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Wales vs England - Build Up/Match Thread - 27-2-21

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Post by TightHEAD Sat 13 Feb 2021, 10:00 pm

First topic message reminder :

Wales v England

27th Feb

KO 16:46

England:

Daly;
Watson,
Slade,
Farrell,
May;
Ford,
Youngs;
M Vunipola,
George,
Sinckler,
Itoje,
Hill,
Wilson,
Curry,
B Vunipola.

Replacements: Cowan-Dickie, Genge, Stuart, Ewels, Martin, Earl, Robson, Malins.

WALES

1. Wyn Jones (32 Caps)
2. Ken Owens (79 Caps)
3. Tomas Francis (54 Caps)
4. Adam Beard (23 Caps)
5. Alun Wyn Jones (CAPT) (145 Caps)
6. Josh Navidi (25 Caps)
7. Justin Tipuric (82 Caps)
8. Taulupe Faletau (83 Caps)
9. Kieran Hardy (3 Caps)
10. Dan Biggar (89 Caps)
11. Josh Adams (29 Caps)
12. Jonathan Davies (85 Caps)
13. George North (99 Caps)
14. Louis Rees-Zammit (6 Caps)
15. Liam Williams (68 Caps)

Replacements:

16. Elliot Dee (34 Caps)
17. Rhodri Jones (19 Caps)
18. Leon Brown (14 Caps)
19. Cory Hill (29 Caps)
20. James Botham (4 Caps)
21. Gareth Davies (59 Caps)
22. Callum Sheedy (6 Caps)
23. Uilisi Halaholo (1 Cap)


Last edited by TightHEAD on Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:21 pm; edited 3 times in total
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Post by miltonkeynesengland Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:09 am

So I guess Jamie George is back to play winger again!

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Post by lostinwales Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:10 am

Lawes injured in training

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Post by Mr Bounce Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:11 am

What's Lawes done wrong? Is he injured?

Shows how much faith Eddie has in Billy Cheeseburger's fitness that he's named a 6-2 split with 2 back row forwards in it. Martin is certain to be capped. Would have preferred a 5-3 split with Odogwu to come on at 60 to cause some havoc, but hey...

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:25 am

From a Welsh perspective, I don't like seeing George Ford there. I think he's a excellent, dangerous player, and he deserves to have started more games for England. I remember him having a man-of-the-match performance in Cardiff not that long ago. But having said that, and without wanting to speak too soon, I'm happy he's got Farrell outside him.

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Post by No9 Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:33 am

Here's a new prediction game... its like a "spot the ball"..

Here's the England 23 to play Wales.. Put a Y next the the players to get a YELLOW and R against those getting a RED.

ENGLAND

15. Elliot Daly (Saracens, 49 caps)
14. Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby, 48 caps)
13. Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 36 caps)
12. Owen Farrell (Saracens, 90 caps)
11. Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby, 63 caps)
10. George Ford (Leicester Tigers, 74 caps)
9. Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 106 caps)

1. Mako Vunipola (Saracens, 64 caps)
2. Jamie George (Saracens, 56 caps)
3. Kyle Sinckler (Bristol Bears, 41 caps)
4. Maro Itoje (Saracens, 45 caps)
5. Jonny Hill (Exeter Chiefs, 6 caps)
6. Mark Wilson (Newcastle Falcons, 20 caps)
7. Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 30 caps)
8. Billy Vunipola (Saracens, 58 caps)

FINISHERS

16. Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs, 28 caps)
17. Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers, 25 caps)
18. Will Stuart (Bath Rugby, 10 caps)
19. Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 18 caps)
20. George Martin (Leicester Tigers, uncapped)
21. Ben Earl (Bristol Bears, 10 caps)
22. Dan Robson (Wasps, 9 caps)
23. Max Malins (Bristol Bears, 5 caps)


Dont forget the amended rules for this years 6 Nations that EVERY team to play Wales must be playing with NO MORE than 14 men for at least the last 20 mins ... Whistle

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:33 am

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:From a Welsh perspective, I don't like seeing George Ford there. I think he's a excellent, dangerous player, and he deserves to have started more games for England. I remember him having a man-of-the-match performance in Cardiff not that long ago. But having said that, and without wanting to speak too soon, I'm happy he's got Farrell outside him.

Outside Youngs and inside Farrell, got to feel for the guy.

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Post by TightHEAD Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:34 am

Uninspired predictable selection.

