sign some good club players (thinking the Ewers, Rokoduguni, G Graham, F Burns's of the world) to get them up, the following season would be the right time to attract a Biggar name Yahoo

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Post by king_carlos on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 12:41 pm

I do wonder if the the match fee for England appearances will come down significantly in the aftermath of coronavirus. I think wages across rugby will come down having seen huge inflation across the last 5 years. £25k per appearance is a huge fee when the RFU will be posting loses and presumably making redundancies due to this.

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Post by GeordieFalcon on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 1:26 pm

Lawes has a young family of 3 children aswell hasnt he. Might not want to unsettle them.

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Post by BigGee on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 1:40 pm

Might also want to provide for their future!

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Post by Bathite on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 1:43 pm

king_carlos wrote:I do wonder if the the match fee for England appearances will come down significantly in the aftermath of coronavirus. I think wages across rugby will come down having seen huge inflation across the last 5 years. £25k per appearance is a huge fee when the RFU will be posting loses and presumably making redundancies due to this.

Pretty sure i've read somewhere that the RFU has already confirmed that these will be coming down. Would be crazy not to and I don't think that players would be too surprised.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Mon 29 Jun 2020, 9:43 pm

Hurricanes and Carlos Spencer part ways due to financial uncertainty created by COVID. Anyone know if he’s mates with Glenn Delaney? Silly Season Transfer Rumours 19/20 - Page 6 3754190863

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Post by WELL-PAST-IT on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 8:36 am

Jamie Gibson to leave Saints today, they kept that one quiet.

Also RugbyPass is reporting the Manu, Genge, Ford, Batemen and Eastmond amongst others are refusing to sign new lower rate contracts having missed the "deadline" day of 28th of June. Tigers have extended it until 2nd July and if the continue to refuse the revised contract they will be stood down from training, whatever that means. I assume they will see out their contracts without playing?

I am not sure if they will worry much about Bateman and Eastmond, but losing the other three would be a massive blow.

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Post by Cumbrian on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 8:57 am

Gabriel Ibitoye being widely reports as off to France. Bit of a conflicting one this. I'm not sure he is particularly near to England selection at the moment (unless there is a lot of injuries), so a year or two experiencing another league might help him develop his game. If he makes waves over there, he could then come back in time for World Cup contention. It is a risk for him though, rugby in France just seems to churn players out and he could easily become a forgotten man.

I don't like the precedent it sets though, older men picking up a pension is one thing, losing 21-22 year olds is another entirely.


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Post by formerly known as Sam on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 9:01 am

We only have three senior looseheads so losing Bateman would be a blow. Eastmond leaving might actually help as we have too many senior centres.

I don't think the England internationals will leave. No other English team has the cap to sign them and if they move abroad they miss out on international selection.

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Post by GeordieFalcon on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 10:20 am

i would take Ibitoye up here in a heartbeat....but sadly...we have no money.

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Post by Sgt_Pooly on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 10:27 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:i would take Ibitoye up here in a heartbeat....but sadly...we have no money.

Could offer him a stottie and night out in the big market?

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Post by king_carlos on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 11:08 am

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:Jamie Gibson to leave Saints today, they kept that one quiet.

Also RugbyPass is reporting the Manu, Genge, Ford, Batemen and Eastmond amongst others are refusing to sign new lower rate contracts having missed the "deadline" day of 28th of June. Tigers have extended it until 2nd July and if the continue to refuse the revised contract they will be stood down from training, whatever that means. I assume they will see out their contracts without playing?

I am not sure if they will worry much about Bateman and Eastmond, but losing the other three would be a massive blow.

By my understanding the deadline being reported is 5pm today so we may know sooner rather than later. Borthwick officially starts tomorrow so I'd guess that's why the players have been given a deadline of today, so the new coach knows where he stands going forward. Gist of it is that a large number (reported to be around 12) of higher paid players don't want to take pay cuts longer term.

Genge, Cole, Lavanini, Taufua, Liebenberg, Brink, Ford, Tuilagi, Veainu

Those guys will all have plenty of offers to play abroad but for the England stars that's a bigger decision. I do think the England match fee will come down significantly though, as discussed earlier in the thread.

If it's right that the deadline is today then we will find out soon. I'd guess around 3 big names will move elsewhere to facilitate better offers for the others. Given that the rest of this postponed seasons games are effectively dead rubbers for Tigers at least Borthwick will have a good few months to work with the players he's got before next season.

Tigers have had 4 out of 7 of England's starting backs for the last 3 years but as we've seen that's pretty futile if we have the attacking structure and lineout of an under 11s touch team.

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Post by GeordieFalcon on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 11:40 am

Sgt_Pooly wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:i would take Ibitoye up here in a heartbeat....but sadly...we have no money.

Could offer him a stottie and night out in the big market?

Not a bad idea...

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Post by Welly on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 5:18 pm

Daily Mail saying Genge and Ford have signed new deals.

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 5:27 pm

Welly wrote: Daily Mail saying Genge and Ford have signed new deals.

