Glasgow and Edinburgh 29 - Buckfast & Bollinger

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29 threads. There is officially something wrong with us.

https://www.606v2.com/t70624p1000-glasgow-and-edinburgh-28-and-counting-the-banter-goes-on?ns=7ndk62cdm0w%3D#4069230

EWT Spoons wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:

NeilyBroon wrote:Rumor has it Simon berghan may be off to sarries, not a bad place to end your career!

Nothing in it, he's done.  Waiting to hear back from a couple of financial institutions to start his post rugby career.

Called it

You have certainly proven many times you have an accurate secret inside source!

Really want to work out who it is...

Ben White is interesting Toulon apparently, which could be a good move for him and almost certainly more lucrative than going to Edinburgh.

He'll have to make up with Dan Biggar if he moves there. What was it Biggar said to him? "Who the f*** do you think you are?!"

Craig has signed with Scarlets. A good move for him as so many players have left he'll gain a lot of game time presumably.

I see that as well as Alex Craig the Ska-lettes have snapped up Teddy Leatherbarrow. He looked a prospect when playing for the under 20's iirc. Let's hope that he doesn't decide that leek fritters and pints of Brains are an attractive diet for an international rugby player.

bsando wrote:He'll have to make up with Dan Biggar if he moves there. What was it Biggar said to him? "Who the f*** do you think you are?!"

Craig has signed with Scarlets. A good move for him as so many players have left he'll gain a lot of game time presumably.

Scarlets'll be hopeful on him being good enough to be a starter ASAP. Sam Lousi needs a new partner as Fifita is preferred at 6. They're a team that is shaping up quite nicely and we will hopefully see that in the league next season.

The two BUCS players seem like random punts tbh.

mikey_dragon wrote:

bsando wrote:He'll have to make up with Dan Biggar if he moves there. What was it Biggar said to him? "Who the f*** do you think you are?!"

Craig has signed with Scarlets. A good move for him as so many players have left he'll gain a lot of game time presumably.

Scarlets'll be hopeful on him being good enough to be a starter ASAP. Sam Lousi needs a new partner as Fifita is preferred at 6. They're a team that is shaping up quite nicely and we will hopefully see that in the league next season.

The two BUCS players seem like random punts tbh.

I'm not sure we could afford much more tbh Mikey.

Don't you have players in those positions currently in the Wales U20s? I'm almost certain that you do. More bad news then as you've lost two TH's.

jimbopip wrote:I see that as well as Alex Craig the Ska-lettes have snapped up Teddy Leatherbarrow. He looked a prospect when playing for the under 20's iirc. Let's hope that he doesn't decide that leek fritters and pints of Brains are an attractive diet for an international rugby player.

Surely Teddy Leatherbarrow needs to be a sidekick in a BBC family friendly, regional detective drama on Sunday nights?

Mike Blair officially leaving Edinburgh now.

Off to Japan to be an assistsnt to Dsvd Rennie at Kobe.

Probably a good thing he is moving on, it would have been odd fof him to have stayed especially with the rumours of him having lost the dressing room.

No sign of a new hesd coach though, so life goes on with Dimes at the helm!

Do we think he may end up doing the job permanently?

Bit late in the day for Edinburgh given they knew Blair was stepping down. I thought pre-season had pretty much started as well now and I would have thought getting someone in before then would have been the most important thing.

You would have to assume they must therefore be sticking with him. Not many top end coaches are available at the minute.

Spoons - you must have some inside scoop on next Edinburgh coach?

Rumours abounding that Logan Trotter is re-signing for the Warriors.

That would be a good signing. Happy to see Blair heading to Japan. Great to see more Scottish coaches getting international exposure these days, it could all prove to be very helpful in the years to come.

This isn't strictly rugby related...but it's the close season...

We often say on here that you can prove anything with statistics; well, this factoid popped up on my Facebook homepage poster wall thing recently.

Compare and contrast the great Lisbon Lions Celtic side from 1967 and the St Mirren 2015 side who were relegated from the SPL.

Easy peasy, the Lions amassed 114 Scotland caps between them and the Paisley Buddies have, so far, 127 Scotland caps.

