Cleverley v Bellew about to be made for October 15th!

Ok so here is some more breaking news

Semms this fight will be made after all. Also it give Groves a slot on the undercard, well thats my prediction anyway.

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/news.php?p=29011&more=1

www.maineventboxing.wordpress.com

This article on BBC Wales Sport contridictes that mind

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/wales/14645343.stm

Not saying that your article is wrong just seems a strange mixture of info

Don't worry Steffan, i am not precious over my sources

I hope this fight happens this year either way

Be the first England v Wales title fight since Haye v Enzo

And we got well and truly turned over there I gotta be honest

I read this was possibly gonna be on October 29th. If tut were the case it'd be a good night, what with Froch-Ward too.

dont worry Steffan, i do not see Wales losing out on this one

Seanusarrilius wrote:dont worry Steffan, i do not see Wales losing out on this one

Me neither. I gotta be honest the whole England v Wales and Bellew and Clev not getting on will promote this fight but if we are honest if Bellew was...say...a Polish guy then people would have no interest and be saying that Clev is fighting a Warren fed tomato can etc

Wales by mid to late stoppage or wide UD for me.

The Galveston Giant wrote:Wales by mid to late stoppage or wide UD for me.

And who will Scotland be cheering for in this Anglo-Welsh clash?

David was the original fight, BBBofC mandatory. Think offers were made to McIntosh too, but the David fight wont happen if they sign the Clev one.

Joke of a fight if i'm honest, so much for wanting to fight the divisions best.

cleverly will destroy bellew inside 5 rounds to be honest cant see anything but a ko win for cleverly. think cleverly should fight cloud after if he fights hopkins he will get destroyed though

It is a matter of size. Evolution. Isn't it, gentlemen? The other man Bellew has not the size, the strength, the genetics to win. It is physically impossible for this little man to win. Cleverly is a look at the future!

Would be interesting to see cleverly in with macrineli i think he would knock him out too

Big Mac is now back with Enzo Calzaghe. He is a better trainer than Vince Cleverly. If they were to meet in the ring one would think Enzo Calzaghe (who is a boxing genius) may conjure up a cunning plan to defeat the seemingly unstoppable Cleverly

So a boxing genius is now defined as having a son who is so damm good that any trainer would look good training him?

Imperial Ghosty wrote:So a boxing genius is now defined as having a son who is so damm good that any trainer would look good training him?

Bit harsh, he had 3 world champions in his stable at one point.

I'd hardly call Enzo Calzaghe a boxing genius. He had a naturally talented son, and a few paper champions.

BALTIMORA wrote:I'd hardly call Enzo Calzaghe a boxing genius. He had a naturally talented son, and a few paper champions.

Clearly you haven't seen this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYIzoFw2jI4

Scottrf wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:So a boxing genius is now defined as having a son who is so damm good that any trainer would look good training him?

Bit harsh, he had 3 world champions in his stable at one point.

He really should thank Frank Warren for that who did a sterling job for him.

Who were Enzo Calzaghe's champs promoted by? Wasn't Warren by any chance, was it?

BALTIMORA wrote:Who were Enzo Calzaghe's champs promoted by? Wasn't Warren by any chance, was it?

Coincidence.

enzo won trainer of the year a while ago he is a good but calzaghe would have been champ no matter who trained him not sure about macarinelli or rees though

Scottrf wrote:

BALTIMORA wrote:I'd hardly call Enzo Calzaghe a boxing genius. He had a naturally talented son, and a few paper champions.

Clearly you haven't seen this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYIzoFw2jI4

Jesus Christ. That's awful. Enzo C will always in my mind be a cross between Geoff and Pops from The League of Gentlemen.

I said a couple of months ago that Cleverley did not have the ambition to fight top fighters and this proves it. Both looking for a pay day, with Cleverley looking for an easy win. I can see him being as protected as Calzaghe, so we will always have doubts on whether he really is any good or not

Cleverly is one of the most hated fighters on this forum. But thats fine I just cant wait when he proves you all wrong

He isn't hated Steffan you should not confuse people being a little unconvinced of his abilities with hatred. Also people will inevitably be cynical of him given he has been given a WBO belt which he did not win in the ring and has lined up a domestic opponent as his first defence because people will interpret this as another fighter going down the well worn Warren route of talking big about facing the best but delivering no such fights.

Heres hoping Frank and Nathan go on to prove us all wrong, Clev certainly posseses the ambition to do so it would appear but talk is cheap and it is ultimately his actions in the ring which people will judge him on, and at the minute,and I do stress at the minute his actions in the ring and levels of opposition are hardly awe inspiring.

Steffan I would echo rowley there insofar as I dont think Cleverly is hated but he has yet to convince many people (myslef included) that he is a bonafide world champion and his next fight with Bellew will do little for him in that regard.

