England Selection for the Warm-Ups

First topic message reminder :

With the 1st warm-up now less than 2 weeks away who would you select for the following matches. Whats the objective? Do we try a few new combinations to let the fringe players have a chance? Or do we select 1st choice and get some continuity.

I've included below the fixtures and Englands WC training squad that teams must be selected from.

August 6, 2011	England v Wales	Twickenham Stadium
August 13, 2011	Wales v England	Millenium Stadium
August 27, 2011	Ireland v England	Aviva Stadium

Player Club

Mouritz Botha	Saracens
George Chuter	Leicester Tigers
Dan Cole	Leicester Tigers
Alex Corbisiero	London Irish
Tom Croft	Leicester Tigers
Louis Deacon	Leicester Tigers
Paul Doran-Jones	Gloucester Rugby
Nick Easter	Harlequins
Hendre Fourie	Sale Sharks
Dylan Hartley	Northampton Saints
James Haskell	Unattached
Courtney Lawes	Northampton Saints
Lee Mears	Bath Rugby
Lewis Moody	Bath Rugby
Tom Palmer	Stade Francais
Tim Payne	London Wasps
Chris Robshaw	Harlequins
Simon Shaw	London Wasps
Andrew Sheridan	Sale Sharks
Matt Stevens	Saracens
Steve Thompson	London Wasps
Thomas Waldrom	Leicester Tigers
David Wilson	Bath Rugby
Tom Wood	Northampton Saints
Joe Worsley	London Wasps

Delon Armitage	London Irish
Chris Ashton	Northampton Saints
Matt Banahan	Bath Rugby
Danny Care	Harlequins
Mark Cueto	Sale Sharks
Toby Flood	Leicester Tigers
Riki Flutey	London Wasps
Ben Foden	Northampton Saints
Shontayne Hape	Bath Rugby
Charlie Hodgson	Saracens
Ugo Monye	Harlequins
Charlie Sharples	Gloucester Rugby
Joe Simpson	London Wasps
James Simpson-Daniel	Gloucester Rugby
David Strettle	Saracens
Mike Tindall	Gloucester Rugby
Manusamoa Tuilagi	Leicester Tigers
Richard Wigglesworth	Saracens
Jonny Wilkinson	RC Toulon
Ben Youngs	Leicester Tigers

My thoughts are to try out some combinations for the home game to Wales, refine a little for the Cardiff away game (keep those new combinations that work - reinforce with a few big guns if needed. The put out first choice test side for Dublin, Ireland being a bit of a bogey side for England over the recent years. For the sake of team confidence we need that away result to put to bed a few issues.


Team for the 1st warm-up, I would like to see -

Stevens
Mears
Cole
Botha
Lawes
Fourie
Moody
Waldrom
Care
Flood
Monye
Flutey
Tuilagi
JSD
Armitage


Res -

Hartley
Paul Doran-Jones
Palmer
Robshaw
Simpson
Sharples
Banahan
(almost looks like a strong Saxons side)

I would tweak that for the away leg - strengthen the Pack if needed to compete against A.Jones and co. Maybe Tinds comes in and Foden gets a run ect.
I would still expect the 15 for the Ireland game to look something like this -

Sherry
Hartley
Cole
Lawes
Palmer
Croft
Moody
Easter
Care
Flood
Ashton
Haps
Tinds
Cueto
Foden

And include any good performers from the previous matches.
Whats your thoughts - would you play your strongest in all warm-ups?

I wouldn't call Matt Smith and Botha similar. Completely different players and positions..

Well clearly that wasn't the point I was getting at and you know it.

I thought Croft was your lineout man

There's a big difference between running a line out and jumping in a line out. Croft is an excellent jumper but not so great at organising one. Deacon on the other hand is a throroughly average jumper but his inclusion in the team took the line out from woeful to very good. In fact Skivington and Mafi are both better jumpers than Deacs but the line out worked when he was in it.

Sam you honestly think being impotent in attack is down to the 2nd row?

Lose the battle up front and you lose the game. Forwards win games, backs decide by how much.

I swear there isn't an England thread running without you two bickering on it..

Apologies. I will not mention that day again on this thread.

Deacon also called the English lineout even though Palmer was considered the main jumper

I apologise Yappysnap I enjoy these conversations with Sam. I think he is very knowledgeable (particularly on his own side) and always nice to get his point of view even when he doesn't agree with me!

I do actually think Deacon is pretty good. Thought he was just a loyal club servant for Tigers but has proved his worth for England in my opinion.

