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Prem 2022 - 2023 Thoughts

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Heaf
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Post by Geordie Wed 10 Aug 2022, 9:21 am

First topic message reminder :

Season is nearly upon us....whats your opinions and hopes for this season...

1. Hopes and Expectations on finishing spot
2. What you want to see from your team
3. Your strengths and Weaknesses
3. Player to watch
4. Academy prospect to watch.

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Post by propdavid_london Fri 26 Aug 2022, 2:04 pm

Poorfour wrote:Quins have posted their squad for their pre-season against London Scottish tomorrow:
https://www.quins.co.uk/article/team-to-travel-to-london-scottish-named

Harlequins Starting XV

Simon Kerrod
George Head
Will Collier
George Hammond
Irne Herbst
Jack Kenningham
Will Evans
Tom Lawday – captain
Lewis Gjaltema
Will Edwards
Ross Chisholm
Lennox Anyanwu
Luke Northmore
Nick David
Tyrone Green

Impact Players
Santiago Garcia Botta, Jordan Els, Jack Musk, Tom Osborne, Rhys Litterick, Charlie Matthews, Dino Lamb, Archie White, Luke Wallace, Alex Dombrandt, Jack Stafford, Tommy Allan, Connor Slevin, Jamie Benson, Hayden Hyde, Cadan Murley, Conor Oresanya

The game isn’t that important but what is potentially significant is that it sees the return to action of Kenningham, Lamb, White and Dombrandt, who were all injured at the end of last season. The only injured player missing from the squad (and there are several DR Quins in the Scottish side, too) is Ross Chisholm. Sounds like the physios have worked their magic in the off—season, which is important given we’ll be missing (at least) Smith, Esterhuizen and Care for the start of the season.

Maybe I am missing him, but Scott Steeles not on the list. Was out for most of last season with injury but was looking really useful as DC cover when he had a run of games.
I am surprised to see as many 1st teamers on the side as there are - thought it would all be kids.

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Post by Geordie Fri 26 Aug 2022, 2:40 pm

Jack Kenningham back eh

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 26 Aug 2022, 3:54 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Jack Kenningham back eh

He and Evans could be a very good flanker combo for Quins. An absolute nightmare to play against.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 26 Aug 2022, 5:12 pm

Great to see him back. Think him and Evans are just a shade below international standard (England moving away from proper flanker s at 6 too) so could be great for Harlequins this year.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 26 Aug 2022, 8:40 pm

And no barbeary and odogwu in the 2nd half lineup anyway.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 26 Aug 2022, 8:40 pm

And no barbeary and odogwu in the 2nd half lineup anyway.

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Post by Poorfour Fri 26 Aug 2022, 11:21 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Jack Kenningham back eh

He and Evans could be a very good flanker combo for Quins. An absolute nightmare to play against.

Evans / Kenningham / Dombrandt is a back row with everything you could ask for. It’s like Skinner / Robshaw / Easter but much faster.
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Post by formerly known as Sam Sat 27 Aug 2022, 6:51 am

Poorfour wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Jack Kenningham back eh

He and Evans could be a very good flanker combo for Quins. An absolute nightmare to play against.

Evans / Kenningham / Dombrandt is a back row with everything you could ask for. It’s like Skinner / Robshaw / Easter but much faster.

And more skillful. The only downside with that backrow is that you are then looking at your tight five to up the carrying in the tight exchanges as Dombrandt tends to stand a little further out so he can hit nice lines. Lawday and Chisholm are real workhorses which Kenningham and Evans can match in defence but aren't really equipped to replicate in attack, you'd get better link play further out with dual opensides though.

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Post by Poorfour Sat 27 Aug 2022, 9:58 am

Kenningham is a surprisingly hard carrier, though. He doesn't look it, but he regularly wins the collision against even big tacklers - he's a bit like Curry in that regard. Chisholm or Lawday on the bench definitely gives the option to change things up, though.
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Post by doctor_grey Sat 27 Aug 2022, 2:59 pm

I have no idea how Saints will do this season.  Clearly the players (with the possible exception of the front row) are good to very good, some world class.  But teams who have to ride a long winning streak to make the playoffs are always suspect the next season.  

