2013 Lions Squad Announcement - Live updates & Discussion

First topic message reminder :

I'm at work with no access to TV/Radio for the big annoucement. I'd be gretful if some of my 606v2 brethern could provide updates as names are announced for the tour.

Please don't turn this into a debate about who should/shouldn't be on tour until after all the names are up, to keep the page clean for others to see the names of the sqaud.

Thanking you in advance

2103 British & Irish Lions Tour Sqaud:

Cian Healy
Tom Youngs
Richard Hibbard
Dylan Hartley
Dan Cole
Adam Jones
Matt Stevens
Mako Vunipola
Richie Gray
Alun Wyn Jones
Paul O’Connell
Geoff Parling
Tom Croft
Sean O’Brien
Justin Tipuric
Toby Faletau
Sam Warburton (C)
Ben Youngs
Mike Phillips
Owen Farrell
George North
Jamie Roberts
Brian O’Driscoll
Manu Tuilagi
Alex Cuthbert
Leigh Halfpenny
Conor Murray
Rob Kearney
Ian Evans
Gethin Jenkins
Dan Lydiate
Jamie Heaslip
Johnathan Sexton
Jonathan Davies
Tommy Bowe
Stuart Hogg
Sean Maitland

Wales: 15
England: 10
Ireland: 9
Scotland: 3

I am really rather upset that Stevens, Hartley, Croft, and Farrell are in. Not out of anti-English bias, more due to England having significantly better players available as do other teams in those positions.

I would have picked Care over C.Murray.

Vunipola has been playing out of his skin mind...and offers so much in the loose. His scrummaging has improved hugely over the last year aswell..but still a massive call.

Im surprised Parling and Hartley got in...

Hmmmmmm, generally Gatland got the squad right but a few mysteries. Picking Warburton as captain means you have four players competing for one spot. I really think he is a poor choice of captain, and if things don't go right from the off the press will be calling for BOD or POC to take over. It's a poor choice in truth for the reasons people have highlighted this week.

Hartley over Best? Nonsensical.

Some very fortunate selections, namely Kearney, Stevens, Croft, Heaslip and Lydiate.

Easy Captain choice when you've shot every other one who lead their respective sides

No bolters at all.

bsando wrote:wow 3 Scottish players... what a joke.

Kelly Brown is the only one who should have been going but isn't - any others would be marginal calls - Grant perhpas? who else?

Bad calls for me are: Lydiate, Croft, T.Youngs, Stevens.

Would have opted for Brown, Wood or Robshaw, Best, Grant.

I'd said to my dad last night "It doesn't really matter who he picks, as long as it is not ridiculous there are lots of good options with not much to choose between".

I clearly didn't forsee Stevens ahead of grant, no Best, only two fly halves...

No Robshaw, no Brown, no Wood, no Grant.

He has massively gone for a mix of what he knows at Wales and players with "reputation".

My immediate reaction is real dissapointment!

Some very odd calls

no 3rd OH
Stevens, Vunipola, Hartley over Best, Croft
5 locks, no Kelly Brown...

Gatland what have you done you've selected players who have only played a few games after coming back from injuries and completely ignored form.

very disappointed

VictorU3 wrote:Very disappointed

Stevens?

Hartley?

Frarrell?

Croft?

and I'm English?

Apart from Farrell the rest will be midweek players.Unless they prove themselves on tour.

"the benchmark was the 6 nations"

So that explains, Croft, Heaslip, Warburton, Tupuric, Hartley, Stevens, Jenkins, all of whom were poor or none existent.

Wood must be gutted, as should be Robshaw, but with only 2 fly halves, we'll have plenty of injury call ups as well

I love this forum. But seriously, leaving Morgan out is a mistake IMO.

No real issues with the squad besides the call of Hartley over Best. That is a shambles of a decision.

Sky sports are hilariourious, shock at no wilkinson, and Phillips makes it???

Surpised that Lydiate us in, Vunipola, Stevens and Hartley all shocks.

Surprised slightly at Maitland - only because he's a relative newcomer to international rugby - a bit of a bolter?

Surprised at the omission of Best, Grant, Kelly Brown, Hines, etc.

propdavid_london wrote:No bolters at all.

Maitland and Youngs have got into a Lions squad with relative minimal international rugby!!