Yes funny exiled scot it's in protest. I actually think as bad as Tindall at inside centre would be he would be no worse than other options.

If anyone wants to talk about who they believe the best English players in the AP are - join me on my thread.

I think we should expect to see alot mor eof banahan at 12 next season...both with Bath and England.

I wouldnt be surprised to see him get some gametime their in the WC build up games.
Now whilst i think he COULD be a very good 12...i dont think he is ready yet for playing 12 in a WC for England.

Would Allen have been able to produce in the WC? Sadly we wont find out.

We all know it will be 12 Hape 13 Tindall ....although Tindall has had a few injuries...so i think Banahan may get the nod...

I dunno, I've had a couple of drinks and can almost come to terms with the idea that a Banahan and Tuilagi partnership could work in the future. Then again, I've been known to be very enthusiastic in my lush moods. I once described Husker du's 'Warehouse: Songs and stories' as the 'best' album ever after a few cherryades. I'll no doubt wake up feeling suitably stupid tomorrow. Viva school holidays!


(I’m an employee not a student for those who wondered! )

Haha

Cumbrian I think you may be right in your booze addled guestimations there, if Banahan gets a good run out at 12 this season for Bath and him and Manu keep on progressing nicely like they are then we could see them both in next years 6N's.

And they could be quite effective, especially compared to the current incumbants.

They'll need to learn quickly though as there are a whole host of centre options getting game time now who'll want in.

As to "Husker du's 'Warehouse: Songs and stories" I don't have a clue what you're on about, is it some kind of role playing game?

For the centre options I think Hape and Tindall is the safest although, it may also be the dullest. Hape will have to stop the shuffling wide and get on the 10's shoulder though. The partnership with the most potential to my mind is also the most risky. Flutey and Manu could shred defences and hold their own defensive line brilliantly. However, Flutey's injuries and form have been all over the place whilst Manu hasn't got the coolest of tempers.

If Flutey plays like he did in '09 then a pairing with Tuilagi could be superb. Lets hope this extended rest and training run with the england team lets him get those knees sorted and remember how he used to play.

Hape for me will never be international quality, MJ may as well have stuck with Erinle.

yappysnap wrote:Haha

Cumbrian I think you may be right in your booze addled guestimations there, if Banahan gets a good run out at 12 this season for Bath and him and Manu keep on progressing nicely like they are then we could see them both in next years 6N's.

And they could be quite effective, especially compared to the current incumbants.

They'll need to learn quickly though as there are a whole host of centre options getting game time now who'll want in.

As to "Husker du's 'Warehouse: Songs and stories" I don't have a clue what you're on about, is it some kind of role playing game?

(adopting a 'comic book guy' voice) Best album ever :


http://www.amazon.co.uk/Warehouse-Songs-Stories-Husker-Du/dp/B000005JAM/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1311766969&sr=8-5

No such thing as 'a best album ever!'

Though if I were pushed I'd point you to some favourites in;

Alterbridge - One Day Remains
Led Zepplin - Led Zepplin 4
Eric Clapton and BB King - Ridin' with the King
Rory Gallagher - Irish Tour '74

Ah Sam....you've just gone up in my estimation yet again.

AlterBridge...great band..booked in to see them again in November.
And Led Zepp 4...great ablum

Mind the Maiden Boys were outstanding on saturday night up here in Newcastle.

If you've not seen Alterbridge before you are in for a treat, Myles Kennedy is the best live vocalist I've seen (4 times with AB once with Slash). Will do a 3 hour show and every song will be note perfect.

Maiden are always good live, saw them at Donnington a couple of years back, you don't stay that popular that long without a good back catalouge and a great live show.

Ah, if I was going to nominate my favourite album ever (sober) I'd have to say it would be one of:

'Horses' Patti Smith
'Blank Generation' Richard Hell and the Voidoids
'Velvet Underground and Nico' by ...
'Raw Power' Iggy and the Stooges
'Fresh Fruit for Rotting Vegetables' Dead Kennedys
'Unknown Pleasures' Joy Division
'The Queen is Dead' The Smiths

Ogden's nutgone flake - Small Faces. Genius.

Yeah mate ive seen AB before, great live band.

An ive been lucky to see maiden many times....not much you can say but brilliant.

Yeah Maiden never disapoint. Did you see any of the solo Slash tour with Myles on vocals? That was suprisingly good, the solo album was pretty ace as well.

No unfortunately i didnt get to see Slash...but i did get the Album and was very impressed....also with the collection of other artists on it.