England v Aus - KO 14:30 Sat 17th NOV at HQ - Match Thread/Build Up etc....

[HERSH]

First topic message reminder :

Feel free to discuss this game and any other aspect involving the England Rugby team good or bad as your opinions count and you won't be judged (by me) if you go against England, but do try to give a reason!

Please respect other posters opinions

Game 1: Eng v Fiji
Game 2: Eng v Aus
Game 3: Eng v SA
Game 4: Eng v NZ

England team to face Australia:

Alex Goode
Chris Ashton
Manusamoa Tuilagi
Brad Barritt
Charlie Sharples
Toby Flood
Danny Care
Joe Marler
Tom Youngs,
Dan Cole
Tom Palmer
Geoff Parling
Tom Johnson,
Chris Robshaw
Thomas Waldrom
Replacements: David Paice
David Wilson
Mako Vunipola
Joe Launchbury
Tom Wood
Ben Youngs
Owen Farrell
Mike Brown

[beshocked]

He plays for Gloucester?

Basically Lancaster realises he should be playing Easter but has trapped himself in a corner by running his mouth of about age and building etc so he'd now going to pick a player as similar to Easter as possible no matter what.

Actually I take it more as Waldrom won the shirt by outperforming Morgan on the SA tour and is being retained as the man in possession (though two starts is hardly man in possession ) who has done little wrong so far. Personally I think Lancaster is wrong - but he knows the players better than I do.

The problem with this whole "winning the shirt" idea is that it only applies to some players. Goode didn't "win" it but has now jumped the que and has the full back shirt, by the same token Monye had a wingers shirt but has been dropped, Johnson has the 6 shirt but you can sense that he's going to be pushed out by Woods wether he plays well or not and then Launchberry played very well but Palmer will still retain that 5 shirt.

To be honest I do think that on form Waldrom can be just as affective as Morgan, both are pretty iffy at times too I was just really surprised by the very basic mistakes that he was making on the weekend.

You are right, Goode didn't win the shirt because the FB shirt has been his since the 3rd test in SA. Goode has done little wrong. Strong performance in SA. You can't drop the man of the match vs Fiji. If Goode had been lacklustre or put in a mediocre performance there would be grounds for dropping him. Just like Monye.

Lancaster has seen no need to drop Goode and why should he? Brown might be hailed as a deity at Quins, he's a very good player but he's unproven at international level. He had an opportunity to take the FB shirt in SA but injury saw him fall behind Goode. A place he has been ever since.

Really I write all of that and that's all you pick up on?

Goode now has the shirt but got lucky on Browns injury to get a chance, what's brilliant for us is that against Fiji he stepped up to the plate and showed his class. He was by far our best back in that game and if he can put in those kinds of performances against the top three in the coming weeks then he'll def be first choice.

To my mind though there is a place for all three fb's depending upon the make up of the backline and the opposition. Foden is almost like having a third wing with his pace and talent for burning the man on the outside, Brown is an old school 15 who has the best all round skillset and Goode is the 10 at fullback style player.

Yes it's lucky Brown got injured. It's generally injury which allows players to stake their claim unsurprisingly. If you grab that opportunity with both hands then fair play! Look at Marler,Youngs (hooker),Sharples. It's great to blood these guys. I am sure Brown will eventually get his chance.

I thought Goode put in a strong performance in SA too. I don't want to make this a Brown vs Goode face off. Both are good players. Brown has been a bit unlucky. Lancaster could have easily picked Brown (what most people wanted). Luckily for Lancaster so far his call has gone his way though maybe with full back he couldn't get it wrong!

Yappysnap let's not get carried away with the whole let's play all our full backs.

[HQ matt]

1) England are at home
2) In the last match between the teams england won
3) Oz have just been comfortably beaten by a french team england have beaten this year
4) Oz have an extensive injury list

For these reasons england are favourites but as everyone knows Oz are always capable of pulling out a result against the odds.

[Biltong]

1) England are at home
2) In the last match between the teams england won
3) Oz have just been comfortably beaten by a french team england have beaten this year
4) Oz have an extensive injury list

For these reasons england are favourites but as everyone knows Oz are always capable of pulling out a result against the odds.

Of all the facts you mention, the bolded one has absolutely no relevance to the match being played on the weekend.

[HQ matt]

would be interesting if goode found himself at 10 (as result of injury to say flood and farrell during a game) and had a stormer, chances would be that lancaster would promote him to starting 10 over burns and bring brown in at fullback.

all hypothetical but interesting none the less.

