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Scotland v France 6 nations Championship Saturday 26th February 2022

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Scotland v France 6 nations Championship Saturday 26th February 2022 - Page 4 Empty Scotland v France 6 nations Championship Saturday 26th February 2022

Post by BigGee Mon 21 Feb 2022, 11:06 am

First topic message reminder :

Scotland v France
6 Nations Championship

Saturday 26th February 2022
BT Murrayfield Stadium
Edinburgh

KO 14.15


Well the Auld Alliance trophy is up for stake between Scotland and France.

France who are probably everybodies favourites for the championship now +/- a Grand Slam to boot but they have found Scotland a hard nut to crack over the past few years and it has likely cost them 2 championshipos. They won't be taking us lightly this time, nor will they probably throw the game a way with a silly punch or crazy run from their own line with the clock dead.

They will be tough to beat though, all the more so as they will be taking this game very seriously.

As for Scotland, well how different this game might have been had we played well and beaten Wales. The optimism around Scotland following the first game against England has evaporated. Add to that we have now got an injury list that will test our now improved depth. However we look at it though, Ritchie, JG, Sutherland and Cummings will be missed.

Still Scotland are back were they are happiest, underdogs with no-one giving them much of a chance. We will surely play better than we did against wales, we will need to!

I am thinking about a side something like this:

1. Schoeman
2. McInally
3. Fagerson Z
4. Gilchrist
5. Skinner
6. Bradbury
7. Watson
8. Fagerson M (if fit) - Baylis if not
9. Price
10. Russell
11. DVDM
12. Redpath
13. Harris
14. Graham
15. Hogg

Bench

Keeble
Turner
Nel
Hodgson
Darge
White
Kinghorn
Tuipolotu

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Post by Unclear Sat 26 Feb 2022, 4:14 pm

Good win for France, but is it too harsh to say that the size of the defeat was down to Scottish errors? For a period in the first half Scotland showed that the French defence could be rattled and things were close. A few Scottish errors or imprecision, a bit of luck and the game was gone, along with the Scottish composure. Things just got worse from there.

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Post by tigertattie Sat 26 Feb 2022, 4:15 pm

jimbopip wrote:My local club were in a cup semi final today. Bidson was playing. I decided to stay at home.
Bigson messaged to say "Guess who's playing in the final?"
Guess I watched the wrong game.

Better skill set would have been on show at bigson’s game

Scotland were knickers. Russell was knickers. Price was knickers

Darge was immense, Darcy putting his all in again.

Other than that. Terrible
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Post by BigGee Sat 26 Feb 2022, 4:20 pm

tigertattie wrote:
jimbopip wrote:My local club were in a cup semi final today. Bidson was playing. I decided to stay at home.
Bigson messaged to say "Guess who's playing in the final?"
Guess I watched the wrong game.

Better skill set would have been on show at bigson’s game

Scotland were knickers. Russell was knickers. Price was knickers

Darge was immense, Darcy putting his all in again.

Other than that. Terrible

There were actually a few other decent performances Tattie

The scrum stood up well and a lot of good performances up front. Bennett showed up when he came on and White has impressed in every game so far. DVDM looked hungry for the ball.

It was our so called game changers who let us down.

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Post by Heaf Sat 26 Feb 2022, 4:27 pm

Unclear wrote:Good win for France, but is it too harsh to say that the size of the defeat was down to Scottish errors?  For a period in the first half Scotland showed that the French defence could be rattled and things were close.  A few Scottish errors or imprecision, a bit of luck and the game was gone, along with the Scottish composure.  Things just got worse from there.

The bungled try at the end of the first half was a huge turning point as if Scotland scored there it's unlikely France would have scored their try at the end of the half. France also got lucky with the bounce if the ball for their try near the start of the 2nd half - and for me maybe they should have been pinged at the ruck prior to that. Ref was also poor at the breakdown allowing France to turn over the ball despite hands on the ground or being off feet. Don't get me wrong France were excellent on the counter attack, but I think if Scotland had taken their chances and had a bit more luck the scoreline would have been quite different ....

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Post by Maine man Sat 26 Feb 2022, 4:35 pm

Quick question for Scottish fans, slightly off topic, how come Hastings isn't in the squad? Is it just down to Kinghorn being more versatile?

