david haye hatred!

by rycoys Wed 10 Jul 2013, 7:55 pm

I can't understand why people on here are so negative towards haye,
As boxing fans surely we should appriciate boxing talant and haye is sheer class
With natural ability snd watching him box should be a joy , I can understand people not likeing him for doing I'm a celeb or programmes with other celebs but I don't care if he wants to do it it's up to him,
The stick he got for the wlad fight was so over the top he lost on points to an all time great heavy who would stop any other heavy in the world , froch lostv o Kessler and ward but gets praised because he took punches and came out looking bruised and batterd! Haye has never been that kind of fighter and always used reflexes and speed so was never going to go out all guns blazing at wlad, ( who would)

He's not perfect,the inactivity and the ppv but the point is people should be excited that such a talant is back
Not negative , just my opinion but i like most at men will be supporting him anyway ,

by Atila Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:21 pm

First of, I don't hate Haye though I'll admit that he's never been a favourite of mine.

For me, the stick he gets for the Wlad loss is due to him standing on a table at a press conference showing his big toe and blaming that for the loss.

by rycoys Wed 10 Jul 2013, 8:27 pm

Atila wrote:First of, I don't hate Haye though I'll admit that he's never been a favourite of mine.

For me, the stick he gets for the Wlad loss is due to him standing on a table at a press conference showing his big toe and blaming that for the loss.

Yes not he's best move and he shouldent have done it , but the frustration of not being at he's best got the better of him , think he must regret it now ,

by mobilemaster8 Wed 10 Jul 2013, 9:11 pm

Hindsight's a wonderful gift.

But reality is that Haye is probably the 3rd best heavy on the planet behind the Klitschkos.

by Strongback Wed 10 Jul 2013, 9:26 pm

There isn't enough Haye hatred if you ask me.

The toe-rag gets away with murder.

by rycoys Wed 10 Jul 2013, 9:30 pm

Strongback wrote:There isn't enough Haye hatred if you ask me.

The toe-rag gets away with murder.

what exactally does he get away with?

by Strongback Wed 10 Jul 2013, 10:08 pm

rycoys wrote:
Strongback wrote:There isn't enough Haye hatred if you ask me.

The toe-rag gets away with murder.
what exactally does he get away with?

He should have been arrested along with Chisora.

He talked his way into a fight with Wlad and ran like a biatch yet there are guys like yourself still blowing wind up his ass.

He's fought in the worst PPV fight in the history of British Boxing.

Do you want me to keep going. Don't let perspective get in your way.

by Steffan Wed 10 Jul 2013, 10:52 pm

His wars with Monte Barrett, Audley Harrison and Dereck Chisora (the one in the ring) will go down in folklore legend. His bravery against Wlad figting with that horrific toe injury will also go down in the history books as legendary stuff. Now he is taking on Tyson Fury. A proven world level fighter with scalps over many great opponents behind him

David Haye...we salute you

by **hampo17** Wed 10 Jul 2013, 11:06 pm

Could be worse I suppose Steffan, he could have fought the NHS like your hero Wink

by manos de piedra Wed 10 Jul 2013, 11:24 pm

Atila wrote:First of, I don't hate Haye though I'll admit that he's never been a favourite of mine.

For me, the stick he gets for the Wlad loss is due to him standing on a table at a press conference showing his big toe and blaming that for the loss.

It was his little toe!

by Steffan Wed 10 Jul 2013, 11:28 pm

hampo171 wrote:Could be worse I suppose Steffan, he could have fought the NHS like your hero

But at least Clev is now fighting a top 5 opponent. Something Haye wouldnt know anything about other than the Wlad toe-gate fight

And anyway the thread is about Haye not Cleverly so if your gonna defend him do it without bringing other fighters into it please thumbsup

by Steffan Wed 10 Jul 2013, 11:29 pm

manos de piedra wrote:It was his little toe!

