England vs USA - match thread

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Post by robbo277 on Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:33 am

First topic message reminder :

Much changed England team named this morning. Will add USA team as I find it.

ENGLAND:
Marler, Cowan-Dickie, Cole, Launchbury, Kruis, Curry, Ludlam, Vunipola, Heinz, Ford (C), Cokanasiga, Francis, Joseph, McConnochie, Daly
Singleton, Genge, Sinckler, Lawes, Wilson, Youngs, Farrell, Watson

USA:
Ainuu, Taufetee, Lamositele, Landry, Civetta, Lamborn, Quill, Dolan, Davies, Macginty, Iosefo, Lasike, Brache, Scully, Hooley
Fawsitt, Kilifi, Mullen, Peterson, Germishuys, De Hass, Campbell, Teo


Last edited by robbo277 on Tue Sep 24, 2019 10:47 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Armchairexpert on Thu Sep 26, 2019 6:18 am

I know the world rankings don’t mean a whole lot but I was surprised to see that USA is two places above Tonga. All the press and comment I read, plus the team selection implies Tonga was the tougher of the two games. Apparently that is not necessarily the case. Of course England SHOULD beat either with a B or even C team, but I shall watch the game through slightly different eyes today.

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Post by Duty281 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 7:42 am

USA have picked up some credible results over the past twelve months, including beating the Samoans two times out of two, whilst also falling narrowly short in games against Uruguay and Japan.

I don't think it'll be a blowout - perhaps a similar score and margin to the first game against Tonga.

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Post by Gooseberry on Thu Sep 26, 2019 8:14 am

Is 35-3 not a blow out then?

USA results are a bit odd. .they weren't that great in the Americas cup ( lost to Uruguay and struggled against Brazil) but very competitive in the tougher Pacidic nations. I assume that's to do with player availability.

They should be pretty well resourced behind the scenes and well prepared for this tournament, I'd expect them to be at least as tough an opponent as Tonga were.

For me a similar scoreline, avoiding injury and suspension, would be plenty good enough and leave England sitting well.

It's not an easy group. That current world ranking is above Italy.

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Post by Pal Joey on Thu Sep 26, 2019 9:49 am

The Trumps won't lie down without a fight (for sure) but you'd have to say the equally brash Borises will safely bank this one.
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Post by SecretFly on Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:31 am

Pal Joey wrote:The Trumps won't lie down without a fight (for sure) but you'd have to say the equally brash Borises will safely bank this one.

Oh it'll be much more Bercow. ORDAH!

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Post by BamBam on Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:36 am

USA will be raring to go, I think they're the last side to play a game in the tournament? That alone makes the first 20 mins a challenge, they'll want to get stuck in with some big carries and tackles early on.

I think we're best off playing for territory and control to start with, take the initial energy out of the game then we can cut loose with the quality in the back division

Its my lucky day, I've managed to persuade the only other member of my team who is in the office today that a pub lunch is in order angel

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Post by SecretFly on Thu Sep 26, 2019 10:58 am

England will cruise this. Not saying they'll blow USA off the field, but will show enough to make it clear they could do if they wanted to.

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Post by BamBam on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:12 am

Enough of your reverse psychology Fly boxing

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Post by king_carlos on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:25 am

It's an England side well set to put a lot of tries on the board. Joseph, Cokanasiga and McConnochie have a club partnership and Ford has been in very good form.

I expect USA to target Cokanasiga's left wing with high balls. Scully on the right wing is a terrific chaser and McGinity has a good kicking game.

Taufete'e is a terrific player at hooker so I hope to see Cowan-Dickie put under some pressure by him.

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Post by robbo277 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:30 am

I'd take another 35-3 and no injuries in a heartbeat.

We can't win the World Cup today. It would be nice to put in the complete game and win 70-0, but we can get by without doing that.

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Post by lostinwales on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:30 am

king_carlos wrote:..

Taufete'e is a terrific player at hooker so I hope to see Cowan-Dickie put under some pressure by him.

Weight wise he's the same size as Billy but I'd be amazed if he could keep going like Billy does.

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:44 am

GSTQ love it.

Good luck lads.
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Post by SecretFly on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:46 am

You'll be rooting for the underdog USA in this one, Tight Wink

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:47 am

Probably not Fly, but don't wish to see a cricket score either.
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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:49 am

No Lads just leave it for Billy to do all the mauling! ffs
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Post by SecretFly on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:49 am

Billy expression: They got me

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:50 am

how about the scrum being destroyed Ref?

How did you miss that one?
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Post by SecretFly on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:52 am

Harder looking guy coming on

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Post by Northgrill on Thu Sep 26, 2019 11:53 am

TightHEAD wrote:how about the scrum being destroyed Ref?

How did you miss that one?

Think a bigger question is how the TMO missed the Francis tackle from KO. Looked like shoulder to jaw.

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Post by Heaf on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:02 pm

offside line seems optional again ...