It's just mad Ted, so it is. Mad.

Les Kiss, that’ll do! Get him a contract

I'd very happily take Declan Kidney and Les Kiss as a coaching team, they had LI playing some great rugby!

RDW wrote:Spoons - you must have some inside scoop on next Edinburgh coach?

Nothing unfortunately.

Based on idle speculation though, in the last update from the club, it was announced it would August at the earliest before we hear about a new head coach.

It could be speculated that August could stretch out to Sept/Oct, due to not wanting to come straight out and say it won't be until after the world cup before you get a coach. Therefore we might see a coach announced after the WC, perhaps a coach who it was just announced won't be taking the team on after the world cup.

That is total speculation though, I genuinely haven't heard anything.

EWT Spoons wrote:

RDW wrote:Spoons - you must have some inside scoop on next Edinburgh coach?

Nothing unfortunately.

Based on idle speculation though, in the last update from the club, it was announced it would August at the earliest before we hear about a new head coach.

It could be speculated that August could stretch out to Sept/Oct, due to not wanting to come straight out and say it won't be until after the world cup before you get a coach.  Therefore we might see a coach announced after the WC, perhaps a coach who it was just announced won't be taking the team on after the world cup.

That is total speculation though, I genuinely haven't heard anything.

So that makes me think your mole is in the Scotland setup but not Edinburgh setup...

Although saying that they're doing incredibly well to keep it all quiet - usually some kind of hint sneaks out.

Kiss is superb. LI were on an upward trajectory on the pitch and the players all seemed to have a lot of time for him.

According to Jamie Lyall, who usually has his finger pretty close to the pulse, Les Kiss is indeed in the frsme for the Edinburgh role, along with Marius Goosen, who was apparently Franco's number 2 while he was at Benetton.

It does sound like they are giving the recruitment process due dilligence, which in the longer term is surely the right way to go.

Margin_Walker wrote:Kiss is superb. LI were on an upward trajectory on the pitch and the players all seemed to have a lot of time for him.

I've not heard that one before, but "God Gave Rock N Roll to You" is a legit banger of a song. Had no idea Gene Simmons was into rugby though.

(no, you shut up)

The Lesser Spotted Miotti has had his contract extended. Looking forward to the four starts he will have next season.

Ben White signs for Toulon as rumoured

Good move for Ben White

It will be interesting to see if it is a holding move for a season while he sorts himself out a proper longer term contract ( maybe with the SRU) or he is staying there longer term. Toulon unlikely to be ovrr investing in a plsyer who will be away on international duty for long periods.

In other transfer news, Rudi Brown, who many were surprised to see dropped from the Edinburgh academy at the end of this season has signed for Vannes in Pro D2.

He will be playing there alongside Hammy McBain who was on the Glasgow fringes before going on to Jersey.

That may be a good move for him and will push him along if he gets plenty game time with them.

As much as its not scottish club rugby, i think its safe to say we all like to keep an eye on former Scotland coach Vern Cotter since he was booted - He's been announced as the Blues new head coach in NZ and has taken former scotland and glasgow warriors assistant coach Jason O'Halloran with him.

Hope he does well, Cotter has had mixed success since Scotland and I thought he was building nicely with Fiji to the world cup!

It would appear that The Rugby Club are announcing a new signing at...well right now.

Kyle Rowe - got to be happy with that!

Kyle Rowe in fact.

Great signing.

I'm sure he'll be another Edinburgh reject who becomes international class at Glasgow! Assuming his bad injury hasn't caused any long-term issues.

I saw it on FB. I couldn't resist commenting "Another Mullet!!!" Cos he has a real in your face 1980's Lionel Blaircut.
Five minutes later I got a thumbs up from George Rowe. Ayrshire folk are world class.

He seems to wear it with pride

Seen pictures on twitter today of him at his barbers!

I see Warriors have signed another player who looks like trailer trash. I hear he has bad teeth. He'll fit right in.