However, none of that matters right now.  Saints-Bedford is being streamed right now.  Lot's of sun at the Gardens.  Lot's of sun here, going up to almost 90°F today, and are just enjoying some pre-season Rugby.  Over breakfast...

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Post by Poorfour Sat 27 Aug 2022, 7:33 pm

Quins recorded an easy win over Richmond, as you’d expect. The key pluses for me are that the new signings, especially Irne Herbst and the returning Charlie Matthews, put in a good showing, several players came back from injury with no obvious loss of form, and no-one seems to have picked up an injury. The main downside is that none of the looseheads on show looked great. If we are reliant on Marler to play 70 minutes every week, I am not sure even he can do that for a whole season
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Post by Poorfour Sat 27 Aug 2022, 7:37 pm

That said - it turns out that several of the Quins academy players were playing for London Scottish, particularly in the pack. It may just be that Quins’ poor showing was a result of our backup forwards being less good than our academy forwards….
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Post by Sgt_Pooly Sun 28 Aug 2022, 5:56 am

Poorfour wrote:Quins recorded an easy win over Richmond, as you’d expect. The key pluses for me are that the new signings, especially Irne Herbst and the returning Charlie Matthews, put in a good showing, several players came back from injury with no obvious loss of form, and no-one seems to have picked up an injury. The main downside is that none of the looseheads on show looked  great. If we are reliant on Marler to play 70 minutes every week, I am not sure even he can do that for a whole season

Every time I see/hear his name, all I can think about is "Charlie Matthews the enforcer".

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Post by propdavid_london Wed 31 Aug 2022, 8:46 am

Charlie Matthews - good club player, but with so much more potential than he delivered.
Bit of a beanpole like Luke Charteris was, and we should hardly have lost a lineout when he was in the squad - but sadly I remember Quins having a pretty naff lineout when Charlie was playing (and before anyone comments - I know its not just the jumpers- but the whole lineout system).

Quins have definitely improved with Flannery though.

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Post by Rugby Fan Fri 09 Sep 2022, 11:20 am

There have been some questions over whether tonight's matches are going ahead. Charlie Morgan of the Telegraph says he understands they will be played.

https://twitter.com/CharlieFelix/status/1568175072195608576

Confirmation to come but hearing tonight’s Premiership rugby games are on.

In the absence of any guidance from the Sports Ministry, the Premiership probably feels it can't afford to cancel.

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Post by Oakdene Fri 09 Sep 2022, 11:36 am

All premier league & EFL matches are off.

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Post by Margin_Walker Fri 09 Sep 2022, 11:42 am

It's not looking great for the weekend's games.

Appreciate the gravity of the situation, but it's completely farcical for me if games don't go ahead.

Sports clubs generally, and rugby especially, are struggling hugely post covid and desperate for match day income. I doubt bars, restaurants and cinemas will be forced to close their doors. What makes sport different?

The people that would have attended the game aren't now going to stay home and confine themselves to silent reflection. They're just going to head out and do something else.

They're far more likely to honour her with silence, clapping, singing the anthem etc at the game.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 09 Sep 2022, 11:50 am

Rugby Fan wrote:There have been some questions over whether tonight's matches are going ahead. Charlie Morgan of the Telegraph says he understands they will be played.

https://twitter.com/CharlieFelix/status/1568175072195608576

Confirmation to come but hearing tonight’s Premiership rugby games are on.

In the absence of any guidance from the Sports Ministry, the Premiership probably feels it can't afford to cancel.

Sounds like they are cancelled. Stupid decision, don't get the rationale. Anyone so upset about it can stay home, plenty would attend and that's not even counting the amount of comments I've read saying that they use things like sport to distract themselves.