Yes it was my error. Which makes his bravery even more amazing

by manos de piedra Wed 10 Jul 2013, 11:39 pm

I understand why Haye does what he does, hes made an absolute fortune from fighting absolute mediocrity, Klitschko aside. I just dont find anything endearing about the way he goes about it. Its not like you are getting compensated with quality opponents or thrilling fights either for the most part. PPV for opponents like Audley or Ruiz? I think he deserves the stick he gets for some of his actions and I think his sheer class either in or out of the ring is an open question. I dont really hate the guy but I stopped being fan around about the time he won his heavyweight title.

by azania Wed 10 Jul 2013, 11:47 pm

Strongback wrote:
rycoys wrote:
Strongback wrote:There isn't enough Haye hatred if you ask me.

The toe-rag gets away with murder.
what exactally does he get away with?

He should have been arrested along with Chisora.

He talked his way into a fight with Wlad and ran like a biatch yet there are guys like yourself still blowing wind up his ass.

He's fought in the worst PPV fight in the history of British Boxing.

Do you want me to keep going. Don't let perspective get in your way.

Where does that comment come from and why such an analogy? Surely doing that is not something to write home about.

by Atila Thu 11 Jul 2013, 1:51 am

manos de piedra wrote:
Atila wrote:First of, I don't hate Haye though I'll admit that he's never been a favourite of mine.

For me, the stick he gets for the Wlad loss is due to him standing on a table at a press conference showing his big toe and blaming that for the loss.

It was his little toe!

Oh, that changes everything then.

by Rowley Thu 11 Jul 2013, 7:44 am

As Manos has already alluded to, when has he demonstrated as a heavyweight that inside the ring he is sheer class? He has looked OK on occasion blowing away overmatched and largely past their best opposition. When he has fought better heavyweights such as Wlad or Valuev he has either got pretty much taken to the cleaners or absolutely stunk the place out. If that is enough to qualify as sheer class in this day and age we are setting the bar fairly low.

by **seanmichaels** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 8:43 am

Rowley wrote:As Manos has already alluded to, when has he demonstrated as a heavyweight that inside the ring he is sheer class? He has looked OK on occasion blowing away overmatched and largely past their best opposition. When he has fought better heavyweights such as Wlad or Valuev he has either got pretty much taken to the cleaners or absolutely stunk the place out. If that is enough to qualify as sheer class in this day and age we are setting the bar fairly low.

I thought he looked class getting rid of Chisora, something Vitali was unable to do.

by Rowley Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:18 am

I suppose I should concede that there is a level of credit deserved for the Chisora performance. Will say from the off I don’t rate Chisora, to steal yet another line from Manos he is Samuel Peter without the punch. However he is normally fairly durable and Haye got him out of there in decent style and fairly early so fair play to that. Still maintain though that beating a guy who pretty much everyone of any class beats is not enough to mark you out as sheer class.

by **seanmichaels** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:25 am

Haye isn't sheer class agreed. I think you'd excuse a dodgy performance if he fought more often.

Think Chisora is a dangerous fighter. Not consistent but the Helenius and Vitali fights show when he gets it right he is (in my opinion) a world level operator. Looked good against Haye early on as well.

by ONETWOFOREVER Thu 11 Jul 2013, 9:41 am

Haye did something no heavy has done in a long time and thats bringing excitment to the division for a short while when he goaded Wlad with his in your face style. His pod casts and youtube uploads added to the anticipation of that fight and for a short while the heavyweight division was being talked about.

Alas he flopped big time. Apart from his antics outside of the ring he gets no respect from me.

by Reborn-DeeMcK-Reborn Thu 11 Jul 2013, 11:30 am

Guysss!!! SSSsssshhh!!!

You are gonna wake DAVE up!!!

He will go crazy if he reads all these bad comments about his hero!!!!