Hope you're all well.

jimbopip wrote:I saw it on FB. I couldn't resist commenting "Another Mullet!!!" Cos he has a real in your face 1980's Lionel Blaircut.
Five minutes later I got a thumbs up from George Rowe. Ayrshire folk are world class.

Noooooooooooo.

According to Mark Palmer in the Sunday Times, it is a toss up between Les Kiss and Brad Mooar for the Edinburgh head coach job and that may be decided if Kiss decides to head back to Oz for the Reds job, which he is also in the frame for. Both pretty good choices in truth, though Booar won't be available immediately, as he is with Scotland for the WC.




Edinburgh are closing in on a new head coach, with Les Kiss and Brad Mooar understood to be the last two candidates left standing after a lengthy recruitment process.

The Australian, Kiss, who was a victim of the closure of London Irish last month, is also wanted by the Reds in his homeland while Mooar is already on the Murrayfield payroll as an attack coach with Gregor Townsend’s national team.

The 48-year-old New Zealander joined the Scotland staff before this year’s Six Nations and it has already been confirmed that he will continue in the role at the World Cup in France in September and October. Mooar was previously an assistant coach with the All Blacks and has worked in the United Rugby Championship as the Scarlets head coach.

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Edinburgh are seeking a successor to Mike Blair, who announced back in March that he would stand down in the summer having struggled with the demands of being a head coach. The former Scotland scrum half has since been appointed as attack coach with the Japanese side Kobe Steelers under Dave Rennie, on whose staff he had worked at Glasgow Warriors.

Marius Goosen, the Italy defence coach, has been strongly linked with the Edinburgh post, but The Times understands that Kiss and Mooar performed the most impressively in an interview process overseen by Steve Diamond.



The former Worcester Warriors and Sale Sharks director of rugby joined the club as lead rugby consultant on a short-term deal towards the end of last season, but has already agreed to oversee pre-season preparations until November.

This would ensure that Edinburgh are covered were Mooar to get the top job, while if Kiss ends up being the successful candidate, he would be in a position to start significantly sooner.

In an ironic twist, Diamond is believed to have applied for the head coach job at the Reds, but it is understood to have come down to a straight choice between Kiss and Nathan Grey — a 1999 World Cup winner with the Wallabies.

Meanwhile, Edinburgh’s Challenge Cup section has been finalised after EPCR, the tournament organisers, confirmed Black Lion as the “invited club” to complete pool 3.



Edinburgh will not actually face the Georgians — the first side from that country to take part in one of EPCR’s main professional competitions. Their four pool fixtures will be home or away to Gloucester, Clermont Auvergne, Castres and Scarlets.

The revised tournament structure for this season’s competition sees each Challenge Cup team face four of its five pool opponents — two home fixtures and two away matches.

Full fixture details will be announced “as soon as practicable” with the first round of games taking place on the weekend of December 8/9/10.

Les Kiss takes the Reds job apparently!

So Brad Mooar for Edinburgh then?

Sorry to hijack the thread with non rugby bits but wondering if any of you good people could offer a bit of advice? Taking my boy to Edinburgh next week for his 16th birthday, as Man United are playing in Murrayfield, it's a afternoon kick off so looking for somewhere to take him early evening to kill a couple of hours. Was thinking maybe a sports bar or somewhere with pool tables etc. Any help/advice greatly received.

Oakdene, very close to Murrayfield is the Roseburn https://www.roseburnbar.co.uk/

It is a solid, old fashioned pub. Apparently it has TV's (a novel invention which I still have to come to terms with). It also sells beers and whisky.
Whenever I've been there after a Scotland match it has been busy and convivial. Even when Fes was ranting about Neo Liberalism being the paternalistic path to Sodom and Gomorrah.

Oakdene wrote:Sorry to hijack the thread with non rugby bits but wondering if any of you good people could offer a bit of advice? Taking my boy to Edinburgh next week for his 16th birthday, as Man United are playing in Murrayfield, it's a afternoon kick off so looking for somewhere to take him early evening to kill a couple of hours. Was thinking maybe a sports bar or somewhere with pool tables etc. Any help/advice greatly received.

There's a few places you could consider.