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Post by bsando Sat 26 Feb 2022, 4:41 pm

BigGee wrote:
tigertattie wrote:
jimbopip wrote:My local club were in a cup semi final today. Bidson was playing. I decided to stay at home.
Bigson messaged to say "Guess who's playing in the final?"
Guess I watched the wrong game.

Better skill set would have been on show at bigson’s game

Scotland were knickers. Russell was knickers. Price was knickers

Darge was immense, Darcy putting his all in again.

Other than that. Terrible

There were actually a few other decent performances Tattie

The scrum stood up well and a lot of good performances up front. Bennett showed up when he came on and White has impressed in every game so far. DVDM looked hungry for the ball.

It was our so called game changers who let us down.

I agree, Price has had a poor 6N so far despite some flutterings of good play. Russell is playing below par at times but also seemed to forget he has a Scottish pack not his Racing 92 pack to carry the ball up. Some of his passes to forwards are just inviting turnover ball at times. It's sad to see this group fold in after building up what was called the best defence in the 6N last year. I'll have to look at the stats but I'd argue we've conceded a lot more points so far than previous seasons. You could see that pain on Hogg's face today in the post match interview. Those two easy scores by France (world class scores) will remind him of the bad days where Scotland often conceded early points most games.

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Post by bsando Sat 26 Feb 2022, 4:41 pm

Maine man wrote:Quick question for Scottish fans, slightly off topic, how come Hastings isn't in the squad? Is it just down to Kinghorn being more versatile?

Don't even go there... haha

My big gripe with the squad this year is the selections. Kinghorn is a talented player but he isn't an international fly half and he is far too inconsistent. Either play him every game so he can build up match confidence or ditch him completely for the big games where accuracy is crucial. Huw Jones is a deadly attacking player, yet not included. Hastings is an excellent fly half, left out. Why can't we develop him into Scotland's first choice fly half? Sean Maitland is a reliable and clever tactical player, left out.

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Post by BigGee Sat 26 Feb 2022, 4:47 pm

The big rationale for playing Kinghorn is the 6/2 bench split as he is the versatile player who allows that to happen.

We have not picked a 6/2 bench in any game yet, so it makes a nonsense of the decision to pick him on the bench to cover FH.

It is probably true that we have played a lot of our better rugby over the past few years with Hastings in the 10 shirt. He is certainly not the complete player, but he is arguably more consistent than Russell and certainly far more experienced than Kinghorn!

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Post by NeilyBroon Sat 26 Feb 2022, 5:08 pm

Well I was right in that it'd either be a Scottish win or a pasting. Just turned out to be the more likely scenario!

Well done France, I hope they go on to win the slam.

From our perspective the wheels have somewhat fallen off haven't they? I'd like to see Hastings brought in, especially of he's played well for Gloucester this weekend. It's madness not having him in the squad in the first place. A focus on basics, offloading etc is needed. We just seem to have lost patience and composure. I feel I'm the only one who thinks vdm hasn't been that great. Darge was sensational, I'd argue he deserves to keep the 7 shirt but expect he'll go to 6 against Italy. Bennett looked good too, I'd argue he should start against Italy. Disappointed but not unexpected tbh! Was still better than the Wales game!

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Post by jimbopip Sat 26 Feb 2022, 6:04 pm

Here's a stupid question...
If Jones, Bennett, Seaman or Tuipoluto had been at 13 would we have scored just before half time?

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Post by NeilyBroon Sat 26 Feb 2022, 6:14 pm

I think we would have made less errors with seaman or Maitland on the wing in place of duhan. Not sure if we'd have scored, it wasn't a great pass to Hogg but it's one he could have caught I think! Again I don't think Harris played badly but I think Bennett made significantly more impact.

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Post by bsando Sat 26 Feb 2022, 6:32 pm

The way Scotland were playing didn't require Harris. From Hogg's post interview however it seemed like their game plan went to crap because France were scoring too easily. Seems like a problem for Scotland because their defence is so crucial to the way they play. Just like the SA in the autumn, the minute they go behind they lose their minds and start chasing the game, ultimately playing into the oppositions hands.