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 11:48 am

I dont think the hatred Haye gets is as bad as Fury. People got behind Haye for his fights but he lost to Klitschko and it was a boring fight. I dont want to see that again. I would prefer to see Fury against Klitschko as he has a better style and is a natural heavyweight. Fury is the future and Haye has already had his chance. If you check the poll on who people want to win most have picked Haye so I dont think he is hated.

by horizontalhero Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:03 pm

winchester wrote:I dont think the hatred Haye gets is as bad as Fury. People got behind Haye for his fights but he lost to Klitschko and it was a boring fight. I dont want to see that again. I would prefer to see Fury against Klitschko as he has a better style and is a natural heavyweight. Fury is the future and Haye has already had his chance. If you check the poll on who people want to win most have picked Haye so I dont think he is hated.

Sorry, but what do you mean by 'has a better style'? surely you meant has no style.

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:09 pm

Fury has a better style for beating the Klitschkos. They are cautious boxers who dont like to take risks and try to box at a distance. Hayes style wasnt suited to that and he lacked the size. Fury is even bigger than the Klitschkos, he has more heart and his style can bully them with strength and aggression which is what the Klitschkos fear.

by Champagne_Socialist Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:20 pm

winchester wrote:Fury has a better style for beating the Klitschkos. They are cautious boxers who dont like to take risks and try to box at a distance. Hayes style wasnt suited to that and he lacked the size. Fury is even bigger than the Klitschkos, he has more heart and his style can bully them with strength and aggression which is what the Klitschkos fear.

Do you have any evidence that they fear this?

by Rowley Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:24 pm

Champagne_Socialist wrote:
winchester wrote:Fury has a better style for beating the Klitschkos. They are cautious boxers who dont like to take risks and try to box at a distance. Hayes style wasnt suited to that and he lacked the size. Fury is even bigger than the Klitschkos, he has more heart and his style can bully them with strength and aggression which is what the Klitschkos fear.

Do you have any evidence that they fear this?

To be fair Vitali looked petrified against Lewis

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:31 pm

You can tell from the way that they fight that they are afraid to take chances and get hit. Lennox Lewis is not an aggressive fighter. He boxed quite similarly to the Klitschkos and was a cautious boxer himself. Boxers like Mike Tyson or George Foreman would have the Klitschkos petrified because they would attack them aggressively and not let them sit and jab at a distance. The Klitschkos would never box those guys.

by **hampo17** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:35 pm

winchester wrote:You can tell from the way that they fight that they are afraid to take chances and get hit. Lennox Lewis is not an aggressive fighter. He boxed quite similarly to the Klitschkos and was a cautious boxer himself. Boxers like Mike Tyson or George Foreman would have the Klitschkos petrified because they would attack them aggressively and not let them sit and jab at a distance. The Klitschkos would never box those guys.

What do you base this on? The Klitschkos have never ducked a challenge, and have always fought their mandatories.

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:41 pm

I base it on everything I have seen of them so far. The way the box, the way act and the way they choose opponents. When an opponent is dangerous they dont seem interested in fighting them. They never fought Valuev because he was massive and they let Haye take care of their job for them and I think they are hoping he will again. But they saw how Haye fought against Valuev and realised that his style was not aggressive and he could box safetly at a distance. Look at Chisora for example. Fury beat Chisora when both were unbeaten and it was very early in Furys career. Who gets ofered a much - Chisora. Chisora actually did better against Klitschko than against Fury even though Klitschko had way more experience and Chisora had lost to Fury already. If Tyson or Foreman were around now the Klitschkos wouldnt go near them unless they were old and past it.

by Rowley Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:55 pm

Can I just say Vitali fought Lewis on a fortnights notice. Are these the action of a safety first guy only looking for easy options?

by **hampo17** Thu 11 Jul 2013, 2:59 pm

winchester wrote:I base it on everything I have seen of them so far. The way the box, the way act and the way they choose opponents. When an opponent is dangerous they dont seem interested in fighting them. They never fought Valuev because he was massive and they let Haye take care of their job for them and I think they are hoping he will again. But they saw how Haye fought against Valuev and realised that his style was not aggressive and he could box safetly at a distance. Look at Chisora for example. Fury beat Chisora when both were unbeaten and it was very early in Furys career. Who gets ofered a much - Chisora. Chisora actually did better against Klitschko than against Fury even though Klitschko had way more experience and Chisora had lost to Fury already. If Tyson or Foreman were around now the Klitschkos wouldnt go near them unless they were old and past it.