Caveat to the majority of these, I've not been to some of them in decades, so I can't comment on the quality.

Marcos - Easy walking distance to Murrayfield, or if that's not an option the Haymarket tram stop is nearby and would drop you off outside murrayfield - https://marcos.uk.com/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=GoogleMyBusiness  This one used to be popular when I was a youth, it closed down for a while and has been renovated, I've not been in since it reopened, but I've heard it's decent enough.  For a 16 year old I would suggest it might be your best option as I'm sure he'll enjoy it

Murrayfield sports bar - Calling this out just for awareness.  Do not go here!  It's fine, but can come across as rough as a badgers arse and it's really hard to shake that impression.  It's within spitting distance of the stadium, but avoid it.

The ball room - https://www.ballroomscotland.com/morningside
I've never been to this one, but it's in Morningside which is a nice part of town.  Slightly harder to get to the stadium from here, but you just need to get back to princes st, which is probably around a 20 min walk from here (or loads of busses down), from there you can walk to the ground (probably 20-30 min walk) or jump on a tram

I can't think of many other places that have pool tables, but bars showing sports I can probably help more with

- Cambridge bar - Good burgers, loads of screens all showing sports easy walking distance to the stadium or the tram stop - http://www.thecambridgebar.co.uk/

- Teuchters (not Teuchters landing, part of the same company, but the wrong side of town) - has a few screens, will generally be showing sports.  It's got a decent selection of beer and whisky, which I'm not sure will really appeal to a 16yo, or it might - https://teuchtersbar.co.uk/

Athletic arms - normally shows sports, again fairly nearby - https://athleticarms.co.uk/

There's loads more but I've run out of steam, with the tram network being expanded if you can find somewhere on or near the tram route you're laughing

The key to getting onto the tram after the match is to let the crowds subside.

This is usually best achieved by staying and having another beer after the game, which would be a far more pleasant experience on a warm July night than it usually is on a freezing cold November or February afternoon!

Unfortunately they are a bit funny about serving alcohol at football matches in Scotland, something that illustrates the class divide in the country very well, so that may not be an option. It is a friendly though, so maybe the usual league rules won't apply.

BigGee wrote:

Unfortunately they are a bit funny about serving alcohol at football matches in Scotland, something that illustrates the class divide in the country very well, so that may not be an option. It is a friendly though, so maybe the usual league rules won't apply.

Not to totally derail the conversation, but I'd say it's less to do with a class divide and more to do with the history of trouble that specifically goes along with football and alcohol in Scotland, especially with the two main culprits through in Glasgow. If they didn't keep shooting themselves in the foot with their toxic behaviour then things might change to allow alcohol, but that seems pretty unlikely sadly.

EWT Spoons wrote:

BigGee wrote:

Unfortunately they are a bit funny about serving alcohol at football matches in Scotland, something that illustrates the class divide in the country very well, so that may not be an option. It is a friendly though, so maybe the usual league rules won't apply.

Not to totally derail the conversation, but I'd say it's less to do with a class divide and more to do with the history of trouble that specifically goes along with football and alcohol in Scotland, especially with the two main culprits through in Glasgow.  If they didn't keep shooting themselves in the foot with their toxic behaviour then things might change to allow alcohol, but that seems pretty unlikely sadly.

It is s bit of both of those things really.

Remember there used to be a complete ban on alcohol at all sports events in Scotland.

I remember going to the grand slam match in 1990 and the police strictly enforcing it, resulting in a lot of disgruntled English fans having to throw their hip flasks in the bin outside the turnstiles.

Then at some point, it was allowed back at rugby matches but not football.

I am no great football fan and totally agree with you about the toxic behaviour of old firm, so called fans.

It is hard to justify these days though and it does not seem fair to the average football fan.

Rugby is not immune from anti social drinking behaviour as well, try going to Cardiff on match days! The rest of the country seems to have grown up and can enjoy a pint while watching a football match and with liberal licensing laws and the availability of cheap booze, those that want to, will get loaded pre match anyway.

Perhaps the price of a pint at the match would put them off dtinking to much!

Thanks all!!