Great selection

Well at least Scoland should be strong for the tournement in SA

No Best??????????

Crimminal, call the police.

The backrow players must be fuming at Lydiate's inclusion. Brown especially. He should be there.

Care over Murray for me too.

Grant indefinitely over Stevens!

Best over Hartley.

Not sure about Maitland either, but hope he finds his feet out there as he offers something different.

SecretFly wrote:Easy Captain choice when you've shot every other one who lead their respective sides

Very odd that, Best, Brown and Robshaw were probably best in their positions throughout the tournament!!!

I know its been coming, but i'm still flabbergasted at no Robshaw.

Lydiate is an unbelievable decision based on a few games since injury

Oh well. There's a reason that "nobody correctly predicted" the squad, Warren and it's not one you should be that proud of.

Just to get the bloopers out of the way:

1. Hartley instead of Best is flat-out unjustifiable.
2. Vunipola and Stevens instead of Grant is very poor indeed when you consider form.
3. No Laidlaw means no 10 cover. Murray finished strong in the 6N and presumably this won it for him but I cannot see that he is a better player than Care.
4. Croft instead of Robshaw is extremely short sighted and can only be based on the past month's games.
5. Heaslip has got some form back but he is by far the most out of form of the forwards selected.
6. Compare Hines to AWJ. Laugh. And then cry.

Bathite wrote:"the benchmark was the 6 nations"

So that explains, Croft, Heaslip, Warburton, Tupuric, Hartley, Stevens, Jenkins, all of whom were poor or none existent.

Wood must be gutted, as should be Robshaw, but with only 2 fly halves, we'll have plenty of injury call ups as well

Tipuric and Jenkins were not poor in the 6 nations. Even Warburton finished the tournament strongly.

Can't believe Best has missed out as hooker.

I not only had him as starting for the Lions, but a possible Captain as a guarenteed starter, and leader.

To not even travel, wow.

Big big call, I think if trying to gel a squad hartley would be harder to get along with than Best.

and Best made the ERC Longlist, can't understand that one at all.

I'm truley speechless by some of the calls Gatland has made.

Very odd calls.

why is Launchbury named in the OP?

Although a lot of people on here are shouting indignation I think that is a pretty decent squad. But Surprised at Stevens but he's an experienced international prop. Probably won't be a test player but will do a job. Surprised at only two 10's but there you go. Warbs as captain will be quality.

None of the picks are that surprising and it is only small margins between those picked and those not.

can sombody give a breakdown of how many representitives each nation has, I am yo busy to go through it all. Cheers.

Bathite wrote:"the benchmark was the 6 nations"

So that explains, Croft, Heaslip, Warburton, Tupuric, Hartley, Stevens, Jenkins, all of whom were poor or none existent.

Wood must be gutted, as should be Robshaw, but with only 2 fly halves, we'll have plenty of injury call ups as well

Agree there is always buckets of injuries - most of the players who have been unlucky will probably tour at some stage. Still a couple of strange picks with reputation over form being given.

Some very odd calls indeed. He has made some picks who are clearly very lucky. I was always concerned that he would leave out some players who could really make a difference and I only hope we don't suffer too badly with injuries as some of the dirt trackers will struggle in the tests. He needed to make the right calls regardless of the difficulties as the Lions need a series win to maintain their integrity. Best, Sheridan, Wilko, Robshaw should all be there. 1st XV will still be strong but the bench and back up will not be as strong as it could be. Stevens and Vunipola are shockers.

Selection of Hartley over Best is puzzling in extreme.

Stevens??? Is he really that good?

Warburton as captain you just have to live with. Interesting to how this alchemy will work.

Griff wrote: Even Warburton finished the tournament strongly.

Between League and Six Nations just how many big games has Warburton had this season?

Some hypocrisy from Gatland in picking Jenkins, when he had said he would exclude guys playing in France.

Stevens! No one saw that coming. Some who have been left out appear to have been judged on one game. Others are very lucky having come back from injury and not played at a high enough levell to warrant selection on form.

Oh well, let's get behind them.

Breaking news:

Wilkinson and Robshaw do not make the lions!!!

Actually the breaking news should be Best, Brown and Robshaw didn't make it but the likes of Stevens, Lydiate and Hartley do somehow!!

