Glasgow and Edinburgh Ongoing Banter Thread 26

[Hazel Sapling]

First topic message reminder :

A continuation on previous threads discussing the past, the present and the future of Scottish rugby. A dose a day, keeps optimism away

Halfway through a Covid season and not far from the Rainbow cups, both teams are on the precipice of missing out on the top tier in Europe next year. The Rainbow Cup is a well thought out idea of including sides from South Africa, the home to a new Covid variant that vaccines may not work on, with international travel involving several regions of Europe.

Glasgow Squad

LH: Kebble, Bhatti, Lambert
Hooker: F Brown, Turner, Stewart, Matthews,
TH: Z Fagerson, Berghan, Pieretto, McCallum, McQuillan
Locks: Cummings, R Gray, Harley, McDonald, Bain, Bean
Back Row: Wilson, Gordon, M Fagerson, Darge, Dempsey, Miller, G Brown

SH: Price, G Horne, Dobie, Kennedy
FH: Weir, Miotti, P Horne, Thompson
Centres: S Johnson, McDowall, Tuipulotu, Grigg, Fergusson
Back Three: McLean, Forbes, McKay, Cancelliere, Tagive, Steyn, O Smith


Edinburgh Squad

LH: Schoeman, Venter, Grahamslaw
Hooker: McInally, Cherry, McBurney, Harrison
TH: Nel, De Bruin, Atalifo, Williams
Locks: Gilchrist, Toolis, Young, Hodgson, Sykes, Phillips
Back Row: Mata, Ritchie, Watson, Bradbury, Crosbie, Haining, Boyle, Kunavula, Muncaster

SH: Pyrgos, Vellacott, Shiel
FH: VDW, Chamberlain, Savala
Centres: Lang, Taylor, Bennett, Dean, Johnstone, Venter, Currie, Hutchison
Back Three: Graham, Kinghorn, Hoyland, Blain, Bofelli, Moyano, Immelman, Owsley


Previous Thread
https://www.606v2.com/t69760-the-glasgow-and-edinburgh-general-chat-discussions-are-limited-to-6-people-before-10pm-to-prevent-the-spread-of-jimboish
https://www.606v2.com/t69555-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-24-covid-funtimes?highlight=banter
https://www.606v2.com/t69038-glasgow-and-edinburgh-banter-thread-no-23-new-season-new-thread?highlight=banter

[Anglobraveheart]

Good review, RDW.

Can Anglo, Big Gee, Hazel, the Mighty Jim or any of the people here who actually know things about Scottish rugby nominate a couple of players to watch out for?

GC, I am honoured to be not only included in your list, but also in prime position of first choice (albeit probably due to alphabetical reasons) amongst such other high level contributors (that you could remember).
I concur with the bulk of the notes above regarding squads and prospects, with, in particular, I think the 3 prime choices at each pro club being:
Glasgow - Darge, Dempsey and Tuipolotu.
Edinburgh - Grahamslaw, Boyle and Chamberlain.

I think and hope that the stubborn and poor player management traits of Rennie and Cockers will be left to history, and both squads will grow and evolve as the new young players come through.
I think that there is the potential for both squads to be competitive in the top 6 during the next 2 years, and come world Cup year, they should be two very capable squads, provided that there is not a revisit to Rennie's methods or Cockerill's bloody-mindedness.
I did not like Rennie's methods, so I am glad he has gone, and this is now a make or break year for DW.
Cockerell, could not have a more apt name, but his stubbornness was not toxic like Rennie's. IMO.
(Unusual that Rennie caused indigestion instead of curing it).
So I look forwards to seeing what MB can do, and as I said above, they are a WiP, with fruits to bear in a couple of years as they grow together.

It should be a very positive new era for both of our clubs.

[BigGee]

From a Glasgow perspective, i sm pretty positive about next season as well. I think we have bloodied some decent youngsters last season and have recruited well. The last few games when we got on a decent run and even beat Leinster was a very positive sign.

I read an interview with DW and he actually sounds wuite bullish and looking forward to next season. About 30 players are back training now with the Argies, Lions and few walking wounded still away, so we may see the academy players get a run or two in the first few games.

Edinburgh more of an unknown quantity as they attrmpt to transition into a new playing style. They are allso short of an attack coach still, though the cynical amongst us would say they have not really had one or maybe needed one for a good few years.

They will hopefully improve as the season goes on.

[EST]

From a Glasgow perspective, i sm pretty positive about next season as well. I think we have bloodied some decent youngsters last season and have recruited well. The last few games when we got on a decent run and even beat Leinster was a very positive sign.

I read an interview with DW and he actually sounds wuite bullish and looking forward to next season. About 30 players are back training now with the Argies, Lions and  few walking wounded still away, so we may see the academy players get a run or two in the first few games.