BigGee wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:

BigGee wrote:

Unfortunately they are a bit funny about serving alcohol at football matches in Scotland, something that illustrates the class divide in the country very well, so that may not be an option. It is a friendly though, so maybe the usual league rules won't apply.

Not to totally derail the conversation, but I'd say it's less to do with a class divide and more to do with the history of trouble that specifically goes along with football and alcohol in Scotland, especially with the two main culprits through in Glasgow.  If they didn't keep shooting themselves in the foot with their toxic behaviour then things might change to allow alcohol, but that seems pretty unlikely sadly.

It is s bit of both of those things really.

Remember there used to be a complete ban on alcohol at all sports events in Scotland.

I remember going to the grand slam match in 1990 and the police strictly enforcing it, resulting in a lot of disgruntled English fans having to throw their hip flasks in the bin outside the turnstiles.

Then at some point, it was allowed back at rugby matches but not football.

I am no great football fan and totally agree with you about the toxic behaviour of old firm, so called fans.

It is hard to justify these days though and it does not seem fair to the average football fan.

Rugby is not immune from anti social drinking behaviour as well, try going to Cardiff on match days! The rest of the country seems to have grown up and can enjoy a pint while watching a football match and with liberal licensing laws and the availability of cheap booze, those that want to, will get loaded pre match anyway.

Perhaps the price of a pint at the match would put them off dtinking to much!

Irvine Welsh has some fairly scathing words for the hypocritical nature of policing drunk football fans v drunk rugby fans... In essence, because a rugby fan is middle class and wearing tweed, even though he's p1ssing in the middle of rose street, being lecherous to scared women in the bars and getting thrown at the pub for "banter", the police wont do anything because he's middle class... Rangers fan who's had a beer and sings a song too loud on the other hand...

Not saying one is better than the other but having been on many nights out on the town with rugby players and a few with football fans, the honest difference is frequency of vomit, quality of threads and snobbery.

Tramptastic wrote:

BigGee wrote:

EWT Spoons wrote:

BigGee wrote:

Unfortunately they are a bit funny about serving alcohol at football matches in Scotland, something that illustrates the class divide in the country very well, so that may not be an option. It is a friendly though, so maybe the usual league rules won't apply.

Not to totally derail the conversation, but I'd say it's less to do with a class divide and more to do with the history of trouble that specifically goes along with football and alcohol in Scotland, especially with the two main culprits through in Glasgow.  If they didn't keep shooting themselves in the foot with their toxic behaviour then things might change to allow alcohol, but that seems pretty unlikely sadly.

It is s bit of both of those things really.

Remember there used to be a complete ban on alcohol at all sports events in Scotland.

I remember going to the grand slam match in 1990 and the police strictly enforcing it, resulting in a lot of disgruntled English fans having to throw their hip flasks in the bin outside the turnstiles.

Then at some point, it was allowed back at rugby matches but not football.

I am no great football fan and totally agree with you about the toxic behaviour of old firm, so called fans.

It is hard to justify these days though and it does not seem fair to the average football fan.

Rugby is not immune from anti social drinking behaviour as well, try going to Cardiff on match days! The rest of the country seems to have grown up and can enjoy a pint while watching a football match and with liberal licensing laws and the availability of cheap booze, those that want to, will get loaded pre match anyway.

Perhaps the price of a pint at the match would put them off dtinking to much!

Irvine Welsh has some fairly scathing words for the hypocritical nature of policing drunk football fans v drunk rugby fans... In essence, because a rugby fan is middle class and wearing tweed, even though he's p1ssing in the middle of rose street, being lecherous to scared women in the bars and getting thrown at the pub for "banter", the police wont do anything because he's middle class... Rangers fan who's had a beer and sings a song too loud on the other hand...

Not saying one is better than the other but having been on many nights out on the town with rugby players and a few with football fans, the honest difference is frequency of vomit, quality of threads and snobbery.

I’d suggest that Irvine Welsh’s view is too simplistic and based on fairly lazy generalisations rather than reality.  