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 26 Feb 2022, 7:07 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:Well I was right in that it'd either be a Scottish win or a pasting. Just turned out to be the more likely scenario!

Well done France, I hope they go on to win the slam.
Can't see who will stop them unless someone can inject some Senokot in their pre-game meals...

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sat 26 Feb 2022, 9:30 pm

https://twitter.com/tenglishsport/status/1497659608311214080?s=21

Not a good look for Finn. Something is off in the team at the moment, despite what the players are saying in the media before games they’re really failing to show up on the pitch.

Great to see Bennett back and one of our better players when he came on, hope he keeps the jersey for the next game. Fantastic showing from Darge too. France are quality, hope they get the slam!

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Post by majesticimperialman Sat 26 Feb 2022, 9:55 pm

Do Scotland rely to much on Fin Russell?

A bitt   like England rely a bit to much on Farrell?

I know Farrell as been inured for a while, but i have no doubt if he gets a chance to play in the nations nations before the  nations is over he will play.

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Post by RDW Sat 26 Feb 2022, 9:59 pm

TheMildlyFranticLlama wrote:https://twitter.com/tenglishsport/status/1497659608311214080?s=21

Not a good look for Finn. Something is off in the team at the moment, despite what the players are saying in the media before games they’re really failing to show up on the pitch.

Great to see Bennett back and one of our better players when he came on, hope he keeps the jersey for the next game. Fantastic showing from Darge too. France are quality, hope they get the slam!

That awful! I'm 17 minutes in and Finn has been dreadful.

Not a good result to wake up to - sounds like majestic France combined with us not being good.

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Post by RDW Sat 26 Feb 2022, 10:32 pm

Juts watched the first half - we were well in the game and France were looking rattled. Their tries were frighteningly good but they certainly weren't dominating the game. Finn has been all over the place but generally we weren't doing too badly.

Then right at the end of the half was the massive swing with the Hogg drop them French try. It's a bit harsh that Hogg gas been getting the stick because the pass wasn't great and he was reaching for it. He definitely could have caught it but it wasn't a major blunder. Harris chose the wrong option and should have given to Price to then have a 2 on 1.

I'm guessing the 2nd half gets a lot worse...

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Post by TheMildlyFranticLlama Sat 26 Feb 2022, 10:39 pm

RDW wrote:I'm guessing the 2nd half gets a lot worse...

Brace yourself!

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Post by Exiledinborders Sat 26 Feb 2022, 11:17 pm

RDW wrote:Juts watched the first half - we were well in the game and France were looking rattled. Their tries were frighteningly good but they certainly weren't dominating the game. Finn has been all over the place but generally we weren't doing too badly.

Then right at the end of the half was the massive swing with the Hogg drop them French try. It's a bit harsh that Hogg gas been getting the stick because the pass wasn't great and he was reaching for it. He definitely could have caught it but it wasn't a major blunder. Harris chose the wrong option and should have given to Price to then have a 2 on 1.

I'm guessing the 2nd half gets a lot worse...
You are being very generous to Scotland and yes if gets worse.

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Post by Exiledinborders Sat 26 Feb 2022, 11:23 pm

NeilyBroon wrote:I think we would have made less errors with seaman or Maitland on the wing in place of duhan. Not sure if we'd have scored, it wasn't a great pass to Hogg but it's one he could have caught I think! Again I don't think Harris played badly but I think Bennett made significantly more impact.
Harris is way overrated. I am a Gloucester fan and he is our third best centre. Glaws fans are glad it’s him who gets picked internationally and not Atkinson.

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 26 Feb 2022, 11:31 pm

Exiledinborders wrote:
RDW wrote:Juts watched the first half - we were well in the game and France were looking rattled. Their tries were frighteningly good but they certainly weren't dominating the game. Finn has been all over the place but generally we weren't doing too badly.

Then right at the end of the half was the massive swing with the Hogg drop them French try. It's a bit harsh that Hogg gas been getting the stick because the pass wasn't great and he was reaching for it. He definitely could have caught it but it wasn't a major blunder. Harris chose the wrong option and should have given to Price to then have a 2 on 1.