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Post by Geordie Fri 09 Sep 2022, 12:52 pm

The queen loved sport anyway...she wouldnt want any sport cancelled.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 09 Sep 2022, 1:17 pm

Games appear to be on tomorrow. Which is good will give rugby the chance to pay their respects for Her Majesty.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 09 Sep 2022, 1:26 pm

May improve viewing figures tbf given everything else is off.

And what real difference does moving the Bristol game to tomorrow have?

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Post by BigGee Fri 09 Sep 2022, 1:49 pm

The official guidelines on public mourning say there is no obligation to cancel and sort of suggests a match tribute is quite appropriate. It also suggests maybe not scheduling a match while the funeral is on. Other than that it is at the sports discretion.

The SRU have cancelled all games in Scotland including Glasgow last wsrm up gsme and the women's International, which means both being undercooked gointo into the league snd WC respectively.

I am going to the theatre on sat night and fortunately that seems to be on.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 09 Sep 2022, 2:18 pm

Wasps are going heavy duty in their back row tomorrow: Shields, T.Willis and Barbeary at 8. Jack's been injured the last couple of warm ups but thats heavy duty carrying and physicality.

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Post by Geordie Fri 09 Sep 2022, 3:35 pm

Falcons team for quins tomorrow...baffling selections.

I wonder if Blamire is moving to the back row permanently

15 Alex Tait, 14 Adam Radwan, 13 Ben Stevenson, 12 Pete Lucock, 11 Nathan Earle, 10 Brett Connon, 9 Josh Barton; 1 Phil Brantingham, 2 George McGuigan, 3 Trevor Davison, 4 Greg Peterson, 5 Sebastian de Chaves, 6 Sean Robinson, 7 Jamie Blamire, 8 Will Welch (captain).

Replacements: 16 Charlie Maddison, 17 Logovi'i Mulipola, 18 Mark Tampin, 19 George Merrick, 20 Tom Marshall, 21 Cameron Nordli-Kelemeti, 22 Tian Schoeman, 23 George Wacokecoke.

Not available for selection: Adam Brocklebank, Callum Chick, Jeremy Civil, Connor Collett, Luke Coulston, Matthew Dalton, Matt Deehan, Mark Dormer, Carl Fearns, Gary Graham, Louie Johnson, Freddie Lockwood, Matias Moroni, Chidera Obonna, Matias Orlando, Tom Penny, Guy Pepper, Vereimi Qorowale, Charlie Smith, Sam Stuart, Philip van der Walt, Michael Young

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 09 Sep 2022, 5:38 pm

Given all those injuries more likely that you just want your best players that are fit in the 23. You've got three good hookers but lots of backrow injuries, drop one in at 7 and tell him to just let loose. Interesting to see what happens at scrum time as Blamire is probably the better hooker at the scrum but McGuigan's better at lineout throwing. Will they mix and match?

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 09 Sep 2022, 5:39 pm

STARTING XV:
15 Chris Ashton [12]
14 Harry Potter [41]
13 Matt Scott [47]
12 Jimmy Gopperth *
11 Hosea Saumaki [12]
10 Freddie Burns [103]
9 Ben Youngs (vc) [282]
1 James Cronin *
2 Charlie Clare [52]
3 Dan Cole (vc) [290]
4 Harry Wells [156]
5 Eli Snyman [20]
6 George Martin [39]
7 Tommy Reffell [78]
8 Hanro Liebenberg (c) [59]

REPLACEMENTS:
16 Joe Taufete’e *
17 Francois van Wyk [17]
18 Will Hurd [8]
19 Cameron Henderson [20]
20 Olly Cracknell *
21 Richard Wigglesworth [37]
22 Phil Cokanasiga *
23 Kini Murimurivalu [36]

So presumably Hegarty and Watson have failed their fitness tests following knocks in the Falcons game.

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Post by Geordie Fri 09 Sep 2022, 6:14 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:Given all those injuries more likely that you just want your best players that are fit in the 23. You've got three good hookers but lots of backrow injuries, drop one in at 7 and tell him to just let loose. Interesting to see what happens at scrum time as Blamire is probably the better hooker at the scrum but McGuigan's better at lineout throwing. Will they mix and match?