I’m a fan of a Scottish football team, used to be a season ticket holder and went home and away for many years, I’m now a season ticket holder at Edinburgh and go to every home game, and some away games as well as internationals and I’d suggest the difference is far more than what he is suggesting it is.

The songs being sung and the violence that inevitably goes along with it, mark the two as very separate, rather than it being just one set of fans singing loudly.  For the avoidance of doubt, this issue is primarily specific to OF fans, and not the majority of Scottish football teams.  There are elements within every support so it’s not just the OF, but the volume of OF fans and the songs and behaviour marks them out as very different from the norm.

That’s not to say there aren’t terrible folk that rock up to rugby matches, you get bellends in all walks of life, but generally speaking at a rugby match you are unlikely to hear sectarian singing, coins, bottles etc thrown onto the pitch with the intent of injuring someone, bottles of piss and all manner of crap being thrown at away fans at Ibrox and Parkhead and town centres being destroyed. Or for that matter the massive increase in reported domestic abuse when one half of the OF lose the derby.  All of which has happened in the recent years by one/both halves of the OF.
None of these things happen at Scottish Rugby games, from the club game to pro to internationals.  This is why alcohol is allowed at rugby and not football

A handful of bumholes who behave like they own the place is pretty much the norm in any city centre on a fri/sat night regardless of any sport being on, and is an issue with society as a whole, rather than being specific to sport.  A group of men (because it’s mostly us lads) wrecking places and beating the ever-loving crap out of each other because the person they’re fighting supports a different team, or the same team, or no team (they don’t always discriminate) seems specific to football in Scotland at least, and again primarily with the OF.

For the record I love football, I will always love the sport, but I 99 time out of 100 I would take my daughter to a rugby game before I take her to a Scottish football match.  Rugby is far from perfect, but it’s a lot safer in general, even with the addition of alcohol.

Aye, Irvine Welsh' opinion is a point of difference on this forum im sure BUT i sometimes get cynical about "rugby values". Sometimes it's there, especially on game day when, as you say, its a safe place for familys to enjoy sport and at I see it most games I play.

Sometimes its not. See Sexton/Hogg/Biggar being felled by hidden snipers semi-regularly on a pitch. And it's definitely not there at university level where the public school boys go out on the lash and abuse the freshers on their own team, let alone unsuspecting innocent members of the public on a saturday night.

We hold up rugby as a an exemplar of team sport and community but we should hold it to much higher standards, especially when we see kn0bbery on or off the pitch.

I like to think that I bestride the class divide like a colossus....

funnyExiledScot wrote:I like to think that I bestride the class divide like a colossus....

A colossus wearing Brora cashmere and sipping a £30 Stockbridge soy latte, but absolutely.

George Carlin wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:I like to think that I bestride the class divide like a colossus....

A colossus wearing Brora cashmere and sipping a £30 Stockbridge soy latte, but absolutely.

Hey, I'll take the hit on Brora cashmere (they make bespoke pyjamas for my pedigree working cocker), but anyone putting soy in my coffee can be assured of a punch in the face (Marquess of Queensbury Rules of course).

Still, Irvine Welsh is talking out of his bum as usual. Having been to many football matches (Ibrox, Goodison, Elland Road, Emirates, Craven Cottage, The Valley, Villa Park, Loftus Road etc.) I can absolutely assure you that the behaviour of football fans is in a totally different league. I would never in a millions years take Little Miss fES to a football match!

I also spent the weekend at Headingly for the cricket, to further burnish my working class credentials, and I can honestly say that the behaviour of cricket fans (given that it's effectively an all day session) is remarkably good!

I think a lot of folk will be on coke at football matches these days, (and not the carbonated variety). I'm not sure if the demand for booze is really there any more. Imagine coming back from the bar with 6 pints just as a goal goes in - you'd get soaked.

That said if the clubs want it, and are prepared to pay for the policing costs associated with any extra antisocial behaviour, then by all means.

Pretty decent draw for Glasgow in the champs cup next season

Northampton and Toulon at home

Bayonne and Exeter away

Always tough, but they should think they can have a crack at all those games. We should be pretty much back to full strength post WC by then as well.