Looks like sexton and farrell will be playing every single flipping game then !! I reckon sexton will be on the plane home before the 1st test, the aussies know if he is crocked then we are up poo creek, and so the local teams will be smashing the crap out of him.

Ok, We're all grumpy about certain choices. But they are now "our" Lions.

We support them to the end. That is all.

I’m gonna support the squad to the hillt but as a Scotsman it is massively disappointing to see Matt bloody Stevens picked over Grant and Lydiate (hardly played any rugby) over Brown (had a storming season).

Really can’t for the life of me understand why Hartley is in there – the Aussies are going to massively target him.

Well not what I expected, some strange calls Stevens being the biggest! Others you can argue that it's close.

Obviously to some there are far to many English who obviously after the 6N are all rubbish.

Warbs to me is the wrong choice on so many levels, not the best open side or blind side touring, very questionable form and declined the wales captaincy

Should have been out of the squad picked POC

Hate to say it too but Warbs captain is a bad call, how does he lead POC, BOD, Stevens, Jenkins etc...

Dont think even Hartleys dad would have picked him, obviously the same cant be said for Mr Farrell

The only unit of the team I am happy with the selection for is the back 3, and possibly the centres. Every other area has huge question marks!

Vunipola was outstanding in a Heineken Cup semi final so not that surprised by that one.

Farrell is a bit lucky after his performance in the same game.

People have a go at Croft and Lydiate but if fit they may be exactly what Gatland wants and needs. Lydiate is one of his go to players and Croft offers a great line out option and pace when play opens up. For what it is worth, I wouldn't have taken Croft either as I think Wood is massively underrated and unlucky that he was switched to No8 in the 6N

Not sure how Jenkins gets in but no other French based players (is that right?) - has he already been released for the Lions. Not to mention the fact that he isn't first choice and is behind another eligible Lion in Sheridan.

Think the luckiest Lion of the lot is probably Hartley, not sure what the rationale for that decision was and not sure anyone forecast 2 English and 1 Welsh hooker.
Overall, not too bad and there are bound to be a few contentious decisions. Think Warburton could have his work cut out to justify his position in the team as he is behind Tipuric and Lydiate in their best positions if they are fit and in form.

Mr Bounce wrote:Ok, We're all grumpy about certain choices. But they are now "our" Lions.

We support them to the end. That is all.

Unless they lose, in which case we were right all along and Warren Gatland knows nothing about Rugby and should retire and run a farm somewhere.

Who covers OH if Farrel or Sexton gets injured? Bizare selection.

Griff wrote:

Bathite wrote:"the benchmark was the 6 nations"

So that explains, Croft, Heaslip, Warburton, Tupuric, Hartley, Stevens, Jenkins, all of whom were poor or none existent.

Wood must be gutted, as should be Robshaw, but with only 2 fly halves, we'll have plenty of injury call ups as well

Tipuric and Jenkins were not poor in the 6 nations. Even Warburton finished the tournament strongly.

Jenkins was largely 2nd choice to James, who was brilliant and has been all season, whilst Jenkins has barely played. Warburton was mixed, but Tipuric didn't even start all the games. All good players, but to have them ahead of Wood and Robshaw is a mistake, but maybe those two should have Croft's place I guess

I think the ratio seems about right for players per country. It's just that some of the English ones are crapper than other English players we could have had instead. Hartley for instance and Stevens have better players who are English than them, otherwise cannot argue with the rest.

Well the positive is that hes picked players that contrast and offer options..

Ie in the back row.
Lydiate - the tackler, the rucker...
O'Brien - The bruising ball carrier
Croft - The fast lineout option.

Hooker
Hartley - Despite his critics (and im one)...good technically - lineout, very good rucker.
Hibbard - A sheer beast of a guy
Youngs - Dynamic, good ball carrier

We did know some very good players would miss out...but Stevens...pah Gatland dropped a clanger there...

Best, Robshaw, and Wilko should be going. Ben Morgan too, Heaslip very lucky IMO.
youngs, stevens and hartley?? best, any other prop??, owens.
Nothing pisses me off more than Farrell going though, definitely influence of his daddy..
glad tipuric got selected though
oh yeah, gray should not be there at all, very poor 6 nations and injured.....
bowe and lydiate lucky but they are very good players.