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Post by MichaelT Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:39 am

No9 wrote:Dont forget the amended rules for this years 6 Nations that EVERY team to play Wales must be playing with NO MORE than 14 men for at least the last 20 mins ... Whistle

Think you'll find England started the craze last year by finishing with 13 players. Everyone else is just copying us. Whistle

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Post by Poorfour Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:42 am

I worry that Daly will be the subject of a load of high balls with excellent chasers coming after them. England will need to have the kind of defensive line speed they showed against the ABs back in the before times, and also to watch out for Wales milking penalties.
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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:45 am

Its set up for Farrell to be MOM....

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Post by miltonkeynesengland Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:48 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:Its set up for Farrell to be MOM....
Yes..Farrell to be MOM for Wales when he gets sent off for tackling a player above the neck!

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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:53 am

miltonkeynesengland wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Its set up for Farrell to be MOM....
Yes..Farrell to be MOM for Wales when he gets sent off for tackling a player above the neck!

Cant see that happening.

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Post by Recwatcher16 Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:53 am

EJ's plan looks to be to target the welsh forwards in the last 20 minutes with a 6/2 split and the backs certainly have experience with only Slade going to have less than 50 caps. Hopefully they will be a little more fluent than last time, where the passing and lines taken were poor.
Unusually there is no SH ref for this game and home support, so AWJ and Wales are going to have to work a little harder on their niggly aspect of their game plan.
It will be a tight affair as usual, looking forward to it.


Last edited by Recwatcher16 on Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:54 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by mikey_dragon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:54 am

GeordieFalcon wrote:
miltonkeynesengland wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Its set up for Farrell to be MOM....
Yes..Farrell to be MOM for Wales when he gets sent off for tackling a player above the neck!

Cant see that happening.

I can see the tackle happening but not the Red Card. It is Farrell after all.

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Post by TightHEAD Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:55 am

miltonkeynesengland wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Its set up for Farrell to be MOM....
Yes..Farrell to be MOM for Wales when he gets sent off for tackling a player above the neck!

When has Farrell ever done that?

How many red cards does Farrell have?
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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:56 am

It wont be a tackle if Farrell gets a yellow...it'll be one of his stupid petulant late hits. Refs are watching him for those now.

But fingers crossed he sorts his head out for this game and just focuses on trying to be a decent player. Which he can be.


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Post by BamBam Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:56 am

mikey_dragon wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:
miltonkeynesengland wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Its set up for Farrell to be MOM....
Yes..Farrell to be MOM for Wales when he gets sent off for tackling a player above the neck!

Cant see that happening.

I can see the tackle happening but not the Red Card. It is Farrell after all.

Pre-emptive ref blaming, I like it

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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:57 am

Why is LCD dropped for George? i thought LCD had a very good game v Italy?

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Post by formerly known as Sam Thu 25 Feb 2021, 11:57 am

TightHEAD wrote:
miltonkeynesengland wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:Its set up for Farrell to be MOM....
Yes..Farrell to be MOM for Wales when he gets sent off for tackling a player above the neck!

When has Farrell ever done that?

How many red cards does Farrell have?

Well one inside the last 12 months for nearly taking off Charlie Atkinson's head.

Congratulations George Martin. Not sure how many locks make an international 23 at 19 but great so see him get a shot. Reward for that massive workrate of his.

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Post by formerly known as Sam Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:01 pm

Sgt_Pooly wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:From a Welsh perspective, I don't like seeing George Ford there. I think he's a excellent, dangerous player, and he deserves to have started more games for England. I remember him having a man-of-the-match performance in Cardiff not that long ago. But having said that, and without wanting to speak too soon, I'm happy he's got Farrell outside him.

Outside Youngs and inside Farrell, got to feel for the guy.

He's used to playing outside Youngs his biggest problem is the lack of any ball carriers in the backline. Nowt out there but playmakers and speedsters.

He'll hopefully get the livewire version of Robson in the second half and not the liability version. Either way he'll be looking to take the ball off a forward first receiver in case of another of Robson's jump to catch passes. Robson ups the tempo as he can then Ford can go with him.

