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Rest of the World

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Post by alfie Sun 18 Dec 2022, 6:45 am

First topic message reminder :

Blimey...just flicked back to see Australia making a meal of chasing 34 to win. Warner another fail (is that a strong hint that his time is all but done ?)

But also Smith Khawaja and Head gone...29/4 and extras has made 14 of them !

Only need five more so no problem...but SA might wonder what might have been if they'd been able to produce a bit more resistance in that awful second innings.

Supports kingraf's pitch assessment , I guess Smile

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Post by msp83 Wed 01 Mar 2023, 6:11 pm

king_carlos wrote:I find the Proteas bowling heavy lineups simultaneously ridiculous and fascinating given their batting weakness. Between their seam depth and 2 quality spinners they should be able to put out a very high quality 4 man attack who are fresh and rested*. The insistence on 5 bowlers with them either having a 5 man tail or a bits and pieces player at 7 is really odd. Backing their strengths taken to the extreme!

Especially vital in Rabada's case given I believe he plays more games a season on average than any other bowler.
The one problem that South Africa has, like India, their batting unit has noone who can provide a half-decent 10 overs on a day if needed. Perhaps Markram, but he is a very ordinary parttimer, and was out of the side before the new coach decided to give him another go. They had Kallis for so long, and a battery of all-rounders before and during his time. But like the West Indies fast bowling riches, the pool of all-rounders seems to have dried up.
Think Jansen has the potential to be at least as good as Vernon Philander with the bat. Big Vern was more of an 8 than 7, and he was part of a pretty batting unit for most of his career. It will be tough for Jansen in this batting unit for sure. But they should stop shifting about his batting positoin. Someone like Muthusamy, when he comes in, should be batting 8 and Jansen should be left alone at 7 and given a proper run at that.
Considering the quality of the batting that they are producing of late, I'd rather have SA doing something like that, rather than bringing in another batter averaging in the early 30s and offering nothing with the ball...

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Post by sirfredperry Wed 01 Mar 2023, 9:13 pm

I see that Bavuma had a two-ball duck in the first innings and then did a little worse in the second.

As for Indore, I expected Australia to struggle as much as India did with the bat. But that second-wicket stand has put them in a reasonable position.

I say reasonable in that they will need a good lead to avoid a tricky fourth innings. The irony of India preparing a raging bunsen and then seeing their spinners outbowled by those of Australia is not lost on me.

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 4:18 am

India really need to wrap up this Australian innings cheaply or there may be no need to worry about tricky fourth innings chases...if the tourists can somehow manage another hundred or so they might very well win this by an innings !

Really can't see this pitch getting any easier so this morning session is crucial for both sides. I am a little surprised to see Siraj opening the bowling rather than one of the spinners. But he's actually bowling some rather nice variations to test Green's defence.

I see msp mentioned he's been disappointed with Axar. Must say I'd also thought he would be more effective , with the memory of how he destroyed England back in 2021. He did play a very important innings , of course ; but he is very much the third wheel in this spin attack...and just hasn't looked nearly as dangerous as Jadeja.

No drama in this first fifteen minutes...

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 4:55 am

Very quiet start , but a few boundaries now ; and the lead is nudging seventy...

Both bats playing very sensibly. Bit of a contrast to some of the Indian batting yesterday. Of course the older , softer ball is making the job a lot easier for them ; but I think they are showing a very good mix of common sense defence with taking the scoring opportunities.

Still balls spinning quite sharply at times - notably from Jadeja (who continues to commit the extraordinary - for a spinner - error of overstepping. Weird....that latest didn't cost a wicket - though it might have as it beat the bat ! But puzzles me why he does it so often)

Nearly an hour gone and only now does Ravi Ashwin enter the attack...

179/4

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 5:22 am

Well the change of bowlers has made the break...Ashwin having Handscomb smartly caught by Iyer at bat-pad...and then Umesh trapping Green lbw a few balls later. 189/6 and Australia will still want some more runs from the tail now...tight period coming up.

Green might think himself a little unlucky that Joel Wilson gave him out on field then as the -unsuccessful - review showed the ball was only just clipping the top of his leg stump. But in truth it looked pretty stone cold out when viewed live and I'd have been surprised if the finger hadn't been raised.

Wonder if Carey will be deploying that reverse sweep today ?

Immediate edit : He won't have any help from Starc as Umesh has just demolished his off stump.! Gone for one and Australia now 192/7...

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 5:29 am

With a new ball now just six overs away , and those three quick wickets , India will be feeling they are almost back in the game...