I still see him as rather raw materials rather than finished goods at the moment and I suspect his handlers do to which is why Bellew and not some of the bigger names is being lined up next. Not Cleverlys fault but more a reflection of the poor state of boxing at present as I dont believe either in terms of acheivement or talent Cleverly can claim to be even 3rd best in his division at the moment. However time is on his side and as you say he will have ample chances to prove his doubters wrong.

I agree that he is not hated, at least not by me. But when I see someone talk big and then do something else, I'll call it. I will be happy to be proven wrong, especially as it would give us another British fighter to be proud of.

Steffan wrote:I hope this fight happens this year either way

Be the first England v Wales title fight since Haye v Enzo

And we got well and truly turned over there I gotta be honest

The fight was nowhere near as one sided as the Enzo bashers like to make out. In parts Enzo outboxed Haye. Looking back on it in hindsight a good big fella boxing behind a stiff jab was always gonna expose Haye. Haye capitalised on a dreadful division and got badly exposed as soon as he fought someone very good. Enzo has better fundamentals than Haye.

Super D Boon wrote:The fight was nowhere near as one sided as the Enzo bashers like to make out. In parts Enzo outboxed Haye. Looking back on it in hindsight a good big fella boxing behind a stiff jab was always gonna expose Haye. Haye capitalised on a dreadful division and got badly exposed as soon as he fought someone very good. Enzo has better fundamentals than Haye.

Course he has. Never leaves his chin out to dry either.

I think most people like Cleverly, he comes across as a decent bloke.

But I think he is going to come unstuck when he steps up his opposition. Gets caught too easily and doesnt have enough power to keep the top guys off him. In my opinion, and I hope Im wrong.

Scottrf wrote:

Super D Boon wrote:The fight was nowhere near as one sided as the Enzo bashers like to make out. In parts Enzo outboxed Haye. Looking back on it in hindsight a good big fella boxing behind a stiff jab was always gonna expose Haye. Haye capitalised on a dreadful division and got badly exposed as soon as he fought someone very good. Enzo has better fundamentals than Haye.

Course he has. Never leaves his chin out to dry either.

Haye landed a couple of big shots but Enzo has the more rounded game. I hate it when the english biased BBC said Enzo was "outclassed" but he wasn't. If outclassed meaning he was beaten in every department then he wasn't. Enzo had moments in the fight where he boxed well behind the jab and the non-jabbing pot shot merchant Haye was caught a few times with it. Haye is the much better athlete who landed on a defensively naive fighter with zero survival skills. Does not mean he was "outclassed" though. Haye has been exposed as just a fly by night flash Harry with virtually no substance, no legacy but he can comfort himself with his millions where he will no doubt accumulate a fine selection of trilbe hats and get a nice pedicure for that poor little toe.

That may be true of Haye but where does that leave Maccarinelli by comparison? Haye is/was the better fighter and proved as much in almost every possible way. He fell short of the standards the Klitschko brothers apply but I would shudder to think of how Maccarinelli would fare against either brother when hes been so badly knocked out by much lesser fighters, Haye included.

D think they are using the term out claseed to mean knocked senseless within two rounds. Admire your sense of national pride but to claim this was anything other than a hiding seems fanciful

Super D Boon wrote:

Scottrf wrote:

Super D Boon wrote:The fight was nowhere near as one sided as the Enzo bashers like to make out. In parts Enzo outboxed Haye. Looking back on it in hindsight a good big fella boxing behind a stiff jab was always gonna expose Haye. Haye capitalised on a dreadful division and got badly exposed as soon as he fought someone very good. Enzo has better fundamentals than Haye.

Course he has. Never leaves his chin out to dry either.

Haye landed a couple of big shots but Enzo has the more rounded game. I hate it when the english biased BBC said Enzo was "outclassed" but he wasn't. If outclassed meaning he was beaten in every department then he wasn't. Enzo had moments in the fight where he boxed well behind the jab and the non-jabbing pot shot merchant Haye was caught a few times with it. Haye is the much better athlete who landed on a defensively naive fighter with zero survival skills. Does not mean he was "outclassed" though. Haye has been exposed as just a fly by night flash Harry with virtually no substance, no legacy but he can comfort himself with his millions where he will no doubt accumulate a fine selection of trilbe hats and get a nice pedicure for that poor little toe.

Lucky punch is that? Enzo was caught before the end, and if you are doing the chicken dance in the second round you can't really complain about the word outclassed being used.

One could argue Audley Harrison was not outclassed by Haye or Mitchell was not outclassed by Katsidas using similar analysis. I see it being a case of when the better ifghter applied the pressure then the opponent folded notwithstanding the previous couple of rounds were not decisive.

alma wrote:

joeyjojo618 wrote:I think most people like Cleverly, he comes across as a decent bloke.