[HQ matt]

i think its relevant to the fact england will be perceived as favourites, it may have an impact on the mindset of the players too

[Biltong]

Disagree, Australia will have absolutely no thought of when england last played a completely different French team in different conditions on a different day with different referee etc.

Neither will england.

[EnglishReign]

Let's not be so prudent with our predictions. We will smash them.

[Biltong]

[EnglishReign]

And your mob is next!

[AlastairW]

gotta love the pure optimism if nothing else!

[lostinwales]

The nice thing is for once England looked settled - even without the 2 or 3 players out injured or out of whatever Lancaster/Brittas thinks is important (Morgan..). There does genuinely seem to be a great team ethos

[beshocked]

I think England will win but unsure about scoreline.

[Duty281]

England team: Alex Goode, Chris Ashton, Manusamoa Tuilagi, Brad Barritt, Charlie Sharples, Toby Flood, Danny Care, Joe Marler, Tom Youngs, Dan Cole, Tom Palmer, Geoff Parling, Tom Johnson, Chris Robshaw, Thomas Waldrom. Replacements: David Paice, David Wilson, Mako Vunipola, Joe Launchbury, Tom Wood, Ben Youngs, Owen Farrell, Mike Brown.

Only one change then, Ashton in for Monye. Sharples will move to the left. I'm very optimistic for Saturday!

[gregortree]

Easy Biltong easy,
hold on and you can start the England v Bokke thread next week.

[gregortree]

Strong bench

[Portnoy's Complaint]

Maybe the most notable thing after the Fiji game is that apart from Cole, England is building a depth unplummeted for years.

[Biltong]

Easy Biltong easy,
hold on and you can start the England v Bokke thread next week.

Not looking forward to that one mate. not at all.

[gregortree]

... or is that depth 'unplumbed' ?
Anyway I think I know what you mean.

(PS: I do not want England to plummet)

[gregortree]

Biltong, the thread or the match ?
Surely must be more than one RSA citizen on here we could wum ?
Who else do you have ?

[beshocked]

Duty281 that's the team we all expected but it would have been nice to see Morgan for Waldrom and Launchbury for Palmer but it's still a good looking side.

[lostinwales]

Could we have an everyone vs AWOP thread? or at least just one....

[Portnoy's Complaint]

Can our backs match their backs.
If our pack destroy the Oz pack, will the extra front rower be a saviour or a P45 for Deans?

Personally I feel that a huge churn in the old order with Australia's place at the top table long term is in question.

I'm not saying England can do it - more likely France.

[Biltong]

Biltong, the thread or the match ?
Surely must be more than one RSA citizen on here we could wum ?
Who else do you have ?

the match, there is Fern, MMaaxx, me, FA0019 (not sure when we supports SA or home nations), me, GerrieSA, me.......

[Jimpy]

Duty281 that's the team we all expected but it would have been nice to see Morgan for Waldrom and Launchbury for Palmer but it's still a good looking side.

Don't really agree about Waldrom. He had a good if unspectacular game gainst Fiji - you love the stats, they're available for all to see. Morgan offers a different prospect, and could be brought on as an impact player later - as should Launchbury, who, in my opinion, hasn't earnt a starting place yet (based on one half of one match?).

[HERSH]

I'm happy with that team, no changes just for changes sake.

Lets hope that they don't start as slowly as they did against Fiji.

[gregortree]

Well Biltong its a race between you and Hersh to start the thread.
If you want to set the tone in the OP title, you'll have to be quick to beat Hersh, when he isn't looking.
Shame there are not more Boks on here who we could bait or WUM.
Although I suspect you are all too wily to bite.
The Bokke certainly beat us up in the 'summer' tour, so they have been England's nemesis home & away for last few years.

[Biltong]

you don't need more BOks to wum, they are mostly a sullen bunch with little sense of humor.

They are more prone to take your head off.

But it is OK, I can take it.

[gregortree]

Biltong,
I know Bokkes like them, but I think head tackles are against the laws.
Anyway, so will you start the usual thread, with different score predictions to vote on ?
Do you have a score prediction ?
Last result (memory ?) was 18-18

[Biltong]

It was 14-14.

I'll start the thread Monday. Wouldn't want the Ozzies to think they're not important.

