Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[navyblueshorts]

First topic message reminder :

Actually Davie, they didn't fit yours (apologies; 'idiocy' is a bit strong). Your earlier comments were all about how he'd actually done something terrible/illegal i.e. told them how to get around 3rd party ownership (he didn't) with the possible implication that he'd been knowingly involved in it (no evidence of this), took £400k for dodgy seminars (he didn't and he said he'd have to clear it with the FA) etc. You wanted him to be a crook from the off.
You also claimed Ben and I said he was 'innocent' - we said no such thing.

You never took S_R's approach re. his position being untenable because he was England manager, the one thing he probably falls foul of. His comments re. Hodgson/Nevile were unfortunate, but this was a private conversation and, actually, big deal. Seriously, the next poor schmuck who takes this on should treat the media as they deserve.

There may well be more to this - we'll see. Until then, the only thing he's 'guilty' of is putting himself in a stupid position cf. the FA's comments re. FIFA etc and forcing the FA to ask him to fall on his sword. S_R's right with this; the FA had little choice really.

[super_realist]

I remember taking my driving lessons in a corsa.
Wasn't to comfortable in in it.
Certainly wasn't terrible.

I've started taking the bus the odd place when I could drive for the first time in about 10 years.

Makes a nice change at times.

It's probably a sufficiently good car if all you do is drive around town, but it isn't a car which I'd want to travel any great distance in, not least because in my observation, Vauxhall drivers are the worst on the road.

[McLaren]

Super

I think you have missed my point. I am saying that the cars just above the cheapest ranges have reached the point where they give you everything the more expensive cars do. If you do go for something more expensive you have to accept all you are buying is the badge. To opt for non "premium" make is not to forgo travelling in comfort or getting the other perks of having a well equipped car.

[super_realist]

No they don't Mac, not even close.
To claim a premium car like a BMW, Audi, Jag or Merc is bought only for the badge just shows you to be completely ignorant on the subject.

To claim a Ford Focus (which is above budget) does all that a 5 Series does, is just an absurd statement. It shows you haven't driven or owned enough cars.

[pedro]

From a technical standpoint cars are becoming increasingly more identical. It's more or less all the same suppliers who supply to all manufacturers, who in reality are now little less than assembly plants. As an example VW, Audi and Skoda are basically the same cars, they just cater to different segments and have different pricing points. What is distinguishing premium brands from those right below is the look and feel and what you get as part of the standard package.

[super_realist]

It's true that many cars often use the same chassis, switchgear etc, but it is ridiculous to say that a Golf is the same as an A6 and that buying an A6 is just being a badge snob.
It's the sort of comment I'd expect someone who travels by bus to make.

[MontysMerkin]

How can an A6 be a golf. It's a skoda superb chassis.

[super_realist]

How can an A6 be a golf. It's a skoda superb chassis.

The point is that Mac is saying that as long as you spend an average amount on a car, there is effectively no difference between a car like this (Golf, Focus, Astra) and premium cars like the 5 Series, XF, E Class or A6.

[pedro]

Of course I'm not comparing a Golf to an A6, but comparing the class equivalents, as Monty says.

[super_realist]

A Superb isn't in the same sector as an A6 either, even if they're built on the same platform.

Having the same platform, and saying every car built on that platform is "basically the same" is like saying that Football and American Football are the same because they are played on a pitch of the same dimensions.

There's so much more to a car than the platform on which it is built. You only have to drive a Superb and an A6 to see that.

[pedro]

Of course there are differences. Just as there is between a man and a chimp. But 98% of the DNA is still the same.

[super_realist]

It's not though, the platform isn't 98% of the car. Rubbish analogy.

[pedro]

Platform and technology. The rest is look and feel. Whether that's 98% or 80% is less important.

[super_realist]

Still doesn't make a Superb "just as good" as an A6 according to Mac's criteria.

One is a family car, other is premium for a reason, and that comes down to big influence from the likes of better suspension, better engines, higher quality interiors, more safety features, driver features, driver enhancements etc etc etc. An A6 is not just a Superb with an Audi badge as Mac would have you believe.

It's like comparing Tesco Value to Waitrose's best range. Yes, they're both Orange Juice, but one is low end and the other is high end and there's a reason for it, which amounts to a lot.

[pedro]

On the A6 it's standard, on the Suberb it's optional with an additional price tag. Not all features, but many.

PS: I drive an Audi so don't get me wrong..

[super_realist]

Well, then you'll know the difference between the two if you've ever had the misfortune to have to slum it in a lower quality car for any length of time.

[pedro]

Yes I can tell the difference but I also know I pay for it, and probably more than it's 'worth'. But that's luxury; you pay disproportionally more just to get that little extra, and in many cases it's just intangibles. And the manufacturers know that of course.

[super_realist]

Of course, but Mac's assertion that an average "cheap" car does exactly the same as a premium car is demonstrably false, and how he said it was more the politics of envy rather than he's informed about the difference, seeing how he stated that buying an expensive car is all about badge snobbery. Says it all really.

[beninho]

New "standard" cars are all very samey. You pay extra for some add ons but not really a lot of difference. As you get to the more "luxury" car, like some Mercs, BMW, Audi then you will notice the difference, but you pay for it.

But some luxury cars are not all much better then the alternatives, a VW Passat is not disimilar to a Audi A4. The car manufacturing business is at the level when cars being produced are generally going to be of decent standard.

[super_realist]

An A4 isn't a luxury car though and it doesn't pretend to be.

[Davie]

So what makes an A4 better than say, a Passat or a Vectra?

[super_realist]

I'm not sure it is much better than a Passat or a Vectra (they don't even make Vectra's anymore, so an A4 is better than one of them), and I've never claimed it is.
An A4 is in the D Segment, same as the Passat and Insignia. It's not considered a luxury car, neither is the C Class, XE or 3 Series which are the class leaders.  