Vitali Klitschko offered Valuev £2.5m and he turned it down. Here's the article.

WBC world heavyweight champion Vitali “Dr. Iron Fist” Klitschko called former two-time WBA heavyweight titlist Nikolai Valuev a “chicken” this week for rejecting a $2.5 million contract offer to fight this spring.

Instead of scrapping the enormous Russian Valuev (50-2-0-1, 34 KOs), Klitschko (39-2, 37 KOs) will defend his crown versus Polish pugilist Albert Sosnowski (45-2-1, 27 KOs) on May 29 in Germany.

“I don’t want to speak bad about him, but I gave Valuev the biggest financial proposal of his career,” said Klitschko, 38, a Ukrainian who has the highest knockout percentage (94.9 percent) of any heavyweight champion ever.

“He [Valuev] told me ‘No, four.’ There are two reasons why he’s done this. Firstly, he wanted to say no anyway. Four million is unrealistic for someone who has just lost their title. The second point is that he understands if the loses to me straight after losing his title, that’s it for him. Valuev is a chicken.”

Russian immigrant Alex Yuzhakov stated that he agrees with Klitschko that Valuev is indeed a coward.

“Klitschko is right, Valuev is a chicken,” said Yuzhakov, 28, who was born in Moscow and currently resides in Somerville. “For a Russian man to turn down $2.5 million a lot of fear must have been involved. Maybe he’s waiting for a more opportune time to fight Klitschko. No matter, he will never beat the true ex-Soviet beast.”

Valuev squandered his belt last November when he lost a close majority decision to Englishman David “The Hayemaker” Haye (23-1, 21KOs).

Haye is scheduled to defend his WBA championship against Methuen’s John Ruiz (44-8-1-1, 30 KOs) in the United Kingdom on April 3.

Provided that both Klitschko and Haye emerge victorious in their respective bouts, “Dr. Iron Fist” would like the opportunity to fight “The Hayemaker” sometime before the conclusion of 2010.

However, Klitschko’s younger brother, IBF, IBO, and WBO champ Wladimir, would also like to imminently battle Haye.

“I told my brother, ‘I want to fight Haye,' but he said no, he wants to fight him,” said Klitschko, who announced in January that he intends to retire at the end of this year. “For him [Wladimir] it is personal, but for me I want the title. My brother already has three but I have to clear it with him. I hope he listens to his older brother.”

A matchup pitting Vitali Klitschko with Haye would be fascinating because of their greatly contrasting styles and body frames.

Klitschko is a towering and rugged specimen who is renowned for his ability to launch powerful bombs with both of his fists.

On the contrary, Haye is essentially an enlarged cruiserweight who would need to outbox and evade Klitschko in order to prevail.

Ultimately, as long as one of the Klitschko brothers fights Haye, fans of boxing will win.

by bhb001 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:07 pm

winchester wrote:I base it on everything I have seen of them so far.

So opinion then, which may be skewed, not their statistics.

Wlad - KO percentage 80.95 from 60- wins

Vitali - 87.23% from 45 wins

Fury - 71.43% from 21 fights

All good percentages, but the K bros have sustained it through lots more fights and all at high level. They aren't cautious. They are effective.

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:11 pm

Yes sounds like typical Klitschko policy. Offer a guy a match when he has just lost, say the guy isnt interested and then go and fight some rubbish opponent instead! Ive never even heard of Sosnowski.

by TopHat24/7 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:13 pm

winchester wrote:Yes sounds like typical Klitschko policy. Offer a guy a match when he has just lost, say the guy isnt interested and then go and fight some rubbish opponent instead! Ive never even heard of Sosnowski.