Weren't likely to leave given their international status and wages demands. Ben Youngs I can imagine might be more annoyed have just taken a significant pay cut and may not want another, ditto Tom particularly as this is supposed to be his last season.

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Post by Welly on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 5:32 pm

Add lavanini too the list of reported stayers.

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Post by king_carlos on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 6:31 pm

Genge, Ford and Lavanini are 3 of the 4 rumoured leavers I was most worried about. The 4th would be Taufua.

I wonder what's happening with Manu and Veainu then...

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 6:33 pm

A lot of agents will have been leaving until the last minute to try and force the best deal from the club. Leaking stories of looking elsewhere has always been par for the course. Tomorrow morning's announcements will be very interesting, shirt reveal as well.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 7:51 pm

Lawes and Biggar among others have signed to 2023 with Saints haven’t they?

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Post by mikey_dragon on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 9:03 pm

Perhaps the worst kept secret but Carre to Cardiff Blues is conformed, and he’s signed a ‘long-term deal’. If they could also lure back John from Sale then they’d finally have the pack that they’ve been missing for a while.

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Post by formerly known as Sam on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 9:43 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:Perhaps the worst kept secret but Carre to Cardiff Blues is conformed, and he’s signed a ‘long-term deal’. If they could also lure back John from Sale then they’d finally have the pack that they’ve been missing for a while.

Good result for them. Sale have managed to renegotiate all contracts with their first team squad apparently. Rumours are that they offered longer term deals in order offer job security in exchange for pay cuts.

Biggar and Lawes 2 of the 19 players agreeing new terms with Saints.

Tigers should be announcing something similar later this week.

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Post by mikey_dragon on Tue 30 Jun 2020, 10:21 pm

I guess Blues will just have to start Arhip ahead of Lewis. Dillon is too much of a liability, but would be very good off the bench if he can improve.

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Post by WELL-PAST-IT on Wed 01 Jul 2020, 8:45 am

Looks like the rumours about Biggar and Lawes moving to France are false, Saints have announced they have signed new contracts.

The bulk of Saints squad for the remainder of this season and next is:

Courtney Lawes, Lewis Ludlam, Teimana Harrison, Piers Francis and George Furbank, Dan Biggar, Rory Hutchinson these have agreed terms to stay at Franklin’s Gardens.

Alex Mitchell, Alex Moon and Fraser Dingwall have all also put pen to paper on contract extensions.
Alex Waller, Mikey Haywood, David Ribbans, James Grayson, Ehren Painter, James Fish, and Lewis Bean, Alex Coles and Samson Ma’asi, Henry Taylor, Karl Garside, Harry Mallinder, Tom Collins, Paul Hill, Ahsee Tuala, Api Ratuniyarawa, Connor Tupai, and Ollie Sleightholme, have also committed their future to the Club in 2020

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Post by Bathite on Wed 01 Jul 2020, 9:37 am

formerly known as Sam wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Perhaps the worst kept secret but Carre to Cardiff Blues is conformed, and he’s signed a ‘long-term deal’. If they could also lure back John from Sale then they’d finally have the pack that they’ve been missing for a while.

Good result for them. Sale have managed to renegotiate all contracts with their first team squad apparently. Rumours are that they offered longer term deals in order offer job security in exchange for pay cuts.

Biggar and Lawes 2 of the 19 players agreeing new terms with Saints.

Tigers should be announcing something similar later this week.

Not sure Sale would've had to offer much of a pay cut either, as they did the whole squad before the June deadline, they were allowed to use the loophole where only 75% of player's caps counts towards the cap. So, keeping the maths simple, a 25% reduction to cap can essentially be ignored and everyone kept on flat salary, which in today's climate is a banging deal. As the Tigers players can attest to!

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Post by king_carlos on Wed 01 Jul 2020, 10:23 am

Bathite wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Perhaps the worst kept secret but Carre to Cardiff Blues is conformed, and he’s signed a ‘long-term deal’. If they could also lure back John from Sale then they’d finally have the pack that they’ve been missing for a while.

Good result for them. Sale have managed to renegotiate all contracts with their first team squad apparently. Rumours are that they offered longer term deals in order offer job security in exchange for pay cuts.

Biggar and Lawes 2 of the 19 players agreeing new terms with Saints.

Tigers should be announcing something similar later this week.

Not sure Sale would've had to offer much of a pay cut either, as they did the whole squad before the June deadline, they were allowed to use the loophole where only 75% of player's caps counts towards the cap. So, keeping the maths simple, a 25% reduction to cap can essentially be ignored and everyone kept on flat salary, which in today's climate is a banging deal. As the Tigers players can attest to!

They were mostly signed to long term deals before the negotiated reductions anyway. Diamond's squad management and recruitment on what was a low budget until last season has been really good. A small squad, lots of quality, not much excess and mostly committed long term.

I genuinely think Sale might challenge for a playoff final place in the next few years. They aren't quite there yet in terms of challenging Exeter but if they can keep that core of Saffas, Curry brothers, James brothers and Ross Harrison together plus build around it (Sam Hill is a cracking signing for instance) then they could get there.

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