An A4 does have better driving dynamics than both a Passat and Vectra though, better materials, better interior, often 4x4, seating, driver aids,  more refined engines, better suspension, brakes etc because it's a more expensive and refined vehicle. Which does make it a tangibly more pleasurable place to be, which is my entire point that Mac couldn't understand.

Macs assertion was that as long as you get a well built cheap model of car, then it does everything that a luxury car can do. Well I can't see how it does.

[McLaren]

Super

As a big car guy did you stay up or get up early to watch the Grand Tour?

[super_realist]

I've just watched it Mac, some lame jokes and typical USA bluster from the American crowd, but overall pretty good. Certainly better than that awful BBC version with Chris Evans.

[McLaren]

I have prime and have never used it to watch anything so might as well give it a go.

[super_realist]

Worth a look, it's beautiful camera work and photography if nothing else Mac.
Glad they contractually can't do the "star in a car" crap

[Roller_Coaster]

Very much depended on who the guest was but the 4 minute "guest show" element around the driving was the weakest point of the Top Gear format to me. Fortunately the guest list did seem to be split between pluggers the BBC got on and people that were car aficionados that wanted/asked to appear.

Haven't got Amazon but might see if I can get the episode(s) from somewhere to have a shufty.

[McLaren]

Roller even if you don't have prime you can rent episodes on Amazon video.

[super_realist]

I got Amazon yesterday for £59 a year. Doesn't seem like much money for all the content and free postage.

[MontysMerkin]

The content is limited, don't be fooled. The free postage only goes with items that have prime stickers on em. I've had it a few years now and it's cheap enough not to notice the cost but we've seen all the 'great' exclusive films such as Looper (wtf?). Doubt many people rush home to see their new and exclusive content...

[super_realist]

Yeah, I doubt I'd have paid 80 for it, but 60 was fair enough with Christmas coming for ordering presents and having the Clarkson programme.

Netflix is also pretty rubbish for content. I've lost count of the films I've watched five minutes of and given up on.

[MontysMerkin]

Netflix is a lot better than amazon! However if you're measuring the cost of £20 difference over a year then I would definitely cancel and spend the money on something (anything!) else.

[super_realist]

I don't see much difference between the two really.
Neither are especially good, but worth having as normal tv is utterly rubbish.

[MontysMerkin]

Breaking bad, better call saul, jessica jones and luke cage just about tip the balance for me....

[super_realist]

Not watched any of them, tried Breaking Bad, but just couldn't see what all the hype was about. Trouble with most of these American series is they have far too many episodes.

[MontysMerkin]

I like it cos it suits my politics (what do you do when your insurance says fock off) and I really enjoy cranstons performances (from malcolm in the middle onwards). The incredible desert scenery and great cinematography. It was the first series that I allowed myself not to rush, and I really got into it. Better call saul really continued that theme. I've tried a few of these binge type series and those 2 are the only ones that have held my interest, although walking deads not too bad and I'm trying to get into westworld - just seen episode 3 and I'm starting to get a bit bored now....

[McLaren]

Amazon video is really bad for content that actually comes with the subscription, if I want to buy something I use Google play.

Gotta admit I watch most of my TV on Netflix with some iplayer as well. Just wish mad men was on it.

[dynamark]

you lads watch a lot of tv .I usually find enough on the freeview channels.virgin have just finished digging up the village and their offer is very good value.

[McLaren]

I've just watched it Mac, some lame jokes and typical USA bluster from the American crowd, but overall pretty good. Certainly better than that awful BBC version with Chris Evans.

Can't believe I missed this earlier but if you are watching Amazon prime at this time of day does it mean you are out of work or working night shifts in a petrol station?

[super_realist]

Every second Friday off Mac. Compressed hours.

[McLaren]

You should have been out on TOC, the weather was ok today.

[super_realist]

It was freezing Mac, not to mention that the Links Trust is incredibly precious and even the slightest bit of frost closes all courses.
I have a time for tomorrow, but not hopeful. Clear skies tonight and low temps probably means another call off. That's winter golf though, so fire on and feet up I think.

[McLaren]

Super, don't know about you but I find it is better to get out the house rather than stay in and inevitably fire up the porn. Get an extra layer on, a hot flask of coffee and get at least a few holes in.

[super_realist]

Depends on the wind Mac, it can be a ghastly place to be if the wind is blowing and it's less than about 6c.
Could do with a few holes though, so hopefully the course will be open.

[McLaren]

Depends on the wind Mac, it can be a ghastly place to be if the wind is blowing and it's less than about 6c.
Could do with a few holes though

Are you talking about porn or TOC?

[super_realist]

Very good Mac.

[MontysMerkin]

 Get an extra layer on, a hot flask of coffee and get at least a few holes in.

Ahh the posh five knuckle shuffle.

[MustPuttBetter]

I tend to find Netflix is great for tv series' but pretty rubbish for films. I was looking through the 'new releases' the other day and White Men Can't Jump was in there. Say no more.....

Not sure if any of you are 80s kids but I've really enjoyed Stranger Things, and was the whole reason I subscribed.

Monty, I also have tried to get into Westworld and find it dull. Massively overhyped

[McLaren]

Mustputt

I watched the first episode of Stranger things but haven't got round to watching it again. It's not that there was anything wrong with it I just didn't grab me straight away and I had kind of forgotten about it.

[MustPuttBetter]

Definitely give it another go Mac
I found it very additive and watched the entire first series in 3 evenings.

It's a bit ET, a bit Stephen King, a bit Goonies, very 80s nostalgic

[McLaren]

It does sound like I should get back into it.

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