Edinburgh more of an unknown quantity as they attrmpt to transition into a new playing style. They are allso short of an attack coach still, though the cynical amongst us would say they have not really had one  or maybe needed one for a good few years.

They will hopefully improve as the season goes on.

He certainly struck a confident tone, although the article did seem to imply that the recruitment for the year has been finished. While the quality being brought in has been good overall, we are really light in a couple of positions - only three Loosheads and six senior Backrow players going into the new season (assuming Rob Harley is now seen as a lock), not much wriggle room for injuries there. I suppose there is less cross-over with international windows now, but would still have been nice to have got a couple more bodies in the pack.

[Hazel Sapling]

I would like to think that Harley, Bain and Cummings (has been shifted over by Scotland during games once or twice) could cover 6 if desperate. There is also G Brown hopefully back (I assume he did his ACL?) and able to take on a bigger role by the time the Six Nations begin.

The LH thing is interesting. Something that may be considered will they try McCallum there? He has been messed about between LH/TH and whilst he should have become a TH from a Scotland point of view, if he is struggling to stay as a pro it does not matter about Scotland. They could also try and grab a LH from Super 6 who performs well.

[BigGee]

There are also rumours about Hamish McBeth, another LH, joining from the Lions at some stage.

Not clear when that might be, presumably he is playing in Currie Cup atm and may or may not play for Lions in the URC this season.

[king_carlos]

Jed Gelderbloom is apparently on trial with Edinburgh. He's a highly rated 9 from the Leicester academy and son of former Tigers centre Glenn. Jed started off playing fly-half so has a good boot on him but has impressed since moving to scrum-half.

Tigers have Jack van Poortvliet already getting first XV game time and two more 9s in the senior academy so it's understandable that Gelderbloom is looking elsewhere but would still be a shame to lose him. He'd be joining Grahamslaw and Muncaster in going from the Tigers academy to Edinburgh.

There have been a few talented 9s come through the Edinburgh academy recently. Frostwick looks a good player and Dan Nutton always impressed me so I was a bit surprised he got released. It still surprises me that Andrew Simmers never featured beyond the Scotland U20s. I rate Shiel but Simmers always seemed the even stronger talent when I saw the two play at U20s in the same sides.

[George Carlin]

There are also rumours about Hamish McBeth, another LH, joining from the Lions at some stage.

Gee - are you making some of these names up?

[BigGee]

There are also rumours about Hamish McBeth, another LH, joining from the Lions at some stage.

Gee - are you making some of these names up?

Opps - i did of course mean Nathan McBeth!

Hamish was the early incarnation of Robert Carlyle  pre Begbie, as the genial highland cop!

A Scottish sounding South African (also SQ)  whats not to like!

[EST]

I would like to think that Harley, Bain and Cummings (has been shifted over by Scotland during games once or twice) could cover 6 if desperate. There is also G Brown hopefully back (I assume he did his ACL?) and able to take on a bigger role by the time the Six Nations begin.

The LH thing is interesting. Something that may be considered will they try McCallum there? He has been messed about between LH/TH and whilst he should have become a TH from a Scotland point of view, if he is struggling to stay as a pro it does not matter about Scotland. They could also try and grab a LH from Super 6 who performs well.

Yeah, he might have to - Kebble is also injured for the start of the season so he will probably be pressed into service there.

If McBeth does come over, that would be the ideal solution.

[jimbopip]

There are also rumours about Hamish McBeth, another LH, joining from the Lions at some stage.

Gee - are you making some of these names up?

See that's what's wrong with these boards; Scottish posters thinking it's funny to give rugby players ridiculous nicknames.

P.S. I am amazed that my comment on the international thread about Steyn/Tuipolotu at 13/14 means we could see Seaman inside Shona slipped under the radar.

[George Carlin]

My favourite rugby player name is Sione Polota-Nau.

I presume his younger brother is Polota-Later.

[BigGee]

An interview with Craig Jackson by Mark palmer in the ST. Talks a bit about the Super 6 and other stuff he does. I have watched the televised game for the past three weeks and would agree that the standard has improved week on week as the players have got back into playing some rugby. It looks a better product than what was on offer in the first season already. Summer rugby helps i guess, some of those grounds (Stirling and Melrose in particular) look just stunning in the sunshine and it certainly helps the rugby.

Jackson unfortunately for him, looked like he picked up a nasty knee injury in the Southern Knights win over Bourghmuir on sunday and I imagine his season will be over.



Craig Jackson spins a lot of plates and fills a lot of cups. The Southern Knights captain, whose day job is running the rugby performance course at Edinburgh College, has built a successful coffee venture during the pandemic, his Bean ‘n Gone trailer quickly becoming a fixture outside the Greenyards gates.

So popular have the centre’s creations proved with locals and — more recently — the returning tourist trade that Jackson has already secured a second unit to cover the event circuit.