I'm guessing the 2nd half gets a lot worse...
You are being very generous to Scotland and yes if gets worse.
Well, yeah. That try that wasn't then the French try at the end of the first half completely changed the complexion of the game. Up to that point it was anyone's game and, at least to me, France looked just vulnerable enough.

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Post by RDW Sat 26 Feb 2022, 11:38 pm

In terms of first half I don't think I'm being that generous. Given how rampant France can be, for us to be 13-10 down on 39th minute having blown 2 good try scoring opportunities wasn't that bad. The French body language wasn't great, then they got that try and it all changed.

The 2nd half was truly dreadful though - we were so sloppy, error strewn and discipline was terrible. I'd hate to see our turnover stats, as there were many.

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 26 Feb 2022, 11:46 pm

Giving up that try to start the second half was the kiss of death.

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Post by Highland Shaun Sun 27 Feb 2022, 12:26 am

Well the lads owe us TWO good games now because Wales game was nothing short of abysmal and this wasn't any better!

I like the man but has Gregor took us as far as he can, its likely he'll get replaced after the world cup anyway but its a question worth asking (and note I say I like him so AM still backing him)?

Also, what changes for Italy game, would you make wholesale changes or keep them to a minimal in acceptance of France being just too good?

Oh and I see that Aussie clown is blasting us on Irish TV again, rich coming from our worse EVER coach!

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Post by Sharkey06 Sun 27 Feb 2022, 12:32 am

As an English fan - apologies for inflicting Karl Dickson on you.  Comfortably the worst English professional referee.  I have no idea how he managed to get a professional contract at club level, never mind being elevated to International level.  I was never a great fan of Wayne Barnes, but after seeing some of Dickson's performances I have changed my tune.

I thought his awarding of the penalty to France for taking the catcher out early in the lineout, whilst also warning the French to stop holding the jumper in the air was masterful.

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Post by Heaf Sun 27 Feb 2022, 12:39 am

Notable mentions also for allowing France to loll around on the wrong side of rucks, put hands on ground and go off feet but still win pens for holding on ...

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Post by Sharkey06 Sun 27 Feb 2022, 12:45 am

I also enjoyed his conversation with Stuart Hogg – Look I know I missed Sam Skinner nearly getting his head taken of by the French fullback, but please give the TMO time to bail me out before you shout at me.

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Post by RDW Sun 27 Feb 2022, 12:51 am

Heaf wrote:Notable mentions also for allowing France to loll around on the wrong side of rucks, put hands on ground and go off feet but still win pens for holding on ...

The one where Price was turned over despite the French player clearly getting in his way at the ruck was particularly impressive, leading to a try.

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Post by Heaf Sun 27 Feb 2022, 12:59 am

Yep - I had a long debate about that one with 7.5 - I thought it was bang on a pen with any other ref but 7.5 saw it differently. After the Hogg drop I think that was the point that sealed Scotland's fate.

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Post by Sharkey06 Sun 27 Feb 2022, 12:59 am

RDW wrote:
Heaf wrote:Notable mentions also for allowing France to loll around on the wrong side of rucks, put hands on ground and go off feet but still win pens for holding on ...

The one where Price was turned over despite the French player clearly getting in his way at the ruck was particularly impressive, leading to a try.

As a former scrumhalf you would have thought Dickson would have a bit more sympathy and/or understanding. I am sure if he had been in Price's shoes he would have been pretty upset with that decision. It didn't affect the result though, just the size of the loss. The Harris pass at the end of the first half was the real game changer.

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 27 Feb 2022, 1:02 am

Highland Shaun wrote:Well the lads owe us TWO good games now because Wales game was nothing short of abysmal and this wasn't any better!

I like the man but has Gregor took us as far as he can, its likely he'll get replaced after the world cup anyway but its a question worth asking (and note I say I like him so AM still backing him)?

Also, what changes for Italy game, would you make wholesale changes or keep them to a minimal in acceptance of France being just too good?

Oh and I see that Aussie clown is blasting us on Irish TV again, rich coming from our worse EVER coach!
Are you referring to he who shall not be named? What is it about Irish tv networks that give a forum to brain-dead, near bigots like him?