Says more about you than it does the K's....

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:14 pm

Statistics can always be skewed. Fury has a better record than both Klitschkos statistically yet somehow I doubt you will accept that to say Fury would beat them.

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:16 pm

TopHat24/7 wrote:
winchester wrote:Yes sounds like typical Klitschko policy. Offer a guy a match when he has just lost, say the guy isnt interested and then go and fight some rubbish opponent instead! Ive never even heard of Sosnowski.

Says more about you than it does the K's....

Not really. I looked him up there. Hes rubbish. Yet still manages to get offered a match by the Klitschkos.

by TopHat24/7 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:21 pm

By 'still' you mean 3 yrs ago and when he'd built up a 42-2 record........

by JabMachineMK2 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:21 pm

winchester wrote:Fury has a better record than both Klitschkos statistically yet somehow I doubt you will accept that to say Fury would beat them.

HAS to be a WUM. HAS to be.

I don't get where all this "heart" bullsh*t has come from about Tyson Fury. He gets decked by poor boxers and gets up and that shows he has heart? No good sir, heart is when you triumph in the face of adversity. Heart is keeping on going ala Vitali against Lennox even though he could have lost his eye.

Getting knocked down and getting up a few times against average/poor boxers is NOT heart, I have no idea where this has come from. He has decent powers of recovery against boxers that are nowhere near elite. WOW such heart. SUCH A ROLE MODEL.

Seriously. Stop saying he has heart. If you think Fury has heart you have absolutely no clue what you're saying.

by Rowley Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:23 pm

winchester wrote:Yes sounds like typical Klitschko policy. Offer a guy a match when he has just lost,

Fair point because when Valuev was 46-0 and on the cusp of equalling Marciano's record Don King was busting a gut to match him with one of the brothers.

by TopHat24/7 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:24 pm

I think by 'record', Jab, Winny means Fury's loss ratio is 0%. Which technically is better than either K.

by bhb001 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:25 pm

winchester wrote:Statistics can always be skewed. Fury has a better record than both Klitschkos statistically yet somehow I doubt you will accept that to say Fury would beat them.

Statistics aren't skewed. They are numbers and, as such, are black and white. Interpretation skews. Fury has a 100% record, but has only had half the fights of Vital and a third of the fights of Wlad. They have operated at the top of the game for several years now. Fury is just starting out in comparison and has none of the ring smarts that they have, learnt through winning and losing. Maybe Fury will get there, but he isn't there yet, in the opinion of me and many other people.

by JabMachineMK2 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:26 pm

Rowley he doesn't understand sarcasm!

He'll take you literally and it'll just build more towards his w*nk bank.

Toppy, statistically I have beaten more amateur middleweights than Fury so therefore he is ducking me as I would like to offer him a fight right now. If he doesn't offer it to me he is blatantly ducking and as such makes me Britains greatest prospect.

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:26 pm

Fury has bags of heart. When hes been knocked down, he gets up to win. When people write him off and claim he wont take big fights he proves them wrong.

My point about stastics was to emphasise that they can be manipulated to support an argument when it suits. This seems to have been lost on you. I dont care what the Klitschkos knock record is I have watched them fight and I know they fight cautiously.

by Rowley Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:32 pm

winchester wrote: I dont care what the Klitschkos knock record is I have watched them fight and I know they fight cautiously.

Suspect they are too busy winning to worry unduly about your view on the aesthetics of it all.

by smashingstormcrow Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:34 pm

JabMachineMK2 wrote:
HAS to be a WUM. HAS to be.

You think?

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:35 pm

Rowley wrote:
winchester wrote: I dont care what the Klitschkos knock record is I have watched them fight and I know they fight cautiously.

Suspect they are too busy winning to worry unduly about your view on the aesthetics of it all.