Most likely. Can't help thinking this is a massive year for Blamire if he wants to push on his England hopes. He can't remain as second fiddle to McGuigan for much longer. And clearly the falcons see McGuigan as first choice...

We also have two VERY good young hookers coming through aswell and they'll be getting games at dome stage this season.
Blamire has some serious thinking to do.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Fri 09 Sep 2022, 7:42 pm

No van der merwe or Hill for Worcester.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Fri 09 Sep 2022, 7:53 pm

Not only no DVDM and Hill but also not Smith and no Hatherall.

15 James Stokes, 14 Will Joseph, 13 Curtis Rona, 12 Benhard van Rensburg, 11 Ollie Hassell-Collins, 10 Paddy Jackson, 9 Ben White, 1 Facundo Gigena, 2 Matt Cornish, 3 Lovejoy Chawatama, 4 Rob Simmons, 5 Adam Coleman (c), 6 Ben Donnell, 7 Tom Pearson, 8 Josh Basham.

Replacements: 16 Agustin Creevy, 17 Danilo Fischetti, 18 Ciaran Parker, 19 Api Ratuniyarawa, 20 Jack Cooke, 21 Caolan Englefield, 22 Luca Morisi, 23 Henry Arundell.

15 Jamie Shillcock, 14 Perry Humphreys, 13 Ollie Lawrence, 12 Francois Venter, 11 Alex Hearle, 10 Billy Searle, 9 Gareth Simpson, 1 Valeriy Morozov, 2 Hame Faiva, 3 Murray McCallum, 4 Joe Batley, 5 Andrew Kitchener, 6 Fergus Lee-Warner, 7 Cameron Neild (C), 8 Matt Kvesic.

Replacements: 16 Curtis Langdon, 17 Rory Sutherland, 18 Jay Tyack, 19 Graham Kitchener, 20 Tom Dodd, 21 Will Chudley, 22 Owen Williams, 23 Noah Heward.

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Post by Rugby Fan Sat 10 Sep 2022, 1:06 am

Telegraph on yesterday's about-face:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2022/09/09/inside-premiership-rugbys-fixture-chaos-following-queens-elizabeths/

Chaos and fury was felt behind the scenes at Premiership clubs over a frantic two hours in which the competition flip-flopped over whether or not to go ahead with their opening fixtures of the season on Friday night, with financial and scheduling concerns off-setting a desire to pay respect to Queen Elizabeth II.

The outcome, which has seen Bristol Bears’ meeting with Bath and Sale Sharks’ match against Northampton rescheduled, has left senior figures angrily questioning the Premiership’s decision-making process. Even though the West Country derby has been rearranged for tomorrow at 5.30pm, the move is likely to cost Bristol between £200,000 and £400,000.

Bristol had sold 23,500 tickets for Friday night and were expecting a sell-out. They are understood to have earned the backing of the Rugby Football Union until a Premiership board meeting scuppered their plans.

Telegraph Sport understands that Friday night matches were moved because the Premiership board could not agree to maintaining the original schedule. It is understood that while all clubs were in favour of starting the season this weekend, having been cleared to do so following government guidance, there was not a unified position over playing the two scheduled Friday matches. At least two members of the board, thought not to have links to clubs that were due to play on Friday night, objected to those games going ahead.

It is also understood that as things stand, there will be no television match official (TMO) or outdoor broadcast facility at either of the rearranged round one matches.

The decision to postpone was finally communicated by Premiership Rugby at 12.45pm. At this point, Northampton’s players were on their way to Salford. Before that, as late as 11am, while the board meeting was ongoing, sources had strongly indicated that Friday night fixtures would go ahead at Ashton Gate and the AJ Bell Stadium with players, coaches and supporters showing their respects to the late Queen Elizabeth by singing the national anthem and holding a moment’s silence.