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Post by Heaf Sun 27 Feb 2022, 1:08 am

Sharkey06 wrote:
RDW wrote:
Heaf wrote:Notable mentions also for allowing France to loll around on the wrong side of rucks, put hands on ground and go off feet but still win pens for holding on ...

The one where Price was turned over despite the French player clearly getting in his way at the ruck was particularly impressive, leading to a try.

As a former scrumhalf you would have thought Dickson would have a bit more sympathy and/or understanding.  I am sure if he had been in Price's shoes he would have been pretty upset with that decision.  It didn't affect the result though, just the size of the loss.  The Harris pass at the end of the first half was the real game changer.

I'm not so sure - the Harris/Hogg one was a massive moment yes -  but if France are pinged there instead Scotland maybe kick to the corner and score rather than the other way so another 14 point turnaround maybe.  Scotland had reeled France in once before after the two early tries so may have pulled it back.  All ifs and buts I know but these games often turn on small margins.  

Like you I don't understand how Dickson was there in the first place - surely there must be better options?

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 27 Feb 2022, 1:20 am

Heaf wrote:
Sharkey06 wrote:
RDW wrote:
Heaf wrote:Notable mentions also for allowing France to loll around on the wrong side of rucks, put hands on ground and go off feet but still win pens for holding on ...

The one where Price was turned over despite the French player clearly getting in his way at the ruck was particularly impressive, leading to a try.

As a former scrumhalf you would have thought Dickson would have a bit more sympathy and/or understanding.  I am sure if he had been in Price's shoes he would have been pretty upset with that decision.  It didn't affect the result though, just the size of the loss.  The Harris pass at the end of the first half was the real game changer.

I'm not so sure - the Harris/Hogg one was a massive moment yes -  but if France are pinged there instead Scotland maybe kick to the corner and score rather than the other way so another 14 point turnaround maybe.  Scotland had reeled France in once before after the two early tries so may have pulled it back.  All ifs and buts I know but these games often turn on small margins.  

Like you I don't understand how Dickson was there in the first place - surely there must be better options?
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Post by bsando Sun 27 Feb 2022, 6:17 am

After the opening weekends win Scotland are now in the perilous position of being possible first scalps for Italy since 2015. With a win and LBP bagged Scotland should avoid wooden spoon territory but losing to Italy away would be a mega blow to Townsend. Considering the fragility of the Scottish gameplan presently there is a lot for Italy to feel confident about heading into that game.

Reviewing the first three games I’d argue dropping Johnson at 12 has been costly. He’s a very good defender who works well in tandem with Harris. He has been absent for both of our two heaviest recent defeats. I’ve noticed Tuipulotu in both his starts this 6N missing opportunities to move the ball on. His game so far seems limited for an international rugby player. I’m glad he’s been given a go however. Testing depth pre RWC is important.

Hastings has to be recalled. It’s a joke he was left out, even the casual fan thought it an odd decision. And as we’ve seen, Russell without genuine competition is a dangerous game for Townsend to play. Had Hastings been involved from day one Scotland would have had two potential starters and it would have forced Russell to lift his game.

Reboot the game plan. Scotland are supposed to be hard to beat according to Townsend. They’re supposed to have an excellent defence with their attack built around a territory based game. So far we’ve conceded 73 points. After Italy likely lose to Ireland tomorrow that’ll leave us 5th on the table for points conceded. Consistent performances have escaped Scotland so far but injuries have been a factor in this. It’s not too late to salvage some pride.




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Post by Heuer27 Sun 27 Feb 2022, 7:08 am

I’ve heard some very gentle whispers that Hastings has fallen foul of GT. This might explain his omission from the squad. Toony has previous for dropping players he feels are getting too big for their boots. Just ask Hogg and Russell.
Like I said ,very gentle whispers and it might just be scuttlebutt.
On yesterday’s game, costly mistakes either side of half time killed the game.
I was looking forward to Dickson reffing as he allows play to run generally but he and his team made some big, game changing errors, which is disappointing.
Russell and Price need to warm a bench ,White needs a start and how do you solve the growing problem of where to fit Darge into the starting 15. Mish and mini Mish could be devastating but equally likely to get blown away by bigger packs.
VDM and Graham are a real handful with the ball but atm our midfield can’t get it there nearly enough. I think something has to change. It would have been Redpath but it needs to be someone.Jones, Hutchinson, Bennett ?