[boomeranga]

The Good Guys:

Robinson  (slipper)
The DOMINATOR (Moore)
Alexander (Kepu)
Sharpe
Timani
Dennis (Gill)
Hooper
Palu (Samo)
Phipps (Sheehan)
Beale
Honeybadger (Mitchell)
Tapuai (Harris)
AAC
Pretty Boy
Barnes

If Palu or a lock goes down early, we're done. I thought Moore would start. I thought Phipps would be dropped, but survives (tip - dating the boss' daughter can help your career). This is the centre pairing I wanted for this year, but injury kept Tapuai out and AAC playing every position bar his best. Good to finally get to see them, but this is the first time they have played together.

Talk is always about our forwards, but on the whole they have been a far better group than our backs this year. We need to find some balls in the backs again, and once we find them, we need to run for a bit and then throw one of them to the next bloke.

Kane Douglas' mum has woken from the coma which is good news for the Douglas family.

Australia by 30. England are a club side.

[LondonTiger]

It was 14-14.

I'll start the thread Monday. Wouldn't want the Ozzies to think they're not important.

HERSH will start one at about 16:30 on Saturday

[gregortree]

[gregortree]

Boomeranga
You need to make your WUM bait a little less obvious

[boomeranga]

ok mate. I'll edit so it says "Ioane". I don't want to cause any trouble.

[gregortree]

Just make sure Ioane doesn't start kissing our wingers. He could get cited.

[Duty281]

Just make sure Ioane doesn't start kissing our wingers. He could get cited.

[boomeranga]

He was born in NZ, so he'll be fine. For a suspension he'll be forced to miss the bus back to Kensington but free to play the following week.

[LondonTiger]

Just make sure Ioane doesn't start kissing our wingers. He could get cited.

so long as he does not do a Hopoate things should be fine.

[gregortree]

Cited for unwelcome workplace harassment

[LondonTiger]

It was 14-14.

I'll start the thread Monday. Wouldn't want the Ozzies to think they're not important.

HERSH will start one at about 16:30 on Saturday

OK I was wrong by about 52 hours

[OzT]

Just make sure Ioane doesn't start kissing our wingers. He could get (ex?)cited.

[ChequeredJersey]

Strong bench

Except once again I say if Brown isn't starting, he's not versatile enough to play on the bench!

[gregortree]

Oz, that is funny

Seriously now..
Don't know his background (English is first language ? dunno) I wonder if he mis spoke himself á la Bush:
"The England wingers are pretty, really good looking. I just can't wait to go against them,"
and was he referring to the look of Ashton's rugby, and not his facial appearance ? I'm trying to be generous here.

[OzT]

Na, I don't think he was misquoted, he probably meant it, though maybe he got Ashton's mug mixed up with Hartley's,I know I do at times.

Looking at his bio, he went to Gregory Terrace and played for their 1st XV, well having played against Terrace a few times, they were always the easier GPS sides to beat, they must have got heaps better in their rugby development.

Can't wait now for Saturday, bring it on!!!

[gregortree]

Oz
Just some light sledging then from Ione. I'm off to Brighton this w/e and will watch the game in a sports pub with my son. We are really looking forward to it too.

[OzT]

Not the Walkabout!!!!!

[Effervescing Elephant]

It's Brighton so will probably be called 'The Minceabout'

[LondonTiger]

Oz
Just some light sledging then from Ione. I'm off to Brighton this w/e and will watch the game in a sports pub with my son. We are really looking forward to it too.

and you were worried about Ioane kissing the boys and making them cry?

[Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler]

Na, I don't think he was misquoted, he probably meant it, though maybe he got Ashton's mug mixed up with Hartley's,I know I do at times.

Looking at his bio, he went to Gregory Terrace and played for their 1st XV, well having played against Terrace a few times, they were always the easier GPS sides to beat, they must have got heaps better in their rugby development.

Can't wait now for Saturday, bring it on!!!

Its not that he was misquoted, its just that people have deliberately misunderstood the sentiment for comic effect.
By "pretty" he clearly meant mincy wusses, suggesting they arent exactly intimidating for a physical side ( which apparently the Aussies aspire to be now). And its not entirely unfair really, neither good nor Sharples is exactly a Josh Lewsey in defence and Ashtons long been critisized for his tackling. Nor are any of the three Tuilagis with the ball in hand. Which makes a change from people laughing at England for picking 25 stone lumps in an attempt to run through the opposition, especially coming from a country that fawned over Cipriani for his dancing.

[gregortree]

It was 14-14.

I'll start the thread Monday. Wouldn't want the Ozzies to think they're not important.

HERSH will start one at about 16:30 on Saturday

OK I was wrong by about 52 hours

Blyyddy 'eck, just noticed.
Hersh started the Bokke thread at 12.04 - wrongfooted all of us.

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