Thats not the point though is it? I suspect Fury is too busy winning and making millions to care what the people slagging him off think also.

by JabMachineMK2 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:35 pm

winchester wrote:I have watched them fight and I know they fight cautiously.

So where do some of the highest knockout percentages in boxing history come from?

I just cannot believe you are saying that a unified champion who has beaten every single heavyweight put in front of him for the past 9 years.

Do you realise how long that is? Its your mental age. Avenged his loss to Lamon Brewster, Knocked out Thompson, Knocked out Samuel Peters, hammered Chagaev, Byrd, Brock and Austin.

These are wimps? Don't fight? Yeah, love to see you in the ring with any of Wlads opponents. Infact, love to see you in the ring with Wlad. Posesses an absolute screamhammerdeath of a right.

Signed to fight Povetkin, undefeated Heavyweight champion of the world. Paper champion yes, but he's wanted this for a while. Yeah...duckers.

Vitali fought Lewis at 2 weeks notice and gets himself involved in wars. Durable and earlier with more power than his brother, they fight differently. You don't watch enough boxing to understand.

by Rowley Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:39 pm

I'm absolutey positive Fury doesn't care. Suspect he would be more concerned were we not talking about him as by doing so we shift tickets and keep him in the press. To be honest I cannot really say if it is the point or not as I long since lost any idea what point it is you are trying to make.

As best I can work it out it is something to do with a bloke who fought Lennox Lewis on short notice ducking a guy who got knocked down by Steve Cunningham, but I may be missing something.

by winchester Thu 11 Jul 2013, 3:55 pm

JabMachineMK2 wrote:
winchester wrote:I have watched them fight and I know they fight cautiously.

So where do some of the highest knockout percentages in boxing history come from?

I just cannot believe you are saying that a unified champion who has beaten every single heavyweight put in front of him for the past 9 years.

Do you realise how long that is? Its your mental age. Avenged his loss to Lamon Brewster, Knocked out Thompson, Knocked out Samuel Peters, hammered Chagaev, Byrd, Brock and Austin.

These are wimps? Don't fight? Yeah, love to see you in the ring with any of Wlads opponents. Infact, love to see you in the ring with Wlad. Posesses an absolute screamhammerdeath of a right.

Signed to fight Povetkin, undefeated Heavyweight champion of the world. Paper champion yes, but he's wanted this for a while. Yeah...duckers.

Vitali fought Lewis at 2 weeks notice and gets himself involved in wars. Durable and earlier with more power than his brother, they fight differently. You don't watch enough boxing to understand.

Id like to see you in the ring with Fury after the all abuse you give him instead of making up stories about being a boxer or posting us updates on who is on your blocked list. You think a 50 year old Lennox Lewis would beat Fury for heavens sake.

The Klitschkos fight cautiously and Fury has the size, style and heart to beat them. Thats my opinion. I may be wrong, I may be right.

by JabMachineMK2 Thu 11 Jul 2013, 4:07 pm

winchester wrote:I may be right.

Yeah....and pigs may fly pudding.

Think Lennox tonks Fury, still do. Foreman did it after coming back and took on boxers worth 10 of Fury. Plus he's 47. Not 50, wasn't in as many wars as Big George, didn't ship as much punishment and fought in a style that completely obliterates anything Fury has shown in his skillset.

Fury is slow for a heavyweight. This is based on evidence. Fury doesn't punch hard for a heavyweight. The only 2 durable people he's faced he's had to go to decision with (Chisora and Johnson) the others were never going to set the world alight. Evidence. Fury hasn't shown heart by fighting on with a dislocated jaw or getting up 4/5 times over 12 rounds to win a fight. Powder punchers have put him down and he's gotten up. Not heart. Based on evidence treacle.

This isn't me giving him sh*t - its based on evidence. The podcast presented him as a really nice bloke who's humble, but he will get spanked against Haye and he knows it. He'll milk this for all he's worth.

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