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Post by Collapse2005 Sun 27 Feb 2022, 8:28 am

doctor_grey wrote:
Highland Shaun wrote:Well the lads owe us TWO good games now because Wales game was nothing short of abysmal and this wasn't any better!

I like the man but has Gregor took us as far as he can, its likely he'll get replaced after the world cup anyway but its a question worth asking (and note I say I like him so AM still backing him)?

Also, what changes for Italy game, would you make wholesale changes or keep them to a minimal in acceptance of France being just too good?

Oh and I see that Aussie clown is blasting us on Irish TV again, rich coming from our worse EVER coach!
Are you referring to he who shall not be named?  What is it about Irish tv networks that give a forum to brain-dead, near bigots like him?

Like it or not Williams' criticisms of Scotland are fair enough even if he was a bad coach. For all his talent Finn Russell is way too casual at times during big games. He has had a bad campaign, there is nothing bigoted about saying this. Scotland have made poor decisions in their two losses, Hogg as captain needs to take some criticism for that. Id rather listen to pundits who say what they think than pundits like Warburton who are there to please everyone.

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Post by BigGee Sun 27 Feb 2022, 9:19 am

Williams is not an objective critic though, he has an axe to grind and boy does he grind it.

We have been poor in our last couple of games no doubt but we don't need to be hesring it fro. A washed up failed international coach, our worst on record.

It would be easier to take if he had any credibility, we don't hear a lot from him, funnily enough when Scotland do play well!

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Post by jimbopip Sun 27 Feb 2022, 9:33 am

Glass half empty/half full time.
It was a cracking game.
If Hogg scores and we go into half time ahead chin
Rory Darge was colossal, he has a bright future ahead of him.
Our scrum achieved parity at least. Which was surprising given the weight of the France pack.
Martin Johnson was level headed and sensible in his comments post match, to paraphrase; Scotland got stuck in, were on top, Harris made a bad decision and executed it poorly, then France got a really fortuitous bounce of the ball at the start of the second half. probably a 21 points swing in a couple of minutes. Midway through the second half an English former team mate of mine messaged me to say "The scoreline is in no way a reflection of the game I'm watching!"
Mark Bennett showed that he can still play at the highest level.

On the down side.vomit
The ref was appalling. He should be walking from Jedburgh to John O Groats, knocking on every door and apologising for his ineptitude.
Dancer looked jaded, again.
Aldi Price looks like a man who is 96% fit; nearly there but not quite. Needs a rest.
Chris Harris! He could have gone for the line. He could have run straight at the defender and offloaded to either of the fat boys on his left shoulder. He could have popped the simple ball to the man nearest him. He threw the pass way too early, the defender wasn't drawn to him and Hogg wasn't ready for it. The commentators seemed slightly puzzled when Harris didn't reappear after half time as he didn't seem injured: I think he was ashamed to show his face.
Did I mention the referee?

It's not all doom and gloom...but there are one or two areas we need to "tweak". Probably rest Aldi Price. Although we can't start Blarehorn at 10. If Toonie is really trying to put Haircut in his place then calling him in now to arrive like the 7th Cavalry would actually be counterproductive; better with Ross Thomson or even Meatball.
we also need a centre pairing that will threaten the opposition's defence.
It's great fun being a Scotland fan, isn't it?

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Post by Collapse2005 Sun 27 Feb 2022, 10:11 am

BigGee wrote:Williams is not an objective critic though, he has an axe to grind and boy does he grind it.

We have been poor in our last couple of games no doubt but we don't need to be hesring it fro. A washed up failed international coach, our worst on record.

It would be easier to take if he had any credibility, we don't hear a lot from him, funnily enough when Scotland do play well!

Maybe he does have a axe to grind and Id agree with you if he actually said something that was unreasonable but to be honest he hasnt really. Yep he was a weak enough coach but Scottish rugby was also a mess across the board back then. He is a pundit now and his job is to critically analyse games he sees.