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Post by Barney McGrew did it Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:01 pm

15. Elliot Daly
14. Anthony Watson
13. Henry Slade
12. Owen Farrell
11. Jonny May
10. George Ford
9. Ben Youngs

1. Mako Vunipola
2. Jamie George
3. Kyle Sinckler
4. Maro Itoje
5. Jonny Hill
6. Mark Wilson
7. Tom Curry
8. Billy Vunipola

Hmm, one of the least scary midfields about. And a bit of sluggish BR (unless someone tapes a burger onto the ball for Billy to chase). Good job we've got Maro & Jonny to sneak it.
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Post by No9 Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:07 pm

WALES TEAM TO PLAY ENGLAND (SATURDAY FEBRUARY 24, KO 16.45)

1. Wyn Jones (32 Caps)

2. Ken Owens (79 Caps)

3. Tomas Francis (54 Caps)

4. Adam Beard (23 Caps)

5. Alun Wyn Jones (CAPT) (145 Caps)

6. Josh Navidi (25 Caps)

7. Justin Tipuric (82 Caps)

8. Taulupe Faletau (83 Caps)

9. Kieran Hardy (3 Caps)

10. Dan Biggar (89 Caps)

11. Josh Adams (29 Caps)

12. Jonathan Davies (85 Caps)

13. George North (99 Caps)

14. Louis Rees-Zammit (6 Caps)

15. Liam Williams (68 Caps)

Replacements:

16. Elliot Dee (34 Caps)

17. Rhodri Jones (19 Caps)

18. Leon Brown (14 Caps)

19. Cory Hill (29 Caps)

20. James Botham (4 Caps)

21. Gareth Davies (59 Caps)

22. Callum Sheedy (6 Caps)

23. Uilisi Halaholo (1 Cap)

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Post by mikey_dragon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:08 pm

Our worst fears realised. Cory Hill is back outta nowhere, good to see him back though.

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Post by No9 Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:09 pm

Well that JD at 12 and North at 13 has just stopped LRZ seeing the ball.. furious

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Post by No 7&1/2 Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:11 pm

Youd imagine that bench is advantage England. We've said that before though and it's not materialised. Better back row on current form and a safe pair of hands at full back.

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Post by No9 Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:15 pm

At least Navidi, Tips and Faletau shouldn't get bullied in the back row.. Just hope they can allow Hardy to get fast ball away. But fear if they do, and Biggar distributes, our Centres will constantly run it up and waste it. Need to get it wide quickly to Adams and Rees-Zammit, with Liam threatening the line putting the fear of god into Farrell and Slade.

Going to be a close one... Fingers Crossed .. if we man up in the forwards.

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Post by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:18 pm

No9 wrote:Well that JD at 12 and North at 13 has just stopped LRZ seeing the ball.. furious

Depends how often (or how) England kick.

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Post by Soul Requiem Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:27 pm

Are we all looking forward to seeing Vunipola and Farrell?

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Post by mikey_dragon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:28 pm

No9 wrote:Well that JD at 12 and North at 13 has just stopped LRZ seeing the ball.. furious

North?

It's likely Biggar's flapping that will stop LRZ seeing any ball, unless he crossfield kicks it to him.

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Post by miltonkeynesengland Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:40 pm

I have recurring nightmare where we kick it stupidly to Liam Williams who cuts up the defence before LRZ speeds in like that try that started the second half last year...this is costing me sleep!

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Post by Cumbrian Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:54 pm

Eddie sticking to his plan of never picking less than 100 locks in each England squad...

In seriousness, I'm pleased for the young lad. You could imagine that he would consider himself a tad fortunate to be ahead of some of the names that crop up time and again on English rugby forums, but still, I hope he grabs the chance with both hands.

In normal times I would say that I am happy with the team (especially with Ford starting), but they've been so sluggish and blunt recently. I struggle to see who is going to come off the bench and change things if we are behind. Billy needs to put in a big performance, the team can't continue to carry him.

I've likened England's game plan to a 'winning one', in the respect that it is fine until we have to chase a game. The most infuriating thing in the world to watch your players robotically kick the ball away when you are chasing points. It's set up to be like that again, if Wales get any kind of decent lead I can see England hitting the skids.
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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 12:59 pm

Some BIG performances from some of the English lads required this weekend. No doubt about that.

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Post by TightHEAD Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:05 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:Some BIG performances from some of the English lads required this weekend. No doubt about that.  

How can pulling on the red rose not get you up for it? BillyV admitting himself that he has been rubbish is just shocking. Lose this then imho it's time up for Eddie.
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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:10 pm

And what is going on with Lawrence.