Is it four wickets now ? Carey given out lbw but refers....but yes! Umpire Menon decision upheld and it is 196/8...

How important that Khawaja/Labuschagne partnership looks now !

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 5:37 am

Umesh using reverse at speed to crash through again...Murphy had no hope as off stump goes flying.

Five wickets have fallen for eleven runs. Umesh has three and Rohit might wish he'd used him sooner...

197/9

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 5:44 am

And all done as Ashwin gets his third , beating a rather desperate swipe from Nathan Lyon. All out 197 , last six falling for 11 in five and a half overs...quite a fightback by the home team !

But some damage done earlier as the lead has been stretched out to 88 ; so India will still need to bat with a lot of discipline if they're to set the Aussies a tough target. Watching the way those wickets went down it is clear there remains plenty of help for the bowlers...

Honestly not sure what will happen from here except I'm expecting to see a finish tomorrow - if not this evening !

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 7:52 am

Hard work for India as they battle to clear that deficit...

Lyon has both openers already : Gill to a daft kamikaze charge and swipe , while he just beat and trapped Rohit lbw...India wasting a batting review this time with what one might call a Watson-esque challenge.
Pujara hanging in. Managed a rare boundary just then but at 43/2 they are still well adrift. Would be a good day for Kohli to produce a magic knock ; I feel that if Australia can bag one of these two they may only have a very small chase. At least this time India (apart from Gill) are not rushing to destruction...nineteen overs done now as drinks come out.

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 8:08 am

Well there goes the big wicket of Kohli ! Only umpire's call on lbw to Kuhnemann , but given on field so he has to go...was a poor choice of shot , to be honest.

54/3 and the Australians are tightening their grip on this game. Jadeja again in at five.

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 8:42 am

Jadeja falls to Lyon , lbw on review. Pujara going his best to keep the ship afloat (36 from 76) but at effectively minus ten for four India appear to be sinking...

Lyon has bowled really well and some balls are jumping quite unplayably : that first innings lead for Australia is proving vital.

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 8:44 am

Tea. 79/4.

After what we just saw in NZ I am reluctant to "call" a game too early. But I know which dressing room will be happier over their cups of tea...

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 8:56 am

Flipped over to the SA test and see that flimsy SA batting lineup has crumbled again...seven down for 76 !

Markram got 47 - the rest have not managed to get into double figures . Roach , Holder and Joseph sharing the wickets.

Lead just 206. Could be in trouble ...though their pace bowlers may yet have the last say.

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Post by VTR Thu 02 Mar 2023, 9:02 am

Yes, two games moving along pretty rapidly. On the SA match, it's a shocker of a collapse, but then the batting lineup does look thin. Still, I would rather be defending than chasing 220, or it may be even more

For India, they are just about hanging in there and could still set 150, which I wouldn't put any money on Australia chasing. Its notable that the old guard, who should all definitely be replaced with younger players, are providing most of the resistance again

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 9:15 am

Pujara is really doing a great job...and Shreyas Iyer - although a bit streaky - is upping the run rate.

Hundred up for India. Lead just 13 but if they can stretch that by another hundred they might have some hopes...nerves on both sides will be tested now.

And nerves might be getting to Kuhnemann : he's going for a few lately , and just did " a Jadeja" : bowling a no ball...

Iyer quickly to 25. Ten run over ! 111/4

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 9:27 am

Starc on...good move I think.

And he has taken the break ! Top catch Khawaja thumbsup

Confirmed by TV check. Iyer's frisky knock ends at 25 and it's 113/5...

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 9:30 am

Was a good little knock from Iyer ; but India needed more. Bet they wish this was Pant coming in now rather than Bharat Smile

Still some batting to come - and Pujara is still there. But they need to build a lot on this 26 run lead...

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Post by dummy_half Thu 02 Mar 2023, 9:47 am

South Africa with a proper telephone number score card (international number version) +47 1 0 0 7 5 4 6 5 9* 20 4*

Follows from a first innings where only the openers made a substantial contribution. Lead by 246 with 1 wicket left. Only day 3, so batting conditions should still be OK for WIndies.

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Post by JDizzle Thu 02 Mar 2023, 9:48 am

alfie wrote:Flipped over to the SA test and see that flimsy SA batting lineup has crumbled again...seven down for 76 !

Markram got 47 - the rest have not managed to get into double figures . Roach , Holder and Joseph sharing the wickets.

Lead just 206. Could be in trouble ...though their pace bowlers may yet have the last say.

Markram was 47 out of 69 when dismissed. For all the talk of cricketing records, I thought he was making a run at the oldest in the book - ‘The Bannerman’!