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Post by king_carlos on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:03 pm

lostinwales wrote:
king_carlos wrote:..

Taufete'e is a terrific player at hooker so I hope to see Cowan-Dickie put under some pressure by him.

Weight wise he's the same size as Billy but I'd be amazed if he could keep going like Billy does.
Few players the size of Billy V keep going like he does!

As a front row he shouldn't really be expected to keep going as long as a number 8 either. He's a hell of a player with a nose for the tryline though.

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Post by robbo277 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:07 pm

I already don't like our lineout. Forget the early overthrow, I don't think we're putting enough pressure on their ball.

Launchbury isn't the best lineout forward and we don't have a strong back row jumper. Maybe Launchbury can come in if Lawes is at 6 but right now I don't like it.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:10 pm

Their props are falling apart.

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Post by lostinwales on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:12 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:Their props are falling apart.


And one of them is going to have to do almost the full 80

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Post by robbo277 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:12 pm

Or uncontested scrums which would take away an England weapon.

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:14 pm

Ref is killing us

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:17 pm

Drive them all day long
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Post by king_carlos on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:17 pm

robbo277 wrote:I already don't like our lineout. Forget the early overthrow, I don't think we're putting enough pressure on their ball.

Launchbury isn't the best lineout forward and we don't have a strong back row jumper. Maybe Launchbury can come in if Lawes is at 6 but right now I don't like it.
Our lineout defence will always suffer when Launchbury is picked. Not so much an indictment of Launchbury's weaknesses as a credit to how strong Lawes, Kruis and Itoje are in the lineout. On the last Lions tour Gatland selected all three of them in matchday Test squads for a reason.

Given Borthwick tends to coach simple Springbok style line-outs they should be fine in attack. Put Kruis in the middle with your strongest two lifters, throw the ball to him and trust your hooker to hit him at the very top of his jump. Simple but effective if all execute their core skill-sets. It is a tactic that places additional pressure on the weakest facet of LCDs game though.

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:21 pm

We look lathargic in defence.
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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:22 pm

Launchbury there of course stealing a lineout.

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Post by bluestonevedder on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:23 pm

The USA are so fast off the line and swarm us. Really aggressive at the breakdown too. Kudos to them- they are causing us all kinds of problems.

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Post by robbo277 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:24 pm

No 7&1/2

Yeah, was always going to happen after I said that.

We were passive at the first couple at least. Allowed them easy ball. See how it goes for the rest of the game then, maybe it'll stay at this level.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:26 pm

Its just steady ain't it. I'm a couple of mins away from my half hour prediction of 20 though.

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Post by Scottrf on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:28 pm

Feels like our mauls could roll 50m at the moment.

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:28 pm

Its a thing of beauty
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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:30 pm

Why don't more games having driving mauls. Beautiful just beautiful
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Post by robbo277 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:38 pm

Could have had that bonus point wrapped up! Should only be a matter of time in the second half.

The scrum, the maul, now the lineout and George Ford's boot look very good. Heinz has looked a bit sloppy and the outside backs haven't done much of note.

19-0 without getting out of second gear really. There have been a couple of nice handling moves, but not too much.

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Post by WELL-PAST-IT on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:47 pm

Actually the only back that has looked really threatening is Francis, he has danced through them a couple of times now

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Post by robbo277 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:51 pm

Marler, Cole and Vunipola all off early at half time.

England lead 19-0 at the break (for Taylorman).

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:51 pm

Piers Francis should have gone off, that was very close to being a red had the TMO reviewed it.
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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:52 pm

So many arms round necks in the tackle being missed by the Ref, When will Daly learn how to time a pass?
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Post by bluestonevedder on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:58 pm

Great turnover by Ludlum

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Post by king_carlos on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:59 pm

TightHEAD wrote:So many arms round necks in the tackle being missed by the Ref, When will Daly learn how to time a pass?
He's a player better suited to receiving a pass outwide than releasing others. I just rate him so much higher on the wing.

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 12:59 pm

BP wrapped up in the 47th minute
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Post by robbo277 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:02 pm

England 24-0 up then.

Youngs, Farrell and Lawes come on for Heinz, Francis and Launchbury.

Should hope England kick in from here with the players on the pitch.

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Post by No 7&1/2 on Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:02 pm

Interesting that launchbury has gone off. Head and shoulders above kruis today so possibly jumped over him for the next game.

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Post by king_carlos on Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:02 pm

Surprised that England are risking Youngs and Farrell this early.

Lawes and Wilson both being on means that Curry will play the 80 unless Singleton comes into the back row.

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Post by TightHEAD on Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:05 pm

Youngs passing is dreadful, if he wasn't a Tiger he'd be no where near this team.
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Post by BamBam on Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:07 pm

Wanted McConnochie to back himself on the outside just then, seems a bit timid from what I've seen

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Post by WELL-PAST-IT on Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:08 pm

England's pack seem much more powerful in the set piece since the changes

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