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Post by NeilyBroon Sun 27 Feb 2022, 10:36 am

Heuer27 wrote:I’ve heard some very gentle whispers that Hastings has fallen foul of GT. This might explain his omission from the squad. Toony has previous for dropping players he feels are getting too big for their boots. Just ask Hogg and Russell.
Like I said ,very gentle whispers and it might just be scuttlebutt.
On yesterday’s game, costly mistakes either side of half time killed the game.
I was looking forward to Dickson reffing as he allows play to run generally but he and his team made some big, game changing errors, which is disappointing.
Russell and Price need to warm a bench ,White needs a start and how do you solve the growing problem of where to fit Darge into the starting 15. Mish and mini Mish could be devastating but equally likely to get blown away by bigger packs.
VDM and Graham are a real handful with the ball but atm our midfield can’t get it there nearly enough. I think something has to change. It would have been Redpath but it needs to be someone.Jones, Hutchinson, Bennett ?

Toonie has form for this and it wouldn't surprise me. Though Hastings doesn't strike me as too big for his boots, teeth and tan maybe...

If this is true though it's not on. We're not a nation who can afford to leave players in key positions out in the cold because of ego clashes. Toonies position should be up for review again, as once again we've gone backwards and ultimately the buck stops with him. We should be performing better at home by now, even against France or South Africa.

It's frustrating that the world cup is next year so a change in coach is really not feasible. I can see us getting a horsing all over again, which two world cups in a row is unacceptable for any coach. Still baffled as to why Vern was let go, 5 years on. The Wilson/Big Jim chat where they talked about it was interesting as even Wilson seemed to think it was a huge injustice. I do wonder if toonie has any respect from the players now. They talk about Tandy in interviews and playing for him, but never mention Toonie.

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Post by RDW Sun 27 Feb 2022, 11:01 am

I see we're in the 'bring back Vern' stage of the 7 stages of Scottish rugby post mortem Laugh

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Post by NeilyBroon Sun 27 Feb 2022, 11:36 am

RDW wrote:I see we're in the 'bring back Vern' stage of the 7 stages of Scottish rugby post mortem Laugh

Let's be honest it's the only solution! I hear Jake white is interested in coaching Scotland Laugh

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Post by NeilyBroon Sun 27 Feb 2022, 11:56 am

In all seriousness though, this once again looks like a coaching issue. Scotland seem to be having an identity crisis and have lost all their attacking edge. I think yes to a degree it's based on key player form but the cohesiveness of the unit is largely down to coaching.

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Post by George Carlin Sun 27 Feb 2022, 12:56 pm

No players should be undroppable. I would have no issue with Russell sitting the next one out. Hogg we need and he at least looks like he gives an excrement in each game.

Very, very worrying that we seemed to drink our own Kool Bru before this season started. The players have hopefully eaten a solid slice of humble pie and are looking at themselves. Darge, Bennett and our scrum were the only real highlights. Losing the Mish must have been very unsettling but that's why you have a coaching team.

I am also looking at Townsend very closely because someone needs to explain why we've been so wildly variable.
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Post by majesticimperialman Sun 27 Feb 2022, 1:25 pm

Was it Hogg or Townsend After they beat England tell every body that we have a special Groop of players?

How special are the Scottish players?

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Post by tigertattie Sun 27 Feb 2022, 1:50 pm

Hi. Long time listener. First time caller.

For anyone who gives a jot of my opinion, here it is (I know jimbo finds my forward analysis insightful, or did he say frightful?)

Now, I’m very much a devils advocate type when it comes to thoughts on rugger. I’m one of the first to say “calm down” when glove starts up the engine on the good train hype and often I’m one of the ones who say “ahhh come on lads we’re not that bad” when the Voldemort of rugby rocks up bearing his axe.

My thoughts on the current squad are that I really do think that some players have bought into their own hype. You have players like Darcy and Watson and now Darge, playing out of thier skins still. Then you have players like Russell and price who are strutting about with an air of “I’m a lion, I’m undroppable”

Now this is where I firmly believe our issues lie. Russell is almost undroppable as there’s no one with his talent that can replace him. However I’d far rather see a 100% committed meatball out there with half the talent of Russell than a 50% committed Russell.