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Post by dummy_half Thu 02 Mar 2023, 9:49 am

As for India v Australia, India effectively 33-6 with Pujara and Ashwin at the crease. Obviously if this was against England they would both score hundreds and leave us chasing about 300, but I suspect Australia will be better able to ram home their advantage.

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:03 am

JDizzle wrote:
alfie wrote:Flipped over to the SA test and see that flimsy SA batting lineup has crumbled again...seven down for 76 !

Markram got 47 - the rest have not managed to get into double figures . Roach , Holder and Joseph sharing the wickets.

Lead just 206. Could be in trouble ...though their pace bowlers may yet have the last say.

Markram was 47 out of 69 when dismissed. For all the talk of cricketing records, I thought he was making a run at the oldest in the book - ‘The Bannerman’!

The most wild and bizarre cricketing record going that one JDizzle - amazing it's never been broken!
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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:06 am

dummy_half wrote:South Africa with a proper telephone number score card (international number version) +47 1 0 0 7 5 4 6 5 9* 20 4*

Follows from a first innings where only the openers made a substantial contribution. Lead by 246 with 1 wicket left. Only day 3, so batting conditions should still be OK for WIndies.

LOL the International Telephone reference 😀

Not a great start for West Indies though with Brathwaite gone for nothing. Fancy 247 may be a few too many.

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:10 am

Pujara playing for his team's life here...a very gutsy fifty clap

May be close to his finish line ; but he has a lot of class. And a wonderful temperament .

Needs support from the bowlers to push this lead up around a hundred. Tall order ...only 45 at present and only Axar and the pace lads to come.

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:19 am

Five for Lyon...good bowling ; great review ! 140/7 as Ashwin trudges off...

Fat lady warming up ?

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:30 am

Appreciate it's easier said than done...but India have batted a fair whack of time here for little runs...I wonder if they'd have been better off being more aggressive rather than padding and prodding on this wicket
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Post by msp83 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:35 am

The bowlers, particularly Umesh and Ashwin, with that burst through session, brought India back into the game, only for the batters to throw it all away yet again. Pujara is fighting, but think this one is gone. Poor shot selection, not respecting the conditions... Kohli's was a very poor shot, Gill too was terrible. Rohit didn't help himself either. Thought they'd show greater discipline in the 2nd innings, but not to be...

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Post by dummy_half Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:36 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Appreciate it's easier said than done...but India have batted a fair whack of time here for little runs...I wonder if they'd have been better off being more aggressive rather than padding and prodding on this wicket

India aren't going all that slowly - 140 in 50 overs. Axar has previously shown som ebatting ability, and Pujara is by nature a steady player, so I thin the approach of just trying to accumulate is still the best option for now. Lose another wicket and perhaps it becomes time to accelerate and try to get as many as possible before the inevitable wickets. If they could possibly eke this out to 120 or so lead it could still be a challenge for Australia (one of those scores they'll either cruise to 1 down, or really struggle)

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Post by msp83 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:39 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Appreciate it's easier said than done...but India have batted a fair whack of time here for little runs...I wonder if they'd have been better off being more aggressive rather than padding and prodding on this wicket
Gill, Rohit, Iyer, were all in a hurry and didn't add too much to the board. Only Iyer looked like he could really take on the spinners with conviction. Others were batting with the mindset that I'd get as much before the ball with my name comes. It still is not that type of pitch really. Pujara, who has spend time out there, but with positive intent, has proven the same.

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Post by JDizzle Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:39 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
JDizzle wrote:
alfie wrote:Flipped over to the SA test and see that flimsy SA batting lineup has crumbled again...seven down for 76 !

Markram got 47 - the rest have not managed to get into double figures . Roach , Holder and Joseph sharing the wickets.

Lead just 206. Could be in trouble ...though their pace bowlers may yet have the last say.

Markram was 47 out of 69 when dismissed. For all the talk of cricketing records, I thought he was making a run at the oldest in the book - ‘The Bannerman’!

The most wild and bizarre cricketing record going that one JDizzle - amazing it's never been broken!

Can’t even doubt it’s authenticity like some (Gilbert Jessop cough). I didn’t realise Bannerman retired hurt in that innings do - he could have put it even further beyond reach.

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Post by msp83 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:44 am

Pujara seems to be getting into a bit of negative mindset mode now. Missing out even on legside short balls from Lyon. Batting without purpose and just block block will take them nowhere...