But I think he is going to come unstuck when he steps up his opposition. Gets caught too easily and doesnt have enough power to keep the top guys off him. In my opinion, and I hope Im wrong.

Still young of course Mr Shabbadu, although the lack of power is certainly worrying

Given that he broke the nose of two of his last three fighters then I'm not sure if power is that much of an issue. He needs to land a stack of punches to get his foes outta there but then so did Calzaghe. I think his defence though is very worrying the way he lunges in with his chin in the air, he's open to the sucker punch and was badly wobbled by his last opponent , a known light puncher. If he did that against Cloud or Dawson even Hopkins I reckon he's not getting knocked out cold.

Lol Macarineli got completely destroyed by Haye he should fight roy Jones next to see who gets knocked out quicker lol.

Colonial Lion wrote:One could argue Audley Harrison was not outclassed by Haye or Mitchell was not outclassed by Katsidas using similar analysis. I see it being a case of when the better ifghter applied the pressure then the opponent folded notwithstanding the previous couple of rounds were not decisive.

Whatever analysis you use I just don't agree that Macca was outclassed, the first round was close and he boxed well behind the jab.

Maybe it's a bad comparison but to demonstrate my point it's like saying Herol Graham was outclassed by Julian Jackson just because he took one of the biggest KO highlight reel shots in recent memory. Obviously Graham was in no way outclassed in that fight.

Super D Boon wrote:

alma wrote:

joeyjojo618 wrote:I think most people like Cleverly, he comes across as a decent bloke.

But I think he is going to come unstuck when he steps up his opposition. Gets caught too easily and doesnt have enough power to keep the top guys off him. In my opinion, and I hope Im wrong.

Still young of course Mr Shabbadu, although the lack of power is certainly worrying

Given that he broke the nose of two of his last three fighters then I'm not sure if power is that much of an issue. He needs to land a stack of punches to get his foes outta there but then so did Calzaghe. I think his defence though is very worrying the way he lunges in with his chin in the air, he's open to the sucker punch and was badly wobbled by his last opponent , a known light puncher. If he did that against Cloud or Dawson even Hopkins I reckon he's not getting knocked out cold.

Sorry what am I like I mean "getting knocked out cold"

It is a poor example indeed because up until the knockout most everyone would agree that Graham had won all the round that has gone before it and from recollection by some margin. Think it is pretty debateable to claim Enzo had won the rounds limited as they were and if indeed he had it was by the thinnest of margins.

Well out of curiosity how would you describe what happened to Maccarinelli in a couple of words?

I have some idea of where you are coming from in terms of your logic as the knockout was so early in the fight it was not yet determined who had established themselves but I think on all evidence, not just that fight, but of the two careers of both fighters and their relative abiities that Maccarinelli was the inferior fighter by some distance. Im not sure I agree that Maccarinelli has better fundementals or the like because again do we argue that because Audley Harrison has a better jab tha Haye he has better fundementals? Even if he does its pretty much irrelevant in the context of the all round package.

Haye is a knockout artist, especially at cruiser so any one of his victims might argue the same as Maccarinelli that Haye had not officially outclassed them before he knocked them out but it seems a bit hollow in the grand scheme of things I must say.

Bad example or not, I have watched the fight several times and maintain that Macca was not "outclassed". I do not believe landing a couple of big rights amounts to such. If Haye was battering him around the ring then landed a couple of chin breaking bombs then fine. But this was not the case.

There had only been one significant punch landed before the end of the fight, and that a pretty decent overhand right landed by Haye. I distinctly remember being surprised that Enzo stayed on his feet. Aside from that and the final barrages that finished it, the fight was a lot of prancing and preening by two people obviously respectful of each others power.

I can, just about, see your argument, only in as much as the fight was so short, but it is hard to get a more comprehensive victory.

Having said all that, Ricky Hatton was winning the second round against Pacquiao by a "country mile".

My comment got removed. How childish

Must have been your "snarling cockney's" comment. Which, frankly, was a bit silly.

Mind the windows Tino. wrote:Must have been your "snarling cockney's" comment. Which, frankly, was a bit silly.

Or could of been some petty poster reporting me or also a moderator drunk on power

Either way it was so childish

It depends how you define 'outclassed'. Comparing the fight to Graham / Jackson is ridiculous though. That fight went on for many more rounds with Graham dominating for long periods. Macca was out of there in the second there was no long period for him to dominate. A better comparison is Tyson / Tubbs. A close first round arguably won by the eventual loser, followed by a destructive KO in the second.

No Steffan, your ridiculously boring Welsh/English them against us stance is what is childish. You've been told before, now quit whining.