“We launched at the back end of last year and it went pretty crazy pretty quickly,” he explains. “I’d always been interested in coffee and wanted to have a little coffee shop of my own. I got offered a trailer a couple of years ago and turned it down, but this time, when I had a bit more time without any rugby [due to the Covid-19 shutdown], I said to myself, ‘If there’s ever a time to do this, it’s probably now.’

“We set up in November/December when we got out of the first lockdown and then even when we went into the second one, we were able to stay open and build. We’re in an ideal spot, with the Greenyards being such an iconic place. We’re across from the [Gibson Park] caravan park, there are lots of walkers, and people are still a bit apprehensive about going into [indoor] places for coffee.

“I’d managed to double book myself at an event so I thought I’d better get a shimmy on and get another trailer out on the road. We’ll keep one back at base in Melrose and the other can be a bit of a tourer. I don’t have any grand plan for the business; I’m just going with it at the moment.

“It’s kicked off to being more than a side hobby, but I’m still trying to focus on my college work and rugby. Ask me in a couple of months if I’m managing to juggle it all!”

Jackson stocks a range of home baking from other local businesses. These products have also gone down well with just about everyone except Ross Ford, Scotland’s most capped male player who is now in charge of the forwards and strength and conditioning at the Knights.

“The baking is probably why I’m not going too great at the minute,” laughs Jackson. “Fordy is not happy with that at all — he says I’ve got to stop with the cakes!”

In truth, the 29-year-old has adapted well to the demands of the FOSROC Super6, the SRU’s “part-time professional” competition designed to act as a bridge between the club and professional games, which continues this afternoon with the Knights hosting Boroughmuir Bears.

For the players, it is a significant undertaking, with three training sessions a week, plus three gym sessions and video analysis to fit in around their other commitments. Murrayfield have stipulated a maximum annual salary of £12,000, with the vast majority of players earning nowhere near this and requiring to supplement their income with a “normal” job or working towards one through study.

For Jackson, who had a spell as a professional with London Scottish and played for Scotland Sevens at the 2018 World Cup, Super6 is unlikely to prove a route back to a full-time contract, but he is in no doubt as to its potential for younger players.

“I want to play at the highest level possible for as long as possible, but it’s more about helping those younger ones, using your experience to help them push through. I wish this competition had happened five years ago when I was a bit younger, because I can see what it’s doing for the lads who have aspirations to kick on and become professionals.”

This should have been the third season of Super6, but the second did not happen and the first was curtailed before the scheduled play-off phase. There have, necessarily, been some rough edges on view in the opening weeks of the tournament, with players stepping back into the arena for the first time since the start of the pandemic. Even so, the style of rugby and attacking ambition are to everyone’s credit, and represent a quantum leap from the (literally) dark midwinter days of that first season when the weather and general vibe were very different.

As a veteran (and, with Melrose, a winner) of the old Premiership, Jackson is ideally placed to gauge the extent to which the desired improvement in skills, conditioning and general “professionalism” has actually taken place.

“Without a shadow of a doubt,” he says when asked if there has been a big leap forward. “Back in the day in the Premiership, with the four top teams there were pretty good standards in those games, but you could probably win other games being 10 per cent off it. Nowadays, if you’re 10 per cent off it, you’ll be on the wrong end of the scoreboard. It’s improved massively. You can see the difference in standards, ambition to play and physicality. If you fall asleep for 30 seconds, most teams will score against you, whereas if you did that in the Premiership you could probably get away with it with mid-table or lower-table teams.

“Some days you would get upsets, but it wasn’t as rife. The standard has gone up. You can see that with some of the pros who drop down — they don’t stand out as much as they would if they dropped to the Premiership.

“I remember some pros coming down and they could just take the piss out of the Premiership, really. The guys who come down now are adding to it, but they’re not miles above everyone else.”

Jackson, a cousin of former Scotland international Ruaridh, is recruiting this year’s intake for a college course which was initially developed by Rob Chrystie, the Knights head coach, and helped the likes of Dougie Fife and Damien Hoyland go from the fringes of the established pathway to Edinburgh contracts and Test caps.

“Rob created a very successful programme, and I’ve probably just inherited his good work to be fair. It’s now trying to put my spin on it and make sure it stays as successful. It’s a difficult year to recruit, with no rugby having been played in the last year or so. You normally look around, sound around, but there’s not a lot to go on and we’re struggling a bit for numbers. It’s the same across the board, but we’ll get there.”

It’s not just the caffeine talking — Jackson gets stuff done.

[BigGee]

Anyone fancy doing a new thread, this one is just about full!

[George Carlin]

Anyone fancy doing a new thread, this one is just about full!

When you're right, you're right Gee.

https://www.606v2.com/t70348-glasgow-and-edinburgh-unceasing-banter-thread-27

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