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Post by Good Golly I'm Olly Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:47 am

dummy_half wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Appreciate it's easier said than done...but India have batted a fair whack of time here for little runs...I wonder if they'd have been better off being more aggressive rather than padding and prodding on this wicket

India aren't going all that slowly - 140 in 50 overs. Axar has previously shown som ebatting ability, and Pujara is by nature a steady player, so I thin the approach of just trying to accumulate is still the best option for now. Lose another wicket and perhaps it becomes time to accelerate and try to get as many as possible before the inevitable wickets. If they could possibly eke this out to 120 or so lead it could still be a challenge for Australia (one of those scores they'll either cruise to 1 down, or really struggle)

I am not hugely watching, but only one bat with a strike rate above 60, and has Todd Murphy really bowled well enough to only concede 14 runs from 13 overs?
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Post by msp83 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:51 am

A message from the skipper, and Pujara deposits Lyon over midwicket for 6!!! So this test match, India may end up losing, but we've had that rarest of rare things to remember it by, a Pujara 6! Wow!

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Post by msp83 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:53 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
dummy_half wrote:
Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:Appreciate it's easier said than done...but India have batted a fair whack of time here for little runs...I wonder if they'd have been better off being more aggressive rather than padding and prodding on this wicket

India aren't going all that slowly - 140 in 50 overs. Axar has previously shown som ebatting ability, and Pujara is by nature a steady player, so I thin the approach of just trying to accumulate is still the best option for now. Lose another wicket and perhaps it becomes time to accelerate and try to get as many as possible before the inevitable wickets. If they could possibly eke this out to 120 or so lead it could still be a challenge for Australia (one of those scores they'll either cruise to 1 down, or really struggle)

I am not hugely watching, but only one bat with a strike rate above 60, and has Todd Murphy really bowled well enough to only concede 14 runs from 13 overs?
Murphy has been steady, nothing special...

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Post by msp83 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 10:56 am

Well, Lyon gets Pujara again! the 13th time does Pujara fall to Lyon... Will Axar have a go? Umesh is surely going to slog everything that comes his way...

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:00 am

Ha...just when it appeared India were upping the scoring (rare Pujara six !) and putting some pressure back in Australia...a great catch by Smith at leg slip has done for Pujara...

155/8.

Might be 155/9 now...no ! Umesh saved by a whisker on drs. Gone next ball swinging though so at just 67 runs on I think this is all over...just a question of when.

Lyon 7/57 clapclapclap


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Post by VTR Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:01 am

Not looking like many to chase now! Maybe we will see a new record today, lowest target ever defended, also a record from the 1800s

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Post by dummy_half Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:06 am

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:
JDizzle wrote:
alfie wrote:Flipped over to the SA test and see that flimsy SA batting lineup has crumbled again...seven down for 76 !

Markram got 47 - the rest have not managed to get into double figures . Roach , Holder and Joseph sharing the wickets.

Lead just 206. Could be in trouble ...though their pace bowlers may yet have the last say.

Markram was 47 out of 69 when dismissed. For all the talk of cricketing records, I thought he was making a run at the oldest in the book - ‘The Bannerman’!

The most wild and bizarre cricketing record going that one JDizzle - amazing it's never been broken!

I know that cricket records from that long ago are likely to be incomplete or unreliable, but Bannerman has a few quite remarkable stats in addition to the runs proportion record: Test batting average of 59 (admittedly in only 3 matches, dominated by the 165*) against a FC average of 21.6, and the 165 appears to be his only first class century (although Wikipedia record him as also scoring a century on Australia's first official tour of England - presumably in a game that did not have first class status).
Also, his benefit match, in 1922, was the first cricket match to be broadcast on the radio.


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Post by dummy_half Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:08 am

And West Indies now 12-2, losing Reifer. Rabada with 2 for 3 in 4 overs (then again, I've always thought Rabada was a bit good...)

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:11 am

I appreciate it is tough to bat on this - especially when you are so far behind in the game ; but really India seem to have made a right mess of this innings by not having much of a plan...

Several players out playing quite wild and undisciplined shots , while at other times they've allowed the bowlers to dictate perhaps a bit too easily. Pujara showed the way locking up one end ; but the other stroke players who could have batted around him tried to go too hard at the wrong balls and consequently none managed a significant score.

Australia surely won't have much difficulty chasing , what , 70 or so ? But even another thirty runs might have made this a real contest.

That stand yesterday by Khawaja and Marnus dwarfs any other partnership in this match. Ironic to think that if Jadeja hadn't overstepped it wouldn't have happened at all...

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:18 am

Axar having a swing now...fair enough. Six to the total . Maybe he should have had licence to take those on when he still had Pujara for company ?