Telegraph Sport understands that referees and match officials were told definitively around mid-morning that the games were on. Some were making their way to the grounds and remained in the dark until the official announcement was made an hour and three quarters later. One head coach involved in a Friday game was said to be in the dark and “waiting by the phone” for news at around 11.15am.

At around 11.30am, following the Premier League’s move to postpone the entire weekend schedule, the mood had begun to change with sources less certain that the Friday schedule would be fulfilled. Insiders at various Premiership clubs around the country described “bedlam”, “scrambling” and “absolute madness”. “I’ve worked in sport a fair while,” said one source. “This is remarkable.”

A coordinated social media post that was published by all 13 teams, explaining that clubs were awaiting guidance, is said to have been drafted by the clubs themselves rather than Premiership Rugby.

The Premiership’s situation looks all the more curious for the RFU’s “respectful continuation” of matches. We now have a scenario where Friday night will see two games in the Championship as Cornish Pirates play Richmond and Coventry meet Bedford Blues, with none going ahead in the top flight.   A congested fixture list in the season leading up to the 2023 World Cup, which already features Premiership Rugby Cup matches being played in midweek, will also have come under consideration. As statistician Russ Petty has outlined, there are only two free weekends for Premiership clubs between now and the competition final at Twickenham – the third weekend in November and the third weekend of the Six Nations.

Bristol’s game against Bath will take place on Saturday evening, which is not too disruptive because both sides have round two games the following Saturday. Sale’s match against Northampton has been moved to Sunday at 3pm.

Northampton Saints' match with London Irish next Friday has also been moved as a result of the disruption, with the game now taking place on Saturday, September 17, kicking off at 2pm.

The fixture has been moved so that Northampton avoid a short turnaround between matches, given they now face Sale Sharks this Sunday and would only have four days off between games. "The club would like to thank London Irish and Premiership Rugby for their swift co-operation," Northampton Saints said.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sat 10 Sep 2022, 9:11 am

What an absolute Poopie show.

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Post by Geordie Sat 10 Sep 2022, 3:52 pm

Half time falcons 17- quins 14.

Good game.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sat 10 Sep 2022, 4:02 pm

Well the reigning champions have been as bad as the commentary team so far. Absolutely shocking stuff. Over complicated attack that coughs the ball up quickly and basic errors giving Chiefs two tries they didn't really have to earn.

Ashton/Burns covering 15 so far was a factor in both tries.

Ridley and the very chirpy TMO did miss Youngs being obstructed for a certain try. The officiating in general has been pretty poor, particularly the TMO who's wildly inconsistent.

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Post by Geordie Sat 10 Sep 2022, 4:50 pm

Well quins win 40 - 31....

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Post by Duty281 Sat 10 Sep 2022, 5:05 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:Ridley and the very chirpy TMO did miss Youngs being obstructed for a certain try. The officiating in general has been pretty poor, particularly the TMO who's wildly inconsistent.

Officiating simply isn't of a good enough standard and it's a real problem. Too many games in the Premiership are decided by the refereeing team.

Leicester absolutely mugged of a deserved win today. The Youngs obstruction as you say, but also Burns being smashed for Exeter's second try, and then for the match-winning score a calamity of errors - a joke of a penalty for Exeter to start it off, then the line-out didn't go five, then there was clear crossing/obstruction in the lead-up to the try. Leicester got some rubbish calls in their favour as well, but none as definitive as those.

The TMO ranged from incredibly observant to completely unsighted. Terrible stuff.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sat 10 Sep 2022, 5:11 pm

It was a very frustrating game with the pissed up chairman's game level of officiating hampering things.

That being said the Tigers backline was woeful and must carry the can for this loss. The final back move that went sideways with a series of passes behind the man all starting with Gopperth who really didn't play well. Scott will be lucky to be in the side next week.

Kudos to Chiefs for the quick, trick lineout at the end. One of the very few moments of ingenuity in the game that actually worked.