Who do we bring in to replace folk being silly? GT won’t bring in Hastings now. And blairhorn doesn’t look assured at 10. Have him covering wing and 15.

We can’t throw the baby out with the bath water, some players may not have had great games yesterday but wholesale changes just isn’t an option for us. We are too heavily reliant on Russell playing well, and he’s simply not. I think if we drop Russell the rest of the team will naturally step up. I also still maintain that our centres are too blunt. Tuipulotu needs Bennett outside him or Harris needs Hutchinson inside him (Redpath is he wasn’t sadly injured). That’s it though. No other changes. You could argue that price needs dropped but swapping your 9, 10 and 12 or 13 mid campaign is a bit too much for me.

The one thing that is needed is Russell needs an almighty rocket up his backside or dropped. His kick (and non existent defensive chase) to DuPont was madness. As was his dropped ball shortly after when he simply took his eye off an easy popped pass. When he’s hot, he’s the best on the planet, but when he’s not hot, he’s a liability.

On the plus side though, just you wait till we have Darge and Hamish on the flanks at the same time. Epic!
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Post by doctor_grey Sun 27 Feb 2022, 3:10 pm

From an outsider looking in......
I think Scotland have a lot of talent though I am not sure all the parts mesh so well. Hogg is the first name on my team sheet regardless of what, when, and where.  Full stop.  As mentioned above, he gives a damn and is damn good.  Watson is one of the most enjoyable and impactful players right now.  Darge is a revelation, at least to me.  Harris and DVDM are very good also.  Second row good too.  Price can be very good.  

On the other hand, I wonder about Russell.  I wanted him in the Lions because I thought he could be a difference maker, and on his day, he is.  But I have come to the conclusion he is crazy.  Not crazy as in unpredictable, but as in half-wit crazy.  In the last 6 Nations his trip for a yellow against England could easily have been red and was stupid.  Worse was his forearm to the chops of the French player which was rightly a red.  Almost plays when he wants and doesn't seem to give a damn at times. Not sure what you can do, because he was a big piece of the win against England.  

Not sure where I am going with this, but wanted to add a few thoughts.  Always just seem a hair away.

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Post by Collapse2005 Sun 27 Feb 2022, 4:02 pm

I agree, used to love Russell but he is a half wit. You simply cant rely on him.

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Post by jimbopip Sun 27 Feb 2022, 4:35 pm

Tigertattie, do the Ladies Of Leith still greet you with, "Love you long time, listener."?
So, France are probably the form team in the world right now. We were on top for large parts of the game. When they had chances to score they did. When we had chances we gave the ball to Chris Harris.
My major concern is that Blarehorn starts against Italy and we run in nine tries thus confirming Toonies in his heretical belief that Blarehorn should play 10 in the World Cup. Toonie needs to call up another 10; Redpath is injured and Hutchison has been nowhere near the 23 for some time now. If Ross Thomson is to be in the World Cup squad he needs to be getting some experience NOW.
Aldi Price needs a rest.
We need to look at another centre pairing, one which can get the ball to the wingers and/or threaten to score tries. They don't need to score...just keep the defence guessing would be an improvement.

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Post by tigertattie Sun 27 Feb 2022, 4:44 pm

jimbopip wrote:Tigertattie, do the Ladies Of Leith still greet you with, "Love you long time, listener."?
So, France are probably the form team in the world right now. We were on top for large parts of the game. When they had chances to score they did. When we had chances we gave the ball to Chris Harris.
My major concern is that Blarehorn starts against Italy and we run in nine tries thus confirming Toonies in his heretical belief that Blarehorn should play 10 in the World Cup. Toonie needs to call up another 10; Redpath is injured and Hutchison has been nowhere near the 23 for some time now. If Ross Thomson is to be in the World Cup squad he needs to be getting some experience NOW.
Aldi Price needs a rest.
We need to look at another centre pairing, one which can get the ball to the wingers and/or threaten to score tries. They don't need to score...just keep the defence guessing would be an improvement.

Do we still have ladies of leith? Where’s FES, he’d know!

So we’re agreeing jimbo? Find a distributing 12 or 13, rest price, send Finn to the french foreign legion until he learns structure!
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