75 ahead. Can't be many more to come with Siraj not exactly Mr Reliable at the other end.

Looking at those best bowling figures on screen , Nathan Lyon likes bowling at Indian bats Smile

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Post by dummy_half Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:23 am

WI 20-4 with Jansen's first over being a double wicket maiden...

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Post by alfie Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:28 am

Brainless swipe by Siraj ends it there. If I was Axar I'd want to kick his arse for that !

Kind of sums up India in this match. Reckon they got a bit too full of themselves after the last match and expected to just turn up here and win. Lesson being taught.

76 to win ? Seen some miracle results lately but I don't think we're going to see an upset here. Australia should coast home and get a deserved victory.

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Post by Duty281 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:31 am

Saw the Indian fightback with the ball, but full credit to Australia for rolling India cheaply again. Lyon with 8, even on this pitch that's still an achievement.

76 needed. Australia *should* get that, however it is the type of pitch where Jadeja could leave them 20/4 and the pressure severely on. But it would be an all-time record if India managed to defend it!

In the other test, I had hoped the West Indies would make it a close finish after fighting back with the ball, by bowling South Africa out inside 30 overs. They have managed to pull off some unlikely chases in recent years...but 26/4. However Mayers (leader of the chase v Bangladesh) and Blackwood (leader of the chase v England) are currently at the crease.

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Post by msp83 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:44 am

Think Australia will walk it tomorrow. Even if they lose couple up front, India haven't got anywhere near good enough to set some panic. Done before lunch...

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Post by msp83 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 11:46 am

South Africa ripping through the West Indies top order. Old warhorse Kemar Roach proved he still has some left in the tank with an inspired 5for, but the batting just isn't up to it against a strong SA bowling lineup.

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Post by dummy_half Thu 02 Mar 2023, 12:32 pm

msp83 wrote:Think Australia will walk it tomorrow. Even if they lose couple up front, India haven't got anywhere near good enough to set some panic. Done before lunch...

Would be an entirely different game if Jadeja hadn't over-stepped to Labuschesne yesterday afternoon - a chase in excess of 150 would present a significant challenge. 75 should be OK, even if Aus lose 4 or 5 wickets.

West Indies mounting something of a comeback against SA, with Blackwood counter-attacking and getting them up to 91-5. And as I write, Da Silva is out, so 91-6 with only Holder and the bowlers left. Will need a borderline miracle to even get close.

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Post by KP_fan Thu 02 Mar 2023, 12:37 pm

There is nothing new to write other than harping on and on about India's sub optimal team selections as I have been before even the start of the series.
Indians got away twice but you can't keep jumping the red light all the time and get away each time.
Aussies batted well …which basically means did not collapse for a 100-120ish odd Smile ….their last 6 still collapsed in a heap for 10 runs and in 25 minutes

When you know Kohli is a dead load and India’s Best tests match batter and game changer Rishab Pant not available and remaining top order flaky.....you need to cover your downside…and plug open holes in your backside.
The weakness is in the batting.
Siraj is useless under the conditions and SKY in his stead could have added 50 runs across two innings or even more by giving Axar, our best batter for this series more time.....as he went N.O. in both innings.

This captain and coach is too template driven…unable to change the template of 2 seamers even when its obviously not required
And unable to change the approach of batting in the midst of the inning.
Yet again many of the top order fell unable to get their foot out of the way…they needed to dance down the pitch much more often….and for a little patch when Iyer did so, India looked like gaining ascendancy.

India should lose this to avoid the gaping holes in their -11 being patched up….though given the collapses you can’t yet be 100% sure that Aus will no crumble one more time to sub-75ish

Smith was far more astute than any of the last two or three Aussie captains……just all round clever and team more organized under him especially on the field
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Post by VTR Thu 02 Mar 2023, 1:59 pm

Can't disagree with Siraj being a waste of a space, but it's hard to know if a guy who made 8 out of a team score of 400 in his only Test so far would definitely tip the balance. The blame for this match is pretty much a collective non performance of most of the batting lineup in both innings. Changing out for one new player wouldn't necessarily make a difference

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Post by Duty281 Thu 02 Mar 2023, 2:08 pm

South Africa win by 87 runs over the West Indies. A win inside three days on a pitch that was a fast bowler's paradise, Rabada picking up 6/50 in the fourth innings.

Full credit to Blackwood who managed to score a highly impressive 79, while none of his teammates got beyond 18.

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Post by dummy_half Thu 02 Mar 2023, 2:32 pm

The last 2 innings of the match lasted respectively 28 and 41 overs, with only one batsman getting past 50. Obviously not a batting paradise.

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