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Post by Geordie Sat 10 Sep 2022, 5:24 pm

Mixed opinions on the falcons game......certainly somethings to work on... but we HAVE to sort our defence out. It's awful.

Blamire looks half the size...he's dropped some serious weight.

Oh and not making excuses we lost due to our defence .but the ref dear lord.
Quins in at the side all the time ignored, obstructing constantly...ignored...TWO bad neck rolls....ignored...

The standard of refereeing needs sorted out.

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Post by Heaf Sat 10 Sep 2022, 8:09 pm

Duty281 wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:Ridley and the very chirpy TMO did miss Youngs being obstructed for a certain try. The officiating in general has been pretty poor, particularly the TMO who's wildly inconsistent.

Officiating simply isn't of a good enough standard and it's a real problem. Too many games in the Premiership are decided by the refereeing team.

Leicester absolutely mugged of a deserved win today. The Youngs obstruction as you say, but also Burns being smashed for Exeter's second try, and then for the match-winning score a calamity of errors - a joke of a penalty for Exeter to start it off, then the line-out didn't go five, then there was clear crossing/obstruction in the lead-up to the try. Leicester got some rubbish calls in their favour as well, but none as definitive as those.

The TMO ranged from incredibly observant to completely unsighted. Terrible stuff.

Was the TMO the same 'Rosie' as the one that got suspended a few years ago?

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Post by westisbest Sat 10 Sep 2022, 8:11 pm

Good start of the season by Irish.

Arundell is quality. Would like to see him start at 15 against Northampton.

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Post by Geordie Sat 10 Sep 2022, 8:35 pm

George Martin 25 tackles 1 missed 2 turnovers

Sam are those stats correct? Pretty outstanding...

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sat 10 Sep 2022, 8:43 pm

Heaf wrote:
Duty281 wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:Ridley and the very chirpy TMO did miss Youngs being obstructed for a certain try. The officiating in general has been pretty poor, particularly the TMO who's wildly inconsistent.

Officiating simply isn't of a good enough standard and it's a real problem. Too many games in the Premiership are decided by the refereeing team.

Leicester absolutely mugged of a deserved win today. The Youngs obstruction as you say, but also Burns being smashed for Exeter's second try, and then for the match-winning score a calamity of errors - a joke of a penalty for Exeter to start it off, then the line-out didn't go five, then there was clear crossing/obstruction in the lead-up to the try. Leicester got some rubbish calls in their favour as well, but none as definitive as those.

The TMO ranged from incredibly observant to completely unsighted. Terrible stuff.

Was the TMO the same 'Rosie' as the one that got suspended a few years ago?

I believe it's a different one. David Rose the former referee was a half decent official it's just he had a tendency to over claim his expenses...

The TMO today was the first one I've heard interrupt a referee mid talk through of a high tackle to tell him to bring down the sanction. The bloke was all over the place swinging wildly from unnecessarily strict to being MIA.

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Post by doctor_grey Sat 10 Sep 2022, 10:50 pm

Duty281 wrote:Officiating simply isn't of a good enough standard and it's a real problem. Too many games in the Premiership are decided by the refereeing team.
So what can be done, mate? Do we need to raise referee compensation to attract more/better people?  Is it training?  if we expect referees to do more studying between game, again, pay more?  

I know a few referees at different levels and most genuinely enjoy officiating.  But when all they see in the media is that they are crap, or they are almost personally responsible for one team's loss or another team's win, how do we recruit more and better?  And they miss things usually because things happen in split moments in a sport that is arguably the most difficult to officiate.  And in some cases, the get eviscerated for it.  Who would ever want to be a ref?  

But ultimately, how to fix?

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Post by formerly known as Sam Sun 11 Sep 2022, 8:13 am

doctor_grey wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Officiating simply isn't of a good enough standard and it's a real problem. Too many games in the Premiership are decided by the refereeing team.
So what can be done, mate? Do we need to raise referee compensation to attract more/better people?  Is it training?  if we expect referees to do more studying between game, again, pay more?  