And as much as im a fan of big Mark (as you know) , why is Ben Earl not starting in the back row...hes far more explosive.

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Post by No 7&1/2 Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:11 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:And what is going on with Lawrence.

And as much as im a fan of big Mark (as you know) , why is Ben Earl not starting in the back row...hes far more explosive.

Better lineout option?

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Post by hugehandoff Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:12 pm

Tighthead.....half a bottle wine....half full or empty?

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Post by TightHEAD Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:13 pm

I'll support the lads all the way. But we will not be winning this match.

Wales by 10
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Post by majesticimperialman Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:14 pm

Soul Requiem wrote:Are we all looking forward to seeing Vunipola and Farrell?

What i am realy looking forward to, is the clash between Vunipola and Faletau.

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Post by LordDowlais Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:15 pm

I'm not looking forward to this game at all. Especially after seeing the teams. We have been fortuitous in the fact that Ireland and Scotland had idiots playing for them and getting sent off.

England will win this one by at least 15pts. I hope I'm wrong though..... COME ON WALES Wales

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Post by Poorfour Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:19 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
Sgt_Pooly wrote:
Luckless Pedestrian wrote:From a Welsh perspective, I don't like seeing George Ford there. I think he's a excellent, dangerous player, and he deserves to have started more games for England. I remember him having a man-of-the-match performance in Cardiff not that long ago. But having said that, and without wanting to speak too soon, I'm happy he's got Farrell outside him.

Outside Youngs and inside Farrell, got to feel for the guy.

He's used to playing outside Youngs his biggest problem is the lack of any ball carriers in the backline. Nowt out there but playmakers and speedsters.

He'll hopefully get the livewire version of Robson in the second half and not the liability version. Either way he'll be looking to take the ball off a forward first receiver in case of another of Robson's jump to catch passes. Robson ups the tempo as he can then Ford can go with him.

The good news is that Ford now has plenty of ball carriers in the pack in Mako, Sinck and (if he "turns up") Billy.
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Post by RiscaGame Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:21 pm

I would expect Farrell to play well this weekend, especially against an out of sorts Davies.

Very excited about Navidi against Curry. Hope our replacement forwards manage the set piece when they come on, especially with England going 6/2 again.

I have little expectations over this tbh, even if I agree with the vast majority of the team Pivac has picked.

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Post by lostinwales Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:22 pm

Very easy to bemoan England's current standards whilst forgetting Wales have been poor for a while.

Lets face it, it is going to be a poor match with two teams defending well but looking blunt in attack and kicking badly.

Can't wait...

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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:24 pm

No 7&1/2 wrote:
GeordieFalcon wrote:And what is going on with Lawrence.

And as much as im a fan of big Mark (as you know) , why is Ben Earl not starting in the back row...hes far more explosive.

Better lineout option?

Possibly..or hes seen as more physical for the initial battle. Who knows.

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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:31 pm

And is there any intention on seeing how Odogwu goes? Clearly hes a good tackle bag holder...

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Post by Gooseberry Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:37 pm

GeordieFalcon wrote:And is there any intention on seeing how Odogwu goes? Clearly hes a good tackle bag holder...

If he's picked it wont be "to see how he goes", it would be because there's a considered belief he can improve the side.

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Post by Sgt_Pooly Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:38 pm

Wales trying to pick a worse centre partnership than England....very sneaky!

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Post by GeordieFalcon Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:38 pm

And how will he know if he doesnt "see how he goes"...

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Post by lostinwales Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:42 pm

I think a lot of England fans would pay to see an alternate team with more go forward in the centres.

Wales selection does seem odd though. How much rugby has JD2 actually played recently?

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Post by No 7&1/2 Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:44 pm

Jones can be a very cautious selector in some cases and then jumps into the deep on others. He does tend to like players to be around training squads for an extended time before full caps. Perhaps the guys like Lawrence and Odogwu aren't really like to feature prominently until the Autumn.

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Post by RiscaGame Thu 25 Feb 2021, 1:57 pm

lostinwales wrote:Wales selection does seem odd though. How much rugby has JD2 actually played recently?

Not much at all, plus he was poor in the game he did play, against Cardiff recently. He looked very off the pace. Maybe a bit easier for him, now he is moving in one position, but it's not what I would've done.

I did note that the gone well in training line has been thrown out by Pivac. I thought that was a Gatland line only.

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