I know a few referees at different levels and most genuinely enjoy officiating.  But when all they see in the media is that they are crap, or they are almost personally responsible for one team's loss or another team's win, how do we recruit more and better?  And they miss things usually because things happen in split moments in a sport that is arguably the most difficult to officiate.  And in some cases, the get eviscerated for it.  Who would ever want to be a ref?  

But ultimately, how to fix?

More training and support. Can't expect people to perform better without actively trying to up skill them. I'd say a mentoring program because we have a lot of young refs currently but we don't have many experienced refs around to do that. Barnes is about the only one, maybe Tempest.

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Post by Poorfour Sun 11 Sep 2022, 9:53 am

That does happen - if you look at the refereeing teams in top level matches, then there is usually a mix of experience. An experienced ref will be accompanied by less experienced ARs, while an inexperienced one will usually have at least some games with a more experienced AR or TMO, especially when they are making a transition to a new level.
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Post by Poorfour Sun 11 Sep 2022, 10:04 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Mixed opinions on the falcons game......certainly somethings to work on... but we HAVE to sort our defence out. It's awful.

Blamire looks half the size...he's dropped some serious weight.

Oh and not making excuses we lost due to our defence  .but the ref dear lord.
Quins in at the side all the time ignored, obstructing constantly...ignored...TWO bad neck rolls....ignored...

The standard of refereeing needs sorted out.

I’ve only seen the highlights, so can’t comment on what you saw but it seems to have cut both ways - even from the highlights, there wasn’t much sign of a clear release for the turnover that led to Radwan’s try (though kudos to him for finishing it) and there’s no way Earle should have been allowed to run that try in when an offside Falcons player clearly impeded Quins’ play in the same phase.

Looks like the refereeing teams are a tad rusty as well as the players.

In at the side is the tricky one. Different refs have different standards for what they’ll accept around breakdown entry, and when sides have been coached slightly differently you’ll sometimes see one side being penalised consistently for something while their opponents are “getting away” with something that to a fan’s eyes looks just as bad. It’s hugely frustrating as a fan, especially when it leads to an imbalanced penalty count - but it’s within the ref’s authority to interpret the Laws as they see fit and as long as they’re consistent it’s on the players to adapt.
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Post by doctor_grey Sun 11 Sep 2022, 12:19 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
doctor_grey wrote:
Duty281 wrote:Officiating simply isn't of a good enough standard and it's a real problem. Too many games in the Premiership are decided by the refereeing team.
So what can be done, mate? Do we need to raise referee compensation to attract more/better people?  Is it training?  if we expect referees to do more studying between game, again, pay more?  

I know a few referees at different levels and most genuinely enjoy officiating.  But when all they see in the media is that they are crap, or they are almost personally responsible for one team's loss or another team's win, how do we recruit more and better?  And they miss things usually because things happen in split moments in a sport that is arguably the most difficult to officiate.  And in some cases, the get eviscerated for it.  Who would ever want to be a ref?  

But ultimately, how to fix?

More training and support. Can't expect people to perform better without actively trying to up skill them. I'd say a mentoring program because we have a lot of young refs currently but we don't have many experienced refs around to do that. Barnes is about the only one, maybe Tempest.
Mentoring is a great idea, but I thought that was supposed to be happening in some form or other.  Could easily have that wrong, to be fair.    To create/improve that will cost some decent money I would think.  Clearly we need referees and the current process needs to be improved.  Not perfect, just improved.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 11 Sep 2022, 12:20 pm

Quite harsh around the ref didn't have a bad game at all. I'm still to see a match where I agree with every decision and there were things I didn't yesterday but there were far poorer performances on the pitch yestersay

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Post by No 7&1/2 Sun 11 Sep 2022, 12:25 pm

How good is that try by Genge, him and sinckler are going to cause teams huge problems.

And the Arundell try; niiiice.

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 11 Sep 2022, 4:30 pm

aaarrgh

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Post by doctor_grey Sun 11 Sep 2022, 4:30 pm

aaarrgh

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